Should've Gone Android? Nokia surpasses HTC and Motorola in the USA
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TheLegendOfMart
Banned
Samsung happened.
WP Central were pretty certain that it would materialise back in July with the 1020 but it never did, which is a shame.
6snap is on the way from Rudy but at the end of the day lots of people still want official apps, no matter how good the third party alternatives might be.
6tag and 6sec cover Vine and Instagram pretty well, and 6snap will do the same for Snapchat.
At the minute it's only Snapchat that there isn't an official client for in the works.
Also worth noting is that while this is pretty big YoY growth for Nokia in the US, it's doing even better in other markets. Particularly Europe.
Hmm, looks interesting but I don't think I could get over the paranoia of using a third party application to log in to my online banking. What guarantee do you have over security?
Hmm, looks interesting but I don't think I could get over the paranoia of using a third party application to log in to my online banking. What guarantee do you have over security?
Yeah, no...
Fox Mulder
Member
me either. I'm not giving a third party login info for any of my stuff. I won't even login to one of the YouTube apps since none of them are official.
TheLaughingStock
Member
Android has an A+ UI on phones
The Abominable Snowman
Member
You do realize that Nokia's decision to go Windows, aside from Microsoft's moneyhatting, was because they wanted a platform they could modify and plant all of their Nokia services on, right?
I mean their Ovi store, GPS app, and many other customizations would've just been brought over to Android, and users would just complain about it if you complain about Touchwiz now.
Anyway, this is good news for Nokia and Windows Phone. I quite enjoy seeing Windows Phones in the wild and will probably soon jump back on the WP wagon.
ChronotriggerJM
Member
Nowhere in the same ballpark as the same thing lol
On my android device, I've changed the icon of my folders to blend into my background (with custom icon packs), I've customized what actions I want to perform on my desktop, which is now basically icon free with a simple clock at the top, my wallpaper is almost entirely visible, I swipe up (from anywhere on the homescreen) to open my app drawer, I swipe down (from anywhere on home screen) to see my notifications, I can slide up from my folder icons to perform actions, etc etc etc. None of which is stock android. In it's current state, IOS and WP are nowhere near that kind of customization.
Sounds awfully confusing and time consuming.. as long as you like it though.
Typed on a Windows Phone, stock rom. Easy.
kurisu_1974
Banned
Don't forget to eat sleep and shit.
ChronotriggerJM
Member
Yeah there's definitely a proper way to explain that I'm just not conveying at this hour in the morning
Basic premise: absolute minimalism with folders that double as functions when you slide instead of click. Full visibility of my wallpaper which changes every couple minutes instead of your typical row of icons and widgets and what have you.
That's just it though, whatever your preference is on what you want out of your phone, you can basically customize it to be so on Android. I wanted absolute minimalism and to have pretty wallpapers. My friend likes to pretend he's Neo in the matrix or some shit, and he's got like 1208927374902834 homescreens with a billion widgets. Not my cup of tea personally, but to each his own.
And while I like the stock keyboard on android, swiftkey is just way too amazing to use it. I swear I could type absolute jibberish on this thing and it will figure out what I'm wanting to type lol.
I promise I won't forget.
PetriP-TNT
Member
WP8 now has Instagram AND Vine so I fully expect it to take over iOS by the end of 2014.
Regarding b., that's why I'm more inclined to get a 2520 and than a Surface 2. If they put even a tenth of the care and effort they have in WP7/8 ... I think it will prove to be the better offering.
I just wish they did a 7-8" instead.
unpopularblargh
Member
Android also works great just out of the box too. Everything he said is completely optional.
Well its not for old people I guess.
I kid I kid
But seriously...only annoying part is starting out. Than it becomes second hand like anything.
ChronotriggerJM
Member
Probably should have emphasized this as well. Stock android is very easy to use lol. Even moreso with some company specific models, like Samsungs touch wiz, or HTC's sense UI
Still think they should have gone Android. WP8 is just a different looking iOS(with none of its upsides) IMO.
And I'm pretty sure, if you were to look it up, HTC and Motorola each have probably sold more phones this year than Nokia.
And I'm pretty sure, if you were to look it up, HTC and Motorola each have probably sold more phones this year than Nokia.
lastflowers
Banned
8.1 has a lot of really nice updates. I really like the new xbox music app. I kind of gave up on it after a couple of months of use after 8 came out.
Motorola? Doubt it. HTC? Just about, but Nokia are quickly overtaking them.
