Lovely Salsa
Banned
We should build a large antenna and point it at them so we can broadcast alien tv shows
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Star exhibits strange light patterns which could be a sign of alien activity
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hobblygobbly
Member
Not sure if posted yet but Bad Astronomer (Phil Plait) did a great article on it too. http://www.slate.com/blogs/bad_astr...ge_dips_in_brightness_are_a_bit_baffling.html
I think you're referring to quantum entanglement? Everyone seems convinced that you can't use it to send data but, mmystifyingly, it does seem that two particles can interact with each other faster than light can travel between them. Last time I looked into it, anyway.
Slayer-33
Liverpool-2
ersocaster
Member
IIRC, they've successfully transferred tiny pieces of data.
Would be fairly stunning if true, as it seems to be about 100x light speed. And the Wikipedia article does mention it. Hopefully there's practical applications.
Subpar Scrub
Banned
I've just caught up with Crash Course Astronomy on youtube... I'm loving all the space talk recently <3
I honestly can't imagine it being anything more than the comet theory though, even with it's miniscule chance of occuring, surely when they're looking thousands of lightyears around, they're going to see it eventually.
I honestly can't imagine it being anything more than the comet theory though, even with it's miniscule chance of occuring, surely when they're looking thousands of lightyears around, they're going to see it eventually.
Chiaroscuro
Member
Great article! 22% dip of the star light??? That is pretty huge considering a larger than Jupiter planet would only dip 1%. If it os comets it is a hell of a comet cloud. I am sure there vould be another natural ecplanation, but... Yeah, aliens 😃
Unless the twist is that they created us. cue the jpeg.
Thank you for the article, it was very informative.
Just what in the world
sorry universe
Yeah I get your point.
In that case they likely could be interested in contacting us if we were the first species they meet.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Nope, same problem, no FTL communication. Quantum entanglement can't actually be used to express any information
Abstruse Moose
Member
So, hypothetically, let say it's investigated more and turns out to be looking more and more like an alien civilization. Would it be possible to spend X billion dollars on a space telescope capable of actually viewing something orbiting a star ~1500LY away?
Chiaroscuro
Member
Acordantly with the article, an object with a diameter half of the star disc! Mindblowing 😲.
Lé Blade Runner
Member
Whatever it is, it has sparked my imagination. What a time to be alive, eh? I am certain that it isn't aliens, but it could be something else that is still very, very cool for us to find.
I am 100% certain that life similar to ours exists somewhere, but keep in mind that 1400 light-years is relatively close. A technologically advanced civilization could be millions of light-years away.
I am 100% certain that life similar to ours exists somewhere, but keep in mind that 1400 light-years is relatively close. A technologically advanced civilization could be millions of light-years away.
What. How can this not be a planet? I assume they've seen no gravitational effect from a would be planet on the star? I don't see how there can be that many comets...
Abstruse Moose
Member
Jupiter size planets only dim the light by ~1%. This object is dimming the light by 22%. This is not a planet.
Chiaroscuro
Member
Not complete solid, as they stated that there are dips and highs within the dips. May be a comet cloud. Or, of course, a miried of collecting mirrors forming a Dyson belt/sphere.
Buggy Loop
Member
Would be really cool
if they can ever confirm its an alien structure.
Would be the beginning of a type 2 civilisation, trying to make a dyson sphere or something. They could already have it finished since we see the light 1400 years ago.
You wouldnt want to mess with them
and scary
Would be the beginning of a type 2 civilisation, trying to make a dyson sphere or something. They could already have it finished since we see the light 1400 years ago.
You wouldnt want to mess with them
Comet cloud seems ridiculous as well. Wouldn't gravity cause the comets to come together and become a star if they're all so massive?
I'm getting more excited about this. The scientists won't outright say it because of conservatism, but this seems artificial.
IndoAssassin
Banned
We already do this with fiber optics. The problem is sending the data through a space.
Scientists have been able to quantum entangle a photon through space about 25 miles apart which is the current record. This is only one photon. We are a long way from developing quantum internet. But it's looking promising.
you'd be looking at 1500-4500y. old light. Whatever happened in there happened a long time ago.
Would be really coolif they can ever confirm its an alien structure.and scary
Would be the beginning of a type 2 civilisation, trying to make a dyson sphere or something. They could already have it finished since we see the light 1400 years ago.
You wouldnt want to mess with them
Reading this thread many gaffers want to mess with them for procreation purposes lol.
Yeah really crazy! I wish we had a documentary on this phenomena ready to be watched right now. I'm not sold on comets as a reason either.
The article above conveys that there is no change to infrared light associated with dust near a sun. Plus the comets would nee to be an absurd size to dim the sunlight that much :/
Abstruse Moose
Member
Comet cloud is certainly unlikely. However, an alien civilization is far more unlikely.
It's definitely exciting. Fun to think about how the world would react. Would it bring us closer together, or push us apart? Would it become a goal for humanity to strive towards? Would we see them as potential enemies or potential friends? Interesting time to be alive.
Chiaroscuro
Member
Not that massive. Any comet cloud would be less massive than any alien construction anyway.
They are talking about an Oort cloud like that was disturbed by a passing star and felt towards the star. Of course such thing should not be stable, comets would start to melt / fall towards the star. They are saying that we are seeing this exactly moment in time, which would be extremely luckly.
Veritigo_X
Member
It would be a good way to ensure peace between our species. Like a marriage treaty in the middle ages.
