Well, he is correct, actually.
SPOILER: Metal Gear Solid V Spoiler Thread | Such a lust for conclusion, T-WHHOOOO
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Well, he is correct, actually.
Freedom = $1.05
Banned
because his nakedness was a joke in the game
in MGSV, quiet stuff is just fanservice shit that embarrasses me that i have it on my tv.
Pretty much.
Y'know, I once defended the Paz rape tape in GZ by saying that it was setting up how monstrous Skull Face was going to be in TPP, and that, going by the trailers, we'd see Big Boss slowly give up his morals and values as he tries to stop him and he'd resort to doing much the same things.
But then that didn't happen and Kojima used rape as a shock tactic again.
But then that didn't happen and Kojima used rape as a shock tactic again.
To your mind.
That it comes so easily to your mind is worrying
akidnamededdy
Banned
Oh good, we're on the "Quiet isn't perversely sexualized because Raiden was naked for humor" phase. Fun fun.
As an aside, I like this tweet from Chip Cheezum the other day.
Boy that would make all those scenes where she flips around kicking peoples' asses even more awkward.
Hahahah on board the ACC with Silence when he suddenly stands up in front of you, doing slow pelvic thrusts and looking you straight in the eye.
Dick Justice
Banned
People really love to jump to the "B-but Naked Raiden!" defense.
Legendary---
Banned
lol don't listen to anyone that doesn't agree
They're delusional if they think women aren't more succeptable to rape than men.
Edit:
https://rainn.org/get-information/statistics/sexual-assault-victims
1 out of every 6 American women has been the victim of an attempted or completed rape in her lifetime
About 3% of American men or 1 in 33 have experienced an attempted or completed rape in their lifetime.
- okay I'm done. Sorry for derailing thread.
Thank you.
akidnamededdy
Banned
To play devils advocate a little here...I imagine if Raiden were a female character and that sequence played out exactly the same way, very few people would be saying it was "played for laughs."
She spotted the parasite so she tried to kill the soldier, I think it's in a tape if I remember correctly.
Dick Justice
Banned
Well he's not a female character, and we're not arguing about hypothetical situations.
ShockingAlberto
Member
This thread has officially gone to the dogs. I am going to die from some terrible combination of despair, laughter, and cringing if I stay here any longer.
He cups his balls and does cartwheels while sneezing and slipping. While also complaining about how embarrassed he is.
Also, as long as we're strictly talking hypotheticals here: If it was a woman, Kojima would definitely put way more ass shots in front of the camera.
WrenchNinja
Member
There's nothing fucking subtle about Quiet.
KOMANI
KOMANI
I'm already a demon
Yup that was the only reason she attacked.
Iirc she also beat up a few because they tried to take revenge on her for their buddies that she killed, she put them in the hospital according to Ocelot.
akidnamededdy
Banned
Well that's convenient.
Lets go beyond the misogynistic and juvenile reasons that go into casually throwing in an attempted rape into a story.
It's fucking cliche at this point. Woman character? Need to give her some trauma? RAPE. No need to go into the effects it has. Just make a lazy excuse on to why a bad person is a bad person. As if drowning her wasn't enough of a motivation for her to unleash murdertons
It's fucking cliche at this point. Woman character? Need to give her some trauma? RAPE. No need to go into the effects it has. Just make a lazy excuse on to why a bad person is a bad person. As if drowning her wasn't enough of a motivation for her to unleash murdertons
Freedom = $1.05
Banned
but if it wasn't salt water then she wouldn't have drowned anyhow since she breathes through her skin.
so yeah they were actually feeding her in that moment, which explains the crazy that comes after
so yeah they were actually feeding her in that moment, which explains the crazy that comes after
Valkyri von Thanatos
Member
Agreed, they did a good job on turning the tables.
Also, wow, I'm surprised the discussion turned to this, I was all making a huge post about Venom's true lack of free will, because he's pretty much a total robot who sometimes is able to express his true feelings but is locked behind subconscious controls on all his actions, and doesn't even really have a choice (IMO) when Big Boss decides to "embrace him as an equal" and uses him to further his plans, but then I post it and see all this ridiculousness.
Quiet is an absolutely sexist character, if the excuse for her exposure was that she just really liked to be wearing next to nothing, it'd actually be less sexist. Still pretty sexist, especially because silencing is also sexist with no good reason, and the camera never gives her equal treatment in ANY SCENE (not even one? WTF Kojima?). Maybe the helicopter crash, but since she is optional there, the camera probably wasn't originally directed with her in the scene, and they just add her depending on if you bring her to the mission.
Also, since the debate still rages (based on morals + skills):
Solid > Naked > Vic Boss > Venom > Solidus > Liquid > Big Boss
/Sissy 
Solid (the greatest snake of all time) > Naked (naive but determined and skilled, probably most "pure" Snake besides Solid before MG1 but whatever) > Vic Boss (traumatized but still has a heart of gold, truly cares about his soldiers, not training them just to be slaughtered like in OH and ZL) > Venom (a tragi figure, brainwashed to follow whatever he believes is "BB's path", not truly a mental copy of John, just incapable of free choice for the most part, very skilled and possessing a "sense" or soul similar to Solid, a little more naive like Naked) > Solidus (just as gray as BB post GZ, but better end goal) > Liquid (Despite hating being a copy of BB and wanting to defy his fate, he ironically is nothing but a shallow copy of BB, still, more skilled and powerful physically than BB I'd say) > Big Boss (AKA, "Big Sissy", he abandons his most loyal soldier to take the heat until he can better manipulate him as a pawn, by his own words he creates conflict, sweeps up his victims, trains them to fight more conflict, and the cycle continues, skilled, but he lost his edge in my opinion after GZ, after all, he loses to Solid)
Dick Justice
Banned
Yes, convenient because your argument is utterly useless, as you're trying to bring up something that never occurred. "But what if Snake was female you guys???"
