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[MrS]

Just keep banging your head against the wall. Things will change eventually.

Has May not said enough is enough and that she will review our stance on terrorism?

Now is not the time for politicising so I apologise for derailing the thread. I'm just very angry at what's going on.

Check the user's post history. Pretty convinced their either crazy or a troll account.

Oh look, the worst poster on GAF doesn't agree with me. What will I do?

 

[Miles Quaritch]

Corbyn is loopy and thankfully he will begin his return to obscurity on Friday morning after he loses the GE. His stance on terrorism is at odds with what our country needs right now.

What does the country need right now and why is his stance at odds with that?

 

[Jezbollah]

I don't think Corbyn is going anywhere after this Thursday...

The police have never actually operated on a shoot to kill policy. The aim is not to kill the terrorist, but to prevent the terrorist from causing further harm. The death is just a byproduct.

Thanks. It would be useful if the BBC were to note that...

 

[Ghost]

It will be interesting to see if this is a widespread thing or if it's just entered my social media bubble because I know people in London, but I'm seeing a lot of backlash to 'virtue signalling' and anger that I didn't see after Manchester. Also seeing a lot of likes on comments and articles based around the idea that it should be ok to blame Islam for this.

To me that argument doesn't make sense, if you're a law abiding citizen your whole life but then you stab someone to death because you saw them do something illegal, you're not a law abiding citizen anymore, you're a criminal, you might say you're a vigilante or that you're just doing what all the other law abiding citizens want to do but believing that doesn't make you less of a criminal and it doesn't make the law responsible for your actions.

Same deal with religious zealots, the second they decide to take up arms they stop being practitioners of their religion, directing anger at religion they used to practice is pointless, it should be directed at the system that steered them away from their religion, and all our efforts should go into disrupting that process across the globe.

 

[Miles Quaritch]

Has May not said enough is enough and that she will review our stance on terrorism?

Do you think she will also review our trade deals with Saudi Arabia, a chief financier and exporter of extremist ideology?

 

[Joel Was Right]

Has May not said enough is enough and that she will review our stance on terrorism?

In fact, I did. Corbyn has been portrayed as more of a pacifist compared to others, but May's statement this morning, downplaying the effectiveness of military campaigns and the role of Islam, plays more to the progressive, measured position on terrorism than Corbyn himself identifies with. In short, there was nothing in the statement that contrasted her to Labour's position.

 

[spekkeh]

Same deal with religious zealots, the second they decide to take up arms they stop being practitioners of their religion

Why?

 

[holygeesus]

I thought there was to be no campaigning today? May seems to be everywhere at the moment...

 

[D4Danger]

Has May not said enough is enough and that she will review our stance on terrorism?

Now is not the time for politicising so I apologise for derailing the thread. I'm just very angry at what's going on.

she was home secretary for six years and PM for one. What is it that should couldn't do in that time?

Do you think she will also review our trade deals with Saudi Arabia, a chief financier and exporter of extremist ideology?

she could start with this instead of trying to ban whatsapp

 

[ClosingADoor]

It will be interesting to see if this is a widespread thing or if it's just entered my social media bubble because I know people in London, but I'm seeing a lot of backlash to 'virtue signalling' and anger that I didn't see after Manchester. Also seeing a lot of likes on comments and articles based around the idea that it should be ok to blame Islam for this.

To me that argument doesn't make sense, if you're a law abiding citizen your whole life but then you stab someone to death because you saw them do something illegal, you're not a law abiding citizen anymore, you're a criminal, you might say you're a vigilante or that you're just doing what all the other law abiding citizens want to do but believing that doesn't make you less of a criminal and it doesn't make the law responsible for your actions.

Same deal with religious zealots, the second they decide to take up arms they stop being practitioners of their religion, directing anger at religion they used to practice is pointless, it should be directed at the system that steered them away from their religion, and all our efforts should go into disrupting that process across the globe.

It is OK to blame the extremist interpretation of Islam these people use to justify their attacks. And then look at ways to prevent people from falling for that interpretation of their religion.

 

[Terbinator]

I thought there was to be no campaigning today? May seems to be everywhere at the moment...

I'd be worried if the PM of our country wasn't everywhere at the minute.

