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[jason10mm]

Don't be cunty. If any, this endless "woke / race" discussion sucks all the life and fun out of actually discussing this movie. This thread sucks to visit.

Then put up some discussion points that are more interesting. God knows I'd rather move on as well.

How about... "Did Batman actually accomplish ANYTHING in this film?" Riddlers plan, from what I can tell, was to flush Falcone out in order to shoot him, then proceed to level Gotham and strip the city of a competent(???) successor via assassination. One of those "don't look at it in reverse" sequence of events that really don't string together well. So when/where did Batman do anything positive? If anything, he displayed a level of predictability that allowed him to push the plan forward. His detective skills were basically to follow the breadcrumbs laid out for him.

 

[En Sama]

I didn't really like this movie I thought the actors were great for the most part but the characters were shit.
Riddler was really bad and the wing suit scene was awful.

Did the Riddler know that Falcone was the snitch from the start? If he did why didn't he just kill him at the funeral? Falcone was supposed to be a recluse and the Riddler wanted Batman to bring him into the light but it was pure coincidence that Batman found out he was the snitch.

I think I missed something that part didn't make sense to me. One more thing why did the Penguin and the cop bring a dead body with them to a drug deal?

 

[FunkMiller]

Looking forward to Matt Reeves casting a black dude as Mr Freeze in the sequel, and all the people whining about this first film being woke because the villains are all white... will be back whining about how they made the main villain black in the second one.

 

[sol_bad]

Then put up some discussion points that are more interesting. God knows I'd rather move on as well.

How about... "Did Batman actually accomplish ANYTHING in this film?" Riddlers plan, from what I can tell, was to flush Falcone out in order to shoot him, then proceed to level Gotham and strip the city of a competent(???) successor via assassination. One of those "don't look at it in reverse" sequence of events that really don't string together well. So when/where did Batman do anything positive? If anything, he displayed a level of predictability that allowed him to push the plan forward. His detective skills were basically to follow the breadcrumbs laid out for him.

Batman ultimately failed but has learnt and grown a lot in his journey so far. If Reeves has a proper story arc thought out and it finishes stronger than Nolan's trilogy, I'm all there for it.

I don't mind seeing heroes fail.

Some people complain about Mary Sue's and Gary Stu's. Are we really going to complain about the opposite where it takes multiple films to see a heroes full arc and journey and to see them win in the end?

 

[FunkMiller]

Batman ultimately failed but has learnt and grown a lot in his journey so far. If Reeves has a proper story arc thought out and it finishes stronger than Nolan's trilogy, I'm all there for it.

I don't mind seeing heroes fail.

Some people complain about Mary Sue's and Gary Stu's. Are we really going to complain about the opposite where it takes multiple films to see a heroes full arc and journey and to see them win in the end?

This Batman was way more of a kid than any of the other version in live action. I know Pattinson's actually older than when Bale first played him, but the character is definitely meant to be far greener, angrier, less in control and less 'Batman'.

I was just happy he stuck closely to the no kill code, which every other guy has cocked up in every other movie so far.

If by film three we've got fully fleshed out Batman, with the more advanced suit, better tech, better skills etc. then I'll be happy.

 

[The Skull]

This Batman was way more of a kid than any of the other version in live action. I know Pattinson's actually older than when Bale first played him, but the character is definitely meant to be far greener, angrier, less in control and less 'Batman'.

I was just happy he stuck closely to the no kill code, which every other guy has cocked up in every other movie so far.

If by film three we've got fully fleshed out Batman, with the more advanced suit, better tech, better skills etc. then I'll be happy.

Does he? Fairly certain that people will have died during the chase scene with all those cars exploding.

 

[FunkMiller]

Does he? Fairly certain that people will have died during the chase scene with all those cars exploding.

Possibly. But the film goes out of its way to underline the fact that Batman doesn’t intentionally kill, and is dead set against it. Good enough for me, in a superhero flick where you naturally suspend disbelief.

 

[strange headache]

I was just happy he stuck closely to the no kill code, which every other guy has cocked up in every other movie so far.

By involving dozens of civilians in a deadly highway chase and sending them to a blazing early grave only to then lecture Gordon about his gun use... the lack of Batman's self-awareness in this movie is simply astounding.

