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[CentralScrutinizer]

In the end it's seriously only nine days. I'm curious if people would be more upset at this, or if there was no time lock and the game was delayed by nine days. I can understand the anger if we have to wait two months for the full game like Splatoon, but we don't. We literally get new features every single day. You go to work/school, come home and make some levels, play for a few hours, go to bed and repeat the cycle, except every new day with have new angles to the game.

 

[BGBW]

There's other smaller, less obvious jabs at their customers... like the simplification of the 3D Mario games, in 3D World, or the removal of item holding in Mario Kart 8. Nintendo assumes their customers are children at this point, and it's because those that aren't just keep buying the games, regardless of the flaws in their design.

Wow. I think you're literally seeing things that aren't there. If anything a lack of item holding makes Mario Kart 8 harder. 3D Land (the one that actually started it) just took 2D Mario and put it on a 3D plane controls and all. Well not quite, it actually added to the arsenal like roll jumping and whatnot... so the opposite of simplification. Seriously, Nintendo is not out to get you and Reggie isn't personally wanting to make jabs at you. Relax. It's videogames. Have fun and enjoy.

 

[Diprosalic]

assuming this is not always online i can just put the calendar 9 days ahead no?

 

[Ozium]

1. Nintendo was completely upfront about this? To me, completely upfront doesn't involve telling you that most of the content that's been advertised for more than a year is time-locked.

2. You were discussing the idea of Nintendo giving people the game its designers designed. Ultimately that is not relevant to the issue that the way they designed it isn't very good. Further, the Street Fighter X Tekken debacle wasn't even truly something worthy of controversy because the roster wasn't really "incomplete." A more likely scenario is that the designers made a base game and then when the game was done, instead of releasing it much earlier, they worked on DLC content.

No I was discussing the idea of paying for something that was designed a specific way and that the company that was releasing said product was telling you this in advertising/promotional material before you have to put any money down to purchase it.

It's upfront because they literally told you before the game has even gone on sale that this is what you are getting for your money. There are a ton of things in promotional materials that are not accessible immediately upon loading the game, are they also duping you?

You're acting as if the game just came out and people discovered this time-locked system and are angry at being blind-sided.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

I can't even come to grips with the thought that Nintendo believes the Minecraft generation (with some sprinkling of LBP, Project Spark, and indie development) needs their hands held through making Mario levels.

An actual tutorial (with achievements for trying everything) would have been more logical and seem less big brotherly.

 

[A Link to the Past]

In the end it's seriously only nine days. I'm curious if people would be more upset at this, or if there was no time lock and the game was delayed by nine days. I can understand the anger if we have to wait two months for the full game like Splatoon, but we don't. We literally get new features every single day. You go to work/school, come home and make some levels, play for a few hours, go to bed and repeat the cycle, except every new day with have new angles to the game.

But this doesn't address the issue people have that the limitations aren't desirable to them.

As for the delay, it doesn't work as an argument because delaying the game wouldn't have a similar effect. People would probably be frustrated, but for different reasons.

 

[Captain Europe]

You're serious aren't you?

The shadiness of on-disc DLC, and the shadiness of treating you're customers like they aren't smart enough to use a simple level editor are very different things.

Nintendo used a similar tactic w/Splatoon, and it's rank play. Locking it behind some arbitrary goal that Nintendo had set, because they assumed the people playing weren't smart enough to comprehend a simple concept that had existed outside of the Nintendo eco-system of games for years.

There's other smaller, less obvious jabs at their customers... like the simplification of the 3D Mario games, in 3D World, or the removal of item holding in Mario Kart 8. Nintendo assumes their customers are children at this point, and it's because those that aren't just keep buying the games, regardless of the flaws in their design.

Bad design is bad.

Uhm, removing item holding made MK8 less random and more skill-based than the previous MK games. And 3D World isn't any simpler than the Galaxy games or Mario 64/Sunshine.

assuming this is not always online i can just put the calendar 9 days ahead no?

You have to do it 9 times for the 9 days. If this will even work.

 

[Molemitts]

As you say, playing for 5 min a day for nine days is not a superior system to unlocking content through normal play. The main problem is that Super Mario Maker doesn't have "normal play" (formal levels per se, 1-1, 1-2... 8-4), you have to consider that if they locked the last batch of pieces only for players who beat the 100 level challenge, how many people would be left out of those pieces?