AranhaHunter
Banned
How does the source know the shipments of motorola phones WW, let alone in the US? I know Sony, Samsung, Apple, and I assume HTC/Nokia released their shipment numbers, but AFAIK, no shipment of Moto X or other Motorola phones were released for Q3. Is this from an independent study making assumptions on shipment numbers or did I miss something?
juliushandle
Member
http://www.kantarworldpanel.com/Global/News/Nokia-and-Windows-global-momentum-continues
10% in Europe
almost 5% in the US
growing fast and near double digits in Latin America
doing shitty in China
10% in Europe
almost 5% in the US
growing fast and near double digits in Latin America
doing shitty in China
Cheek!! lol
I did come from Windows Mobile 5 and 6 where I wrote my own Roms.
I loved to tweak the look of it and make it a very personal and individual device.. I suppose just like you can for Android now.
Must admit, and i guess somewhat with in line with what you said.. i just got tired/too old for fiddling and find the simplicity of WP8 refreshing..
Windows Phone seems fairly popular in Europe. MSFT is definitely making some inroads.Courtesy of Sir Fragula in the other thread:
Complex Shadow
Cudi Lame
Beat Apply in Italy, thanks Italia-GAF!
soundahfekz
Member
Microsoft is gonna fuck this up
w1ck3dn1nj4
Member
As far as Im concerned, Nokia should have gone Android because thats the only way Ill consider buying one. IF MS is confident about the appeal of windows mobile to consumers, they should give consumers the option to dual boot Nokia phones imo :-D That way, MS can artificially inflate their numbers, whilst people like me, will at least not rule out the possibility completely. Its a win win for everybody.
As it stands, there are simply too many limitations on both iOS and windows mobile, which I puts me off the prospect immediately. First, its the degree of control and flexibility. Someone here remarked in terms of UI, Android gets a C+, MS an A+, while Apple gets a F. Nah! Not from where Im standing. Android is the only one I would consider giving a pass grade, whilst both Apple and MS get automatic F(s)!
Why? Because Androids the only one where I can control the UI to be how I want it to be, unique to my needs. Through the use of custom launchers, I can modify the UI to suit my usage. Neither iOS nor windows mobile offers that sort of user control. I really like the minimalistic approach, using labels or shortcuts within sub-nested labels, to organise what layers I want to see (or hide) on top, using custom gestures to launch or do whatever I like, even combining unique apps to multitask the way I want. Basically whatever I deem fits my flow, is doable. Not what MS or Apple dictates I need. And the degree of control is not limited to UI alone. It goes down to system level functionality, with brilliant stuff like Swiftkey and apps like Titanium backup, to the degree of automation control with stuff like Tasker etc.
Now, the other major gripe I have against both iOS and windows mobile is the restriction imposed by the two, on users to install or buy anything outside the confines of their store. Just consider something like Humble Mobile Bundle for example. Without the ability to sideload freely, iOS and windows mobile are deprived of the opportunity to enjoy such offerings on their mobile devices. I find myself asking, just who the fuck do they think they are to mandate how people should ply their trade, what percentage cut theyre entitled to make, or how consumers should use our devices? To me the availability of such freedom to support anyone I want without contributing a single dime to the coffers of Apple, MS or even Google, if I choose not to, is precisely why I prefer to support android as the platform going forwards. Its the lesser of evils.
Yeah, I know Windows Mobile is less draconian compared to iOS, but its no less anti-user imo. Last I checked, MS requires you to register a developer account which entitles you to two pathetic sideloads. If you want more (ceiling is 10), youve got to pay them cash for such a privilege. Fuck that! This is what I find so disgusting about MS. Their approach stinks of greed. By opening the door, MS is already giving the green light to apps outside their store. What is the difference between installing two such apps on your phone and three or more, short of MS believing itself to be justified in charging you to run stuff on your own phone? And how is this even helpful to your own fan base, ones who are likely to carry multiple devices? Why should it be limited to one phone only? Fuck you MS for trying to monetize something that shouldnt have a price tag to begin with.
IMO, the most troubling aspect of this iron grip philosophy of dictating what we can or cannot run on our device is the underlying implication for everybody. It essentially means the kind of freedom we take for granted today, to run whatever we like on windows or macs, could be slowly phased out tomorrow if their mobile OS philosophy becomes the standard wide norm as we move ever closer to a convergent future between competing mobile and desktop paradigms. See how MS is already making such plans with their push for metro on Windows 8 desktop?
