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//: StarCraft II: Heart of the Swarm |OT| Like Riding a Bike
- Thread starter Corran Horn
- Start date
Corran Horn
May the Schwartz be with you
Anyone watching the finals? Zest has actually managed to make pvp fun a few times and I like hero a lot so I don't mind these two duking it out (although I did mind that pvp was so common this tournament).
Edit: Kespa chairman is on now and saying that there will be more opportunities to earn WCS points during next Proleague. I guess they've gotten a lot of feedback from the teams on that. No word on how, I guess more events like Kespa Cup and the Race War between rounds?
Edit: Kespa chairman is on now and saying that there will be more opportunities to earn WCS points during next Proleague. I guess they've gotten a lot of feedback from the teams on that. No word on how, I guess more events like Kespa Cup and the Race War between rounds?
Everybody bummed out that flash is gone
Flash vs zest rematch would have been amazing.
Anyways i was too sleepy
I hope there is starleague in 2015
Ogn pls
Kespa pls
Flash
Pls
I can see that, although I was more bummed about Flash playing poorly than him being knocked out :/
Zest totally wrecked hero, some amazing play out of him even disregarding the mind games. Hero was sooo close in the fourth game which could have turned the series around.
AdventureRacing
Member
Anyone watching dreamhack? Really cool tournament and it could be having a huge impact on who makes blizzcon.
That sounds promising. That's been an issue for a while now, there needs to be more events in Korea and not just because of WCS points.
That sounds promising. That's been an issue for a while now, there needs to be more events in Korea and not just because of WCS points.
Yeah, I feel the same way. Watching a match here and there, but not excited.
AdventureRacing
Member
MMA has a good chance of winning now and considering his competition in WCS EU i'd say he is damn near certain to make blizzcon.
Didn't realise the semis were best of 3, that's pretty awful really. I agree that it's not the most hype tournament but it's pretty fun. Hopefully the next one has a better line-up. Playing in Russia in the current environment surely can't help in terms of attracting talent.
Didn't realise the semis were best of 3, that's pretty awful really. I agree that it's not the most hype tournament but it's pretty fun. Hopefully the next one has a better line-up. Playing in Russia in the current environment surely can't help in terms of attracting talent.
AdventureRacing
Member
Yeah i feel like you need at least BO5, it's hard to get hyped for a bo3 and they're just over so fast. Not sure why they prefer this as it really cuts down the time they spend at the business end of the tournament when viewership is at its peak.
Imagine Flash's IEM run without the best of fives. Would have been cut short early.
AdventureRacing
Member
Watching the russian stream for now. Seems a strange target for a ddos attack. Chat is going crazy lol.
AdventureRacing
Member
The power of protoss :Kappa.
demosthenes
Member
2-1 ma so far. I think ma takes it.
AdventureRacing
Member
Not yet he's not, there has only been 2 GSL's this season.
my point still stands
There just needs to be more WCS point opportunities in Korea, especially during proleague season when the best players are tied to proleague contracts and rarely have a chance to travel to foreign events. The Kespa president saying that there will be more WCS points available in Korea next year sounds really promising. Looking forward to hearing the details.
Also, ggwp dreamhack:
(MMA's trophy)
Also, ggwp dreamhack:
(MMA's trophy)
AdventureRacing
Member
The point of blizzcon isn't necessarily to have the 16 best players or we would just take the top 16 players from GSL/proleague. There is still going to be 4-5 players from WCS Korea that end up making it.
Also Korean players can compete in foreign events. Players like hyun, jaedong and the other Koreans who have left travel a long way to compete in events. I don't see how it's more difficult travelling between EU and NA than it is between Korea and EU/NA. That's more a responsibility of the teams.
I agree that there should be more opportunities for Korean players to get WCS points but that's up to the Korean scene. Blizzard doesn't run dreamhack/IEM/MLG/redbull. Hopefully the kespa cup is a sign that we will see more tournaments being run there.
No it doesn't. One of his runners up weren't in this season so i'm not sure why it's relevant. It's like saying it's silly that MVP isn't in despite having won so many GSL's.
When we're talking about who makes this blizzcon what other approach can you take?
Also Korean players can compete in foreign events. Players like hyun, jaedong and the other Koreans who have left travel a long way to compete in events. I don't see how it's more difficult travelling between EU and NA than it is between Korea and EU/NA. That's more a responsibility of the teams.
I agree that there should be more opportunities for Korean players to get WCS points but that's up to the Korean scene. Blizzard doesn't run dreamhack/IEM/MLG/redbull. Hopefully the kespa cup is a sign that we will see more tournaments being run there.
No it doesn't. One of his runners up weren't in this season so i'm not sure why it's relevant. It's like saying it's silly that MVP isn't in despite having won so many GSL's.
When we're talking about who makes this blizzcon what other approach can you take?
Rumors continue that proleague 2015 will award WCS points:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/starcraft-2/467067-2015-season-of-proleague-may-award-wcs-points
Which would be awesome, and completely necessary imo. The proleague schedule is one of the biggest things getting in the way of Kespa players being able to travel to foreign events to win WCS points.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/starcraft-2/467067-2015-season-of-proleague-may-award-wcs-points
Which would be awesome, and completely necessary imo. The proleague schedule is one of the biggest things getting in the way of Kespa players being able to travel to foreign events to win WCS points.
AdventureRacing
Member
This is awful for multiple reasons. I don't agree with awarding WCS points to a teamleague where the coach decides who gets to play. It goes against all the other rules in place for earning WCS points. It also cheapens proleague which should be the premier event in Korea and is instead relegated to yet another WCS point event.
