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[XiaNaphryz]

Everyone's just excited about the practical effects and that is taking center stage in discussion in here.

I expect we'll see something similar to JJ's last two Trek films in terms of balancing the practical and digital. Which, conveniently enough, also had ILM as the primary effects house.

Welp, I'm out. I really disliked the architectural and mechanical design of everything in the prequels, especially when it influenced spin offs too.

You realize those guys were being art directed by Lucas? He reviewed and gave feedback on every little piece of art.

 

[SeventhSon]

It can take up the entire shot and still work for me if it's well done. Whenever I see this scene I still get that sense of "oh fuck, don't fall off the edge!" like I did when I was a little kid. I now know its just an immediate flat floor, but a part of my brain calls BS on that fact, a part of me still feels like I did when I was a little kid and didn't know any better, which means its working.

True movie magic.

 

[injurai]

Welp, I'm out. I really disliked the architectural and mechanical design of everything in the prequels, especially when it influenced spin offs too.

*sigh*

I was trying to be optimistic but it really was atrocious.

 

[Bucket Mouse]

Chiang demonstrated that he could emulate the look of OT-style vehicles with his work on Shadows of the Empire.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

I hope JJ's able to stick around for Episode 8.

 

[injurai]

I hope JJ's able to stick around for Episode 8.

Isn't he contracted for all 3?

 

[GentlemanCrow]

Welp, I'm out. I really disliked the architectural and mechanical design of everything in the prequels, especially when it influenced spin offs too.

Look at the set they have shown us. Besides Doug Chiang is a fantastic artist who was given a remit by Lucas to design things a certain way. He also designed a lot of stuff that was very Original trilogy influenced. Include the Outrider from Shadows of the Empire:

EDIT: Damn it, Mouse.

 

[XiaNaphryz]

I was watching some stuff on the the Robocop Blurays and if your not looking you can't tell when something is extended in a matte. The 1980s had it down pat when it came to 2D set extensions. The trick is obvious but clearly it's been lost in the move to more advanced techniques. Put a matte in where people aren't looking for one and they won't find it.

I disagree. Digital mattes today are at the very least just as seamless, usually moreso these days. And if you didn't realize, digital mattes started showing up in the late 80s.

 

[watershed]

Look at the set they have shown us. Beside Doug Chiang is a fantastic artist who was given a remit by Lucas to design things a certain way. He also designed a lot of stuff that was very Original trilogy influenced. Include the Outrider from Shadows of the Empire:

Man I love the Outrider design. It fit perfectly into the established Star Wars universe. It's clearly Corelian but at the same time doesn't just ape the Falcon design. Really great. I hope we see more stuff like this in the new trilogy. Clearly in keeping with the OT but still new and not rehashed.

 

[SeventhSon]

brb playing Shadows of the Empire on N64

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

Isn't he contracted for all 3?

Is he? I don't think that's been mentioned. I'd be very surprised if he was, considering the turnaround to get the sequel out two years later really isn't his style - much like the turnaround on this film.

 

[Tatsumaki Senpuukyaku!]

Has it occurred to anyone that they showed that particular creature because he was shooting a two minute youtube spot and it would have been highly impractical to cg anything in

Spoiler

george lucas would have still cg'd in jar jar

 

[Warm Machine]

Welp, I'm out. I really disliked the architectural and mechanical design of everything in the prequels, especially when it influenced spin offs too.

I loved it. They brought something new to the universe that wasn't there before. They could have simply played safe and copied but got to push the boundaries. Why would all places in the galaxy be homogeneous? Besides there are loads of clear hooks throughout.

One thing I'm terrified about is JJ's personal style. The Super 8, Star Trek snow monster, and Cloverfield monster all come from the same spindly multi joint family of lame creature design. I also find the interior of the Romulan ship to be ludicrous in Star Trek.

Doug Chiang has a very unique personal style. It is reflected in both his pre and post Star Wars work. Chances are he'll be doing droids and ships. McCaig will be doing characters, costumes and some creatures.