This is why Im dislike Windows 8.x so much. Not because I dont appreciate the slight improvements under the hood, but rather I detest how MS is using their desktop monopoly as exploitative leverage like some cowboy manoeuvre to shepherd their herd into their pen enclosure for future slaughter. This is also why I believe people like Gabe and indie developers are slowly hedging their efforts on Linux, not just because of the threat MS could make future desktops a niche product for enterprises (say by slowly pricing it out of the reach of most consumers to steer them towards their walled garden) but also, by accepting their package of control now, they are in fact giving MS a leash tied to their necks, which they can then yank and suffocate in any way they please, when the time is right. We only have to look at what a closed system like Xbox could do to have an inkling whats in store tomorrow if MSs scheme comes into fruition. Fuck that.
Ok rant over :-D
As it stands, there are simply too many limitations on both iOS and windows mobile, which I puts me off the prospect immediately. First, its the degree of control and flexibility. Someone here remarked in terms of UI, Android gets a C+, MS an A+, while Apple gets a F. Nah! Not from where Im standing. Android is the only one I would consider giving a pass grade, whilst both Apple and MS get automatic F(s)!
Why? Because Androids the only one where I can control the UI to be how I want it to be, unique to my needs. Through the use of custom launchers, I can modify the UI to suit my usage. Neither iOS nor windows mobile offers that sort of user control. I really like the minimalistic approach, using labels or shortcuts within sub-nested labels, to organise what layers I want to see (or hide) on top, using custom gestures to launch or do whatever I like, even combining unique apps to multitask the way I want. Basically whatever I deem fits my flow, is doable. Not what MS or Apple dictates I need. And the degree of control is not limited to UI alone. It goes down to system level functionality, with brilliant stuff like Swiftkey and apps like Titanium backup, to the degree of automation control with stuff like Tasker etc.
Now, the other major gripe I have against both iOS and windows mobile is the restriction imposed by the two, on users to install or buy anything outside the confines of their store. Just consider something like Humble Mobile Bundle for example. Without the ability to sideload freely, iOS and windows mobile are deprived of the opportunity to enjoy such offerings on their mobile devices. I find myself asking, just who the fuck do they think they are to mandate how people should ply their trade, what percentage cut theyre entitled to make, or how consumers should use our devices? To me the availability of such freedom to support anyone I want without contributing a single dime to the coffers of Apple, MS or even Google, if I choose not to, is precisely why I prefer to support android as the platform going forwards. Its the lesser of evils.
Yeah, I know Windows Mobile is less draconian compared to iOS, but its no less anti-user imo. Last I checked, MS requires you to register a developer account which entitles you to two pathetic sideloads. If you want more (ceiling is 10), youve got to pay them cash for such a privilege. Fuck that! This is what I find so disgusting about MS. Their approach stinks of greed. By opening the door, MS is already giving the green light to apps outside their store. What is the difference between installing two such apps on your phone and three or more, short of MS believing itself to be justified in charging you to run stuff on your own phone? And how is this even helpful to your own fan base, ones who are likely to carry multiple devices? Why should it be limited to one phone only? Fuck you MS for trying to monetize something that shouldnt have a price tag to begin with.
IMO, the most troubling aspect of this iron grip philosophy of dictating what we can or cannot run on our device is the underlying implication for everybody. It essentially means the kind of freedom we take for granted today, to run whatever we like on windows or macs, could be slowly phased out tomorrow if their mobile OS philosophy becomes the standard wide norm as we move ever closer to a convergent future between competing mobile and desktop paradigms. See how MS is already making such plans with their push for metro on Windows 8 desktop?
This is why Im dislike Windows 8.x so much. Not because I dont appreciate the slight improvements under the hood, but rather I detest how MS is using their desktop monopoly as exploitative leverage like some cowboy manoeuvre to shepherd their herd into their pen enclosure for future slaughter. This is also why I believe people like Gabe and indie developers are slowly hedging their efforts on Linux, not just because of the threat MS could make future desktops a niche product for enterprises (say by slowly pricing it out of the reach of most consumers to steer them towards their walled garden) but also, by accepting their package of control now, they are in fact giving MS a leash tied to their necks, which they can then yank and suffocate in any way they please, when the time is right. We only have to look at what a closed system like Xbox could do to have an inkling whats in store tomorrow if MSs scheme comes into fruition. Fuck that.
Ok rant over :-D
funkystudent
Member
It only took 5 years, billions of dollars, selling the smart phone wing of the company and firing all the software engineers but Nokia are finally at 4% market share.
Well done!
Well done!
Those 5 years really flew by.