Now something like a new starleague or a new tournament like kespa cup would be amazing. Or maybe something like a dreamhack style event in Korea would also be cool.
In the end i feel like blizzcon takes up too much importance and cheapens everything else in the scene. Which kind of sucks because in the end blizzcon is a pretty shitty tournament all things considered. Only half of the event will even be live. This is the tournament that the entire year of SC2 builds up to? Frankly i'm more excited for any random dreamhack or MLG event than that. The only interesting thing is the large prize pool and even that doesn't feel all that big anymore. Shame they couldn't get some sort of crowdfunding thing going like the international to increase the prize pool a bit. Blizzcon seems like a prefect opportunity to do something like that.
It doesn't cheapen proleague at all. Proleague has most of the best players in the world, with competition basically on par with GSL. Coaches will pick the best players they have available, just as they always have. If a player can win in proleague then of course it should count towards WCS. It's unfair not to. Those players with Kespa contracts are barely ever allowed outside of Korea while the proleague season is on, so they can't go spamming entries into foreign tournaments that they know they'll do well in like other Koreans do. Why should being a good enough player to earn a contract with Kespa be a hindrance when it comes to making the global finals? That's how the system is working right now, and it's bullshit. Everyone can see that, and I'm glad it sounds like Blizzard sees it too.
AdventureRacing
Member
I know that pro-league will still have the best players i just don't like how every single SC2 event is just another event to funnel into blizzcon. It becomes less about the event itself and more about the WCS points which to me cheapens it. You shouldn't want to win a game in Pro-league to get 20 WCS points, you should want to win because it's pro-league.
As for Kespa players not being allowed outside of Korea well that's the decision of the teams and the players for signing with those teams. I don't see how it would hurt to let some of their players occasionally travel overseas to compete in a foreign tournament.
The reason it's a hindrance to be in Korea right now is because there simply isn't much money in the scene hence why there are no tournaments there. There are tournaments like dreamhack/MLG/IEM/redbull for foreigners to compete in because that's where the money is. If the foreign scene is the one basically keeping the scene alive i don't see what's wrong with it getting extra WCS points overall.
Lets not pretend like it's impossible for kespa players to qualify for blizzcon. There are probably going to be 5 kespa players at blizzcon which isn't THAT terrible.
I agree that there should be more chances for Koreans to earn WCS points anyway, i just don't think adding points to pro-league is the answer. There are requirements for an event to be able to give out WCS points and i don't think pro-league meets them. If they're going to do that than they need to change the rules.
You kinda touched on why I think awarding WCS points for proleague is necessary. There just isn't much interest in holding separate events in Korea. It's an awkward time zone where sponsors will miss out on western viewership. I agree that holding separate events in Korea would be a better alternative but the reality of it is that those elite players who join Kespa teams are at a disadvantage when it comes to making the global finals. They shouldn't have to choose between the best team league in the world and a shot at blizzcon (like you said it is still possible for proleague players to make it if they're successful in GSL, but for most it's a disadvantage that can't be overcome). I also agree it is partially those teams' fault for not allowing their players to fly to foreign tournaments, but at the same time they can't be always flying halfway around the world to compete for WCS points. The AM and EU regions have plenty of local events that those players can travel to at a fraction of the cost of what KR region players would incur if they attended the same number of events.
Bottom line I just don't like seeing incredible players like soO and Rain missing out on blizzcon (though soO still has a shot at making it) largely because of Kespa contracts keeping them in Korea. I mean if those two were in AM region they'd be among the ones with 4k+ points right now, easy. I can understand the appeal of having a good variety of players, and I actually like that about the upcoming region lock, but imo the best 16 players in the world should be the ones playing for the world championship, regardless of region. Blizzard has to do something to address the lack of WCS points available in Korea, and this seems like the best realistic choice right now. I know it's a team league but it still comes down to very high level 1v1 Starcraft.
Also I'm going to a movie lol will be back later if you want to keep talking. It's an interesting issue.
Bottom line I just don't like seeing incredible players like soO and Rain missing out on blizzcon (though soO still has a shot at making it) largely because of Kespa contracts keeping them in Korea. I mean if those two were in AM region they'd be among the ones with 4k+ points right now, easy. I can understand the appeal of having a good variety of players, and I actually like that about the upcoming region lock, but imo the best 16 players in the world should be the ones playing for the world championship, regardless of region. Blizzard has to do something to address the lack of WCS points available in Korea, and this seems like the best realistic choice right now. I know it's a team league but it still comes down to very high level 1v1 Starcraft.
Also I'm going to a movie lol will be back later if you want to keep talking. It's an interesting issue.
AdventureRacing
Member
Enjoy the movie, thinking of heading over to the cinema myself later. I spend way too much time at the cinema ;;.
Thanks. You know I was thinking after I left, Blizzard's choice to get rid of the season finals that we had in 2013 might be the reason why things feel more skewed this year, at least to me. Players from the Korean region did really well in those finals, and they were worth a lot of points. Maybe if they just brought back those finals things would even out better and there wouldn't really be a need for WCS points in proleague.
AdventureRacing
Member
The competition feels less hype without them as well. I thought they would up the ante with the regional finals because there was no season finals but they're still the same. I think that's why sometimes WCS struggles for viewers compared to something like dreamhack, it doesn't really feel like a big tournament, even the finals feel like a small little production.