Support NeoGAF

[FSLink]

A lot of the more creative weapon choices in the game I wish they just saved for a later entry. Genis's Kedama, Colette's Chakrams, and Sheena's cards are pretty lame in this game. They would have benefited being in like Xillia or something where they got more creative and had better animation for artes. If Colette stayed an archer, judging by Natalia she probably would have been more useful in battle too.

This is why I wanted a remake, would have been nice to see Genis and Raine have some physical artes. Raine could even have some Ruin Mode kicking artes for fun.

 

[Dice//]

That is true, she's one of the most boring characters to control in battle.

the irony. (I agreed with everything you said in your black-lowlighted post)

It's almost funny that a lot of my personal crap characters seem to have lone-player battles. Sheena versus that ninja, Karol vs that whale/shark thing (Vesperia), and Kimahri (FFX) with his brethren.

I actually want to add that it feels like it took almost up till Graces for the entire cast to at least be somewhat interesting in battle (Vesperia wasn't too bad but the learning curve was steeper)

 

[PKrockin]

I also liked how her and Yuri's relationship was completely platonic. I was shocked at the end that I went through an entire jrpg without hints of romance between the male and female leads.

The series, and JRPGs in general, need to do this more often. But then I suppose they'd lose the female Japanese fanbase so enamored with these awful hackneyed romance subplots.

 

[Bladenic]

A lot of the more creative weapon choices in the game I wish they just saved for a later entry. Genis's Kedama, Colette's Chakrams, and Sheena's cards are pretty lame in this game. They would have benefited being in like Xillia or something where they got more creative and had better animation for artes. If Colette stayed an archer, judging by Natalia she probably would have been more useful in battle too.

This is why I wanted a remake, would have been nice to see Genis and Raine have some physical artes. Raine could even have some Ruin Mode kicking artes for fun.

Agreed. In particular, Chakrams need to return on a character. Hopefully Zestiria.

I also still wanna see how Colette's Final Fury would have looked like.

 

[Dice//]

The series, and JRPGs in general, need to do this more often. But then I suppose they'd lose the female Japanese fanbase so enamored with these awful hackneyed romance subplots.

First off, I am a female, and yes I love romance plots in general. I also acknowledge the vast majority of JRPG or games otherwise do a crap job at them.

On the other hand I actually love what they did with Estelle and Yuri. A line in Star Ocean 2, of all things, I think puts their relationship best for: "They're more than friends, and less than lovers".

I'm gonna quote something I mentioned, but it holds:
" ...her relationship with Yuri is particularly wonderful.[...] What I like is that despite her status she was willing to trust and understand Yuri even though he's at the bottom of the social pyramid (princess vs. lower-class trouble-maker). Their caste didn't matter because they had mutual respect and understanding for one another and had few gripes with respect to that (in fact, at no real point does Yuri treat Estelle like a princess unless he's teasing her, and Estelle never really sees Yuri as this poor vagabond). I thought it was particularly interesting to see her grow thanks to Yuri and change her life around after meeting him as she almost learns vicariously through his example (this actually goes for the entire party as well).

Honestly hope for less romantic pairings in the future unless they actually have a decent story to tell.
Phantasia's version was like "boy meets girls" and since they met first, love MUST happen.
I thought Abyss chronicled the growth of a relationship quite well (albeit somewhat unrealistically).

 

[PKrockin]

I hope you didn't take that to mean I was implying anything about women in general, just that from what I hear a significant portion of women in Japan consider the love story a big reason why they play the series.

... Which, having just finished Graces, blew my mind. lol

I agree with pretty much everything you said though. Yuri's relationships with Estelle and Karol are really well done.

 

[R0ckman]

Worst offender was ToD2. God that game sounded like it was written by a 12 year old girl. I had just played through it again a year ago and realized how anti-god it was. It wasn't the fact that it was anti-god in itself rather than how hard it stressed it.

Spoiler

You literally murder the Goddess of the game when she was created by the hopes of people who wished for support after most of the towns were in ruins from the end of ToD PS1 version.
Thank god they did a retcon on that shitty sequel with ToD remake.

I feel stories are only going to get worse. Vesperia was clearly them trying something different. It worked, so I don't know why the hell they went back to old habits.

 

[Dice//]

Worst offender was ToD2. God that game sounded like it was written by a 12 year old girl. I had just played through it again a year ago and realized how anti-god it was. It wasn't the fact that it was anti-god in itself rather than how hard it stressed it.

Spoiler

You literally murder the Goddess of the game when she was created by the hopes of people who wished for support after most of the towns were in ruins from the end of ToD PS1 version.
Thank god they did a retcon on that shitty sequel with ToD remake.

I feel stories are only going to get worse. Vesperia was clearly them trying something different. It worked, so I don't know why the hell they went back to old habits.

