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[Grief.exe]

Enlighten me. I'll play anything.

I don't know why people want me to bash Skyrim before I even get my hands on it.

Your best bet is Skyrim if you like open world games.

If you enjoyed Fallout 3, have you played New Vegas yet?

Another one to look into would be Kingdoms of Amalur, I haven't personally played that one though.

 

[cicero]

I think you missed the part where I said don't argue about it, which is something I do.

However, you were tricky here and assumed a context (incidentally, upon me) to justify this game, so I will address it..

I was having fun, not intentionally trying to provoke you into a grim serious debate with "tricky" comments... I guess I would describe it as trying to provoke people into having fun with FTL. I have no axe to grind other than a kind of enthusiastic evangalism taken from my own huge enjoyment of FTL.

I likewise hate prefab non-challenges of modern games. I am fine with ultimate death. When videogames started, everything was a roguelike. The difference is that better games incorporate at least one of two major elements, either what I call dynamic reactive challenge, or offer a far greater range of viable strategic options that will lead you to success.

This game lacks both. The overall pathway and strategy is decided for you, whether you realize it or not. If not, you will die. Likewise, the way you react to those "random events" is reactive, yet not dynamic. If you do not know and do precisely what you need to do, you will die. This is like the difference between a boss with a movement pattern and a boss with quality AI. The latter keeps you on your toes, creative, surviving on skill and adaptive intuition that can work in different ways.

You speak of a "difference between a boss with a movement pattern and a boss with quality AI. The latter keeps you on your toes, creative, surviving on skill and adaptive intuition that can work in different ways." things which supposedly aren't also applicable to FTL as you are required to juggle your energy, weapons, weapons timing, and subsystems while controlling your crew members as they deal with intruders/fires/repairs/oxygen/health? Those sound precisely like dynamic RTS elements to me...

The "overall pathway and strategy" is decided BY YOU, not for you, as you claim. There is no single "right" choice you are making, each has its pros and cons. I have survived battles after deciding to open my doors to suffocate intruders along with various members of my crew. I could have easily decided to do something different and still survived. You ignore the power of the choices that you make in a dice rolled randomly generated world in a game system with a distinct intentional lack of total freedom. You seem to think that having defined limits to game strategy in a tightly controlled system within the game makes it inferior in some way. It doesn't. It only ADDS to the freedom and importance of my choices within that system.

You claim to be fine with ultimate death while complaining about how it is applied within a genre that has ultimate death as a major game mechanic. You claim exact precision is required to avoid death, when I avoid death in literally every run because of the choices I have already made before those random encounters, or my adaptability when I do meet challenges. That I came to that knowledge over a period of time as I understood and grew to appreciate its complexities more, doesn't make it merely an effort of trial and error.

It is possible to have this design in turn-based strategy, although obviously you will see such dynamism far more often in RTS games. Similarly, the difference between a good and bad fighting game is made in the extent to which the gameplay system and movesets are conducive of this dynamic, creative, reactive freedom of options. I would also say the best platform and adventure games are those that encourage and reward freedom and personal expression in how one interacts with and searches out the environments.

So the dynamic reactive challenge is what makes an experience feel alive and like success is from your skill, and then a range of viable options you can successfully take gives that skill a context to make the entire thing feel both adventurous and personally expressive. I believe the combination of these two is the foundation of good gameplay in the tastes of many people, and both are to some extent automatically created in a multiplayer setting, which is one reason why many people like playing against others so much.

Beyond the obvious RTS elements in FTL, is this not comparing apples and oranges? You are giving me examples using genres and gameplay aspects that are not roguelike or roguelikes with a specific Battlestar Galactica/Red November boardgame Spelunky/Weird Worlds video game influence. How exactly do these expansive multiplayer/adventure/fighting game examples of what you apparently consider more legitimate or worthwhile "dynamism" come into play in a roguelike? Are there any examples of this that meets your standard of good worthwhile "dynamic reactive challenge" gameplay? Why should I assume anything but that you just don't "get" the roguelike mechanics and genre and that your somewhat vague standard/theory of "dynamic reactive challenge" in this case, which I don't believe is applicable to roguelikes to begin with, doesn't have much actual merit beyond promoting a style, mechanic, and genre of game that you personally appreciate more than roguelikes or FTL?

Because FTL so sorely lacks both, if the illusion is not effective on you, then it really comes off more as a puzzle game. The difference is that in a puzzle game once your mind has figured out the answers you solve it right there and move on. In FTL you have to continue on slogging through the same stale patterns of encounters and salvage. And that is after you are robbed of the joy of actual puzzle solving, since there are so many hidden details that pop up the keys to success are far more effectively found by trial and error rather than cognitive effort..