 

[Zakalwe]

Do you think she will also review our trade deals with Saudi Arabia, a chief financier and exporter of extremist ideology?

No. She will continue to lie about her intentions and make the wrong moves. Probably taking us down the road of more extreme surveillance, arms sales, and bombings.

Not saying she won't increase investment where it's required, too, but she's clearly a shill and has other interests besides the safety of our country at heart.

Oh look, the worst poster on GAF doesn't agree with me. What will I do?

Ha! I kind of hope that's true, would be quite an honour.

 

[hodgy100]

Do you think she will also review our trade deals with Saudi Arabia, a chief financier and exporter of extremist ideology?

Lol no because that is "good for industry"

 

[avaya]

Not overnight, but over several years, quite possibly given the right conditions. It's important there are strong safeguards against this happening.

Just a few years ago there was a case of British police working with companies to spy on those engaged in trade union activities and help to destroy their careers. With unfettered access this kind of activity could become commonplace.

The security services can already access e.g. Facebook messages and email with a court order and approval from a judge. They cannot access end-to-end encrypted messages. What you are proposing is preventing internet companies from offering end-to-end encryption. This is not exotic technology. The mathematics required has been available for decades. Anyone can download the code needed to rig up an unbreakable end-to-end messaging system. Stop people from communicating via WhatsApp securely and normal people and companies will have their communications exposed to theft and the baddies will move on to other easily obtainable methods of communicating securely.

(By the way, the Paris attackers communicated via SMS, which is not encrypted, and so the regulations you propose would have made no difference there.)



http://www.itv.com/news/2017-03-26/...rror-strategy-flaws-after-westminster-attack/

The police have never actually operated on a shoot to kill policy. The aim is not to kill the terrorist, but to prevent the terrorist from causing further harm. The death is just a byproduct.

I take back my comment, clearly uninformed about what is currently available to services these days ( I was not advocating the police having full access, just intelligence services).

 

[holygeesus]

I'd be worried if the PM of our country wasn't everywhere at the minute.

Just comes across as blatant opportunism to me, especially considering the BBC aren't even featuring Corbyn's response.

 

[Betty]

Just comes across as blatant opportunism to me, especially considering the BBC aren't even featuring Corbyn's response.

Sounds like May then.

 

[LNBL]

That won't be effective and they will just go underground which is more dangerous. It's a complex issue.

Didn't the terrorist of the manchester attack get reported by his mosque like 3 times to the police prior?

 

[Auraela]

Wow



It is believed 31-year-old Candice Hedge, from Brisbane, was stabbed once in the neck but did not suffer life-threatening injuries.

A friend told TV channel ABC she was well enough to call from the hospital and explain that the knife missed her main arteries.

 

[Ashes]

Sounds like May then.

I gotta say I disagree. She wasn't her usual robotic self. Seemed like she was genuinely angry.

 

[JonnyDBrit]

So turns out my Aunt and her husband got lucky last night. They were out having some drinks at one of the establishments in the area, and it was as they were walking home that they saw ambulances and police heading in the very direction they'd just walked from.

Christ.

On a slightly lighter note, this was apparently at one of the Tube stations:

 

[Auraela]

Armed police raid in barking in flats.

Independent saying it was home of one of suspects and 4 people been arrested there

 

[Jezbollah]

I thought there was to be no campaigning today? May seems to be everywhere at the moment...

National level campaigning has been suspended for the day, whereas local level campaigning continues.

 

[Zakalwe]

I gotta say I disagree. She wasn't her usual robotic self. Seemed like she was genuinely angry.

Sure. I don't think May is utterly devoid of empathy, and I do think she cares about this country and is obviously outraged at the attacks, the problem is her hypocrisy in the ways she's dealt with things in the past (reduction of Police spending for one) and the danger of her actions in the future in reaction to them.

Also she represents the interests of the elite, so counter productive actions like arms sales and draconian measures like spying on the population are likely to happen under her watch.

She's not a robot, sure, but she is dangerous.

 

[RoyalFool]

Getting fed up of the tolerent left suggesting we just carry on as usual and pretend it didn't happen, whilst allowing parts of the UK become breeding grounds for these radical nutjobs.

 

[Hodders]

It's a problem for multiple reasons

1) current foreign policy makes it easier to recruit in war torn countries, this gives them more people who can target at risk youth in western nations through social media and other channels.

