So it looks like HFW actually has free climbing.

Now Genshin Impact looks good. It seems like they are actually holding onto something. Zelda really gets a pass on things. I dont think any other game wouldnt be laughed out if their mountains were just some flat texture. Where angles, ledges, etc .. none of it mattered. For SOTC all those rules existed and its a PS2 game.
f1VxO7K.gif

Shadow did first.

Parkour was mostly came with Assassin's Creed and now people pretending like it's BOTW thing, same with glider that was there for ages in many games before it. You really think that Nintendo fans just born yesterday.

They should have textures to make the climbing make sense, or at least use some tools for those soft slops:

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I mean, respect our brain, dear devs.
 
there is no terrain. it's just 4 polygons with a cartoon rock texture. people should compare it to AC which is the gold standard.
yeah, after years of only climbing certain objects in the world cause of the "immersion"

they copied the gold standard from BOTW.
 
yeah it's easier to do free climbing when you use playstation 2 animations where you don't give a crap about what the character is actually climbing.
A shame Horizon 2 will use PS4 animations when PS5 animations could have been possible. Maybe for Horizon 3.
 
The lack of free climbing was one of the most disappointing thing of HZD, I don't think they fix it for HFW, they probably introduce more grips and a more flexible system with the grappling hook, but no free climb like Zelda.
 
Parkour was mostly came with Assassin's Creed and now people pretending like it's BOTW thing, same with glider that was there for ages in many games before it. You really think that Nintendo fans just born yesterday.

They should have textures to make the climbing make sense, or at least use some tools for those soft slops:

One-pair-martial-arts-Wrist-Support-climbing-tools-Tactical-gloves-Hidden-Slip-paw-Claw-2pcs-B2.jpg_Q90.jpg_.webp


ead951dc776d280d95bacfefb172aced


HTB1aMq8XODxK1RjSsphq6zHrpXaB.jpg


I mean, respect our brain, dear devs.
damn breath of the wild really frustrated your ass back in 2017 lmao
 
They really need to just get Kojima permission to wholesale rip off the traversal mechanics of his game but speed them up abit
 
Are we debating over which system gives you more freedom or which one looks more realistic?

From what I've played BOTW gives you more freedom but Uncharted has a more realistic climbing system. Seems like the degree of freedom and how realistic it looks have a relationship with each other.

Too much freedom can make a game look unrealistic but too little of it can hinder the gameplay.
 
You mean that mechanic where you just push the stick forward and the game does the rest, circa 2015 Assassins Creed Syndicate?
 
from another interview:

In the first Horizon, we used a lot of the yellow climbing handholds, specifically placed by designers and artists so the player had one path to climb somewhere. For this game, we wanted to open that up more.

This wasn't so clear in the State of Play, but in the open world of the Forbidden West, you can climb anywhere. You also don't have to ping the Focus all the time. As was explained, the Focus ping is only for places where the light conditions are bad. At night for example, when you cannot see climbing points immediately, you can ping it just to see more clearly. Even without the ping though, you can always climb up places. We added the glider so you can quickly go down as well, which really speeds up traversal. Now you don't have to go around mountains anymore, like in the previous game. It feels much, much more free.
 
AC copied that and modified it better:

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I usually agree with your posts, but I don't understand this. You think BotW climbing is bad, but this is good? Just sounds like Nintendo hating to me, because logically I don't see how this makes sense. This game DOES focus on realism, yet the climbing looks more akin to Spiderman with how the movements look (look at the way the hands and feet stick onto the rocks, even when the player is angled more backwards in the bottom right of the screen) and the speed of leaping around.

Again I don't care if people like Nintendo games or not. But this just reads like all the typical hating I see on their stuff "oh it's for kids!" then turning around and saying that something that ripped it off and, from the looks of it, in an inferior manner, is presented as better because "it's for grownups." I know you didn't say that last part, but you did say Zelda climbing was for kids, but if so many people can't figure out how to handle it without getting frustrated ... maybe that means there is actually something to it and they should figure out how to make it work for them in the game instead of just getting angry. :pie_thinking:

Also, if the mechanic was silly and "for kids" why would a major player rip it off?