If you enjoy it, good for you. Also, if you find an experience of this nature fun, you should probably be a lab scientist. I have no intention with arguing with you about hypothetical objective merits of this game. I am only explaining my perspective on its gameplay design since you seemed to have no clue what I meant by my prior statements.

This seems to fly in the face of anything that I have experienced. You describe the gameplay as some restricted stale puzzle-like experience where one is only REACTING to preplanned events, how trial and error are supposedly a bigger key to success than cognitive effort, and how you desire a "a far greater range of viable strategic options that will lead you to success." as one of the two elements of your "dynamic reactive challenge" standard. This ignores how FTL absolutely demands hard non-reactive decisions and choices that define each run through the game, how FTL pointedly limits the wideness of strategy, providing not limitless freedom within the world against the challenges in the game, but the right kind of limited freedom which demands time and effort to go from basic levels of play to increasingly complex and demanding strategic and tactical decisions.

Again, you seem to desire a different style of game instead of a roguelike, which you don't seem to understand or appreciate as a genre. I view the roguelike mechanic of a neverending array of constant hard choices combined with randomness as having FAR more freedom within the system it is designed in than you give it credit for. Why is it that so many of those who love FTL find that the decisions they make within its environment are FAR more refreshing, interesting, and significant than in most other typical modern games today?

In the end, I hope people have as much fun with FTL that I have had. If you aren't having fun with it, then maybe it just isn't for you.

EDIT: Oh my. This post looks far bigger than I thought it was going to look. Sorry.

 

[Horse Detective]

Your best bet is Skyrim if you like open world games.

If you enjoyed Fallout 3, have you played New Vegas yet?

Another one to look into would be Kingdoms of Amalur, I haven't personally played that one though.

I have, and I enjoyed that too. Almost more than 3, but for different reasons. Mostly because I enjoyed the conversations between characters in games.

I have watched videos about Dark Souls, but it looks awfully claustrophobic.

 

[sibarraz]

Around which time we could see NBA 2K13 with a really cheap price?

That's why I hate some sports games, I can't find the latest version knowing that a newer one will come soon

 

[-tetsuo-]

The World Building is unparalleled imo. Only Beth games have that "I wonder whats over here, here and oh here" feeling for me.

You need to expand those horizons.

 

[Thieve]

Around which time we could see NBA 2K13 with a really cheap price?

That's why I hate some sports games, I can't find the latest version knowing that a newer one will come soon

It's on GMG for $7.50, even less with the 20% coupon.

 

[Salsa]

steam getting all up in my grill

 

[Knurek]

I have watched videos about Dark Souls, but it looks awfully claustrophobic.

Dark Souls isn't an open world game. It's more like a good 3D version of Castlevania with a very mean streak.

 

[MMBosstones86]

I'd recommend Dreamfall: the Longest Journey for something simple with a good story.
And Thomas was Alone for something not intense to pass the time.

Recommend

 

[Rickenslacker]

steam getting all up in my grill

You think you're all safe selling your e-cards for pocket change and all but then they catch wind and start hamboning up in your shit.

 

[Caerith]

I have, and I enjoyed that too. Almost more than 3, but for different reasons. Mostly because I enjoyed the conversations between characters in games.

I have watched videos about Dark Souls, but it looks awfully claustrophobic.

Dark Souls is hardly claustrophobic at all. Lots of open space!

Spoiler

For you to fall into.

 

[cicero]

steam getting all up in my grill

It is quite annoying. I don't even think that Paypal is requiring the same amount of data (SSN) that Stearn is. You can opt in or choose not to, unfortunately not with Stearn. And having that in yet another database somewhere is just begging to be stolen and abused.

 

[MMBosstones86]

This friday is the 28th of June.

2 - 8 = 6

June is halfway through the year.

6/2 = 3.

HL3 launch ARG starts the 28th and lasts the whole summer sale. We're all fools for selling our cards so soon.

How does one math?

 

[Salsa]

It is quite annoying. I don't even think that Paypal is requiring the same amount of data (SSN) that Stearn is. You can opt in or choose not to, unfortunately not with Stearn. And having that in yet another database somewhere is just begging to be stolen and abused.

it was kind of a non-issue since im not a US citizen and after I entered that they were like "okay"

 

[Nokterian]

So after buying Joe Danger. Doing a first time setup,my whole pc crashes it happend 3 times in a row and that was enough for me. DPC_WATCHDOG_VIOLATION off course that stands for blue screen of death in Windows 8 64 bit. I never ever had this. Are more people having the same problem? I never had this before with all games i have.

 

[Grief.exe]

I have, and I enjoyed that too. Almost more than 3, but for different reasons. Mostly because I enjoyed the conversations between characters in games.

I have watched videos about Dark Souls, but it looks awfully claustrophobic.