2) the lack of on the ground policing is reducing the intelligence we are getting so while this person and the Manchester attacker were on lists the lack of actionable intelligence means they cannot be arrested. I do not want to live in a country that goes too far the wrong way and starts locking people up for thinking bad thoughts.

3) the drop in community support workers also means that targets for extremist propaganda are not having these ideas and beliefs challenged.

Reducing recruitment in war torn countries reduces the ability to spread propaganda, working with other nations can also help reduce the funding to these organisations. This will reduce the number of vulnerable people who are exposed to such extreme ideology.

Increasing policing and intelligence services means we can investigate those suspected threats in more detail and they will hopefully have more information to go on as well.

More social support workers will also help reduce the numbers of vulnerable people who are converted by the extremist views. That means there are fewer targets the police and intelligence services need to look at meaning there are more resources per suspect.

There is no way around it in my eyes but the cuts the conservative government have introduced are a contributing factor to these attacks. I also do not think you can trust this government to keep us safe when there have been 3 attacks in 3 months.

To be blunt, anybody who votes conservative is, in my opinion, partially responsible as they implicitly support policies that increase the likelihood of these attacks taking place.

Whilst i do 100% agree regarding the cuts, please note that it was a Labour government that made the decision to invade both Iraq and Afghanistan though, which is really the key root cause of any sucessful or attempted terrorist attack in the UK since 2001.

Both Labour and Conservative governments in the last twenty years have created a total security shitfest in the country now for the average person through their policies that i doubt even a Corbyn lead government can reverse.

Social reform and extra policing is one thing but the ideology is too far along now i'm afraid, in that i still believe British citizens would be targeted even if we removed ourself from any conflicts in the muslim world completely.

As a 38yr old family man i am fearful for what will happen to this country over the next 20yrs.

Edit: Just noticied that you have acknowledged the Blair government in a later post, rendering this post of mine pointless

 

[Zakalwe]

Getting fed up of the tolerent left suggesting we just carry on as usual and pretend it didn't happen, whilst allowing parts of the UK become breeding grounds for these radical nutjobs.

Not what's happening. So calm that noise, please.

 

[Memory]

Getting fed up of the tolerent left suggesting we just carry on as usual and pretend it didn't happen, whilst allowing parts of the UK become breeding grounds for these radical nutjobs.

Source?

 

[Impeccable]

You can see the hatred and the line of thinking Donald Trump employs to control his people in this thread. Blaming people other than the terrorists, asking for insane and improbable responses to a whole religion based on the radical side of things.

It is the same tone you can hear daily on the Alex Jones show.

Gross.

 

[holygeesus]

Getting fed up of the tolerent left suggesting we just carry on as usual and pretend it didn't happen, whilst allowing parts of the UK become breeding grounds for these radical nutjobs.

What would you suggest? Start lobbing bombs at a few random countries as retaliation? Saudi Arabia?

 

[FyreWulff]

Getting fed up of the tolerent left suggesting we just carry on as usual and pretend it didn't happen, whilst allowing parts of the UK become breeding grounds for these radical nutjobs.

whoareyoutalkingto.gif

 

[hodgy100]

Getting fed up of the tolerant left suggesting we just carry on as usual and pretend it didn't happen, whilst allowing parts of the UK become breeding grounds for these radical nutjobs.

The "tolerant left" as you call them want to increase police budgets to allow further integration with communities. So that when a community reports 5 times about an extremist they have the resources to actually deal with it.

 

[CharmingCharlie]

Getting fed up of the tolerent left suggesting we just carry on as usual and pretend it didn't happen, whilst allowing parts of the UK become breeding grounds for these radical nutjobs.

Perhaps you could get fed up with the radical right wing government we have in power right now that has reduced police manning levels to ridiculously low levels.

 

[Auraela]

You can see the hatred and the line of thinking Donald Trump employs to control his people in this thread. Blaming people other than the terrorists, asking for insane and improbable responses to a whole religion based on the radical side of things.

It is the same tone you can hear daily on the Alex Jones show.

Gross.

But this is the thing people will be pissed off. These attacks are barbaric and far to close to home for many people.

3 in 3 months. 5other attacks stops. Just imagine if those wernt aswell?

