The American vs. Europe view on vacations and time off is flabbergasting
- Thread starter Trojita
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My work isn't great, but by American standards it's incredible:
0-3 years - 15 days
4+ years - 20 days
8+ years - 25 days
This is general paid time off, so including sick time. Every 7 years we also get a 4 week sabbatical in addition to vacation. Also 6 weeks fully paid maternity leave.
But even still, vacation was apparently non-negotiable. I had 21 days from my previous employer and I tried to negotiate that into my hire and they flat out told me no. Instead, I asked for the equivalent of 6 weeks salary and it got approved. This makes absolutely no sense to me.
My problem is I make enough money right now to be perfectly happy but I never seem to have the time to spend it. Every performance review, I always ask for more vacation time instead of a raise but apparently they just don't do that.
0-3 years - 15 days
4+ years - 20 days
8+ years - 25 days
This is general paid time off, so including sick time. Every 7 years we also get a 4 week sabbatical in addition to vacation. Also 6 weeks fully paid maternity leave.
But even still, vacation was apparently non-negotiable. I had 21 days from my previous employer and I tried to negotiate that into my hire and they flat out told me no. Instead, I asked for the equivalent of 6 weeks salary and it got approved. This makes absolutely no sense to me.
My problem is I make enough money right now to be perfectly happy but I never seem to have the time to spend it. Every performance review, I always ask for more vacation time instead of a raise but apparently they just don't do that.
I worked for Sallie Mae for a while and I forget how quickly you could accrue time, but it would roll over. However, they still limited how much you could take off, so unless you took the time as you got it, you wouldn't be able to use it AND you would lose it by the end of the year.
But they regularly wouldn't approve the time off even if you requested month in advance because it would hurt the bottom line, and if they did approve, they would be openly pissed at you for it. They made it so hard to take time off that it wasn't even worth it. It was really pretty miserable. I had one woman on my team who was on maternity leave and they actually called her 3 weeks in trying to get her to come back to work early.
But they regularly wouldn't approve the time off even if you requested month in advance because it would hurt the bottom line, and if they did approve, they would be openly pissed at you for it. They made it so hard to take time off that it wasn't even worth it. It was really pretty miserable. I had one woman on my team who was on maternity leave and they actually called her 3 weeks in trying to get her to come back to work early.
Vivalaraza
Member
Not necessarily.
Competition is good. A lack of appreciation for the needs of employees however, does not result in excellency.
As for your first paragraph, I don't know what the actual ratios are but it's not the population which counts, it's the population/jobs. The US has a large population but that in itself creates far more jobs.
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
That's probably not too uncommon in the US either, especially for lunches. I know where I've worked if you didn't have a lunch period on your time each day management would get on you about it because they can get into legal trouble over it.
And yeah, the US is horrible when it comes to time off. That's nothing new.
Liberty4all
Banned
The Canadian job market is competitive ... we don't have dozens of major cities we can move to pursuing career opportunities like the US ... The biggest job markets are Toronto, Vancouver, Calgary and Montreal.
With that said, in my experience Canadians can take their vacation time without employer prejudice. There is alot of emphasis on work life balance at the companies I have worked at.
With that said, in my experience Canadians can take their vacation time without employer prejudice. There is alot of emphasis on work life balance at the companies I have worked at.
Flatline
Banned
So you're practically the real life version of him but since it's reality it's depressing and fucked up instead of funny:
Also, everything about you screams victim of consumerism, your work is your life and you actually like that.
Starting a new job in a week. My first full time job at that.
start with 10 days vacation. You also get 5 sick days and 3 personal days, or somekthing close to that. From Xmas Eve until New Years you have off and it doesn't count against your vacation days. Federal holidays off as well.
Don't know if this is a lot of whatever. I know you get more as you stay in the company longer, I just forget the finer details.
I would love if there was a country with the American employment numbers as well as European vacation days.
start with 10 days vacation. You also get 5 sick days and 3 personal days, or somekthing close to that. From Xmas Eve until New Years you have off and it doesn't count against your vacation days. Federal holidays off as well.
