Updates with no info are worth it for comments like this.
Sakurai uses the pic of the day to vent out personal feelings! Of course the overwhelmingly majority won't give a hoot and will just diminish the update as being a waste of time, but there's something to Sakurai just reflecting on the series like this...
...that, and it's only midnight here, guys, you folks that are seeing this at 3am are nuts
7am here, and now I'm gonna make like dat dere Nintendog and fall asleep on the floor.
Also, this stage in general is really odd considering the footage of it at E3. For some reason it also reminds me just how much I love the Wii U stages shown so far; Battlefield, Skyloft, Wii Fit, Dr. Wily's Castle, Pyrosphere, Animal Crossing and the Punch Out-esque Stadium are all great looking.
7am here, and now I'm gonna make like dat dere Nintendog and fall asleep on the floor.
Also, this stage in general is really odd considering the footage of it at E3. For some reason it also reminds me just how much I love the Wii U stages shown so far; Battlefield, Skyloft, Wii Fit, Dr. Wily's Castle, Pyrosphere, Animal Crossing and the Punch Out-esque Stadium are all great looking.
I really like the idea and general aesthetic of the stage, I just really wish it didn't have walk-off edges. More than anything the biggest issue I'm having with the stages we've seen so far in SSB4 is the prevalence of walk-off edges. Those things kinda suck. A lot.
The picture updates just around midnight my time, so it's perfect to see right before I go ahead and head to bed.
....I call bullshit. Were getting something big tomorrow. Same thing happened last week. On Mewtwo's birthday, we got a pic of Rosalina doing her F-air which we already knew about. People lost all hype, untill he revealed the awesome assist trophy Mother Brain on the same stage the Rosalina pic was in. So expect something new shown on this stage soon.
7am here, and now I'm gonna make like dat dere Nintendog and fall asleep on the floor.
Also, this stage in general is really odd considering the footage of it at E3. For some reason it also reminds me just how much I love the Wii U stages shown so far; Battlefield, Skyloft, Wii Fit, Dr. Wily's Castle, Pyrosphere, Animal Crossing and the Punch Out-esque Stadium are all great looking.
I really like the idea and general aesthetic of the stage, I just really wish it didn't have walk-off edges. More than anything the biggest issue I'm having with the stages we've seen so far in SSB4 is the prevalence of walk-off edges. Those things kinda suck. A lot.
The picture updates just around midnight my time, so it's perfect to see right before I go ahead and head to bed.
Walk-offs are problematic from a gameplay standpoint. They make it far too easy to just camp around the edges of the stage and gimp your opponents that way and eliminate the fun and important element of ledgegame. And, of course, stages with walk-offs are effectively useless for competitive play for the same reasons.
I'd prefer for them to fudge things a little and let a stage have proper ledges rather than just import locations and keep the walk-offs. The Nintendogs stage, for instance, could have easily had the blocks be on a raised corner of the house or on a table or somesuch and instantly made the stage better designed.
7am here, and now I'm gonna make like dat dere Nintendog and fall asleep on the floor.
Also, this stage in general is really odd considering the footage of it at E3. For some reason it also reminds me just how much I love the Wii U stages shown so far; Battlefield, Skyloft, Wii Fit, Dr. Wily's Castle, Pyrosphere, Animal Crossing and the Punch Out-esque Stadium are all great looking.
stages that are (mostly) without walkoffs:
Battlefield
Castle Siege
Delfino Plaza
Final Destination
Frigate Orpheon
Halberd
Hanenbow
Luigi's Mansion
Lylat Cruise
New Pork City
Norfair
Pictochat
Pirate Ship
Pokemon Stadium 2
Port Town Aero Dive
Rumble Falls
Skyworld
Smashville
Spear Pillar
Summit
Yoshi's Island
Big Blue
Brinstar
Corneria
Green Greens
Jungle Japes
Pokemon Stadium
Rainbow Cruise
Temple
I really hope the direct isn't this week because if it is then its probably going to be a Diddy reveal during their 55% of the direct coverage being taken up by Tropical Freeze.