Thats just in the uk. You then have all other attacks in the middle east and elsewhere.

I dont have an answer but i can understand people lashing out and sounding crazy in this thread. I dont think its the best but atleast there fruststion isnt killing people in barbaric ways

 

[Guerrillas in the Mist]

Getting fed up of the tolerent left suggesting we just carry on as usual and pretend it didn't happen, whilst allowing parts of the UK become breeding grounds for these radical nutjobs.

Literally nobody here is saying this.

 

[Jezbollah]

To refer to the whole of "the left" is as "tolerant" at best is obscene generalisation, and at worse is massively insulting

 

[Kurtofan]

Fucking Pissboy is at it on twitter again

not even linking the tweets, they're outrageous

 

[Murkas]

Getting fed up of the tolerent left suggesting we just carry on as usual and pretend it didn't happen, whilst allowing parts of the UK become breeding grounds for these radical nutjobs.

Apt name!

 

[Sane_Man]

Getting fed up of the tolerent left suggesting we just carry on as usual and pretend it didn't happen, whilst allowing parts of the UK become breeding grounds for these radical nutjobs.

Username checks out.

 

[Daffy Duck]

I see May I pushing her political agenda to regulate the internet after this.

Fucking disgusting

 

[Showaddy]

Fucking Pissboy is at it on twitter again

not even linking the tweets, they're outrageous

What an absolutely loathsome cunt. Hope Sadiq takes the high road and just ignores the ignorant shitstain.

 

[kmax]

Getting fed up of the tolerent left suggesting we just carry on as usual and pretend it didn't happen, whilst allowing parts of the UK become breeding grounds for these radical nutjobs.

Standing united against the threats that threaten our way of life is our obligation in order to uphold our free and open society. Letting scumbag terrorists or right-wing idiots threaten that harmony is not something we can ever let happen.

When they hit us, we stand up and become even louder in conveying that they will never succeed.

 

[Condom]

Literally nobody here is saying this.

The most used argument of a rightwinger when it comes to the Islam debate is the strawman argument against the left.

I just read an article on this phenomenon after a terrorist attack and literally the exact thing is happening in the comments with people who have obviously not even read the intro/conclusion of the piece.

 

[entremet]

Fucking Pissboy is at it on twitter again

not even linking the tweets, they're outrageous

Trump?

 

[D4Danger]

Getting fed up of the tolerent left suggesting we just carry on as usual and pretend it didn't happen, whilst allowing parts of the UK become breeding grounds for these radical nutjobs.

the "left" in this case are actually advocating a change in policy because you might not have noticed but they haven't been in power for a decade. Read or watch Corbyn's speech after Manchester and maybe you'll learn something.

 

[Sarek]

Same deal with religious zealots, the second they decide to take up arms they stop being practitioners of their religion, directing anger at religion they used to practice is pointless, it should be directed at the system that steered them away from their religion, and all our efforts should go into disrupting that process across the globe.

So I guess eg. the Crusaders weren't practioners of Catholicism either right?

 

[Auraela]

Omg donalds twitter

Do you notice we are not having a gun debate right now? That's because they used knives and a truck!

 

[Akai__]

Just caught up on this. Absolutely horrible. :'(

 

[Cabaratier]

So I guess eg. the Crusaders weren't practioners of Catholicism either right?

Well to be fair, crusaders were robber kings and knights who got an excuse from the pope to pillage the Middle East. Don't forget they randomly switched to sacking Constantinople instead of going to Jerusalem, because they found out they could. So that actually backs his point.

 

[CharmingCharlie]

I see May I pushing her political agenda to regulate the internet after this.

Fucking disgusting

You know I would love to say "I refuse to let the terrorists scare me or change my way of life". However the truth is my own government scares me a hell of a lot more than any damn terrorists.

 

[Marlenus]

Social reform and extra policing is one thing but the ideology is too far along now i'm afraid, in that i still believe British citizens would be targeted even if we removed ourself from any conflicts in the muslim world completely.

As a 38yr old family man i am fearful for what will happen to this country over the next 20yrs.

For those who are already radicalised I think it is a case of doing our best to prevent them from committing these attacks.

Going forward though I think a change in policy can reduce the number of future radicals, combine that with improved funding for security and the resources you can spend on each threat goes up.