Don't know if this is a lot of whatever. I know you get more as you stay in the company longer, I just forget the finer details.
I would love if there was a country with the American employment numbers as well as European vacation days.
Yup, even in a place like Tim Horton's (where the manager seemed upset when asked if there was a union upon being hired) respected the laws enforcing two 15 minute breaks per shift.
Occasionally I'd end up working through them for one reason or another and they never had any real complaints about putting an extra half hour on my clock out time, either.
Of course, they basically paid minimum wage and they worked me like a dog, but the rules are followed... at least in my limited experience.
My first post, been reading the forums for years though.
I get 30 days paid leave + a small leave bonus, 2 weeks sick leave with medical certificate and a few days sick leave without a certificate.
This is in Australia, teachers get school holidays off which adds up to 12 weeks.
I get 30 days paid leave + a small leave bonus, 2 weeks sick leave with medical certificate and a few days sick leave without a certificate.
This is in Australia, teachers get school holidays off which adds up to 12 weeks.
Boom Boom Pow
Banned
err, there's no stereotypes that amerixans are lazy.
-COOLIO-
The Everyman
all i got from that was that you work 50-60 hours, rough.
I think after the devastation of World War II, Europeans learned the importance of the finer things in life, while at the same time Americans were industrializing and learning the value of the almighty dollar. Different cultures due to different experiences, but kind of sad for us Americans really.
milanbaros
Member?
UK is a good balance. Lower unemployment than Eurozone but with most of the employment benefits.
UK here,
I work 9-5 Mon-Fri and I get each year
- The 8 natational bank holidays off full pay
- 30 days holiday at full pay
- 5 Days carers leave (for looking after poorly kids/family) at full pay
- Upto 6 Months Full Pay if I'm sick (half pay for a following 6 months)
- 2 weeks paternity leave (Male) Paid
- 12 months maternaty (Female) Paid
I find it crazy that the US is the only big developed country not to respect people's work life ballance like this and cover people's maternaty/paternaty &health care also.
I work 9-5 Mon-Fri and I get each year
- The 8 natational bank holidays off full pay
- 30 days holiday at full pay
- 5 Days carers leave (for looking after poorly kids/family) at full pay
- Upto 6 Months Full Pay if I'm sick (half pay for a following 6 months)
- 2 weeks paternity leave (Male) Paid
- 12 months maternaty (Female) Paid
I find it crazy that the US is the only big developed country not to respect people's work life ballance like this and cover people's maternaty/paternaty &health care also.
Ether_Snake
å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®
I work part time at a grocery store and shifts under or equal to 5 hours only get one break. 5 hour shifts are the worst because of it lol. xD
On that note, I don't have a real job yet so I don't really worry about vacation time. My vacation time would consist of me staying at home playing video games, lol.
Sadly, no.
Nexus Zero
Member
God that "enriching" post is so heart breaking.
I get the average UK allowance. For me, the importance in this isn't so much time away from work but what I get to do with it. Next year I've booked off three weeks in April to go to Japan, and I'll still have two weeks to spend elsewhere later in the year. I have the money to go to these places because I don't put so much value in wearing fucking Lacoste (seriously?)
I get the average UK allowance. For me, the importance in this isn't so much time away from work but what I get to do with it. Next year I've booked off three weeks in April to go to Japan, and I'll still have two weeks to spend elsewhere later in the year. I have the money to go to these places because I don't put so much value in wearing fucking Lacoste (seriously?)
Wow, that's pathetic. Dude works that much and all he has is a crummy BMW and Ralph Lauren polos to brag about. And an "enriched" attitude to go along with them. I honestly, truly thought it was a joke post.
Android18a
Member
Where I work we get 26 'free' days off where we can book it off as we will, plus bank holidays and christmas.
It's pretty nice
It's pretty nice
Japan is far worse than the U.S. if you're in a domestic Japanese company. Last year, my father broke his leg, so I wanted to take a Friday and Monday off to visit him in Manila while he was recovering (from Tokyo). My boss' initial response was, "Well, if he isn't dying, then there's no urgent need for you to go. But I'll think about it."
