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Starhawk |OT| Not Quite Warhawk, Yet Not Quite Like Anything Else
- Thread starter MoonsaultSlayer
- Start date
PM'd
Holy shit, it is impossible to have fun in this game if your just a person who wants to do a quick match?
Everytime its the same thing. Beaten to shit by an opposing team inside the spawn, noticing its 4 on 20,.......
Think its just time for me to pack it in and hope I see a true sequel to Warhawk
If I enjoyed playing single player games or had friends to play co-op with it might be a different story but as it stands now I just cant enjoy death loops in mutiplayer...dont get me wrong, I'd love to be on the side of a winning team making a server empty every round -_- sounds like a blast...
This all sounds like what I experienced in the beta.
As for the spawn rape, I notice that gaf clans (well atleast the BF3 one) has no problems with doing this.
I don't see the fun in one team dominating another over and over till the loosing team all quits.
When tanks swarm your base try not to be a hero (unless you find one not moving and can spawn kill him). What I do is just find a corner, get my 10 rifts and build a tank spawn behind the base, announce it on the mic, and this usually drives them back a bit. Also make turrents in corners (where tanks can't take them out) and just camp with them to take out any soldiers who come your way. I finish with 1.0+ kdr with lots of kills even in a baserape this way.
Millions you say?
And I hate when someone says "they could've tweaked the last game". Untrue. Would've led to so many Warhawk 1.5 complaints.
But I do agree that it's a bit of a clusterfuck right now. I think that's because people don't have a handle on the mechanics yet. The second games start nowadays, you have about 80 walls falling from the sky randomly. Bubble shields everywhere etc etc. I'm gonna give it some time.
...though this is not to say I'm not having fun because I am. Just wish I was better in the hawk in general.
test_account
XP-39C²
A lot of the time creating Starhawk (or any new game for that matter) is most likely devided to making all the assets, so i doubt that they could have cut the developement time in half.
user8503492
Banned
This all sounds like what I experienced in the beta.
As for the spawn rape, I notice that gaf clans (well atleast the BF3 one) has no problems with doing this.
I don't see the fun in one team dominating another over and over till the loosing team all quits.
Its crazy to me that people talk sometimes about Warhawk being bad because of this or saying the WH's, weapons etc.. were unbalnced when I never had an issue with Warhawk.
I never thought anythign in WH was to bad, sure at times a kick ass pilot would own the skies but I would just change my game plan and go on foot or another vehicle. I just couldnt, and still cant, find an issue in WH that made me say "F this game" like Starhawk has made me
As for being the hero or using a tactic to counter people...man I get out my pod only to be sent back to a respawn a second later. I had mutiple games last night wer my tactic was spawn-->pod in--> run and jump like a mother fucker throwing my nades all around me praying I kill or damage something. Then in less the a few seconds I was stomped and rocketed or bombed by mechs/hawks, hit with a tank shell from a mile away, ran over by a jeep/speeder, rocket sniped by a guy on a mountain who sees my little red arrow above my head.
Like I said, many of us in quite a few games used the "Fuck it, Im not spawning anymore" tactic.
I honestly looked at my watch last night after 90 minutes of this over mutipel servers and said "why am I wasting my time forcing myself to play/like this game"....
Glad they took at hover, it relay messed with the balance in Warhawk.
I know how its like, that's why you really need to see where you land when spawning and find cover asap. Enemies will all be shown in Red so you pick the area furthest away from them, not just spam X as soon as you die, and then slowly start building some defenses there. Bikes cost nothing and they are brilliant for getting away to get some breathing space.
I want to see how the tanks get nerfed though.
user8503492
Banned
Really? Sure a hovering pilot could do some damage but if I remember correctlyit was like being a sitting duck since they were so weak against any type of gun fire. On top of that it was about the easiest way to get an anti-air kill since they just "hovered" there.
I think I killed more hovering WH's with sniper rifles, machine guns, mounted guns, and rocket launchers then I ever killed in dog fights and such. It always seemed like a highly skilled pilot was the only dominating hover user while any other guy who tried it was a sitting duck.
