I grabbed one with RSI after doing some melts(Phoenix I had you for two days lol). I will most likely melt it and get the Phoenix back. If it looks like it will turn into something amazing I might remelt stuff and by back.
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Star Citizen Alpha 2.0 | The 'Verse Awakens
- Thread starter Raticus79
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I grabbed one with RSI after doing some melts(Phoenix I had you for two days lol). I will most likely melt it and get the Phoenix back. If it looks like it will turn into something amazing I might remelt stuff and by back.
staticneuron
Member
Been wanting to get it for a while. My Van and Polaris sacrificed themselves for the impractical luxury ship.
Heh, I hear that! Melted Phoenix, Vanguard, BUK Harbinger, and one of my 85x to get it.
Looking at it now and cleaning up my roster I did a lot of melting: Phoenix, Redeemer, Vanguard, Harbinger BUK, Cutlass Blue, Sabre, Hull-B, and M50. Used up all my money boosting ships and CCUs as well this week. Reliants, Xian Scouts, Starfares, Geminis all done now.
Need that buy back token to come back here soon, and a few times over, to get several ships back.
Zalusithix
Member
RSI? If you mean LTI, I'm unsure how you managed that without being there for the first concept sale. Not like you can CCU to it.
Anyhow, it'll probably look amazing when done. It'll also be an amazing pirate magnet. It basically screams "Please attack me!" more than any other ship.
RSI store credits. Yes sir 4 year version and I am ok with that. Same 4 year on the Phoenix when I get around to buying it back down the road.
The show floor backgrounds in the Galactic Tour videos look damn nice.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYeBhPvhybk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6aeRYrT8Zso
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IxJj-Tkp8P4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2eKotGpwjbE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3FSFjR0p4Z8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYeBhPvhybk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6aeRYrT8Zso
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IxJj-Tkp8P4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2eKotGpwjbE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3FSFjR0p4Z8
Mister_Bubbles
Member
Hah, those videos are great.
Zalusithix
Member
Well, I YOLO'd and killed my physical Phoenix package and Carrack for the 890. The Carrack will be bought back in 2017 one way or another, but the Phoenix is down for the count. Partly because it's impossible to buy back (physical) and partly because having two luxury ships is all kinds of pointless. My original purpose for the Phoenix has long since been replaced by other ships in my fleet - leaving only the luxury aspect going for it. I'm still greatly looking forward to what CIG does with the redesign, but I'll no longer be able to call one my own.
Somewhat sad to kill the physical package, but eh, no big loss... In the end the box/tin will only collect dust like all my other special editions. Between that and the fact that it still won't even ship for years and it's far less enticing to me now than it was back in the day.
Edit:
Somewhat sad to kill the physical package, but eh, no big loss... In the end the box/tin will only collect dust like all my other special editions. Between that and the fact that it still won't even ship for years and it's far less enticing to me now than it was back in the day.
Edit:
I updated your profile in the roster with those changes.
staticneuron
Member
Thank you!
And Wow at our org contribution to funding. That is quite a bit. I am tempted to kill the phoenix and caterpillar in favor of trying to get the Polaris back. I wasn't thinking I would use it but the more I think about it, the more appealing it seems. If 2.6 is when we see the Cat in engine I will make my choice then.
You melted the Carrack? Nooooooooooooooo
I'm obsessed and flat-out bought the 890 Jump. I wanted a luxury ship and a true "rare" ship in my fleet.
Zalusithix
Member
It hurt to melt, but it's only temporary. While I have a bunch of ships, most of them are either part of my Armada pack (and thus unmeltable) or upgrades from LTI donor hulls. Buy backs are simpler when dealing with straight ships that haven't been CCU'd, so the Carrack got the axe. At any rate, it'll likely be back in my fleet before it's hangar ready, and certainly before it's flight ready. The Carrack is still slotted to be my personal workhorse as it has the best balance of capabilities for my interests.
As for the Jump, I'm quite interested in seeing what they have planned for it. The $600-> $900 jump in price is the largest price hike on a ship this side of the Javelin, and certainly the largest hike proportionately speaking. Either they're trying to keep it super rare by pricing it at stratospheric levels or the thing has seen some significant upgrades. I mean hell, it's more expensive than the Polaris - a larger military corvette.