 

[OmegaSupreme]

This Batman was way more of a kid than any of the other version in live action. I know Pattinson's actually older than when Bale first played him, but the character is definitely meant to be far greener, angrier, less in control and less 'Batman'.

I was just happy he stuck closely to the no kill code, which every other guy has cocked up in every other movie so far.

If by film three we've got fully fleshed out Batman, with the more advanced suit, better tech, better skills etc. then I'll be happy.

The worst thing about Batman as has been discussed before.

 

[jason10mm]

Is batman any different at the end of the film? Usually a film tracking the growth of a skillset would have the protag fail at something, training montage a bit, then succeed at a much harder and more critical version of that thing later on, even if it is ultimately proven futile. I don't recall batmtan getting better at anything other than maybe punching. He discovers some stuff about himself, yes, but how that will inform his actions we've yet to see.

 

[Billbofet]

By involving dozens of civilians in a deadly highway chase and sending them to a blazing early grave only to then lecture Gordon about his gun use... the lack of Batman's self-awareness in this movie is simply astounding.

Agreed. As cool as that chase scene is, Batman could have just waited 20 minutes and found Penguin probably back at that nightclub in his office vs. the dozens of super dead folks now burning to ashes on the freeway.
Least he didn't use a gun.

 

[Star-Lord]

Finally got around to watching this over the weekend. I enjoyed it, as flawed as it is. I'm keen to see where Reeves goes with the sequel.

 

[Hardensoul]

Agreed. As cool as that chase scene is, Batman could have just waited 20 minutes and found Penguin probably back at that nightclub in his office vs. the dozens of super dead folks now burning to ashes on the freeway.
Least he didn't use a gun.

After the car chase Penguin is

Spoiler

released

. Makes it pointless. The Riddler solved more crimes than Batman. Everything fell into Batman’s lap, sure he solve some riddles.

I saw no growth by Batman! LA Confidential seems to be the noir film it was trying to emulate but failed to do so.

Movie was way too long!

Spoiler

Esoecially with the pointless Selina escort out of town

SMH

 

[Hardensoul]

This Batman is a buffoon. He has a giant ticking bomb clock in front of him as it counts down to zero and ignores it, letting it explode in his face. It facilitates a "cool" slow motion sequence, but undermines the character.

This and the scene after that at the police station! If you wanted to know who he was, take his mask off when he’s passed out cold or tie him down before he wakes up!!

Then the shotgun does almost as much force as the explosion! Movie went for so much realism but fails so much at it!

 

[SJRB]

After the car chase Penguin is

Spoiler

released

. Makes it pointless. The Riddler solved more crimes than Batman. Everything fell into Batman’s lap, sure he solve some riddles.

I saw no growth by Batman! LA Confidential seems to be the noir film it was trying to emulate but failed to do so.

Movie was way too long!

Spoiler

Esoecially with the pointless Selina escort out of town

SMH

Batman is kind of a selfish twat for the bigger part of the movie, not exactly the "5 steps ahead, 4D chess player" like we all know him from the comics and whatnot. But him being useless is kind of the point as he comes to realize by the end of the movie. Going around beating up thugs out of a personal quest for vengeance doesn't help himself or the city and usually only makes it worse.

So at the end he switches to being a beacon of hope, aiding Gotham citizens, fighting crime for the greater good.

[of course that leads to the infamous Batman paradox where Batman defeating thugs = more thugs and agression = Batman defeating more thugs, but perhaps this is tackled in the next movie]

Movie should've addressed the sheer stupidity and recklessness of the highway chase though. Would be nice if Alfred asked him "was it worth it?", forcing Bruce into a moment of introspection. Because man, so much pointless carnage. Maybe a tidbit where Bruce Wayne pays for all the damages or something, I don't know.

 

[Hardensoul]

Batman is kind of a selfish twat for the bigger part of the movie, not exactly the "5 steps ahead, 4D chess player" like we all know him from the comics and whatnot. But him being useless is kind of the point as he comes to realize by the end of the movie. Going around beating up thugs out of a personal quest for vengeance doesn't help himself or the city and usually only makes it worse.

So at the end he switches to being a beacon of hope, aiding Gotham citizens, fighting crime for the greater good.

[of course that leads to the infamous Batman paradox where Batman defeating thugs = more thugs and agression = Batman defeating more thugs, but perhaps this is tackled in the next movie]

Movie should've addressed the sheer stupidity and recklessness of the highway chase though. Would be nice if Alfred asked him "was it worth it?", forcing Bruce into a moment of introspection. Because man, so much pointless carnage. Maybe a tidbit where Bruce Wayne pays for all the damages or something, I don't know.