Hint: Climbing in BotW isn't ever supposed to be an unlimited ability that lets you just get anywhere you want at anytime. It's a skill that you build up over time via stamina growth and, potentially, the climbing gear. This allows you to do more, and travel further as you grow. Sounds like puzzle solving. Logic. Gameplay design. Things that Nintendo excels at and the rest of the industry tends to only understand at a surface level, never quite replicating what makes their games special and successful. This GIF is, IMO, a perfect example of that.

IMO Assassin's Creed is like the game equivalent of a Michael Bay film. Massively popular with the masses, but really quite bland at its core. 🤷‍♂️
 
I usually agree with your posts, but I don't understand this. You think BotW climbing is bad, but this is good? Just sounds like Nintendo hating to me, because logically I don't see how this makes sense. This game DOES focus on realism, yet the climbing looks more akin to Spiderman with how the movements look (look at the way the hands and feet stick onto the rocks, even when the player is angled more backwards in the bottom right of the screen) and the speed of leaping around.

Again I don't care if people like Nintendo games or not. But this just reads like all the typical hating I see on their stuff "oh it's for kids!" then turning around and saying that something that ripped it off and, from the looks of it, in an inferior manner, is presented as better because "it's for grownups." I know you didn't say that last part, but you did say Zelda climbing was for kids, but if so many people can't figure out how to handle it without getting frustrated ... maybe that means there is actually something to it and they should figure out how to make it work for them in the game instead of just getting angry. :pie_thinking:

Also, if the mechanic was silly and "for kids" why would a major player rip it off?

Hint: Climbing in BotW isn't ever supposed to be an unlimited ability that lets you just get anywhere you want at anytime. It's a skill that you build up over time via stamina growth and, potentially, the climbing gear. This allows you to do more, and travel further as you grow. Sounds like puzzle solving. Logic. Gameplay design. Things that Nintendo excels at and the rest of the industry tends to only understand at a surface level, never quite replicating what makes their games special and successful. This GIF is, IMO, a perfect example of that.

IMO Assassin's Creed is like the game equivalent of a Michael Bay film. Massively popular with the masses, but really quite bland at its core. 🤷‍♂️

Hey, Fenyx has similar climbing to BOTW, same as Genshin, but those don't fit well with realism. AC's version isn't perfect but you usually go to cracks. I would like if using similar methods as Zelda is to have some climbing tools that you acquire.

Would it bother me if it was 100% like BOTW? Not so much, but won't be ideal. It's not something big.
 
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Now Genshin Impact looks good. It seems like they are actually holding onto something. Zelda really gets a pass on things. I dont think any other game wouldnt be laughed out if their mountains were just some flat texture. Where angles, ledges, etc .. none of it mattered. For SOTC all those rules existed and its a PS2 game.
f1VxO7K.gif

Shadow did first.

This. Stop pretending like botw invented free climping :)
 
This is super exciting, IMO. The glowing climbing paths in the first one were one of my biggest complaints about the game (which speaks to its quality).
 
i imagine they'll do it in a realistic way and slap ledges all over the world to climb up. not something unrealistic like climb anywhere you want like in botw.
 
yeah it's easier to do free climbing when you use playstation 2 animations where you don't give a crap about what the character is actually climbing.

Amazing how people feel threatened by a WiiU game years after it was launched.

I loved HZD but let's not kid ourselves, Zelda is the better game, it's so good that they're actually copying it's features.

To add salt to injury, BOTW will sell better than both Horizons combined, at $60 each copy no less, no need to give it away or sell it for $5, lol.

Seeing the free climbing and the glider made Forbidden West an insta buy for me.
 
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God I hate Zelda-style "free climbing". It's the perfect way to break immersion - slowly, unnaturally, plodding up a surface only to slide back down to the bottom when you don't quite have enough stamina. So stupid.
Not a fan either (or BOTW in general for that matter). But I think it's still better than what is present in the latest AC games - you can climb everything and anything, just keep pushing the stick. Oh, but you need to press X on occasion too, seemingly quite randomly. And some surfaces you just can't climb (mountains with no visible gripping points are fine though). That's just stupid and takes all challenge/strategy out of world traversal.
 
Amazing how people feel threatened by a WiiU game years after it was launched.

I loved HZD but let's not kid ourselves, Zelda is the better game, it's so good that they're actually copying it's features.