The moment Nintendo considered not having all the pieces available from the start (which I don't think is a bad idea), the 5min/9day lock seems to be the less bad option.

Then it shouldn't be locked behind any super hard, or time consuming challenges. There are levels included that content could be locked behind, those levels could show unique or interesting ways to use a object. Or objects can be unlocked once you've designed and completed levels that meet certain criteria. I agree that locking stuff behind hard challenges would be unfair.

Well the gameplay of Mario Maker is both making and playing. Unlocks behind playing seem to be the Amiibo costumes, which makes sense since unlocking parts behind a skill ceiling could permanently lock people out of tools whereas at least the costumes are just fun little extras.

With the making they currently say play with a new pack of tools for five minutes to unlock the next 'shipment' which will arrive the next day. That's basically a free for all five minutes that you can do whatever you want with. They said this is a tool designed around experimentation so they don't really want to tell you what to do so this makes sense. Of course the big beef here is the shipment time. Do I agree with it? No. Will I make a big deal over it? No.

However, lets say after five minutes the next batch of stuff arrived. The user may have not finished experimenting with the initial batch. After another five minutes more is added when they still haven't bothered with the initial ones they unlocked. They may feel like they're getting bombarded with stuff (of course if everything was unlocked at the beginning this feeling would not happen). So I guess they thought leaving it to the next day allows one to comfortably finish with the playing around at your own pace before worrying about the next lot.

If anything the big flaw is the nine days. I'm guessing if it was just four days there'd be less concern because each pack would be bigger. Some after all only give you about three items which isn't really worth waiting a day for.

Then why would stuff unlock every 5 minutes? It should be instead about getting the player to experience that object, through play, or creation. Making sure that the player actually know the use for each item. This means experienced players learn quickly so they can move on fast, as the have less use for tutorials. While less experienced players spend more time unlocking each item, and thus more time learning. It's a case of having items unlock at the right pace.

 

[A Link to the Past]

No I was discussing the idea of paying for something that was designed a specific way and that the company that was releasing said product was telling you this in advertising/promotional material before you have to put any money down to purchase it.

It's upfront because they literally told you before the game has even gone on sale that this is what you are getting for your money. There are a ton of things in promotional materials that are not accessible immediately upon loading the game, are they also duping you?

You're acting as if the game just came out and people discovered this time-locked system and are angry at being blind-sided.

No, I'm acting like Nintendo advertised it for a year without mentioning any limitation system and then announced it less than a month before its release.

As for the first issue, SFxT didn't withhold anything. The content was designed effectively post-development. SFxT didn't launch half-finished.

Uhm, removing item holding made MK8 less random and more skill-based than the previous MK games. And 3D World isn't any simpler than the Galaxy games or Mario 64/Sunshine.

To be fair, 3D World is probably the most pathed 3D Mario game besides 3D Land.

 

[Ushojax]

Isn't this how Brain Training worked? Every day you played the game, a new mode would unlock.

 

[beril]

assuming this is not always online i can just put the calendar 9 days ahead no?

you have to play 5 minutes each day and then switch the calender 1 day at a time

 

[A Link to the Past]

Isn't this how Brain Training worked? Every day you played the game, a new mode would unlock.

Brain Age isn't core-focused though. If they're trying to recreate that kind of system, then they're barking up the wrong tree because that audience isn't buying Mario Maker.

 

[CentralScrutinizer]

But this doesn't address the issue people have that the limitations aren't desirable to them.

As for the delay, it doesn't work as an argument because delaying the game wouldn't have a similar effect. People would probably be frustrated, but for different reasons.

I guess I can't understand because I'm of a different mind set when it comes to stuff like this. My intention with this game was never to attack day one and rip its content to spreads creating level after level after level. There's a learning period to everything and I like the idea of learning new tricks every day. I know people wanted this day one and I can see why they're mad, but in the grand scheme of things, this is so tiny. This game is meant to have a long lasting community, Nintendo is just trying to find a way to make sure everyone goes through the same hoops.

Not a problem for me. I actually like this approach. I understand why some don't.