Now instead of hovering dudes are just dropping in as giant mechs and stomping the crap out of you. And even the ones who start to take fire just transform and spin there way away from anti-air.
I did try a mech vs. infantry fight tho with a guy, kind of left me baffled on what I was doing wrong. There was a large rock between us and he would keep hiding behind it while I kept lighting his ass up with the mech machine gun. I must have had 50+ hit markers on this guy while he was running back around rocks...and he still wouldnt die lol.
Even my son said "guess you need rockets for everything" lol.
I'm down. Wednesday or Tuesday night sound good?
Sounds good. Wednesday would be the best time.
batmandarkknight
Member
could i get a clan invite please? or do i just request an invite in game?
or do i just request an invite in game?could i get a clan invite please?
Send a PSN message to Jrod87, and include your neogaf name in the body of the message.
MoonsaultSlayer
Member
Wednesday is my online game night with my family and friends. Don't make me choose lol.
The Elite
BOSS
Yeah, I'm finding that my best offense is when I play a good defense in this game.
TrAcEr_x90
Member
I am officially smitten. I still have the same issue with it that i mentioned several posts up... it's more punishing to shitty teams than most. I've had quite a few matches where our one spawn is just surrounded by tanks bombarding the shit out of us. But, when that isn't happening, this is one of the funnest online shooters I've played in a long time. I love that it's a mix of completely over the top action with shit blowing up everywhere, really fast firefights with flying vehicles overhead, speeder bikes, tanks, everything... but then it's juxtaposed with the whole base building aspect which adds a layer of strategy that you just don't find in shooters anymore.
It's so good. I am not, however. I'm afraid to look at my stats but that's probably for the best. This doesn't seem like a good game to obsess over KDR in. I'm a pretty decent defender and auxiliary base builder. I'm not so good at killing
Hi tusken!
Thats how I was with Warhawk, took me a looong time to get a decent amount of kills and points in a match. Once in clicks though, its the funnest online game I've ever played. ......I have to get my diablo 3 fix in, but after that, ill be picking this up for sure. When does this go on the psn store?
ReturnOfTheRAT
Member
Zones is great. It's the right pace for me for console multiplayer gaming. Attack, capture, defend, repeat. So much fun playing extended sessions of it over the weekend.
Tanks do need balancing to prevent against campers. If we don't have missle launchers, a couple of tanks and arms repairing them makes a base impenetrable.
Tanks do need balancing to prevent against campers. If we don't have missle launchers, a couple of tanks and arms repairing them makes a base impenetrable.
Try that on me and I'll have to snipe you out of the mech's driver seat.
Well I'm down as long as the time is reasonable(EU GAF here), so if the time falls to anything between 6pm EST - 10pm EST I'm down.
Is it me or is every game lopsided? There are no close games whatsoever, it's either spawn rape or be spawn raped.
Also I wish you could unlock more stuff, there is almost no incentive to level up your character, for it being a multiplayer game there are exceptionally few unlocks.
Its crazy to me that people talk sometimes about Warhawk being bad because of this or saying the WH's, weapons etc.. were unbalnced when I never had an issue with Warhawk.
I never thought anythign in WH was to bad, sure at times a kick ass pilot would own the skies but I would just change my game plan and go on foot or another vehicle. I just couldnt, and still cant, find an issue in WH that made me say "F this game" like Starhawk has made me
As for being the hero or using a tactic to counter people...man I get out my pod only to be sent back to a respawn a second later. I had mutiple games last night wer my tactic was spawn-->pod in--> run and jump like a mother fucker throwing my nades all around me praying I kill or damage something. Then in less the a few seconds I was stomped and rocketed or bombed by mechs/hawks, hit with a tank shell from a mile away, ran over by a jeep/speeder, rocket sniped by a guy on a mountain who sees my little red arrow above my head.
Like I said, many of us in quite a few games used the "Fuck it, Im not spawning anymore" tactic.
I honestly looked at my watch last night after 90 minutes of this over mutipel servers and said "why am I wasting my time forcing myself to play/like this game"....