Many Japanese people in their 40s and above have this mindset left over from 20 years ago that work is everything in life and that missing it to pursue a remotely decent private life is seen as undesirable. Luckily the younger people aren't as bad, but there are a few people out there who still harbor such an attitude.
I even heard down the grapevine from someone that, "As a Japanese person, I don't understand why [cvxfreak] goes home on time. We're all working hard so late, so he should show some consideration for us."
So I went to a foreign-run company a few months ago and that's that.
Many Japanese people in their 40s and above have this mindset left over from 20 years ago that work is everything in life and that missing it to pursue a remotely decent private life is seen as undesirable. Luckily the younger people aren't as bad, but there are a few people out there who still harbor such an attitude.
I even heard down the grapevine from someone that, "As a Japanese person, I don't understand why [cvxfreak] goes home on time. We're all working hard so late, so he should show some consideration for us."
So I went to a foreign-run company a few months ago and that's that.
Lacoste, shits not even expensive!
Trojita
Rapid Response Threadmaker
If a lot of Europeans here didn't know how shit our Maternity Leave was in the USA, I have another bombshell for you.
In the US you are required to go to to the hospital to deliver your baby, BY LAW, the costs to have a child are OUTRAGEOUSLY expensive. Yet we still have an infant death rate nearing a 3rd world country.
In the US you are required to go to to the hospital to deliver your baby, BY LAW, the costs to have a child are OUTRAGEOUSLY expensive. Yet we still have an infant death rate nearing a 3rd world country.
Nexus Zero
Member
Yeah when I heard that I couldn't believe my ears. Also interestingly the same people who are more likely to support private healthcare like this, are more likely to support outlawing abortion. I love Americans but some of this shit is just incomprehensible to me.
That is called benefit of imigration, in Europe it is much different. Most of nations have minus birthrate and in some countries after demographic high there is low number of young people.
Companies compete with each other not only in salary but benefits to employe.
I in Poland have 20days paid leave (26 after 10 years working) + 10-15 public days and there is almost 0 problem to talk with your employe to get you free unpaid days (naturaly within etictboundries) + companies fund you gym/pool/food depending how big is company (each company beyond 20-30 people is requied to collect small part of your salary and fund people events)
For example last year i had ~30 days of paid leave and my company funded week in spa + various partiestoutside of working days.
That is beside 2 weeks paid leave because of sickness.
Phoenician_Viking
Banned
Well not having maternity leave should be straight up illegal. I never thought the US would be this backward with regards to workers right.
PjotrStroganov
Member
Would't they be screwed if the company goes bust?
I know that unfrtunetelly and i can't grasp how payingtfor delivery is legal.
My mother had cancer and remission later and we paid 0$ without healthcare smystem in place we wouldn't be able to pay even 1/4 of cancer treatement.
Socialism! Rabble rabble rabble bootstraps rabble rabble.
Lunchbox come back pls, thought you got a perma.
Been working the same job for 5 1/2 years had only 1 week paid vacation and no sick days or personal days. Never taken my days off until the end of the year and saved them for any "sick" or "emergency" situations. I work generally almost 50 hours a week and finally out of exhaustion and overwork I took one week of last Sept to rest. This year decided to say fuck it and booked a 2 week vacation in Poland in Sept to visit family and got a nice surprise that my boss decided to reward me with 10 days of paid vacation from now on (company policy is 10 days after 10 years T T ). Found out all managers were given 10 days so not just me and that it was only because this one asshole manager who does almost no work got it already so he wanted to be "fair" and make it for all of us.
I envy our Europeans neighbors so many days off and you can just hop on a plane/train or just drive and hit one of many countries nearby so easily. My goal is to retire there someday (already have citizenship by blood).
I envy our Europeans neighbors so many days off and you can just hop on a plane/train or just drive and hit one of many countries nearby so easily. My goal is to retire there someday (already have citizenship by blood).
Isn't that because American hospitals are a little too generous with the c-sections? I believe I saw a documentary about this, but I can't remember the title.
