-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
STEAM | September 2017 - Summer Ys Ending
- Thread starter MRORANGE
- Start date
- Status
I imagine a very narrow one, but I'm not too familiar with VentureBeat. I'd have to watch more videos of this guy, maybe he's just slow on the uptake and totally fine in other genres heh.
So, looking into the original article by Dean Takahashi on Venture Beat, I was flabbergasted to find this gem:
https://venturebeat.com/2017/08/24/...nutes-of-shame-with-an-old-time-cartoon-game/
This is in VENTURE BEAT.
We've come across a lot of lol-journalism that we've have to correct over the last couple of years, but I'm going to leave this one. It's too damn good.
And you're all welcome for Super Meat Boy.
https://venturebeat.com/2017/08/24/...nutes-of-shame-with-an-old-time-cartoon-game/
This is in VENTURE BEAT.
We've come across a lot of lol-journalism that we've have to correct over the last couple of years, but I'm going to leave this one. It's too damn good.
And you're all welcome for Super Meat Boy.
Nabs
Member
Servizio
I don't really need a tag, but I figured I'd get one to make people jealous. Is it working?
This is the only part that honestly bothered me. I specifically had this implemented so that the player couldn't get past this part until they did an actual air dash. That way we could guarantee that the player had done it at least once and therefore would be familiar with it.
It's printed on the screen "Y - DASH -> Quick evade on ground or air" with an arrow pointing you where to go and he kept jumping over and over and over.
You can tell he was hammering the jump button (A) in the air too, because you can see the parry animation (pink spiral), which is activated by hitting the jump button while in the air.
What more can we do?
After a certain amount of time, a red arrow appears and points to the Dash Button symbol. A little more time, the symbol starts to glow. Maybe after that the air part of "in the air" is underlined. And then again, and again, in increasingly...frustrated lines.
You could also have a player ghost/stand in doing the required actions so they know what it all looks like. Like maybe the player two character does every thing ahead of them and repeats it with on screen button prompts until they pass it.
This is the only part that honestly bothered me. I specifically had this implemented so that the player couldn't get past this part until they did an actual air dash. That way we could guarantee that the player had done it at least once and therefore would be familiar with it.
It's printed on the screen "Y - DASH -> Quick evade on ground or air" with an arrow pointing you where to go and he kept jumping over and over and over.
You can tell he was hammering the jump button (A) in the air too, because you can see the parry animation (pink spiral), which is activated by hitting the jump button while in the air.
What more can we do?
JUMP & DASH
It's obvious but hey, people do miss the obvious.
More tash:
ModBot said:Instructions for participants:
I am giving away 2 Steam keys. To enter this giveaway, send a PM to ModBot with any subject line. In the body, copy and paste the entire line from the message below that corresponds to the game you want. (if you include more than one game, you will be blocked from entering). Confused? Watch this GIF tutorial or ask for help.
Want to make your own ModBot giveaway? Click here for a quick tutorial thread. Please give generously.
ModBot Basics:
- No need to thank me. Please don't post thank you messages in thread or in PM.
- Do not trade keys you win off-site to enrich yourself. Don't try to claim games you have no interest in collecting or playing. Don't claim games to give them to friends off-site.
- If the key is already taken you will not receive a reply. Replies may take a minute or two.
Rules for this Giveaway:
- This is a free for all! You can enter for multiple games on the list below. Send an individual PM for each game you'd like to win.
Adam and Eve: The Game - Chapter 1 --MB-534FF210335AF8D7- Taken by rainking187
Moonstone Tavern --MB-ECD88A3383231DBB- Taken by abelasabel
Chairmanchuck
Member
I have to thank you for all the hours I spent in Super Meat Boy. Cuphead must be a direct sequel to that!
Totally worth it. It revamps the game and upgrades almost every aspect.
Also I'm really loving the darkest dungeon style dissavantages that your soldiers can get.
Some Humble Bundle leftovers I've been sitting on for too long.
Just be wary that I believe there are region restriction on the stuff from the Saints Row bundle (Saints Row 2, The Third, Risen 3, Killer is Dead, Sacred). Mine are EU keys, so maybe only enter for those if your from the same region, unless someone knows different?
Just be wary that I believe there are region restriction on the stuff from the Saints Row bundle (Saints Row 2, The Third, Risen 3, Killer is Dead, Sacred). Mine are EU keys, so maybe only enter for those if your from the same region, unless someone knows different?