To add salt to injury, BOTW will sell better than both Horizons combined, at $60 each copy no less, no need to give it away or sell it for $5, lol.

Seeing the free climbing and the glider made Forbidden West an insta buy for me.

Who feels threatened? Please move over we are having a real discussion here.
 
Some people in this thread: "Zelda free climbing is for kids and totally unrealistic. Climbing is much more realistic in this PlayStation (trademark) game I like, where a skinny woman can leap 20 feet through the air and single-handedly kills hundreds of people and 50 foot tall robot dinosaurs."
 
So no more invisible walls? that would be a pretty big improvement over the almost on rail exploration of the first one, every time you felt curious about a land mark you would be greeted with a no fun allowed invisible force shield.

Fingers crossed for it to be the case.

Watching Link climb slowly up a wall for 20-30 seconds is about as fun as a loading screen. It's a lazy mechanic and it has as much to do with "gameplay" as pressing buttons on a calculator does.

I feel bad for people that have been blinded by the Nintendo moniker and assume what they are feeling when they slog through a game like BOTW is pure joy.
You are wrong, git gud.
 
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So no more invisible walls? that would be a pretty big improvement over the almost on rail exploration of the first one, every time you felt curious about a land mark you would be greeted with a no fun allowed invisible force shield.

Fingers crossed for it to be the case.


You are wrong, git gud.

Git gud? I finished BOTW and have no desire to play it again. Git gud has nothing to do with it. I 'git' a different game.
 
I'm pretty sure there'll be more than enough unclimbable shit, just to prevent players from breaking map gating. There are a number of areas in HZD that could've been made easier by just climbing around shit.
 
Not a fan either (or BOTW in general for that matter). But I think it's still better than what is present in the latest AC games - you can climb everything and anything, just keep pushing the stick. Oh, but you need to press X on occasion too, seemingly quite randomly. And some surfaces you just can't climb (mountains with no visible gripping points are fine though). That's just stupid and takes all challenge/strategy out of world traversal.
And what challenge\strategy does the botw climbing system possess over the one in the new ac games?!

You know that you can drink stamina potions from the pause menu and continue your climbing at infinitum right?!
 
And what challenge\strategy does the botw climbing system possess over the one in the new ac games?!

You know that you can drink stamina potions from the pause menu and continue your climbing at infinitum right?!
As I said, I'm not a fan of the BOTW system either. Just that I dislike the modern AC version even more.
 
And i was asking why you hate the one in the ac game more, just curiosity.
Because while having to worry about a stamina meter (or rain coming out of seemingly nowhere) is hardly riveting gameplay, it's still better than just pushing a stick I think. Even if you somewhat arbitrarily have to press X once in a while.
 
Because while having to worry about a stamina meter (or rain coming out of seemingly nowhere) is hardly riveting gameplay, it's still better than just pushing a stick I think. Even if you somewhat arbitrarily have to press X once in a while.
I agree.

BotW isn't the prettiest looking animation system, but at least it provides a small modicum of challenge when choosing how to get to a destination, which while AC's system look nicer, is substantially more boring to do. Though, freerunning/climbing in general in AC is boring, they really should go back to Unity's system of traversal, it was so fun and stylish to just run around in Unity and they nerfed it so hard moving forward from that game.
 
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Because while having to worry about a stamina meter (or rain coming out of seemingly nowhere) is hardly riveting gameplay, it's still better than just pushing a stick I think. Even if you somewhat arbitrarily have to press X once in a while.
Yeah but the stamina meter is non-problem when you have a fuckload of stamina potions in your inventory, and botw is very generous with the quantity of food that you find everywhere, it's only a working mechanic at the start and for the first 10 hours when link has the stamina of a 90 years old and less food.

It's an half baked mechanic because nintendo didn't had the balls to fully commit with the stamina meter and instead it gave you an easy option to literally climb everything.

I guess that having the urgency of entering a menu to drink a potions to not fall is still less brainless than not having a stamina meter at all but we are really discussing about what is more tasteful between horse cum and dog cum in here :lollipop_grinning_sweat:
 
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"And this [State of Play] is a showcase for that, to show you can now free climb anywhere in the world," de Jonge said in an interview with IGN, noting that the way Forbidden West allows for free climbing actually changed during development.