It's 4% in the US. Much higher everywhere else, and showing no sign of slowing growth.
lastflowers
Banned
It's for development purposes(?). It's not limited to one phone(?).
Your 'opinion' is objectively wrong :\
It has more in common with Android than iOS in terms of featureset.
A couple of people in here have touched on it, but those claiming that if Nokia had gone Android they'd be in even better shape are kind of missing the point. It's not like Android losers have a lack of quality phones. Nokia having a quality phone on Android wouldn't have made it automatically successful.
Outside of the obvious financial investment by Microsoft directly, Windows Phone gives Nokia two distinct advantages:
1) A unique-looking interface and OS that genuinely differentiates it from other phones that Android could never give them
2) An OS that can actually run extremely smoothly and relatively quickly on immensely cheap hardware, with most apps on the Store working fine on those devices.
Outside of the obvious financial investment by Microsoft directly, Windows Phone gives Nokia two distinct advantages:
1) A unique-looking interface and OS that genuinely differentiates it from other phones that Android could never give them
2) An OS that can actually run extremely smoothly and relatively quickly on immensely cheap hardware, with most apps on the Store working fine on those devices.
Sqrt_minus_one
Member
Losers? Really what are we 7 now and defending Billion Dollar corporations on the internet.
Ignoring that.
The question; if Nokia should have gone Android or not has already been answered by funnily enough Microsoft, the $7.2B buy out and $2B non recoverable cash injection have already answered the question, if Nokia was succesful in it's WP experiment and the answer is obviously no. Nobody sells a succesful company with promising growth prospects.
There is no Nokia any more in the smartphone market there is only Lumia and Windows Phone 8, MS have sunk how many billion (Elop: "with a B") into this Nokia adventure $2B - $3B at the start and now the figures above? Yet people still think Nokia is doing well? Who are you kidding?
1. WP running great on low end hardware? OK what low end hardware, the Nokia 520 as zomwtfbbq pointed out is quite beefy, my Galaxy Nexus runs fine unless I use Chrome which murders it - but that is driven by Google's insistence on running essentially the same platform on desktop and mobile. Quite the contrary if you want to talk running on low end hardware go see what is being sold in China and Africa and count how many are running WP.
2. Unique interface - you mean the same interface that can't be changed across any OEM? Is that not the antithesis of unique?
What the OP also fails to point out is that the HTC he is shitting on is the second largest maker of Windows Phone handsets. So whatever is driving Nokia is unique to Nokia and not WP which is common to both companies. Read - marketing push HTC can't match, Here Maps HTC which became universal in Feb, camera performance HTC can't match, low margins on the 520 HTC cant match. Throw in the MS financing and it becomes obvious other WP OEMs are outclassed here.
Sony which has categorically stated for some bizarre reason that China and the USA are not it's focus for smartphone sales but globally they shipped more than Nokia now imagine they actually had competent management in 2 of the biggest smartphone markets in the world.
As I will say as many times as this argument crops up the fact that MS had to buy Nokia and the fact that MS will soon become the world largest dumbphone maker as the Nokia board have cut their phone business all together and ran sits on the very opposite side of the argument that Nokia should not have gone android - throw in the leaks that Nokia were still working on an android handset a few weeks before the deal with MS was announced pretty much sums it all up what senior execs thought they should be doing.
I sound very anti WP but I am not WP will be successful in terms of market share MS obviously view it as a strategic and important product. I think it is a risky and pointless investment by MS and support the investor who said they should spin off the Entertainment and Devices division (Xbox, WP etc) and Bing to concentrate on their core strengths .
ps - The reason I say it's pointless is Google with Android is devaluing the OS - Android is not the best OS on the market but it's free and as a result I will never pay $100 to install windows on my phone. So MS is forced to offer WP at a pittance $10 per phone that pales in comparison to the license cost of PC's. Throw in the fact OEM's don't particularly like not being able to differentiate in terms of hardware and you face an expensive uphill struggle. Google on the other hand makes the bulk of it's money on Android through ads, giving away the OS for free is a no brainer. Apps are not making Google or Apple huge returns unless MS wants to transform itself into an ad company a la Google.
Well considering it's missing the features that define Android, like multiple homescreens, 3rd party keyboards and widgets, I don't know how you can say that with a straight face. In fact, WP8, on the whole, is pretty uncustomizable(like, you guessed it, iOS) whereas Android you can change pretty much every aspect of it.
If my opinion is "objectively" incorrect, I'd like you to back that claim up.
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