ModBot said:Instructions for participants:
I am giving away 10 Steam keys. To enter this giveaway, send a PM to ModBot with any subject line. In the body, copy and paste the entire line from the message below that corresponds to the game you want. (if you include more than one game, you will be blocked from entering). Confused? Watch this GIF tutorial or ask for help.
Want to make your own ModBot giveaway? Click here for a quick tutorial thread. Please give generously.
ModBot Basics:
- No need to thank me. Please don't post thank you messages in thread or in PM.
- Do not trade keys you win off-site to enrich yourself. Don't try to claim games you have no interest in collecting or playing. Don't claim games to give them to friends off-site.
- If the key is already taken you will not receive a reply. Replies may take a minute or two.
Rules for this Giveaway:
- This giveaway is a raffle. The winners will be selected by random draw 3 hours after the draw was created. Any games not claimed after that point will be given away first come first serve.
Risen 3 Complete Edition --
MB-F4F2C88C61C45E65- Taken by someguyinahat. 5 entrants total.
Sacred Franchise Pack --MB-6C36767902BF854D- Taken by Sarcasm. 3 entrants total.
Cook, Serve, Delicious! --MB-9F6BBDD3CD2315C2- Taken by ScreamingTrees. 2 entrants total.
Goat Simulator: GOATY --MB-FDE6EE867DAE4764- Taken by rainking187. 1 entrants total.
Killer is Dead Nightmare Edition --MB-8059F201FC00928D- Taken by boybrushdRED. 10 entrants total.
Odallus: The Dark Call --MB-4A7B5A412B52D6C2- Taken by FeedMeAStrayCat. 2 entrants total.
Oniken --MB-DC845974338FC925- Taken by Orakio Rob. 1 entrants total.
PAC-MAN 256 --MB-2494DDCB90E92DBD- Taken by voodooray. 5 entrants total.
Saints Row 2 -- MB-D82776780F1FB71B
Saints Row The Third --MB-2338425917AA75F6- Taken by ThirtyFour. 1 entrants total.
I don't like to talk bad about journalist articles and player's skills because playing in a trade show or public place isn't the best environment, but Dean's article is not only inaccurate, but it's unfair with the game and his devs.
Sorry, but not. Cuphead is a shoot, jump and run game. If you have hard time following the instructions and realizing that your jump isn't enough to get over the next obstacle and you need to jump off the only other platform to gain more height, doesn't make the game so difficult that excludes the beginners and the devs a liars. Maybe, only maybe, you have a hard time to get focused while playing in a trade show, you were tired or had a bad day.
Sorry, but not. Cuphead is a shoot, jump and run game. If you have hard time following the instructions and realizing that your jump isn't enough to get over the next obstacle and you need to jump off the only other platform to gain more height, doesn't make the game so difficult that excludes the beginners and the devs a liars. Maybe, only maybe, you have a hard time to get focused while playing in a trade show, you were tired or had a bad day.
In fact all games, the most shallow and easiest of games do. Even Telltale games have a small tutorial dialogue at the beginning to tell you how making decisions work.
Having that tutorial is part of making these games more accessible, in this case especially as the game doesn't seem to let you pass until you've beaten these specific road blocks, therefore making entirely sure that you have a general grasp of all the concepts before the game throws you into the action.
I haven't read the comment section so i might be off here, but i would say that is an incredible, intellectually dishonest strawman.
We've seen all of this argument happening around Polygon's NuDoom gameplay already with people making similar disingenuous arguments.
While i don't want to justify any form of actually hate- or spiteful comment, nobody's expecting everyone - to quote Arthur "Doom Gameplay" Gies - to play MLG style.
People (as well as the medium of game itself) are expecting a basic understanding of videogame interactivity and input methods.
Nobody complained about Arthur Gies because he sucked so hard and failed at the game, as he factually did not, his DOOM gameplay did not show him actually dying in the game, people complained that he was playing like the first human to ever touch a gamepad (and the fact that he's a reviewer who's doing it where certain expectations should be had).
Anyways, Videogames are an interactive medium.
As such, they will always exclude people that are not capable of properly interacting with it. And there isn't anything wrong with it either.