"We hand annotated lots of the rocks, the cliffs, the mountain sides. But at some point, we changed that to an automatic system that just detects if there is a latch somewhere in the geometry," he said.

"So now the entire world, everything is automatically annotated. That means you can climb anywhere," he continued, noting that this will be somewhat limited inside settlements, where players also shouldn't expect to fight, either.

"There is more hand-placed, controlled exploration going on there. But outside of the settlements, in the open world, you can climb anywhere."

De Jonge clarified that what players saw in the State of Play - when Aloy's Focus zeroes in on a few handholds on columns of dilapidated buildings - isn't a sign that that's the only structure people can climb. Rather, the Focus lets players get a better sense of where these grabable spots are.

"I think some people think that you have to [use the Focus] to be able to climb, but that's not true. This is just for light, for low light conditions, to be able to highlight them so you can actually see them better. But the player could climb anyway without having to ping."

 
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Yeah but the stamina meter is non-problem when you have a fuckload of stamina potions in your inventory, and botw is very generous with the quantity of food that you find everywhere, it's only a working mechanic at the start and for the first 10 hours when link has the stamina of a 90 years old and less food.

It's an half baked mechanic because nintendo didn't had the balls to fully commit with the stamina meter and instead it gave you an easy option to literally climb everything.

I guess that having the urgency of entering a menu to drink a potions to not fall is still less brainless than not having a stamina meter at all but we are really discussing about what is more tasteful between horse cum and dog cum in here :lollipop_grinning_sweat:
That's if you commit yourself to learning the food system. I never gave it more than a tertiary glance until my 4th playthrough of BotW. Used it in only the most basic of ways for getting a few hearts and the occasional buff when I'd throw random shit inside of a recipe. The food system is broken if you know what you are doing or scour the internet for recipes. But at that point, the whole point of the game is generally ruined. BotW excelled at sense of discovery and adventure, which if you go on-line to look up everything, why even play? There are few things in BotW that could be considered broken/ruinous, but for a first shot at an open-world game, Nintendo did a lot of new/unconventional things that made it stand out and for a Nintendo game, it's shocking how little hand-holding the game actually does.

I'm disappointed we haven't seen more games copying/learning from BotW. Free-climbing in Horizon was sorely needed and was a huge source of annoyance for me in the first game. I'm glad that GG took that to heart and look forward to seeing them copying more things from other games to improve on the awesome things Horizon does well.
 
Commit into learning the food system??

Dude that thing is the most easy shit ever, there is no study to do, you mix a couple of ingredients until it memorize the receipt and then you are good to go, and the world is full choke of stuff that gave you stamina, you don't even have to grind that stuff.
The game is not remotely as deep as people think unless it's their first proper open world game, and since 90% of big ambitious open world don't run on nintendo systems, it's probably what happened to many people who think that botw is the second coming of jesus for everything he does...

I'm more impressed by the fact that you endured 4 playthrough of that game without putting a gun into your mouth tbh, i can't even do more them 2 run on the same game, especially big ass open world games :lollipop_squinting:
 
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"And this [State of Play] is a showcase for that, to show you can now free climb anywhere in the world," de Jonge said in an interview with IGN, noting that the way Forbidden West allows for free climbing actually changed during development.

"We hand annotated lots of the rocks, the cliffs, the mountain sides. But at some point, we changed that to an automatic system that just detects if there is a latch somewhere in the geometry," he said.

"So now the entire world, everything is automatically annotated. That means you can climb anywhere," he continued, noting that this will be somewhat limited inside settlements, where players also shouldn't expect to fight, either.

"There is more hand-placed, controlled exploration going on there. But outside of the settlements, in the open world, you can climb anywhere."

De Jonge clarified that what players saw in the State of Play - when Aloy's Focus zeroes in on a few handholds on columns of dilapidated buildings - isn't a sign that that's the only structure people can climb. Rather, the Focus lets players get a better sense of where these grabable spots are.

"I think some people think that you have to [use the Focus] to be able to climb, but that's not true. This is just for light, for low light conditions, to be able to highlight them so you can actually see them better. But the player could climb anyway without having to ping."

Yeah i was just about to post that stuff, i think that make things more clear for everyone.
 
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