The funding estimate is a lowball. The prices are all original prices and not the updated ones, so the Jump is still registering at $600 (and I plan on keeping it that way). Then there's the fact that it's only based on 96 of our over 270 org members. Even if the rest are Aurora package holders, that's a lot of additional funding.
As for your ships, dumping the Phoenix seems sensible. The cat I can't really comment on as I don't know what you were planning on using it for. The Javelin would give you a large military ship which would balance things out a bit role wise if you wanted to diversify in that direction. (It could also carry your Hornet too.) The Jav won't exactly be a walk in the park to man and maintain though for personal use. If you mean for org use, then things are even more unsure as our big ship counts are fluctuating like mad during this sale as people melt this to buy that.
staticneuron
Member
Well, I am on the fence because the Phoenix is not just looks, specs wise it is more powerful than the other Constellation Variants making it seem like its real role is to pick a fight. It's larger power plant, missile load out and slot for capital pylon is something the other variants do not have. I was planning on using the cat as cargo to give more gameplay variation, but the original plan I had was to explore, hence my first big ship was the Carrack and then the Aquila.
Yeah I was at first thinking about getting smaller ships with alot of different gameplay functions and now I am realizing I can keep one or two smaller ships and the rest are large multi purpose or dedicated ships. So that is why I am a bit on edge with the idea of getting rid of the phoenix, because with a bit of moving around I might be able to get polaris without losing it. but If I can pull that off I would say that is the last shuffle for my fleet. I did want a Jump. Now I have one and the other ships I originally planned on jumping in with. The Polaris would be a nifty aggressive ship that I would probably use for the org.
EDIT:
I also might get the new Hornet MK2 so I would have both old and new.
Zalusithix
Member
Thought the new Hornet was military only?
Also, be careful on putting too much stock into the paper stats of the Phoenix. Those things are woefully outdated now, and fluctuated even in the beginning. While I believe it'll be more defensive than the Andromeda in the end, I'm not sure if it'll meet or exceed it on the attack.
Yeah, I've held on to mine for the same reason. Slightly better version of a ship that's already a solid generalist choice. It's all so vague as far as stats go that it's just a hunch at this point anyway.
I'm pretty happy with my selection of ships now. The Sabre is fun to fly, the P-72 has racing covered, and the Endeavor + Hull E should both be big earners (in different ways) with org support to help fill in the gaps in any ships we need.
staticneuron
Member
Oh you are right. I Didn't notice it was F7A. Ahh well. I can contain my expectations about that.
True, it isn't really supposed to dominate the Andromeda, it looks more to match it. With the exception of the capital turret. But indeed this is pure speculation but I would imagine, with the trend they have taken so far with ships that it would live up to being the more premium version of the constellation so that it is actually worth the gap versus just being pretty. I also look towards the snub fighters and current specs for each variant. The Archimedes despite being made by same manufacturer clearly looks to have higher specs than the merlin. While that may not be final I believe it shows intent. So for ships like the Phoenix, which unlike other lines with variants, it doesn't seem to be fit for any specific role other than general purpose and being the top of the line in its class.
Yeah same thoughts about this as of now. We have a pretty amazing ship lineup so I do imagine that not only individually but as an org we are w force to reckon with.
Zalusithix
Member
Remember that the Phoenix has its own rover and the P72 vs P52 as part of its value in comparison to the other Constellations. It's not just the ship hardpoints that contribute to the price.
staticneuron
Member
True but it quite literally states in the manual
And when you look at all the variant specs side by side the phoenix either matches or exceeds the other variants.
That is why I am saying even if specs are not final, the "intent" seems pretty firm that it is meant to be the top of its line in every aspect. So not just the Lynx rover or the P-72 seems to be the differentiating factor but a combination of all premium parts. The phoenix is unique in this regard because almost all other lines have clearly defined and different roles for their variants. The ship that is the closest may be the Aurora LX, but even that is a stretch because you can say it has one higher class hard point than the others. Also to note, the ship that comes closest cost wise is the Aquila and it also has a rover and snub.
edit: but meh, this could just be me overstating importance of phoenix simply because it is shiny. The more I think about it. Not sure if I would miss it when I already have Aquilla.