If anything, it's a good thing. It means the interactivity matters, while it's unfortunate to those who are not physically or mentally able enough to play a specific game, there's no reason to have every game cater to the lowest common denomitor.
There are some games that do it and that's fine.
There also some that don't and that's fine too.
If we want to have diversity in this medium, we also gonna have to allow for diversity in difficulty and complexity. It means there are going to be hardcore character action and grand strategy games next to Uncharted and Telltale adventures.
If a developer's explicit goal was to make a game that makes his playerbase sweat and curse, giving the options for easier difficulty modes would directly compromise said goal.
While you are allowed to ask, you are not entitled to have the developer compromise their own vision just to accomodate you. It's on the dev to figure out how much options he's willing to give to the player.
But at the end of the day, even on the most braindead of difficulty modes you're going to get stuck if you're not capable of pressing A -> Y in this order, which seemed to be the actual issue with this Cuphead gameplay rather than its difficulty.
And that's just life.
so if you still buy indie games instead of waiting for the inevitable bundle (sorry Cuphead dev in the thread >_>), Songbringer looks fucking dope.
Have the Y button graphic grow in size after each failed attempt?
Servizio
I don't really need a tag, but I figured I'd get one to make people jealous. Is it working?
The impression I'm getting is that Cuphead is going to inevitably get a face full of the "Cartoons = For Kids, Therefore Easy" fallacy and there's probably not a lot you can do about that between now and release.
Yeah no, spin it all you want Mr Takahashi but that's really bad.
I know the game is supposed to be hard, and I don't expect anything stellar from a game journalist on his first try, but this goes way beyond first try shittiness.
Why, for example, are you fucking air dashing through ennemies on a regular basis when the fucking game keeps punishing you quite clearly for it ?
I can understand newbiness, lack of skill, etc. no problem. That's on another level.
And on the subject of representing the experience of a novice gamer, yeah why not, but you are really representing someone who never touched a controller in his life. Like my mom. And my mom would be bright enough to learn from her mistakes and not repeat them again and again.
I think maybe this is what irks some people in these type of video, not that the player is bad, but that he is so bad that you say to yourself there is no way this man play games even on a semi regular basis. What's the point of the input then ? I don't ask for a pro-gamer video, not even a gamer video.
I know the game is supposed to be hard, and I don't expect anything stellar from a game journalist on his first try, but this goes way beyond first try shittiness.
Why, for example, are you fucking air dashing through ennemies on a regular basis when the fucking game keeps punishing you quite clearly for it ?
I can understand newbiness, lack of skill, etc. no problem. That's on another level.
And on the subject of representing the experience of a novice gamer, yeah why not, but you are really representing someone who never touched a controller in his life. Like my mom. And my mom would be bright enough to learn from her mistakes and not repeat them again and again.
I think maybe this is what irks some people in these type of video, not that the player is bad, but that he is so bad that you say to yourself there is no way this man play games even on a semi regular basis. What's the point of the input then ? I don't ask for a pro-gamer video, not even a gamer video.
Kaleinc
Banned
Something like book reviewer who can't read.
Hint prompt which shows character standing on a short cube and then inputs: hold A, Y but I wouldn't bother.
Please stop. that's so painful to watch.
yeah this whole thing is just bizarre, that video plays like the person playing is high or something, but then the super meat boy thing just makes it all the more apalling lol, what the hell is going on...