At least in warhawk there would be a jeep or a warhawk spawn somewhere outside your base that you could sneak out and try to capture an outside spawn. The maps were bigger and the game just overall more fun. The paid map packs which fractured the community and newer better looking games that came out are eventually what pulled people away.
I for one would have just loved the same warhawk formula with updated graphics and new weapons, this build a bear shit is not for me.
Mother fucking bullshit.
Being able to walk around,shoot and stop shit and fly off is much worst.
Not bullshit ta all ,it was really cheap as hell.All people did was go into hover mode and rain down terror.
Warhawks should have never had that much superiority on ground troops.
What's the name of the game?
Not transformers.
I am hoping for some form of base security measures, maybe a enemy line that you can't cross or land on in certain game modes.
Man-is-Obsolete
Member
I gotta say for me half the fun of warhawk was going toe to toe with a hawk in hover mode and chucking nades at it and rockets and actually blowing it up. I played mostly with randoms for almost 2 years and got spawn raped less than I did in the starhawk beta. Like someone else said there was always a base to escape to and there were always vehicles to grab, no building and having it destroyed seconds later.
user8503492
Banned
Exactly! A hovering Warhawk was a pilot just waiting to be torn to shreds by the slightest bit of enemy fire. He might one or two kills max unless he's some god like pilot but more then likely a pack of random noobers would take the Hawk down in seconds.
Mech Hawk > Warhawk when it comes to secondary mode ground pounder smashing.
Same here to with the spawn camping. At launch, months later when i replayed it, years later etc.. I never got my shit pushed in like I have in my first and last 25+ rounds of Starhawk.
From what I saw, even with teams stacked evenly, once a team can have the slightest edge in the first few moments or minutes its usually game over for the other team. Battling back from the smallest deficeit can be almost impossible due the obvious inbalances in the game. They horrific balance issues are so glaringly large that if you tip the scales the slightest winning is easy losing is inevitable.
Like I said before, I feel like Im barking up the same tree I did when KZ3 came out or R3...people say Im wrong, people say give it time, etc..
But look at those two games and how eaches community and sales took a nose dive due the sequel being a cluster fuck of bad design choices.
If you put out a new IP and it becomes a cult hit with a devout community...you dont say "fuck you, Im changing EVERYHING!"
You basically lose your community and still wont have a chance to bring in the new customers. You take what you had, make it better, please the extablished community and show newer players how your popular model has been enhanced.
MoonsaultSlayer
Member
Well we're all on our own consoles playing online. We like to have private matches in selected games each week. I just don't want to bail on them in favor of gaf clan and I also don't want to miss out on the first gaf gathering... =[ #firstworldproblems
weekend_warrior
Banned
I gave up this morning...Gamestop gave me $20.24 :/ Sucks but its $20 more that I can put down on Diablo so my wife doesnt murder me for buying 2 games back to back.
If I could only get my buddies who I play BF with or the original WH with to come play...but they all were turned off by the beta and even me throwing it in last night when a few were over didnt convince any of them
A big tipping point, which was actually kind of funny, was last night in a server with a clan.
They had maybe 15 members on the server and would "base-r*pe" us till everyone quit.
Then a new round would start and they would try to balance the teams by having some of the clan members jump to our team...but, before they could switch teams or balance things out the round would have already started and they would be driving tanks into our base or bombing us.
So my team every 2 or 3 matches would be clan members bitching about thier own guys not giving them a chance to get ready lol. Then the arguements would spill into the lobby like "Damn it Mike, let us get balanced and ready before you guys start raping us!"
I will say, one tactic I havent seen or used since the old "carpet bomb the carrier" in BF2 was in effect during a few games I played last night...the old "Screw it, I'm not spawning" tactic!
I will admit tho, I had some great conversations with my team who like me gave up spawning till the next round started.
Damn, I'd have given you $25.
Whats fun is seeing someone land on a mine lol.
famousmortimer
Banned
I'm streaming some multiplayer at http://www.twitchtv.com/famousmortimer if anyone is curious how it's possible to have a .3 KDR.