 

[Floex]

In the end it's seriously only nine days. I'm curious if people would be more upset at this, or if there was no time lock and the game was delayed by nine days. I can understand the anger if we have to wait two months for the full game like Splatoon, but we don't. We literally get new features every single day. You go to work/school, come home and make some levels, play for a few hours, go to bed and repeat the cycle, except every new day with have new angles to the game.

To play devil's advocate, exactly it's only 9 days. Why hold content back for 9 days?

 

[Screamapillar]

Ah, of course.

There just has to be something that is annoying.

You put into words what I was unable to, but felt the same about.

I mean, here's the thing. I completely understand Nintendo's intentions, here. I get it. From their perspective, it certainly makes sense to ease players into a new style of game for them. The problem is, I'm a customer, not an employee, and I don't care about the business end of it. I want to buy a game and have total access. Immediately.

There ought to be an option to skip the "time delay" for advanced players that want to hop right in.

Nintendo should patch that in for release day. There's still time.

 

[CentralScrutinizer]

To play devil's advocate, exactly it's only 9 days. Why hold content back for 9 days?

For the reasons explained already. Nintendo wants people to experiment with every idea first before adding in new components. It's like making more sophisticated level designers. That's their goal. It's either do this and let you explore the content every day on your own, or set arbitrary tutorials on level design where they force you to make x amount of levels with certain things before unlocking more of the builder. I prefer the nine day method.

 

[BGBW]

Then why would stuff unlock every 5 minutes? It should be instead about getting the player to experience that object, through play, or creation. Making sure that the player actually know the use for each item. This means experienced players learn quickly so they can move on fast, as the have less use for tutorials. While less experienced players spend more time unlocking each item, and thus more time learning. It's a case of having items unlock at the right pace.

How do you measure the player knowing how an item works especially when we've seen just how creative one can be with the items? There's no right way to use an item and it would go against what Nintendo wants to be to say there is. Like I said, this is a Mario Paint pseudo sequel. The only rule is Mario must be able to reach the end of the level. You can place items however you wish and they're not going to tell you how.

Using time is an easy way to know someone has played around with the items without telling them how they should (obviously I realise the player is being told in another way how they should play with the locking off of items and fixed order).

 

[Captain Europe]

To be fair, 3D World is probably the most pathed 3D Mario game besides 3D Land.

I know that open world is a thing now, but pathed doesn't have to be bad. I believe it gives the designers a better oppertunity to design great platforming courses. Plus the linear 3D Mario thing started with Galaxy not 3D World, despite what most believe.

 

[KeRaSh]

I do think skipping to the next day and playing for 5 minutes should technically work since it has to unlock all tools for offline players, too.
The real question is: Will the tools stay if you set it back to the actual date again? And if not, will I be able to upload a level with a wrong system time?

 

[A Link to the Past]

I know that open world is a thing now, but pathed doesn't have to be bad. I believe it gives the designers a better oppertunity to design great platforming courses. Plus the linear 3D Mario thing started with Galaxy not 3D World, despite what most believe.

True, but Galaxy games also had more incentive to revisit levels. No matter how good you are, you need to play every level in Galaxy multiple times. 3D World doesn't require that unless you missed a token, and finding that last thing sometimes isn't super fun.

 

[BGBW]

I do think skipping to the next day and playing for 5 minutes should technically work since it has to unlock all tools for offline players, too.
The real question is: Will the tools stay if you set it back to the actual date again? And if not, will I be able to upload a level with a wrong system time?

If you're worried about going back, you're better of setting the clock back nine days before playing so every time you skip forward you're approaching the correct date.

True, but Galaxy games also had more incentive to revisit levels. No matter how good you are, you need to play every level in Galaxy multiple times. 3D World doesn't require that unless you missed a token, and finding that last thing sometimes isn't super fun.

That's because instead of reusing a levels they gave us unique levels. Hell Galaxy 2 showed signs of this by really cutting back the number of challenges per level. Also if you're into speed running there's loads of incentive to return to levels in 3DLand/World. Land's Streetpass feature is still one of the best.

 

[Kouriozan]

We have now entered Animal Crossing time traveling meta.
But yes, I see no reason this would not work, this game isn't online only.

 

[Orakio Rob]

I like this. I'm easily turned off by games that offer me too many options at once. Actually, I think this is very, very good for guys like me, but I understand how you all feel.