anyways, i was meaning to play some more la noire but got distracted watching league of legends and haven't played in a few days
big case is starting to heat up with some dumb time wasting treasure hunting bullshit and i guess all those people i sent to the gas chamber haven't been killed yet so they might wash police mishandling away in the end or something i guess. this game is pretty decent anti death-penalty propaganda, you get a nice first hand look at the negligence and general ineptitude and uselessness of cops, from the bottom to the top of the chain of command, so i'm gonna commend it for showing cops as trash, i very much like that
kind of hope it wraps up soon, the game kind of got too repetitive at this point, but also it feels like no matter what you do you kind of find the damning evidence in the trunk of the guy's car anyways so it's not like all my fuckups really matter i think
so yeah, idk, i like things about the game, i like playing it in black and white and i love the music, and i think it sometimes makes good on its potential, but it's too broken and awkward and unfocused to be a complete game
hope at least there's a satisfying ending to it
anyways, i was meaning to play some more la noire but got distracted watching league of legends and haven't played in a few days
big case is starting to heat up with some dumb time wasting treasure hunting bullshit and i guess all those people i sent to the gas chamber haven't been killed yet so they might wash police mishandling away in the end or something i guess. this game is pretty decent anti death-penalty propaganda, you get a nice first hand look at the negligence and general ineptitude and uselessness of cops, from the bottom to the top of the chain of command, so i'm gonna commend it for showing cops as trash, i very much like that
kind of hope it wraps up soon, the game kind of got too repetitive at this point, but also it feels like no matter what you do you kind of find the damning evidence in the trunk of the guy's car anyways so it's not like all my fuckups really matter i think
so yeah, idk, i like things about the game, i like playing it in black and white and i love the music, and i think it sometimes makes good on its potential, but it's too broken and awkward and unfocused to be a complete game
hope at least there's a satisfying ending to it
Tizoc
Member
*polygon doom 2016.gif*
Nyteshade517
Member
Coreda
Member
At least he doesn't appear to review games
Things like this though are why I pay little attention to Metacritic scores.Edit:
Oh wow lol
I'm getting nervous watching that. Kinda like when I see my mom use her PC.
Jim_Cacher
Member
That Cuphead gif made my day.
hardcastlemccormick
Banned
I actually completely agree with his comment.
That being said, saying this to defend the inability to figure out the open few jumps? Not feeling that.
I'm probably not going to play Cuphead because I am genuinely crap at platforming, so buying the game would just give me a half hour of frustration and then never playing it again. It's just reality here - I will never see the majority of content in that game. Neither Bloodborne, where I spent hours in the opening level and never beat it.
Looking at it without context, I can understand how someone not as proficient as us in video games can stumble on that obstacle. Previously the player had to follow 2 simple instructions, duck and jump, that instantly made him move forward but, out of nowhere, comes a much more complex string of actions that seem to have a small window to actually be successful, jump & dash across. It's understandable that a non videogame-familiar player might read that instruction and assume that you can just dash across a particular high object that can't be jumped over.
In all honesty, the game's at fault here not the player. It should either present much easier to perform actions before this dash sequence or the text should be much more clear.
Wok
Member
What more can we do?
Actually, the whole problem here comes from the fact that the player is confortable staying between the cube and the cylinder.
So, change the text for the "JUMP" section to make it obvious that the player has to jump ONTO the cube, instead of ABOVE it. You could change the text once the player hits the ground between the cube and the cylinder.
Another trick could be to make the cube glow yellow, so that the player's attention is back to the cube.
Yep, this would also work.
I honestly don't see it. Instructions are more than clear enough, as it is the way it's all presented.
The problem isn't the fact that is difficult to go over this kind of obstacle, and we can argue even about that, but the fact that who is playing isn't even able to try what the game is telling to him, jump and dash.
What he is doing is jumping, jumping, jumping and more brainless jumping
If my father, 60, is playing Just Cause 3 with the hook and all the shit that you need to do to maintain the momentum in the air...well, I think that everyone in this world can read and follow the instructions
Jim_Cacher
Member
Would moving the "Dash" text closer to the cube helps? In that way, it signals the player to dash immediately after jumping off from the cube.
New trailer for The Good Life (Swery)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1MzVVp-aqUs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1MzVVp-aqUs
texhnolyze
Banned
Doom gif is funny, but the Cuphead one is just painful.
After witnessing on of my console-only friends play the first level of DOOM on PC with mouse and keyboard this gif looks so shockingly harmless in comparison.
I don't get the impression the instructions point out you should jump & dash, at first glance I see two separate instructions not stringed together.
Jumping over and over again is stupid, I agree, but he eventually tries to dash mid-air, duck&jump, looking up and jumping, he's doing it wrong but it seems he's trying different things. Besides let's not forget that stuff like Sonic 3 barrel exists, and I say this as someone that still doesn't understand how someone can get stuck there.
Coreda
Member
Simply moving the 'Jump' tip over the box would have made a difference for such players, probably. You can see he jumped exactly where it says 'Jump' but failed to understand the need to jump from the box to the next column like any reasonable person
Here are some re-arranged layouts from least signpost-y to spelling it out:
Jawmuncher
Member
I hope the cuphead devs change nothing.
- Status
Similar threads
- Locked