Yes, point three.
Yes, point three.
The Frankman
Banned
Yea I wouldn't have traded it in like that. I hate feeling cheated.
test_account
XP-39C²
The problem with not doing any changes is that there is a chance that the game an get stale. People often wants something new in a sequel. Others are fine with just some bug fixes and new maps and weapons. So it can be a gamble in terms of sales, especially if the first game wasnt a huge seller.
Everything isnt always changed, but it is often the smaller changes that can affect things in a big way, for better or worse. Like with KZ3, it is pretty much the exact same game as KZ2 in terms of gameplay. You have the classic War Zone mode in there which defines KZ2. You also have all the weapons and items from KZ2 as well. But someone had an issue with the different class system, while other liked it. It is smaller changes like that can feel like they changed everything. For me personally, i found the maps in KZ3 War Zone to be less interesting compared to KZ2, so that is my main reason for playing KZ3 for a shorter period of time. I love the new Operation mode however, i played that quite a bit.
For Starhawk however, even if it has kept much of the original gameplay stuff, buidling bases changes the gameplay dynamic quite much. So that is a pretty big change indeed.
If someone say that you're wrong for simply not liking a game, then they are wrong. It is completely subjective to like a game or not.
The Frankman
Banned
Hey could use some more people on the stream here!
link!
Man-is-Obsolete
Member
Definitely still looks like the Starhawk I knew in the beta. 15 minutes in and half the team is building, and rebuilding in the spawn and there isn't a single outpost built by either side.
Will say the combat looks awesome, which makes it even more disappointing.
Man-is-Obsolete
Member
To be fair it was lower in the beta, it didn't matter. Only thing it will do is make it easier to build an outpost AND some defenses, but it can still be destroyed in seconds by only one hawk and then it is back to the home base.
The Frankman
Banned
you missed some awesome matches, it really depends on the game you join.
Mr_Appleby
Member
bunker + repair guns can hold out well. i've been rocking the engineer skill (always spawn with a repair gun) and it can help hold a base against assault but also zipping in to an enemy base on a bike or jeep and tearing down their buildings with it is pretty effective.
yeah trying to train myself not to do this. "incoming" a hawk that just stomped you is so satisfying though.
this doesn't sound like a good tactic to be honest.
Ugh, just had the game freeze on me twice in an hour, was doing really well the second time as well. The freezes cause the PS3 to have to check and restore the hard drive every time too, pain in the ass! Has Dylan Jobe mentioned anything about it yet?
On the topic of balance, I definitely think Outposts should be reduced in cost, down to 6 maybe? I feel like 4 would be too little. If a team is getting absolutely hammered it'd be nice if they got some kind of bonus for a short time to help them out. Get a deathstreak of 3 and recieve doubled rift energy when you spawn bonus or something. Tanks need to be nerfed, I'd say make them cost more to spawn, as damage wise I think they're fairly easy to kill if you know what you're doing, and the damage they deal isn't unrealistic. Knock the build cost from 2 to 4.
On the topic of balance, I definitely think Outposts should be reduced in cost, down to 6 maybe? I feel like 4 would be too little. If a team is getting absolutely hammered it'd be nice if they got some kind of bonus for a short time to help them out. Get a deathstreak of 3 and recieve doubled rift energy when you spawn bonus or something. Tanks need to be nerfed, I'd say make them cost more to spawn, as damage wise I think they're fairly easy to kill if you know what you're doing, and the damage they deal isn't unrealistic. Knock the build cost from 2 to 4.
famousmortimer
Banned
Man, I had some fun on that stream - it was cool getting a bunch of gaffers in there and shooting the shit. I'm gonna throw up another stream in an hour or so, maybe sooner. I'll post here.
As for the complaints - I'm not going to argue that most of what you guys are saying isn't true - because it is... but I don't think it's going to be a problem for a long time. The more complex a game is strategically the more of a giant clusterfuck it is at launch. There's like 19 different problems at play right now.... mainly:
1. People don't know how to play.
1a. People really don't know how to create logical and tactically sound bases.