 

[UncleSporky]

I can't even come to grips with the thought that Nintendo believes the Minecraft generation (with some sprinkling of LBP, Project Spark, and indie development) needs their hands held through making Mario levels.

To be fair, Minecraft doesn't start you with every tool either. You don't start out with a chest full of minecarts and beds and flint+tinder. You make them individually, sometimes after a long period of exploring for the materials, and then you play with the object to see how it works.

 

[A Link to the Past]

If you're worried about going back, you're better of setting the clock back nine days before playing so every time you skip forward you're approaching the correct date.


That's because instead of reusing a levels they gave us unique levels. Hell Galaxy 2 showed signs of this by really cutting back the number of challenges per level. Also if you're into speed running there's loads of incentive to return to levels in 3DLand/World. Land's Streetpass feature is still one of the best.

Speed run value is an aspect of pretty much any 3D Mario game. To me, I find that the (fewer) levels found in Galaxy 2 made a bigger impression on me than the numerous levels of 3D World. This is of course not to say that the levels are bad, but they don't stand out as individual units as much as they did in previous console 3D Marios.

 

[UncleSporky]

I do think skipping to the next day and playing for 5 minutes should technically work since it has to unlock all tools for offline players, too.
The real question is: Will the tools stay if you set it back to the actual date again? And if not, will I be able to upload a level with a wrong system time?

The tools would have to stay because imagine creating a level using day 9 elements, then telling your Wii U it's they year 2000 and trying to edit those levels you made. Would you be able to copy the elements throughout your level but not add new ones...?

 

[Captain Europe]

True, but Galaxy games also had more incentive to revisit levels. No matter how good you are, you need to play every level in Galaxy multiple times. 3D World doesn't require that unless you missed a token, and finding that last thing sometimes isn't super fun.

I personally prefer more courses over revisiting levels, but I guess that's a personal preference. After replaying Galaxy again with Luigi I only went back to replay the more linear levels cos they were much more fun to speedrun than the more open levels.

To be fair, Minecraft doesn't start you with every tool either. You don't start out with a chest full of minecarts and beds and flint+tinder. You make them individually, sometimes after a long period of exploring for the materials, and then you play with the object to see how it works.

But does Minecraft lock content behind days?

 

[Molemitts]

How do you measure the player knowing how an item works especially when we've seen just how creative one can be with the items? There's no right way to use an item and it would go against what Nintendo wants to be to say there is. Like I said, this is a Mario Paint pseudo sequel. The only rule is Mario must be able to reach the end of the level. You can place items however you wish and they're not going to tell you how.

Using time is an easy way to know someone has played around with the items without telling them how they should (obviously I realise the player is being told in another way how they should play with the locking off of items and fixed order).

Nintendo can create levels that showcases many uses for a certain object. There's no right way to use it, right, but showing certain uses can get the player's imagination going. That's far better then putting a time gate on content, which doesn't even demand that the player learn the options given to them.

 

[I Wanna Be The Guy]

True, but Galaxy games also had more incentive to revisit levels. No matter how good you are, you need to play every level in Galaxy multiple times. 3D World doesn't require that unless you missed a token, and finding that last thing sometimes isn't super fun.

Not true. More often than not stars in the same galaxy in SMG were basically just act 2 and 3. You weren't repeating the same stage. You were playing a separate stage with the same theme. There is almost no incentive to revisit levels in the Galaxy games with tbe exception of a number of stages with hidden stars, whereas with 3D World there's lots of hidden things to find in EVERY level.

 

[Twenty7KVN]

I don't understand why Nintendo feels this is the only way to do this. Why don't they just make it optional? When you first boot up the game have three options beginner where they have the stuff locked away for nine days with a clear explanation saying that,intermediate with a regular tutorial mode with everything unlocked and advanced with no tutorial and everything unlocked.

 

[Hedja]

Hand holding to the extreme. Nintendo should really stop trying to be our parents and know that people are different and deal with things in different ways.

Splatoon's dripping of content just made me bored of tediously remembering to play a few hours every other day when they randomly release on-disc content.

Animal Crossing New Leaf was worse with its one-a-day add/remove town furniture crap.

It's all extremely tedious and just forcefully extends the lifetime of the game.