Mmm... Plot-wise, I think Vesperia is a small disaster (the third act is completely strange, odd, and played-up poorly with an "out-of-nowhere" final boss despite the larger threat looming in the sky). Vesperia, I think, shines ONLY because of its awesome cast that has this amazing synergy and balance between them and the larger politics at hand.
Vesperia = Cast > Story.

I thought Graces' plot was ok. Aside from the cliche's I actually liked some of the implications that an immortal android like Sophie has, especially with respect to revelations in the post-game storyline

Spoiler

(I actually thought the "Sophie Lhant" adoption was a really sweet idea to reconcile how she fits in with Asbel and the fact she's going to out-live him)

.
Also, the fact the Asbel and Hubert were raised separately was very interesting, specifically because of real-life ramifications of "who gets dad's empire" is an issue that's pretty close to a lot of Earth history.

I hope you didn't take that to mean I was implying anything about women in general, just that from what I hear a significant portion of women in Japan consider the love story a big reason why they play the series.

No, no, I didn't think you were. And like I said, personally it's not too far from something I like in games. It just sucks seeing it done like crap a lot. xD

 

[Bladenic]

Worst offender was ToD2. God that game sounded like it was written by a 12 year old girl. I had just played through it again a year ago and realized how anti-god it was. It wasn't the fact that it was anti-god in itself rather than how hard it stressed it.

Spoiler

You literally murder the Goddess of the game when she was created by the hopes of people who wished for support after most of the towns were in ruins from the end of ToD PS1 version.
Thank god they did a retcon on that shitty sequel with ToD remake.

I feel stories are only going to get worse. Vesperia was clearly them trying something different. It worked, so I don't know why the hell they went back to old habits.

I'm still at the end of ToD2 (really need to beat it) but Kyle and Reala may be the worst protagonists/couple in the series (and they could make a strong effort in all JRPGs). What sucks is that the rest of the cast is pretty decent, but the plot is so focused on Reala that they get like no time to shine.

 

[Dice//]

I'm still at the end of ToD2 (really need to beat it) but Kyle and Reala may be the worst protagonists/couple in the series (and they could make a strong effort in all JRPGs). What sucks is that the rest of the cast is pretty decent, but the plot is so focused on Reala that they get like no time to shine.

She also looks like the creepy doll you find in your grandma's attic. Her legs are seriously gonna snap broken.

HOWEVER...the game obviously has the best opening theme ever.

 

[romulus91]

general opinion on whether this game holds up? (remove rose tinted glasses if possible

have the game wrapped up sitting on the shelf

 

[Link Man]

general opinion on whether this game holds up? (remove rose tinted glasses if possible

have the game wrapped up sitting on the shelf

I'm enjoying it quite a bit.

 

[FSLink]

HOWEVER...the game obviously has the best opening theme ever.

You don't need a fancy car, like you just the way you are

I also still wanna see how Colette's Final Fury would have looked like.

I imagine she'd do a bunch of Ring Whirlwind type attacks, and then at the end she probably would have tripped and caused explosions. So probably not as cool as we'd hope. Kohaku's still my favorite Final Fury besides Stahn's (da bess)

 

[ShroudOfFate]

I started up DotNW after I beat Symphonia, and holy shit. Either this game is hard, or I really suck. I'm on normal and almost every fight I've been in so far has resulted in all of my party members dying.


Also, regarding the characters:

Spoiler

They really do try to pull out all the stops to make you hate the old MCs don't they? I feel like it's working the opposite of what they intended though. I just kind of hate Emil and Marta lol

 

[Seda]

Also, regarding the characters:

Spoiler

They really do try to pull out all the stops to make you hate the old MCs don't they? I feel like it's working the opposite of what they intended though. I just kind of hate Emil and Marta lol

Hmm? I haven''t gotten to DotNW yet, but it's only been a few years since I last revisited it. I remember thinking that having Sheena and Regal around fairly prominently early on helped to ground the otherwise unlikable Marta and Emil.

 

[Shadownet]

general opinion on whether this game holds up? (remove rose tinted glasses if possible

have the game wrapped up sitting on the shelf

It hold up pretty well in my opinion. The only thing I absolutely despite about this game.

Is the world map camera.

Half the time when I'm going anywhere, the camera is pointed so low that I can't even see where I'm going. Plus the character run slow as heck. Even long range mode is slow by any JRPG standard.

You won't get special flying transportation till half way through the game. And by then. You're already sick of the world map.

That's why I'm starting to appreciate Xillia world map more now. It's broken into smaller areas, with quick travel being available about 25% into the game.