Diddy reveal this week, Direct next week would be splendid.
It's probably telling that SSB64, with its stages being more abstract and with a higher focus on gameplay than the fanservice element or having locations from franchises, had only one walk-off stage in its roster, and it was a secret stage with a bunch of gimmicks to its name.
Well I more mean ones where it doesn't make sense.
The Kid Icarus stage in Brawl for example was fine for floating platforms.
Smashville though was just stupid, it's a floating platform with everything relevant to Animal Crossing just being in the background.
I think it's more an issue of validity. There is a certain amount of fanservice-y coolness to having a Smash Bros. stage that accurately portrays an area from a game, and it's far easier to do that with walk-offs than with the typical Smash Bros. floating platforms. Look at Bridge of Eldin, for example. It wouldn't really work as well from a fanservice view if they went ahead and chopped off just the bridge and had it have ledges.
That said I'd definitely prefer a stage that plays better but is less true to the source material. Just like I wouldn't expect Mario's fireballs to work the exact same way in SSB and the Mario games - they need to be changed somewhat to fit the medium, and the same goes for stages.
It feels like SSB4 has a handful of stages that are walk-offs just for the sake of being walk-offs, though. The boxing arena and Wii Fit stage come to mind - why not just make them floating platforms? They would effectively have the same aesthetic and would work much better as stages to play on.
Walk-offs is why I dismiss 90% of Brawl mod stages. It's a result of most of them just being lazy rips from other games now and of course most games don't consist of floating islands as set pieces.
Pretty disappointing for a pic of the day, but we're basically guaranteed to see Diddy this week, so I might not get my hopes up for anything until then.
In OT4, EmCeeGamer spoke out a warning about speculating about Direct dates etc., especially treating those speculative dates as actual dates, so I would suggest to calm down on it.
would enjoy a penny back if you don't care go reading this
I don't understand why people wish to constrain smash's metagame to where "The ledge and off-stage game is a HUGE part of what makes Smash so great, walk-off stages are the antithesis to that." Wasn't a huge draw to smash the fact that it was like a sandbox fighter, where you make your own combos, etc. I believe, if smash 64 had just walk off stages, a meta game would've developed without the off stage game. But the instant the idea of a competitive scene with a different rule set comes up, it gets shot down as getting rid of a huge part of the smash competitive scene. Which would be in an opposite role should my hypothetical smash 64 been a thing. Why can't we have a scene with a meta game developed around walk off stages. (This is hard to explain). Think of it like an alternate timeline in the Zelda timeline. Both coexist at the same time. I just feel people who try to define what is a HUGE part of smash don't realize that this is either defined by another player , who was in a similar situation as my alternate rule set could be, but nobody got there before him to establish walk off stages only rules, or, the developer envisioned it this way, which in this case is likely true, but even then doesn't mean it has to be followed. Look at Brawl.
Short version: People are stingy with following definitions when the same definitions likely weren't in place at some point in time.
Pokemon is a decent example, with a of OU, Ubers, UU, STABmons, etc. with different philosophies to the meta game, occasionally different rules, all coexisting
I prefer non walk off, though I don't hate them and see his point in the Kid Icarus Animal Crossing example
2nd paragraph is probably one of the rudest generalizations I've seen, and I don't care for either side on that one
would enjoy a penny back if you don't care go reading this
I don't understand why people wish to constrain smash's metagame to where "The ledge and off-stage game is a HUGE part of what makes Smash so great, walk-off stages are the antithesis to that." Wasn't a huge draw to smash the fact that it was like a sandbox fighter, where you make your own combos, etc. I believe, if smash 64 had just walk off stages, a meta game would've developed without the off stage game. But the instant the idea of a competitive scene with a different rule set comes up, it gets shot down as getting rid of a huge part of the smash competitive scene. Which would be in an opposite role should my hypothetical smash 64 been a thing. Why can't we have a scene with a meta game developed around walk off stages. (This is hard to explain). Think of it like an alternate timeline in the Zelda timeline. Both coexist at the same time. I just feel people who try to define what is a HUGE part of smash don't realize that this is either defined by another player , who was in a similar situation as my alternate rule set could be, but nobody got there before him to establish walk off stages only rules, or, the developer envisioned it this way, which in this case is likely true, but even then doesn't mean it has to be followed. Look at Brawl.