It was absurd more than anything. Him cupping his hands the whole time, and the fact that you're essentially sneaking past a bunch of high-tech ninjas in your birthday suit kinda drives home that idea. Also this:
This.
She was dehydrated and weak. That soldier actually helped her with the water.
akidnamededdy
Banned
You've never been in a discussion/debate where hypotheticals were used? Are you seven years old?
I think that because she was covered up by the POW suit, she couldn't photosynthesize or breath properly. Submerging her was drowning her but in a different way, and only through her skin being exposed in the struggle did she be able to come back.
So she was basically caught (which is unbelievable) all for some rape motivation to kill a bunch of soviets. And like Paz and Chico, this trauma is conveniently unexplored because they all exit the story immediately after
Oh good, we're on the "Quiet isn't perversely sexualized because Raiden was naked for humor" phase. Fun fun.
As an aside, I like this tweet from Chip Cheezum the other day.
Crazy that we're back to debating Quiet, but this got a damn good laugh out of me.
That said I do always feel the need to point out that breasts aren't gentials, therefore the focus on Quiet's body translated to a male character would have nothing to do with genitals.
It's be all shots of V-shaped torsos, sculpted abs, thick thighs, muscular forearms or whatever the hell people who like men get off to, with the appropriate sexy poses. Focus on breasts and focus on genitals isn't remotely the same thing.
There's a pretty good pic of Venom in Quiet's outfit that's a pretty good indicator, but I don't have it on me.
Dick Justice
Banned
Gotta resort to insults now? How old are you exactly? The hypothetical in this case has no relevance, because we were talking about how the situation with Quiet and Naked Raiden differ. Not "Oh, but what if Raiden was a female in this situation".
I dunno gang. If you throw a pack of morally questionable soldiers a literal supermodel in a bikini I don't think they're gonna waterboard her and leave it at that. I'm not trying to be "Rah rah RAPE SCENES BABY" but I do think that was a realistic depiction. You ever watch the docs Act of Killing and hear the monsters who particpated in government sanctioned genocide just bragging about what a good day it was to go into a village and kill everyone and rape the women, including kids?
I think the argument "You shouldn't use rape because even if it's realistic because you are making a fictional world" is a weak one personally.
I'm much more frustrated with the thirsty and damaging camera focusing on Quiet's boobs then an attempted rape that made sense in the context of that scene.
I think the argument "You shouldn't use rape because even if it's realistic because you are making a fictional world" is a weak one personally.
I'm much more frustrated with the thirsty and damaging camera focusing on Quiet's boobs then an attempted rape that made sense in the context of that scene.
WrenchNinja
Member
this is totally the same thing as Quiet
totally
the same
aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhh
totally
the same
aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhh
Freedom = $1.05
Banned
the issue is as follows:
the whole scenario, while maybe plausible, only exists because kojima wrote it. So kojima sits down with a sheet of paper, writes EPISODE 45 on the top, and then he has to figure out what to write, to which we get a scene where Quiet somehow gets captured by a bunch of pansies and they all want to rape her because that's the ultimate in drama that he could come up with regarding a women, no matter how powerful she is or how completely inept he is at handling something as sensitive as rape
Dick Justice
Banned
The surrounding context behind her rape scene was flimsy as shit, and just came across as an excuse for DRAMATIC ATTEMPTED RAPE SCENE. How exactly does she get captured in the first place considering her superhuman powers and shit?
She apparently forgot how to drink water after MB. It's really weird given that she was perfectly fine before she met Venom. I'd buy a trap made by ex-XOF members or something, but some russians? Weak.
GavinUK86
Member
Inferno313
Banned
Exactly. If Kojima was trying to make a statement about the prevalence of rape in war, and actually went in-depth to how something like this happens in the real world and the effect it has on the individual. That would be one thing.
But as it stands, the rape scene is purely there to add tension. It's rape as a dramatic device, and that's lazy and gross and diminishes the horror of actual rape.
Valkyri von Thanatos
Member
Thanks, that's pretty interesting sounding. DamnnI should really get to Ghost Babel, sounds like it's story is about on par with MGS1/2. Damn, wish he could take over for Kojima, but Konami... He wouldn't anyways probably but you know.
He's also tortured and taunted by his enemies.
I think I agree with Dick Justice here (good username for this conversation). It's more absurd than anything. I actually think that whole scene is way out of place for the game and, even on replays, it sticks out as a "we didn't know how to fill this time"kind of moment.
But I still don't see it as an all around humorous moment.
Oldest Snake
Member
Sure you complain about that but if it was hotdogs then NOBODY would be complaining!
Because she let herself be captured? Even Miller (or was it Ocelot?) commented to that effect when they are telling you about the mission, saying they have no idea how they could have captured her.
She felt lost due to the second outbreak at Mother Base and thought that she wouldn't be able to control the English strain within her by just staying silent. So she left MB and let herself get caught by Russians. Probably had a death wish since she knew she couldn't return to MB again.
Punished_Snake
Member
Was Quiet sent by Skull Face to assassinate Big Boss in the hospital scene or she was part of the ruse?
Edit: I'm asking this because during the Quiet Exit mission, Code Talker inform us that she refused the Wolbachia treatment because part of her still wants revenge.
Edit: I'm asking this because during the Quiet Exit mission, Code Talker inform us that she refused the Wolbachia treatment because part of her still wants revenge.
Inferno313
Banned
As far as I know she was a member of XOF sent by Skull Face.
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