 

[ShroudOfFate]

Hmm? I haven''t gotten to DotNW yet, but it's only been a few years since I last revisited it. I remember thinking that having Sheena and Regal around fairly prominently helped to ground the otherwise unlikable Marta and Emil.

Well, so far just the interaction with Lloyd and Colette has made me dislike them. I've only made it to

Spoiler

Hima

right now.

Good to hear that other MCs return and balance out the new ones though.

 

[HawthorneKitty]

Wahoo

 

[CielTynave]

So I caved and just ordered this, despite still having Lightning Returns, Bravely Default, and about 7 other games unfinished. Hopefully I'll have the game by the end of the week instead of next week.

 

[Link Man]

So I caved and just ordered this, despite still having Lightning Returns, Bravely Default, and about 7 other games unfinished. Hopefully I'll have the game by the end of the week instead of next week.

Yeah, I postponed Bravely Default to play this. No regrets.

 

[Bladenic]

The in battle subtitles seem to always be wrong. For boss battles anyway. I assume they are translations of the JP versions, but the English versions may have been localized differently, so the text doesn't match.

Like (mid game boss spoiler)

Spoiler

Gnome says "Time to taste dirt" in English but the text says "Taste the power of Mother Earth!"

Or it's all just fucked up, I dunno.

 

[TEJ]

Beat ToS1, replaying DOTNW in between wonderful 101 sessions. I don't like emil or marta but <3 <3 <3 tenebrae

 

[HawthorneKitty]

Okay, I officially hate this game.
Fucking casino.

 

[luokyl]

Just received the UK version of this game in the post, don't nearly have enough time to play it at the moment, but did chuck it in for 20 mins.

Raine's voice sounds unusually hissy at the beginning.

The UK standard edition case is weird. It's a multi disc case with the multi disc flap ripped out, it's not a standard PS3 case, but rather the type of thing they used for the Tales of Graces F Day One edition. WEIRD!

 

[Dice//]

You don't need a fancy car, like you just the way you are

Thank you.

 

[PKrockin]

It hold up pretty well in my opinion. The only thing I absolutely despite about this game.

Is the world map camera.

Half the time when I'm going anywhere, the camera is pointed so low that I can't even see where I'm going. Plus the character run slow as heck. Even long range mode is slow by any JRPG standard.

You won't get special flying transportation till half way through the game. And by then. You're already sick of the world map.

That's why I'm starting to appreciate Xillia world map more now. It's broken into smaller areas, with quick travel being available about 25% into the game.

Use the d-pad. It makes you move at the speed of the GC version.

 

[HawthorneKitty]

Use the d-pad. It makes you move at the speed of the GC version.

Does it make you move at 60fps tho?

 

[FSLink]

Does it make you move at 60fps tho?

The feel of 60fps.

 

[PKrockin]

Does it make you move at 60fps tho?

Why would I want that when I have my nice cinematic 30fps?

 

[R0ckman]

I'm still at the end of ToD2 (really need to beat it) but Kyle and Reala may be the worst protagonists/couple in the series (and they could make a strong effort in all JRPGs). What sucks is that the rest of the cast is pretty decent, but the plot is so focused on Reala that they get like no time to shine.

Spoiler

Game seems like it was primarily made to redeem Leon Magnus. Then they just redeemed him in ToD before he died in the remake making ToD2 useless. Loni was a pointless character story wise and was more like filling the party roster, same with Nanaly.

 

[pancakesandsex]

Spoiler

Game seems like it was primarily made to redeem Leon Magnus. Then they just redeemed him in ToD before he died in the remake making ToD2 useless. Loni was a pointless character story wise and was more like filling the party roster, same with Nanaly.

I don't see where you're getting the retcon thing from, iirc they don't change any of the major story beats, and they even included a Barbatos random encounter.

 

[R0ckman]

I don't see where you're getting the retcon thing from, iirc they don't change any of the major story beats, and they even included a Barbatos random encounter.

Outer wall does not fall at the end of the remake. Stan says this in his ending speech. No towns are destroyed in remake.

Most towns are destroyed in ToD2 due to the otter wall dropping. Batbaros was a cameo.

 

[RPGCrazied]

How much gald to totally

Spoiler

rebuild luin

? Fastest way to get gald? I think I'm about at the last dungeon.

 

[pancakesandsex]

Outer wall does not fall at the end of the remake. Stan says this in his ending speech. No towns are destroyed in remake.

Most towns are destroyed in ToD2 due to the otter wall dropping. Batbaros was a cameo.

You talking about in the letter at the end? Because he specifically says it's slowly moving towards recovery, and that it will take a long time to get back to normal...

 

[Seda]

How much gald to totally

Spoiler

rebuild luin

? Fastest way to get gald? I think I'm about at the last dungeon.

Gold Dragon in Torent forest.

 

[RPGCrazied]

Gold Dragon in Torent forest.