 

[KeRaSh]

If you're worried about going back, you're better of setting the clock back nine days before playing so every time you skip forward you're approaching the correct date.

Haha, I didn't even think of that. Genius.

The tools would have to stay because imagine creating a level using day 9 elements, then telling your Wii U it's they year 2000 and trying to edit those levels you made. Would you be able to copy the elements throughout your level but not add new ones...?

Yeah that's what I imagine. I don't think they will actually go the extra mile to make sure nobody is able to skip the 9 day period.

I wonder how they will react if they see levels published with tools from day 9 in it.

 

[Captain Europe]

Not true. More often than not stars in the same galaxy in SMG were basically just act 2 and 3. You weren't repeating the same stage. You were playing a separate stage with the same theme. There is almost no incentive to revisit levels in the Galaxy games with tbe exception of a number of stages with hidden stars, whereas with 3D World there's lots of hidden things to find in EVERY level.

The comets had you repeat areas, not that I think they were anything to write home about.
The one hit comets made me feel like a pro though haha

Hand holding to the extreme. Nintendo should really stop trying to be our parents and know that people are different and deal with things in different ways.

Splatoon's dripping of content just made me bored of tediously remembering to play a few hours every other day when they randomly release on-disc content.

Animal Crossing New Leaf was worse with its one-a-day add/remove town furniture crap.

It's all extremely tedious and just forcefully extends the lifetime of the game.

One thing that really irks me about Splatoon is the stage rotation, gets so boring to play on the same stage.

 

[Dreamwriter]

In the end it's seriously only nine days. I'm curious if people would be more upset at this, or if there was no time lock and the game was delayed by nine days. I can understand the anger if we have to wait two months for the full game like Splatoon, but we don't. We literally get new features every single day. You go to work/school, come home and make some levels, play for a few hours, go to bed and repeat the cycle, except every new day with have new angles to the game.

Sure, that works for your play-style. How about people who play games differently? A game like this I would normally binge-play when I first got it, then maybe play once a week after that if I liked it, having fun creating crazy levels. But in this case, binge-playing on the first day is seriously limited and doesn't help unlock any content, which means a more likely scenario is I play a bit on the first day, get frustrated by the limitations, and then don't have access to the rest of the content for weeks because I'm not going to have an incentive to hook up my Wii U to play a game that isn't fun. Or, I'm forced to set up my Wii U once a day for 9 days to open the level editor for 5 minutes before I start my "binge" pattern, and it becomes homework.

 

[UncleSporky]

But does Minecraft lock content behind days?

It locks content behind exploration of other content.

If you want to look at Minecraft as a level editor/creation tool, the content that allows you to create different colored blocks for example is contingent upon you finding some sheep you can lure to the right area, start them breeding with each other, find plants that can be used to make every kind of dye, dye the sheep's wool, make shears and shear them etc.

It could indeed take days to get set up for this, to make one giant work of pixel art for example.

Terraria is a game with even more unique things locked behind your progress, tons of tools you don't have access to until you beat multiple bosses and get to hard mode, and then adjust to the new difficulty of hard mode, learn to survive, and scour the world for chests that might contain the objects that let you make a more interesting world. It took me and my friends like a week to get to some of the game's elements.

But these are not primarily level editors, I think. They're games that you're playing. Mario Maker doesn't force you to collect rocks so you can place them in your level.

 

[DrWong]

Hand holding to the extreme. Nintendo should really stop trying to be our parents and know that people are different and deal with things in different ways.

Splatoon's dripping of content just made me bored of tediously remembering to play a few hours every other day when they randomly release on-disc content.

Animal Crossing New Leaf was worse with its one-a-day add/remove town furniture crap.

It's all extremely tedious and just forcefully extends the lifetime of the game.

Well, considering Splatoon & ACNL success...

 

[BGBW]

Animal Crossing New Leaf was worse with its one-a-day add/remove town furniture crap.

Calling this hand-holding completely misses the point of that series.

Sure, that works for your play-style. How about people who play games differently? A game like this I would normally binge-play when I first got it, then maybe play once a week after that if I liked it, having fun creating crazy levels. But in this case, binge-playing on the first day is seriously limited and doesn't help unlock any content, which means a more likely scenario is I play a bit on the first day, get frustrated by the limitations, and then don't have access to the rest of the content for weeks because I'm not going to have an incentive to hook up my Wii U to play a game that isn't fun. Or, I'm forced to set up my Wii U once a day for 9 days to open the level editor for 5 minutes before I start my "binge" pattern, and it becomes homework.