That's a common statement about New Vegas. The writing was generally better.

As for RPG suggestions.

Dark Souls is one of the best games this generation, and semi-open world.

Witcher 1/2 are semi-open world as well. Look into CD Prokekt's upcoming games if you want to get hyped, Cyberpunk and Witcher III.

Check out Xenoblade on Dolphin. I haven't personally played it, but its a huge world.

Other RPGs worth playing Wasteland 2 (out this year), XCOM (SRPG), Kotor 1/2, Kingdoms of Amalur (haven't played it).

 

[drizzle]

it was kind of a non-issue since im not a US citizen and after I entered that they were like "okay"

For me, they said: Hey, we have an American address for you on our database, so you'll have to fill up this form and somebody will eventually take a look at it and we'll let you know if what you're telling is us right or not.

That's what happens when you use an american address as your billing information to buy GTA, back when Steam allowed you to circumvent region locking that way.

I filled the form up on Thursday and i'm still getting that message.

 

[Blue Ninja]

Getting BOSS to sort my Skyrim mods is a pain in the ass. I run the software, it seems to work, but my load order doesn't get updated. Sucks, but I guess I can do it manually in the morning.

With over a 100 mods. *sigh*

 

[Salsa]

For me, they said: Hey, we have an American address for you on our database, so you'll have to fill up this form and somebody will eventually take a look at it and we'll let you know if what you're telling is us right or not.

That's what happens when you use an american address as your billing information to buy GTA, back when Steam allowed you to circumvent region locking that way.

I filled the form up on Thursday and i'm still getting that message.

I think I did that once.. but no problems here so far

I just entered the same billing adress I enter when I use my credit card to buy directly from Steam (wich is rare since I mostly use paypal)

 

[CheesecakeRecipe]

How does one math?

ain't even gonna edit it

ya'll act like you've never seen a typo before

 

[Shorty11857]

Defender's Quest is a lot of fun, well worth the $5 it's on sale for. Played 3 hours of it today and really enjoyed it

 

[Acorn]

You need to expand those horizons.

My horizons are expanded enough, nobody beats them at world building. Everything else they are subpar.

 

[Grief.exe]

My horizons are expanded enough, nobody beats them at world building. Everything else they are subpar.

I think, objectively, this is the case.

Bethesda has crafted a great world to get lost in.

The underlying game is very shallow and repetitive, but that doesn't change the world.

Its interesting to observe the change in perception on Skyrim.
When it first came out everyone was enamored. It won GOTY awards, and was voted into the top 5 on GAF's best RPGs of all time.

Flash forward to today, when people have had time to reflect, the game just doesn't hold up well. It almost dropped out of the top 30 of GAF's top RPGs.

I think, among the lowest common denominator, it will always be accepted as a great game. The game is kept very simple, there are always waypoints, its very linear, and all of the depth/RPG elements have been stripped out or homogenized.

Its just very sad for me. Morrowind was one of my favorite games of all time. To see everything that made that game interesting stripped out is depressing.

 

[jtb]

I posted this in the stupid questions thread but I figure I'll cross post this here.

I'm about to boot camp my MBA basically just for gaming. since my MBA has a tiny SSD, is it relatively easy to install steam games to an usb 3.0 external hard drive and will there be much of a performance hit (if any?) from doing so?

 

[xelios]

Only Beth games have that "I wonder whats over here, here and oh here" feeling for me.

Plates, paintbrushes and randomized loot.

Lawnmower parts, tin cans and bottle caps.

Never wonder again.

 

[Joe Molotov]

so yay on Joe, right

nothing to worry about port-wise?

gonna have to fill that Trials crappy-port hole

Sure thing, you can fill my port holes any time, big boy.

 

[Gurthang]

Is KOTOR worth playing if you know the twist?

 

[sibarraz]

It's on GMG for $7.50, even less with the 20% coupon.

http://www.greenmangaming.com/s/cl/en/pc/games/sports/nba-2k13/


Here appears at 30 dollars

 

[Salsa]

god dammit

 

[AndyBNV]

Yay for a good PC port: Joe Danger runs at 60FPS at 3840x2160 with 16x MSAA.

 

[Grief.exe]

Is KOTOR worth playing if you know the twist?

Play KOTOR II

I would say KOTOR I is still worth playing. Makes conversations more interesting when you know the twist.

 

[jtb]

Is KOTOR worth playing if you know the twist?

hell yes. for one, it's the best star wars game ever

for another, it'll give you the proper context to go into kotor 2, which is one of the best WRPGs ever (though it's not as star wars-y)

 

[RibbedHero]

I posted this in the stupid questions thread but I figure I'll cross post this here.