LegendofJoe
Member
WeAreStarStuff
Member
Enjoyed reading this; thanks for posting.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
And used it to send information? Last I checked that was still theoretically impossible; sure you can entangle two particles but you can't manipulate that to transmit any data.
Abstruse Moose
Member
Feels like the JWST has been 3 years away for 10 years.
WeAreStarStuff
Member
I believe it has been proved that information can be transmitted.
You think wrong
LegendofJoe
Member
Last I heard it's on track to launch in October 2018.
Must be something huge to cause a 22% reduction in starlight.
Hopefully it's aliens. Maybe it's just something massive, which would still be awesome. I think it's in scientist's best interest to look into this, aliens or not. It's something we've never seen before, whatever it is, and it's worth investigating.
Hopefully it's aliens. Maybe it's just something massive, which would still be awesome. I think it's in scientist's best interest to look into this, aliens or not. It's something we've never seen before, whatever it is, and it's worth investigating.
What I love about this -- and I know I'm not being original in stating this -- is that this story, regardless of the actual cause of dimming, puts a lot of things into perspecective. Finding evidence of extraterrestrial intelligence would have a much smaller impact on humanity than I had ever assumed. In this case, we'd have to wait 3,000 years for a roundtrip communication (or contact, assuming the aliens decide to visit after getting our message). Maybe humans could visit in 1700 years if we could develop near-SOL travel in ~200 years. It would do nothing to change the Enlightened world's understanding of the universe other than to provide further evidence for various scientific theories already widely accepted relating to the origins of life. It would certainly be a nice boon for space funding in major countries, but beyond that ... I just don't see much.
Joe Shlabotnik
Banned
How long would that mass of comets last? Is it transient enough that we should be able to observe it shrinking over the next few years?
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Ah, I get why it's confusing, but this isn't actually about transmitting information at faster than light speeds. You still need to send the data encoded by the photons at sublight speeds through a fiber optic cable, its just using some quirks of entanglement for encryption. I think this line in particular is badly worded
WeAreStarStuff
Member
Hmm.., I see.
I do believe we will find a clever way in the future to use QE to transmit data, be it a decade, or a century, or a millennium from now. Then again I am overly optimistic in these manners.
Abstruse Moose
Member
So being able to look up a specific star and have certain knowledge that there is a hyper advanced civilization living in that system does nothing for you?
Netherscourge
Banned
Tachyon Super Luminosity is the theoretically fastest known travel in the universe.
The slowest these particles could move is the speed of light. But they could, theoretically, reach the same distance, in one year, 2.43 milliseconds FASTER than the speed of light. These particles can move faster as they LOSE energy, through self-propulsion. Energy shoots out one way, which pushes the particle faster the other way.
Harness that type of propulsion, and you can move faster than the speed of light. Easier said than done, of course.
Then, learn how to capture unspent particles in-flight, and you can go anywhere you want in the known universe with virtually unlimited fuel, so long as you swung by a star or black hole every so often to grab more tachyon particles.
The slowest these particles could move is the speed of light. But they could, theoretically, reach the same distance, in one year, 2.43 milliseconds FASTER than the speed of light. These particles can move faster as they LOSE energy, through self-propulsion. Energy shoots out one way, which pushes the particle faster the other way.
Harness that type of propulsion, and you can move faster than the speed of light. Easier said than done, of course.
Then, learn how to capture unspent particles in-flight, and you can go anywhere you want in the known universe with virtually unlimited fuel, so long as you swung by a star or black hole every so often to grab more tachyon particles.
Dion Blaster
Member
The light patterns we're picking up now are also the same age so a giant telescope that could see that far would theoretically show us what is causing them.
I think you're missing the point. The effect it has on 21st century human society is going to look like this:
1. Religious organizations will have to look at dogma and recontextualize it. This will not be trivial. Some will deal and adapt better than others.
2. Like exoplanet tech, our xenoscope tech will explode exponentially. We'll find MORE.
3. We'll have to consider the genuinely terrifying security implications.
4. We'll be forced to unthink our anthropomorphic views: "Why would an intelligent species attack us?" Is a completely stupid question. You don't have to go to space to ask "Does a Spider feel love?"
Ooo this is an interesting question; how big would it have to be?
efyu_lemonardo
May I have a cookie?
The answer to your question is that although from A and B's point of view there has been no causality violation (or time travel) there exists an inertial frame of reference C in which there has been. Special Relativity explains exactly how to find such a frame of reference C, and from C's point of view B will have replied before receiving A's message. Even worse, one could find an inertial frame of reference in which A received the reply before sending the message.
Without going into the details of how to find this frame of reference, it's important to note that since all inertial frames of reference are considered equivalent according to relativity, C's observation of a causality violation would be no less legitimate than A's or B's observation of no causality violation.
If you're interested in understanding this issue better, you can read more about relativity of simultaneity here.
Exactly. Kepler was looking at a tiny quadrant of space. We need to be checking out our neighborhood ASAP.
LegendofJoe
Member
I disagree, finding a lifeform more advanced than we are would be a huge wake up call. We are competitive by nature. If we see that someone else can build something like a Dyson ring we're going to want to match or exceed them. Our entire philosophy on life and what it means to be human would change.
Chiaroscuro
Member
Not a clue, it is beyond my limit knowledge. Would like to know too, it should be on the paper. Shame that we are not observing that star anymore.
WeAreStarStuff
Member
I read a lot of science in my spare time as hobby, but reading Einstein's papers on relativity have always been difficult for me to fully grasp. The man was brilliant. I even had a dream once where he tried explaining it to me, hahaha. In the dream I didn't understand it any better, I was just thinking "god damn Einstein."
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