Why are you unhooking your Wii U? More people leave their console plugged it. Heck, since this uses the GamePad you could play this off screen so no need for the TV to be on.

 

[Schrödinger's cat]

How does this work for copies sent for review?

Are these subject to the same unlocking mechanism or are they fully unlocked from the off.

And, as such, if they differ from the consumer version of the product - which may affect learning curve, immediacy, accessibility, longevity - would that be tantamount to reviewing a different product?

 

[SeanR1221]

So it's even worse than I thought. It's 9 days regardless of when you buy the game.

Here's what Nintendo should do. Make it a fucking option. There. Done.

I was planning on playing this game that entire weekend. Now, if I were to buy it on 9/11, I'd be playing a gimped version with less than half the content. How does that sound cool to anyone?

I hope Nintendo gets shredded for this.

 

[maxcriden]

How does this work for copies sent for review?

Are these subject to the same unlocking mechanism or are they fully unlocked from the off.

And, as such, if they differ from the consumer version of the product - which may affect learning curve, immediacy, accessibility, longevity - would that be tantamount to reviewing a different product?

It would not be tantamount to a different product. Within 9 days the products will be identical. Review code IIRC has not been sent out yet, though, so we have no idea if the game will be identical for reviewers. I imagine many would understandably utilize the clock trick if need be. While learning curve and immediacy will be slightly different for just over a week, accessibility and longevity will not reasonably be.

So it's even worse than I thought. It's 9 days regardless of when you buy the game.

Here's what Nintendo should do. Make it a fucking option. There. Done.

I was planning on playing this game that entire weekend. Now, if I were to buy it on 9/11, I'd be playing a gimped version with less than half the content. How does that sound cool to anyone?

I hope Nintendo gets shredded for this.

If you are looking to play levels, you will still have, I believe, plenty of options of levels to play that utilize more advanced toolsets. If you are primarily interested in creating levels, there should still be plenty of robust and diverse items to utilize in creating excellent levels. Each subsequent day for nine total days you will have access to more items, but there should be plenty of functionality to begin with.

Just to mention, what was shown off at E3 2014 is probably pretty much all available day one, if I had to guess. So right there you have plenty of complex and diverse tools. What was shown at The Game Awards, and at NWC and E3 this year, will be unlocked very quickly. If you want more items, though, I see no reason the clock trick wouldn't work.

 

[Dreamwriter]

Why are you unhooking your Wii U? More people leave their console plugged it. Heck, since this uses the GamePad you could play this off screen so no need for the TV to be on.

My TV has three inputs, of which one is dedicated to my PC, one is dedicated to the cable box, and the third is shared between three game systems and an Amazon Fire TV (which is what I use the most often of those). My power connections are also limited, so I generally only have the one thing I have hooked up to the TV plugged in.

 

[UncleSporky]

If you want more items, though, I see no reason the clock trick wouldn't work.

I'd hesitate to say it's a guarantee. Nintendo can detect changes in the system clock and prevent unlocking new content on that basis, because you modified the time, if they feel like being jerks about it. I have no idea why they would, but they could.

I believe they have in the past, I forget which game it was...if you touched the clock you became ineligible to get the free stuff the next day and had to wait 24 more hours.

 

[Filter]

I'm looking forward to seeing the variety of levels that are made under these restrictions.
Putting hard limits on projects usually helps creativity, making you come up with novel solutions to problems.

Having everything unlocked at the start would lead to even more of a clusterfuck of levels no doubt. In this way, the player has to go through the same kind of progression of added gameplay that the actual designers did when the Mario games were released. But instead of 30 years worth of design practice, it's compressed into 9 days.

If you can't make fun levels with the basic gameplay items, there's no way you can make fun levels with all of the gameplay items at once.

 

[Hanmik]

I'm looking forward to seeing the variety of levels that are made under these restrictions.
Putting hard limits on projects usually helps creativity, making you come up with novel solutions to problems.