Except for cargo capacity. 😭
staticneuron
Member
Good call. But that space is needed for Jaccuzzi, wall TV, conference table and service bar. lol
I know they have to redesign it because you would ave to get out of ship first to access rover? The path to P-72 doesn't work yet? I am so curious because it looks like there will be possible changes in redesign.
Zalusithix
Member
Perfection only means "perfection" within the goals set for it. It doesn't mean that it has to be a master of all trades. I expect that in the end the cooling/shield/power/weapons will be superior in quality to the other Constellations by default, but I expect them to be the same size class. I see the raw cargo space being traded for VIP transport capability. VIP transport is more elusive than mere cargo, and thus more valuable. I see the missiles being reduced in quantity due to the point defense. There's no reason for a luxury touring version to have more large missiles than the Andromeda which has internal missile bays. This is a ship that you'd normally be on the defensive with for the stated purpose. The P72 upgrade and rover addition are value added bonuses.
My assumptions are based on the tenant that a variant shouldn't obviate the purpose of all other variants. It can have a niche that it does really well, but that should come at the expense of something. CIG has been better with that lately if the Vanguards and Avengers are anything to go by. I expect the revamped Constellations, Cutlasses, and Freelancers to be more balanced than they initially were in that respect.
Zalusithix
Member
I'm pretty sure that aspect was nixed when it only having one turret caused a shit storm. The Taurus has that "double blind" storage where the one turret would be.
Oh, oops. They should get around to updating that description one of these days.
Zalusithix
Member
I'll stick with my aquila and carrack for now, but I really hoped there would be a UEE exploration pack for this anniversary sale, I missed it the last time it was available
Ships themselves tend to consistently come back for sale. Special multi-ship packs, on the other hand, can go away and never return. I wouldn't hold out hope for any given package to return.
I mean, I could be wrong. Those days are hazy at this point. I just remember a hell of a lot of stat/feature inconsistency on the Phoenix between the website and brochure. Most took a "wait and see" mentality where they picked it up and melting was contingent on what it would actually turn out to be. Obviously it never turned out to be anything as the ship was perpetually a partially functioning hangar queen. So it's currently undergoing a redo, but was never finalized in the first place. The ship is as much conjecture today as it was years ago.
I see, well I'm only missing the Terrapin, I'll just buy it with ingame currency one day, I spent way over the amount I fixed myself already :x
staticneuron
Member
But the Phoenix does come at expense to something. The phoenix does not come with extra fuel, long range sensor, jump point scanners that that Aquila (exploration) has. It also does not have the extra cargo space the Taurus (transport) has. But for the Andromeda (multipurpose) the Phoenix is better in almost every regard other than storage capacity and amount of missiles. It also valid to point out that the Andromeda missiles seem to be re-loadable without landing while the phoenix is not. But the ships defaults (again according to manual and intent) has the phoenix with parts of the same class but have the ability to get a larger power plant and the point defense weapon doesn't seemed to be installed by default on website.
So it doesn't do everything the niche concepts do, I don't think that was ever the idea, it simply does the multi purpose better. And again the capital pylon wasn't put there at expense to anything else, but in addition to. That only makes sense in given it's status as a premium model otherwise the phoenix would be worthless. Logically speaking if it cannot outclass its fellow variants, speaking of course in multipurpose fashion, by a noticeable margin, why price it as such? I would imagine if all the variants would get in a fight, the phoenix would come out on top. Sort of like, its niche, is to have strong offensive and defensive capabilities for its class. Perhaps one of the strongest outside of the ships designed to take out capital ships/carriers. Granted though if the Aquila was to run it can go farther than the others, and if the Phoenix doesn't destroy the Andromeda quickly a protracted battle would come down to skill and power management but it just looks like the phoenix is not only the type of ship to look pretty but also bully its way to the top of the hill for ships of a similar class or weaker.
Edit: I guess it should also be a point to talk about purpose. I do not believe the Phoenix is better all around ship for the average player, but mote like ferrying precious cargo or being a mobile command center. I imagine andromeda is better for flexibility.
I'll stick with my aquila and carrack for now, but I really hoped there would be a UEE exploration pack for this anniversary sale, I missed it the last time it was available
Yeah I picked up that pack because it was such a great deal, I melted my other stand alone LTI for it. The sales aren't over so whatever they sell on Saturday for the grand finale may be some more packages.