How much does it drop? I don't have a Blue Sephira though.

 

[RoeBear]

How much does it drop? I don't have a Blue Sephira though.

16,800 iirc with the Blue Sephira, so without would be 8,400. You might be able to make one at Dirks house.

 

[Professor Beef]

oh my god FUCK this casino

 

[ohlawd]

How much gald to totally

Spoiler

rebuild luin

? Fastest way to get gald? I think I'm about at the last dungeon.

Almost 4.6 million.

 

[Professor Beef]

Almost 4.6 million.

Untrue. It's closer to one million.

 

[ohlawd]

Untrue. It's closer to one million.

lol I added an extra 0 for some reason...

I wrote down the numbers, probably fudged it up so I might have ended up donating more than necessary. Definitely less than 500k.

 

[Shahed]

How much gald to totally

Spoiler

rebuild luin

? Fastest way to get gald? I think I'm about at the last dungeon.

Top of my head says about 700,000 (including all the new buyable weapons). Really easy to do in like half an hour.

You need Collette, one of each level Ex Sphere and the ability to fly. Put one of each level 1-4 on her. Sharp Eyed, Magical, Lucky and Stat Boost. Gives you the skill that makes stealing have a 100% rate.

There's an enemy in Fooji mountains in the first screen. Chimera looking thing. Steal Rune Bottles, escape and fight again to steal some more. Rinse and repeat (escaping as Sheena helps you get a title eventually). Once you have 20, fly to Flanoir and buy 20 Talismans. Use the Rune Bottles to upgrade them to Blue Talismans and then sell them. A run of 20 nets you 300k profit and takes 10 mins or so. Do as often as you need


Just a warning that doing this too early can give you overpowered weapons and break the game for a while

 

[RPGCrazied]

Thanks guys. I did it in the gamecube days, but forgot. I know you get a snazzy pirate costume, so its worth all that gald/trouble.

 

[HawthorneKitty]

Praise the Goddess Martel!
Just got a million chips after spending around 3 hours in total in the casino!

I love this game now.

 

[Professor Beef]

Praise the Goddess Martel!
Just got a million chips after spending around 3 hours in total in the casino!

I love this game now.

>:|

 

[R0ckman]

You talking about in the letter at the end? Because he specifically says it's slowly moving towards recovery, and that it will take a long time to get back to normal...

But he said the outer wall did not fall. Which it didn't. Everything floated into space.

Beyond that a lot of resources went into the countries going to support the team in destroying a portion of the shell so they could get through again. You probably have to recover from that and the fact that the Oberon corporation probably had a big impact on the economy. It basically collapsed right after all this.

Kongman confirmed his town and arena were fine. In ToD2 the town was destroyed but reconstructed with the help of arena funds. If you talk to NPCs they tell you this. Cyril was also destroyed in ToD2, completely non existent on the map even. Mary tells Stan at the end to come and visit her and Dalis in Cyril in the remake.

Spoiler

Dalis was also dead in ToD2, he survived through canon in the remake.

In the end they truly did retcon the game. Which is fine, the sequel was a mistake and a quick cash in like DotNW.

 

[pancakesandsex]

But he said the outer wall did not fall. Which it didn't. Everything floated into space.

Beyond that a lot of resources went into the countries going to support the team in destroying a portion of the shell so they could get through again. You probably have to recover from that and the fact that the Oberon corporation probably had a big impact on the economy. It basically collapsed right after all this.

Kongman confirmed his town and arena were fine. In ToD2 the town was destroyed but reconstructed with the help of arena funds. If you talk to NPCs they tell you this. Cyril was also destroyed in ToD2, completely non existent on the map even. Mary tells Stan at the end to come and visit her and Dalis in Cyril in the remake.

Spoiler

Dalis was also dead in ToD2, he survived through canon in the remake.

In the end they truly did retcon the game. Which is fine, the sequel was a mistake and a quick cash in like DotNW.

I have to rewatch the whole sequence outside stahns house since it's been a while, but the letter portion at the end at least did not say there was no fall, it said "the effects of the collapse were enormous"

Can't say I agree about a retcon being a good thing. Playing back to the future with stahns idiot kid was a lot of fun, and it still has one of the most interesting combat systems in the series to date.

 

[Seda]

Got the million chips trophy. I started with about 50k chips, took about 2 hours to hit a 777 (had about 5k chips at this point), then after that, you go into the bonus mode, went to 1,000,000 in about 5 minutes.

 

[Professor Beef]

The RNG in this fucking casino hates me.

 

[ShroudOfFate]

I want to like DotNW but it feels like such a slog. The combat is so slow coming from the first game and no real world map sucks.

I'm going to keep playing though. I have to know what's going on with Lloyd and Co.