 

[Bucket Mouse]

EDIT: Damn it, Mouse.

This is what happens when you're friends in real life.

 

[No Love]

Look at the set they have shown us. Besides Doug Chiang is a fantastic artist who was given a remit by Lucas to design things a certain way. He also designed a lot of stuff that was very Original trilogy influenced. Include the Outrider from Shadows of the Empire:

EDIT: Damn it, Mouse.

One of the best looking ships in the whole franchise. Love the Outrider. Shadows of the Empire was so badass.

 

[Kevtones]

Four different and unaffiliated people in my life told me I sound exactly like JJ Abrams today because of this video.

 

[Blader]

Isn't he contracted for all 3?

No. And directors rarely, if ever, sign multi-picture deals like that anyway.

 

[injurai]

Is he? I don't think that's been mentioned. I'd be very surprised if he was, considering the turnaround to get the sequel out two years later really isn't his style - much like the turnaround on this film.

Yeah not sure where I had picked up that impression but I'm not seeing anything on the subsequent two.

Disney has a lot of their plate with Marvel. There are still 2 Pirates films in the pipeline. Hopefully that's more than enough to give VIII and IX some breathing room for production. Disney is probably holding out to see how VII fares, hopefully the put faith in JJ's hands if everything comes together.

 

[GentlemanCrow]

I disagree. Digital mattes today are at the very least just as seamless, usually moreso these days. And if you didn't realize, digital mattes started showing up in the late 80s.

You misunderstand me, or I misrepresented what I was trying to say.

What I meant was matte painting that worked in the past did so by being used sparingly at the right angle to sell a location. Take the OCP building entrance at the end of Robocop. You don't expect it to be fake so you brain doesn't look for it.

Now I'm not saying that digital mattes aren't better, that would be stupid, but they aren't always used with as much care as the hand painted ones were (not that all old matte were perfect). The prequels are an easy example of that. The Avengers is an example of very impressive and seamless matte backgrounds. Most of the final fight is a soundstage.

I was just saying that it took a while for digital mattes to catch up with painted ones.

 

[XiaNaphryz]

The Avengers is an example of very impressive and seamless matte backgrounds. Most of the final fight is a soundstage.

Most of that wasn't digital matte work actually, NYC was primarily a giant 3d set.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

He's probably doing all three.

 

[Tatsumaki Senpuukyaku!]

It would be cool if they got a different director for each movie a la the OT.

 

[Konka]

I'm of the impression that actors act better when they are interacting and seeing something that is actually there and not a green screen.

 

[vareon]

So Episode 1-2-3 Special Edition might replace Hayden Christensen with animatronics then.

 

[No Love]

So Episode 1-2-3 Special Edition might replace Hayden Christensen with animatronics then.

The acting would sure be less robotic in that case.

 

[SeventhSon]

I'm of the impression that actors act better when they are interacting and seeing something that is actually there and not a green screen.

Actors perform better when they can act with real sets and props and not have to be highly paid LARPers.

 

[GentlemanCrow]

Most of that wasn't digital matte work actually, NYC was primarily a giant 3d set.

But there was matte that matched that set and New York correctly and linked to the one shot that followed the whole team that was almost certainly digital. All I'm saying is it was pretty seamless whatever they did. I feel like we've swapped arguments

 

[disappeared]

He's probably doing all three.

Del Toro ought to be in consideration for at least one of them.


edit:

We can only hope.

Also, yeah.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

He's probably doing all three.

We can only hope.

Del Toro ought to be in consideration for at least one of them.

No thanks.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

It would be cool if they got a different director for each movie a la the OT.

I doubt Abrams takes the job just to do the one movie.

He takes this job because he gets to be Steven Spielberg & George Lucas COMBINED. He walks from Paramount because Paramount won't let him run Star Trek like he wants to run Star Trek. When Lucasfilm offers him Star Wars - you don't think he made sure he gets to RUN Star Wars?