Zalusithix
Member
We'll just have to agree to disagree on the functionality of the Phoenix. It's kind of pointless to debate anyhow since even CIG didn't have a clear plan for it back in the day. Meanwhile you have stuff like the above which is a remnant of outdated mechanics. Sizes are based on the hull. You aren't going to get a class size larger power plant to fit in the same hull. It could have a higher quality one, but not a bigger one. Alternatively it could have multiple smaller ones or a small auxiliary one tucked somewhere, but going up an entire class size would cut into usable space big time.
Bo Knows GAF
Member
Yes it is!
staticneuron
Member
Ha. I just edited my above post to address purpose. If class of hard point based off of size then that means one of two things. Either the Phoenix is not going to have capital level point defense as suggested or they are going to adjust size of ship. This also touches on how this plays out with the cat. The cat as described had an s5 class power plant and has always been a larger ship than the Connie (then made even larger after redesign). Some Connie variants have S6 power plants and the Phoenix states it has an S7 class hard point in relation to power plant. One would imagine something like that would be needed to power point defense gun. So yea, hope they clear this up because soon they will have these ships in game and it would be nice to know how the numbers play out for customization.
Yeah, they've seriously improved it from the last time they showed it.
Zalusithix
Member
Missing the commercial video right now though. That's what I was looking forward to the most!
Now would be a good time for one of those videos where they build content in order to produce a commercial. Have a Banu ship dealer giving a sales pitch on a Merchantman.
Given the large quantities of DOF, I doubt the location would stand up to scrutiny in-game.
staticneuron
Member
I think it sounds cool.........Which is why i bought one a while ago. 😞
Zalusithix
Member
The latest ATV covered this, and Roberts is of the opinion that it'd be cool to do in the future in the PU itself. If possible of course.
The MM is an alien ship. By that factor alone it has the interest of many. Beyond that, it's supposed to be a damn good trader. Certainly the best at the time of reveal and before the Hull monstrosities came into the picture.
staticneuron
Member
See this is what I am talking about. Looking back at reveal I see more concept images than on ship page. Thanks for idea!
This pic gives much better idea of layout of ship:
Zalusithix
Member
Looks like they dialed back the Prowler seated capacity during development. At one point it was capable of 20 people (plus the two crew).
That'd be a lot of drop capacity for a ship of that size.
That'd be a lot of drop capacity for a ship of that size.
mercenar1e
Member
maybe its just me but i would have preferred seated restraints instead of what they're going with here. the latest ATV is the kind of things id like to see more of. it looked really good.
staticneuron
Member
That looks correct to me. If you notice there are 10 silhouettes there. Multiply that times 2.
TBH though the brochure states 16 and doesn't have space for those additional 3 behind pilot and copilot
But either way outside of the pilots it looks like spaces are doubled.
Also I found out the point of misunderstanding we were having earlier thanks to the Phoenix QA.
Not all hard points are hull specific. Power plant isn't but engine size is.
EDIT: Adding more quotes from Ben
Zalusithix
Member
There are seated restraints, just not in front of the side exit doors. Rows of seats in the middle would create more junk blocking your path while trying to go from one side to the other. A seated person also takes up more depth than a standing person, so it'd create more obstruction going from front to back. It's a drop ship, not a luxury touring vessel.
Edit:
The seats in the one section don't appear in the info sheets. I'm assuming the info sheets are more up to date on their idea of what it should be than a render that could have come from any point during the process.
As for the Phoenix, I'm once again falling back to my position that details from years ago are meaningless in light of the many changes made to the game's mechanics. The game is in constant flux, and even ships that were defined and flying have gone through adjustments. The Constellation wasn't even close to flying back when those stats were defined, and the Phoenix was kind of a mess even among the Constellations.
Also, back when the Phoenix was the most expensive ship a player could buy, the expectations of many were extremely high on what it should be. There was a lot of pressure on CIG by the community to "make it worth the price". These days the Phoenix is less expensive than a fancy drop ship, a space 747, and a space 18 wheeler among other things. I think expectations of what you should get for a given price have tempered over the years. Assuming VIP transport turns out to be lucrative, that alone would make the Phoenix a good value. The next cheapest option would be an $890 Jump after all.
SeanNoonan
Member
My rather awkward AtV debut \o/
It was awesome to be able to show some of the levels in early development - hope I get to do more of this stuff in the future.
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