Edit: It was "The business of being born": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KvljyvU_ZGE
Moff
Member
not bad, but not nearly good enough for the hours you work. you dont want to know what kind of stuff people have that work 50-60 hours over here. and they still get 25+ day vacation, + unlimited sick days, + weeks of maternity leave
GraveHorizon
poop meter feature creep
Goddamn, that "enriching" stuff sounds so pretentious. I hope it's a joke.
I work at a small family-owned/run restaurant, Wednesday-Saturday. We get two weeks off a year for Christmas and 4th of July, and two days during the week of Thanksgiving. But every other week, we work. We're open on Mother's and Father's Day and Valentine's Day regardless of the day of the week, so that's extra right there. And we're strongly suggested to volunteer to come in for a couple days during our week off in order to deep clean the restaurant. If any any days (Sunday-Tuesday) adjacent to before and after the vacation week weren't counted as vacation time since those would normally be our days off anyway, we get 10 days off a year. (Oh yeah, I also work half days on Tuesdays restocking food items and doing other stuff by myself.) You can request days off for really important stuff, like weddings, funerals, and generally things you're required to attend that aren't trivial. And it is a restaurant, so if you're really sick you shouldn't come in.
You can only imagine how employees feel about not being able to take any random day off for stupid shit, like school football games or the fair. We go through so many people on that fact alone. That all said, my work isn't terrible, and it's the food service industry so it's probably to be expected.
I work at a small family-owned/run restaurant, Wednesday-Saturday. We get two weeks off a year for Christmas and 4th of July, and two days during the week of Thanksgiving. But every other week, we work. We're open on Mother's and Father's Day and Valentine's Day regardless of the day of the week, so that's extra right there. And we're strongly suggested to volunteer to come in for a couple days during our week off in order to deep clean the restaurant. If any any days (Sunday-Tuesday) adjacent to before and after the vacation week weren't counted as vacation time since those would normally be our days off anyway, we get 10 days off a year. (Oh yeah, I also work half days on Tuesdays restocking food items and doing other stuff by myself.) You can request days off for really important stuff, like weddings, funerals, and generally things you're required to attend that aren't trivial. And it is a restaurant, so if you're really sick you shouldn't come in.
You can only imagine how employees feel about not being able to take any random day off for stupid shit, like school football games or the fair. We go through so many people on that fact alone. That all said, my work isn't terrible, and it's the food service industry so it's probably to be expected.
What the fuck? If they would treat employees better they would probably make more money just due to lower staff turnover. Those are the sort of small business owners that can just fuck off.
Zoe
Member
What? You are not required by law to have a hospital birth. Home births are a thing.
Zoe
Member
There are midwives, but lots of insurance plans won't approve them.
Shake Appeal
Member
Daniel Jackson
Member
This topic really amazes me. I guess I should really consider myself lucky with 40 paid days of vacation per year. By law, the minimum number of vacation days for everyone here is 4 times the number of days they work per week. So if you work 5 days per week, you get 20 days. And that's only what's required by law. A lot of employers give you more. And, also by law, we all get vacation money on top of the normal salary every year around May. This is 8% of your annual salary.
Right now I technically get 2 or 3 weeks vacation, but I rarely take it. I work for a small company that I'm kind of working toward building up, so at the moment it's kind of all hands on deck trying to make it big. Once we make it big we'll probably get some awesome vacation time. I don't mind it because I do have such a large stake in things. I'll also probably end up going to some conventions in places I wouldn't have been able to fly to.
This sounds like paradise. Do you live in heaven?
This sounds like paradise. Do you live in heaven?
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
As an American I can't even imagine having 40 paid vacation days. That's basically two months once you factor in your normal off days. I mean, wow.
Guess you should consider yourself lucky? lol
I work for the city government of Washington, DC and accumulate a half of a vacation day per pay period (2 weeks), or what amounts to 13 vacation days per year. And I work in a white-collar IT position with a decent salary, so while I consider myself lucky compared to lots of other folks, I would kill for benefits like yours. (You get vacation money?)
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