Having everything unlocked at the start would lead to even more of a clusterfuck of levels no doubt. In this way, the player has to go through the same kind of progression of added gameplay that the actual designers did when the Mario games were released. But instead of 30 years worth of design practice, it's compressed into 9 days.

If you can't make fun levels with the basic gameplay items, there's no way you can make fun levels with all of the gameplay items at once.

 

[Tertullian]

The 9 day tutorial defense force. Absolutely amazing.

No you guys, it totally makes sense! You see, Nintendo's fanbase is composed entirely of especially dimwitted children, who will be simply overwhelmed and make nothing but shitty gimmicky levels if given access to the fire flower from the beginning! We must save them from themselves by locking away most of the content in the level editor they just paid $60 for!

How does this work for copies sent for review?

Are these subject to the same unlocking mechanism or are they fully unlocked from the off.

And, as such, if they differ from the consumer version of the product - which may affect learning curve, immediacy, accessibility, longevity - would that be tantamount to reviewing a different product?

Holy shit, I didn't even think of this. Reviewers will get a profoundly different experience for the first 9 days of gameplay (which is generally when a consumer plays a game the most, and which is far longer than a reviewer normally even plays a game). What a mess.

I see that above me we already have a front-line soldier for the "reviewers reviewing a different game from consumers" defense force, which shocks me, though obviously nothing should shock me by now.

 

[Hazu]

Over 1500 posts on such a little thing? Is that really a big deal? Some people need to stop complaining about everything.

 

[Interceptor]

I'm looking forward to seeing the variety of levels that are made under these restrictions.
Putting hard limits on projects usually helps creativity, making you come up with novel solutions to problems.

Having everything unlocked at the start would lead to even more of a clusterfuck of levels no doubt. In this way, the player has to go through the same kind of progression of added gameplay that the actual designers did when the Mario games were released. But instead of 30 years worth of design practice, it's compressed into 9 days.

If you can't make fun levels with the basic gameplay items, there's no way you can make fun levels with all of the gameplay items at once.

This. They should patch it to 20 days just to fuel the "outrage". It's about maintaining quality, not handholding.

 

[Captain Europe]

It locks content behind exploration of other content.

If you want to look at Minecraft as a level editor/creation tool, the content that allows you to create different colored blocks for example is contingent upon you finding some sheep you can lure to the right area, start them breeding with each other, find plants that can be used to make every kind of dye, dye the sheep's wool, make shears and shear them etc.

It could indeed take days to get set up for this, to make one giant work of pixel art for example.

Terraria is a game with even more unique things locked behind your progress, tons of tools you don't have access to until you beat multiple bosses and get to hard mode, and then adjust to the new difficulty of hard mode, learn to survive, and scour the world for chests that might contain the objects that let you make a more interesting world. It took me and my friends like a week to get to some of the game's elements.

But these are not primarily level editors, I think. They're games that you're playing. Mario Maker doesn't force you to collect rocks so you can place them in your level.

Sounds like those games use good systems that fit them. SMM doesn't though, there are better ways of doing tutorials for it.

I'm looking forward to seeing the variety of levels that are made under these restrictions.
Putting hard limits on projects usually helps creativity, making you come up with novel solutions to problems.

Having everything unlocked at the start would lead to even more of a clusterfuck of levels no doubt. In this way, the player has to go through the same kind of progression of added gameplay that the actual designers did when the Mario games were released. But instead of 30 years worth of design practice, it's compressed into 9 days.

If you can't make fun levels with the basic gameplay items, there's no way you can make fun levels with all of the gameplay items at once.

Exactly, so what's the point then? There are whole uni courses on creativity, Nintendo didn't come up with some insane tutorial that will make everyone a creative level designer in 9 days, they just think they did.

Over 1500 posts on such a little thing? Is that really a big deal? Some people need to stop complaining about everything.

This. They should patch it to 20 days just to fuel the "outrage". It's about maintaining quality, not handholding.

Yeah, wanting to use the content you paid for is complaining about everything and an ''outrage'', it's also totally going to prevent shitty levels.

 

[marink]

Do we know what exactly will be unlocked?

 

[BGBW]

locking away most of the content in the level editor they just paid $60 for!

Couldn't this argument be made against anything that locks anything behind something? Why progress through a game when you paid $60? They should give me the final boss after I press start for the first time!

Do we know what exactly will be unlocked?