First thing he did is chuck the script, rewrite the outline, and get the movie pushed back.

He's not going to walk after Episode VII unless he absolutely fucks the dog with the movie.

 

[disappeared]

No thanks.

It's too bad Kershner was as old as he was.

 

[XiaNaphryz]

But there was matte that matched that set and New York correctly and linked to the one shot that followed the whole team that was almost certainly digital. All I'm saying is it was pretty seamless whatever they did. I feel like we've swapped arguments

Just saying it wasn't matte work, it was a 3d modeled set. I saw it while they were still in production. That's all.

 

[Kerned]

I doubt Abrams takes the job just to do the one movie.

He takes this job because he gets to be Steven Spielberg & George Lucas COMBINED. He walks from Paramount because Paramount won't let him run Star Trek like he wants to run Star Trek. When Lucasfilm offers him Star Wars - you don't think he made sure he gets to RUN Star Wars?

First thing he did is chuck the script, rewrite the outline, and get the movie pushed back.

He's not going to walk after Episode VII unless he absolutely fucks the dog with the movie.

Yup. JJ wants to be the guy who saved Star Wars.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

Singer saves X-Men. JJ saves Star Wars.

Terminator keeps biting the pillow.

 

[caesar]

If this isn't better than all of the prequels I will eat my hat. Honestly I hope it's better than ROTJ too. Star Trek was a fun romp, but he messed it up a bit. However, I think he's perfect for Star Wars.

 

[XiaNaphryz]

Singer saves X-Men. JJ saves Star Wars.

Terminator keeps biting the pillow.

I bet you can't wait for the inevitable Terminator reboot helmed by Snyder!

 

[Chezzymann]

If this isn't better than all of the prequels I will eat my hat. Honestly I hope it's better than ROTJ too. Star Trek was a fun romp, but he messed it up a bit. However, I think he's perfect for Star Wars.

Yeah, he's got the right energy for star wars, all we need is less lens flairs and a competent screen writer (which they have, Lawrence Kasdan)

 

[ryutaro's mama]

Terminator keeps biting the pillow.

Terminator franchise should have died after T2 like its creator intended.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

I bet you can't wait for the inevitable Terminator reboot helmed by Snyder!

I'm curious to see what happens when Snyder does a Star Wars spinoff in about 3 or 4 years.

 

[Warm Machine]

I doubt Abrams takes the job just to do the one movie.

He takes this job because he gets to be Steven Spielberg & George Lucas COMBINED. He walks from Paramount because Paramount won't let him run Star Trek like he wants to run Star Trek. When Lucasfilm offers him Star Wars - you don't think he made sure he gets to RUN Star Wars?

First thing he did is chuck the script, rewrite the outline, and get the movie pushed back.

He's not going to walk after Episode VII unless he absolutely fucks the dog with the movie.

I'm not sure how much he could have gotten the script altered given the timeline. I know they switched writers but the draft would have probably gotten a slight change instead of wholesale. Also the production design would have been started before he even got there. I'm even guessing it started before Disney bought the property. It took 4.5 years for Phantom Menace to get made. 5 years since the beginning of writing. This is looking like a touch over 3 years.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

I'm not sure how much he could have gotten the script altered given the timeline. I know they switched writers but the draft would have probably gotten a slight change instead of wholesale. Also the production design would have been started before he even got there. I'm even guessing it started before Disney bought the property. It took 4.5 years for Phantom Menace to get made. 5 years since the beginning of writing. This is looking like a touch over 3 years.

Nah, it's well known that Abrams and Kasdan threw Arndt's script out for a pretty big rewrite. It's part of the reason they couldn't cast till so late in the game.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

I'm not sure how much he could have gotten the script altered given the timeline. I know they switched writers but the draft would have probably gotten a slight change instead of wholesale. Also the production design would have been started before he even got there. I'm even guessing it started before Disney bought the property. It took 4.5 years for Phantom Menace to get made. 5 years since the beginning of writing. This is looking like a touch over 3 years.