Short version: People are stingy with following definitions when the same definitions likely weren't in place at some point in time.
Pokemon is a decent example, with a of OU, Ubers, UU, STABmons, etc. with different philosophies to the meta game, occasionally different rules, all coexisting
I prefer non walk off, though I don't hate them and see his point in the Kid Icarus Animal Crossing example
2nd paragraph is probably one of the rudest generalizations I've seen, and I don't care for either side on that one
Most of the reason why walk off stages don't work is because yes the edge guard game is essential, but because several characters like Jigglypuff rely on an aerial game where the opponent has to go off stage so that you can do a Wall of Pain.
Walk-off stages severely limit characters who do not have a strong ground game and it effectively gives a soft handicap to those characters.
Stages have to be as neutral as possible in order to bring out the full effects of what a character can do at the competitive level and it just isn't feasible with walk off stages like Yoshi's Island Melee where you can effectively combo off the slopes and have infinites.
There's a reason as to why people made Dreamland the only legal stage in Smash 64 as Yoshi's Island was too big.
When comparing walk off stages to floating stages, floating stages are higher in quantity and they don't serve to limit a character's combo potential or aerial or ground game like a walk off stage does.
I love mostly all the stages in Smash and I really do enjoy playing casually in walk off stages. But when you're competing, walk off stages aren't feasible and thus FD, Battlefield, Dreamland, FoD, etc are the standard for the metagame.
Tournament play is completely subjective to the rule created by the community, but that;s just how every FGC is and we abide by it because we agree that these rules, for the most part, balances out gameplay to the point where skill is what lets you win.
I do agree that what he said was rude and out of hand and honestly, I do understand why people dislike floating stages. Not every stage has to be tourney legal and all stages should be fun in their own right. But there has to be at least 5 or 6 tourney stages because platforms really do make a huge difference as to how the game is played.
Speaking of stages I wonder if we'll get any returning stages in Smash 4. Ideally I would like to see some stages from all old games return, though I wonder if maybe we'll just get stages from Brawl like how Brawl only got stages from Melee.
Actually adding some old stages to the game would probably be some nice and easy free DLC that Nintendo could make for the game.
would enjoy a penny back if you don't care go reading this
I don't understand why people wish to constrain smash's metagame to where "The ledge and off-stage game is a HUGE part of what makes Smash so great, walk-off stages are the antithesis to that." Wasn't a huge draw to smash the fact that it was like a sandbox fighter, where you make your own combos, etc. I believe, if smash 64 had just walk off stages, a meta game would've developed without the off stage game. But the instant the idea of a competitive scene with a different rule set comes up, it gets shot down as getting rid of a huge part of the smash competitive scene. Which would be in an opposite role should my hypothetical smash 64 been a thing. Why can't we have a scene with a meta game developed around walk off stages. (This is hard to explain). Think of it like an alternate timeline in the Zelda timeline. Both coexist at the same time. I just feel people who try to define what is a HUGE part of smash don't realize that this is either defined by another player , who was in a similar situation as my alternate rule set could be, but nobody got there before him to establish walk off stages only rules, or, the developer envisioned it this way, which in this case is likely true, but even then doesn't mean it has to be followed. Look at Brawl.
Short version: People are stingy with following definitions when the same definitions likely weren't in place at some point in time.