I'm about to boot camp my MBA basically just for gaming. since my MBA has a tiny SSD, is it relatively easy to install steam games to an usb 3.0 external hard drive and will there be much of a performance hit (if any?) from doing so?

I've done the same before, if you're HDD is mains powered (which I assume it is) the performance difference is minimal vs. a built in HDD. Loading may be slightly slower, and texture streaming could be worse depending on the energy saving settings of the drive, but it'll work great for the most part.

 

[Sajjaja]

hell yes. for one, it's the best star wars game ever

for another, it'll give you the proper context to go into kotor 2, which is one of the best WRPGs ever (though it's not as star wars-y)

Best Star Wars games? No. Fun? Yes. Janky? Yes.

I thought it was overrated. The Jedi Knight series will forever be the best Star Wars games for me.

 

[Blue Ninja]

I think, objectively, this is the case.

Bethesda has crafted a great world to get lost in.

The underlying game is very shallow and repetitive, but that doesn't change the world.

Its interesting to observe the change in perception on Skyrim.
When it first came out everyone was enamored. It won GOTY awards, and was voted into the top 5 on GAF's best RPGs of all time.

Flash forward to today, when people have had time to reflect, the game just doesn't hold up well. It almost dropped out of the top 30 of GAF's top RPGs.

I think, among the lowest common denominator, it will always be accepted as a great game. The game is kept very simple, there are always waypoints, its very linear, and all of the depth/RPG elements have been stripped out or homogenized.

Its just very sad for me. Morrowind was one of my favorite games of all time. To see everything that made that game interesting stripped out is depressing.

Yeah, it's not a very deep game, RPG-wise. But fuck, the world is so amazing that it's still my game of the forever, really. Especially now that I'm playing with mods, stuff like getting blinded by blizzards and having to make camp, I fucking love it.

I also turned off all compass and waypoints, installed a mod that makes the quest logs a bit more Morrowind-like, and it's great.

 

[jtb]

I've done the same before, if you're HDD is mains powered (which I assume it is) the performance difference is minimal vs. a built in HDD. Loading may be slightly slower, and texture streaming could be worse depending on the energy saving settings of the drive, but it'll work great for the most part.

just what I wanted to hear. thanks!

 

[drizzle]

My cousin still had 3 invites for the Card Beta on her inventory, so I'm selling them for 4 cents a pop.

And they're still selling.

Doesn't the card thing go public tomorrow?

 

[HoosTrax]

My cousin still had 3 invites for the Card Beta on her inventory, so I'm selling them for 4 cents a pop.

And they're still selling.

Doesn't the card thing go public tomorrow?

Yes, but the only people who are widely aware of that fact are the ones who are already in the beta and receive the announcements.

 

[Prelithe]

so yay on Joe, right

nothing to worry about port-wise?

gonna have to fill that Trials crappy-port hole

Is it still crap I wonder? A quick search shows that it's patched up to 1.03 and notes some performance improvements. Might test out the demo later to see if it runs ok on my machine.

 

[Thieve]

http://www.greenmangaming.com/s/cl/en/pc/games/sports/nba-2k13/


Here appears at 30 dollars

Ah damn, I guess it just ended. Sorry then.

 

[Grief.exe]

My cousin still had 3 invites for the Card Beta on her inventory, so I'm selling them for 4 cents a pop.

And they're still selling.

Doesn't the card thing go public tomorrow?

Goes out of beta Wednesday.

 

[Rand0m TAG]

ok, so whats a good game with character creation. not skyrim, cant stand that game

 

[xelios]

Edit: Gone

 

[HoosTrax]

ok, so whats a good game with character creation. not skyrim, cant stand that game

Saints Row the Third

 

[cicero]

ok, so whats a good game with character creation. not skyrim, cant stand that game

The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind
Dragon Age: Origins
Mount & Blade: Warband
Fallout: A Post Nuclear Role Playing Game
Fallout 2: A Post Nuclear Role Playing Game
Fallout 3: Game of the Year Edition
Fallout: New Vegas Ultimate Edition
Dark Souls: Prepare To Die Edition
Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning

 

[TronLight]

Saints Row the Third

Seconded.

 

[Rand0m TAG]

you know, i think ill try saints row.
thanks

 

[Stallion Free]

Is KOTOR worth playing if you know the twist?

Yeah, the character interaction is still quite amusing. My GF is working her way through the Ipad port atm and she reminded me of some of the hilarious responses you have with Carth if you roll female.

 

[DeathGlobe]

I liked saints row 3 but it just sucks when you have no friends who will co op. I imagine it would be a better experience

 

[cicero]

Direct from the Paradox store.

March of the Eagles 75% off ($5)
Sengoku 75% off ($2.50)
http://www.paradoxplaza.com/buy