It took Star Wars and Empire about 1 1/2 years to get made. It's not like you NEED five years to make a Star Wars movie. In fact, the two Star Wars movies considered to be the greatest by the public at large are the ones that were made the fastest.

The draft got a wholesale change, as did the outline. Again, it's why the film got pushed back to December. That's as compressed as the production pipeline could get and still make the 2015 date Iger promised investors when they bought the property in October 2012.

As Sculli pointed out - casting only JUST happened in the last few months - and it's still not even finished yet.

Lotta stuff got switched up. You can change a LOT about a script without having to change the settings. And it's possible they changed some of the settings anyway.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

The biggest clue is that so little of Arndt's work on the film remains that he no longer has a script or story credit.

 

[Warm Machine]

It took Star Wars and Empire about 1 1/2 years to get made. It's not like you NEED five years to make a Star Wars movie. In fact, the two Star Wars movies considered to be the greatest by the public at large are the ones that were made the fastest.

The draft got a wholesale change, as did the outline. Again, it's why the film got pushed back to December. That's as compressed as the production pipeline could get and still make the 2015 date Iger promised investors when they bought the property in October 2012.

Empire had the benefit of having 1/2 the production design done for it. It was also a 3 year gap between it and the original.

We will see how much of the scripts were actually changed when the movie actually comes out and all the making of material is released. I highly doubt the turn around on a property this big with so many sign offs was easy to happen over a couple months.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

Empire had the benefit of having 1/2 the production design done for it. It was also a 3 year gap between it and the original.

We will see how much of the scripts were actually changed when the movie actually comes out and all the making of material is released. I highly doubt the turn around on a property this big with so many sign offs was easy to happen over a couple months.

Who said it was easy? Abrams was fucking begging Disney for another 6 months. He wanted it pushed to summer 2016. But Disney refused.

It's the one thing that has me worried. It is an incredibly rushed schedule given the circumstances.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

We will see how much of the scripts were actually changed when the movie actually comes out and all the making of material is released. I highly doubt the turn around on a property this big with so many sign offs was easy to happen over a couple months.

Nobody said it was easy. Empire sure as fuck wasn't.

The script got chucked & rewritten. Basically, back in July of 2013 is when Kasdan & Abrams really dug in. You can build sets concurrent with the writing based on the outline for the script once the story's been (re) broken. So that's saving time. But June/July 2013 is when Abrams really started pushing to get that release date moved back, and got in some fights with Kennedy.

It's not out of the realm of possibility to knock out 2 or 3 drafts between two people over the course of 8-9 months. Especially when those two people are Abrams & Kasdan.

Again, nothing says it has to be easy.

edit: Sculli & I are doing some two-part harmony shit here.

 

[brandonh83]

It's the one thing that has me worried. It is an incredibly rushed schedule given the circumstances.

I too am a little concerned about how much has been put in and apparently trashed, but I would like to think that Abrams, as a long time fan knows what he's doing and that a lot of people are looking up to him to nail it.

Then again, I am notably a far more optimistic person than you are

 

[Bobby Roberts]

Iger recently admitted this thing is going to cost quite a bit more than any previous Star Wars movie. I'd imagine most of that is going to come from having to pay the premium necessary to get all that post work done with a year less time than they thought they were going to have.

On the other hand - they're planning to essentially keep this schedule going forward, so they might as well get used to it now.

 

[Warm Machine]

Who said it was easy? Abrams was fucking begging Disney for another 6 months. He wanted it pushed to summer 2016. But Disney refused.

It's the one thing that has me worried. It is an incredibly rushed schedule given the circumstances.

The original dates had to have implied that the movie was already in development when they bought the property. No Star Wars movie has been easy to make but that original push was madness. I'm with you on the schedule being tight as is.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

On the other hand - they're planning to essentially keep this schedule going forward, so they might as well get used to it now.

I seriously don't see them holding to that December release date for sequels.