Pokemon is a decent example, with a of OU, Ubers, UU, STABmons, etc. with different philosophies to the meta game, occasionally different rules, all coexisting
I prefer non walk off, though I don't hate them and see his point in the Kid Icarus Animal Crossing example
I really feel like I shouldn't need to clarify that my post represents my opinion, but I guess I do? I'm purely speaking for myself and how much the off-stage, ledge and recovery metagame affect my enjoyment. It's why Brawl's dumbed down and OP recoveries bother me so much.
Nothing to do with a competitive ruleset, it's just my preference. Walk-off stages are also fundamentally flawed since players can just camp near the edge of the screen risk-free, unless some sort of stage hazard prevents it, and if you need a stage hazard to balance your game properly then I feel like you need to hit the drawing board again. There's at least a degree of risk involved in camping on the ledge for most characters, stalling tactics notwithstanding, and the new ledge mechanics hinted at for Smash 4 seem to be tackling that issue already.
Well that's exactly that it isn't it, a generalization, and definitely not one to be taken too seriously. Those kinds of people really do bug me though.
would enjoy a penny back if you don't care go reading this
I don't understand why people wish to constrain smash's metagame to where "The ledge and off-stage game is a HUGE part of what makes Smash so great, walk-off stages are the antithesis to that." Wasn't a huge draw to smash the fact that it was like a sandbox fighter, where you make your own combos, etc. I believe, if smash 64 had just walk off stages, a meta game would've developed without the off stage game. But the instant the idea of a competitive scene with a different rule set comes up, it gets shot down as getting rid of a huge part of the smash competitive scene. Which would be in an opposite role should my hypothetical smash 64 been a thing.
A metagame developed exclusively for walk off stages is a pretty broken one considering there are characters that can just chain-grab/lock opponents to the blastline (Donkey Kong has his cargo throw, Dedede his down-throw and many characters have jab locks for example).
Recoveries (and recovery tethers) become a bit pointless, and the deep, unique intricacies of edgeguarding and how each character has moves tailored for it (such as Marth and Fox) are less useful. The game is also far less exciting as a whole now that an entire dynamic is ripped from the game.
Meteor Smashes will not kill unless you hit them as they're grounded (bouncing them up, but this lessens knockback), so they become much less useful.
Characters with projectiles now have a lovely giant open area to camp their projectiles on, and can just go with an annoying runaway tactic.
The stage in general now just appears "safe". I love how exciting things can be if you're going far off-stage to kill a character as Marth, or if you shine spike someone as Fox, and to get these situations you have set your opponents up for them, which means they messed up. I like Smash Bros for so many reasons, with one being the general mindgames you create when you or your opponent is offstage. It's amazing.
I would've offered to play Project M wifi with people here ages ago if not for:
1. Only being able to play the mod via Dolphin since there's no PAL support yet
2. Australian time zones
3. God awful internet in general, though I'd be willing to directly connect my desktop to the router
4. I'm even more god awful competitively
I would've offered to play Project M wifi with people here ages ago if not for:
1. Only being able to play the mod via Dolphin since there's no PAL support yet
2. Australian time zones
3. God awful internet in general, though I'd be willing to directly connect my desktop to the router
4. I'm even more god awful competitively
No need to worry at all about competitive, when it comes to online you're basically playing casuals and it's nice to unwind sometimes.
The internet code sucks but hey, if it's what we have then we'll make the most of it.
To remedy that dolphin problem, the wii u pro controller is Bluetooth compatible and it's an amazing way to play Melee and PM on my MacBook. It's the second coming of the GameCube controller. I hope pal support comes soon and that this alternative works.
Even with the time zone differences it'd be great to play nonetheless.
I would've offered to play Project M wifi with people here ages ago if not for:
1. Only being able to play the mod via Dolphin since there's no PAL support yet
2. Australian time zones
3. God awful internet in general, though I'd be willing to directly connect my desktop to the router
4. I'm even more god awful competitively