2. People don't know how to create games. There are tons of games up with auto balance off, team switch on (team switch is fine, if balance is on), with bad loadouts, and creates situations where games turn out to be 18v6 and it sucks. But over time people are going to figure out that certain settings suck and you will see them far less.
3. The game is not completely balanced yet. I don't think it's far off though. The hawks and tanks need a bit of a nerf, defenses a bit of a buff... and I think it will be in acceptable range. I don't know if it ever will be perfectly balanced, but what is...
4. People exploiting the imbalances create a feeling of it being more broken than it is.
You add all of those up and you end up, in most games, with imbalanced teams base camping and the fun being sucked straight out of the game. But they all are going to change. People will get better. There will eventually be a default base setup that most people use (something logical, with shields.... not 14 turrets and 5 hover bikes). The server settings will get better as people who join games will stop joining games with autobalance off - therefore people who make games will stop making games with autobalance off. Once the tanks get a nerf it will be the opposite and for two weeks you wont see any tanks and only crying about how they were nerfed too hard.
I dunno. I feel good about this game. I got into a couple of incredibly even and intense matches tonight - people on the steam saw them! And man they were so awesome. It's hard to make any grand declarations yet in either direction (which is why im surprised people are selling it so quickly) but if this game does pan out how I hope it will - with people getting smarter and the games becoming more even. This could be one of the best shooters this gen.
I just hope it's selling well enough for lightbox to keep supporting it.
As for the complaints - I'm not going to argue that most of what you guys are saying isn't true - because it is... but I don't think it's going to be a problem for a long time. The more complex a game is strategically the more of a giant clusterfuck it is at launch. There's like 19 different problems at play right now.... mainly:
1. People don't know how to play.
1a. People really don't know how to create logical and tactically sound bases.
2. People don't know how to create games. There are tons of games up with auto balance off, team switch on (team switch is fine, if balance is on), with bad loadouts, and creates situations where games turn out to be 18v6 and it sucks. But over time people are going to figure out that certain settings suck and you will see them far less.
3. The game is not completely balanced yet. I don't think it's far off though. The hawks and tanks need a bit of a nerf, defenses a bit of a buff... and I think it will be in acceptable range. I don't know if it ever will be perfectly balanced, but what is...
4. People exploiting the imbalances create a feeling of it being more broken than it is.
You add all of those up and you end up, in most games, with imbalanced teams base camping and the fun being sucked straight out of the game. But they all are going to change. People will get better. There will eventually be a default base setup that most people use (something logical, with shields.... not 14 turrets and 5 hover bikes). The server settings will get better as people who join games will stop joining games with autobalance off - therefore people who make games will stop making games with autobalance off. Once the tanks get a nerf it will be the opposite and for two weeks you wont see any tanks and only crying about how they were nerfed too hard.
I dunno. I feel good about this game. I got into a couple of incredibly even and intense matches tonight - people on the steam saw them! And man they were so awesome. It's hard to make any grand declarations yet in either direction (which is why im surprised people are selling it so quickly) but if this game does pan out how I hope it will - with people getting smarter and the games becoming more even. This could be one of the best shooters this gen.
I just hope it's selling well enough for lightbox to keep supporting it.
MoonsaultSlayer
Member
Not playing zones? I tell you, people bitched about my proposed ideas for having pre-built capturable zones in all modes but it is needed. Thankfully zones has such a feature with multiple tiers to make capturing/defending them a joy. People know their objective: go out and capture zones and defend them. All that is lost in the open/emptiness of tdm and ctf.
Playing tonight, I did nothing special, usually finished like 4kills-6deaths give or take a few on each side. And it didn't bother me. My role was more mellow, but when the action ramped up, it fucking rocketed. Love. This. Game.
The complaint about the base not being setup is strange to me. When you first enter a game, everything is naturally going to be a clusterfuck because you cant really dictate what people are going to drop and you cant sit around waiting to see what others are going to do because then nothing would get done.
Just reclaim and tell people what to drop. Does this work 100% of the time? Of course not. But it's better than just leaving all that stuff lying around when you have the power to correct it.