Movie had so much potential. I wanted to be entertained but there just so much stuff that didn’t make sense that threw me out of the moment. It made it hard for me to enjoy!

Edit: The growth after all the failure that you/everyone mentions by end. Makes no sense with how the Bat signal was used in the beginning! The Bat signal to me has always been that Batman was already competent and earned trust and hope for Gotham. It would’ve been better if it was at the end then?

 

[gizmopub999]

I give it a 4/5

 

[RaduN]

Pretty weak movie, almost to the point of beeing completely pointless.

It was not smart, not emotional, not even interesting in the least...overall not gripping in any way.
I like Pattinson a lot, and i enjoy action-fantasy flicks.
This was simply a nicely shot but very weak movie in all other aspects.

 

[Kazekage1981]

i like how catwoman

Spoiler

at the end just decides to drive away upstate and avoid the city altogether. lol. Problem Solved

 

[Kazekage1981]

When are they gonna have:

Poison Ivy
Mad Hatter
clayface

Getting tired of the joker. This movie was alright-not great. Looking forward to the sequel.

 

[Badlucktroll]

When are they gonna have:

Poison Ivy
Mad Hatter
clayface

Getting tired of the joker. This movie was alright-not great. Looking forward to the sequel.

The director mentioned wanting to use Mr. Freeze.

 

[CrankyJay™]

The movie had some cool stylistic choices but Batman was miscast. His voice sounded like Bale’s at times, which was bad to begin with.

Not sure what the hell was up with the Joker casting. I saw the deleted scene and thought I was watching some made for YouTube clip.

Casting was hit and miss. Colin Farrel, Jeffrey Wright, and Andy Serkis were all great.

But Turturro as Falcon? I can’t take that guy seriously in anything. Batman was miscast too. Riddler was a fucking weirdo.

Not sure how they make a franchise out of this.

 

[FunkMiller]

Pretty weak movie, almost to the point of beeing completely pointless.

It was not smart, not emotional, not even interesting in the least...overall not gripping in any way.
I like Pattinson a lot, and i enjoy action-fantasy flicks.
This was simply a nicely shot but very weak movie in all other aspects.

There's your problem. This wasn't in any way an action fantasy flick. It was a neo-noir detective story with some mild action beats.

I think maybe people were expecting a more typical superhero movie with this, and got something very different. YMMV as to whether you're happy with that or not.

 

[FunkMiller]

Edit: The growth after all the failure that you/everyone mentions by end. Makes no sense with how the Bat signal was used in the beginning! The Bat signal to me has always been that Batman was already competent and earned trust and hope for Gotham. It would’ve been better if it was at the end then?

They did that in Begins. And why would having the bat signal automatically make him the fully rounded Batman? As Batman says, he sees it as a warning to criminals... not as a sign of hope for the people of the city. That's where this Batman starts off on the wrong foot, and his arc in the film is coming to realise that you can't just be an agent of vengeance to succeed, you need to be something more hopeful.

 

[Hardensoul]

They did that in Begins. And why would having the bat signal automatically make him the fully rounded Batman? As Batman says, he sees it as a warning to criminals... not as a sign of hope for the people of the city. That's where this Batman starts off on the wrong foot, and his arc in the film is coming to realise that you can't just be an agent of vengeance to succeed, you need to be something more hopeful.

Why not? Because Gordon trusted him enough to call him to the crime scene with the bat signal.

Even that first crime scene was odd when we come to find out the other cops consider him a vigilante and don’t seem to trust him at all. They could’ve arrested him for being a vigilante!

Gordon, we come to find out is only a lieutenant at this time. So he over step his authority to invite Batman there? He got chewed out by the Chief too. It was a very odd dynamics going on there.

So if he’s still green for story using bat signal by Gordon there made no sense! But maybe Batman himself uses the signal to put a scare on the criminals!

 

[Aggelos]

Oh man, what kind of virtual cinematography is this...

 

[SJRB]

That huge LED screen is insane.

 

[jason10mm]

Damn, that is impressive. The amount of pre-producrion/prefiʻming work needed to have all the surrounds ready for the actors to come in for their part must be nuts. I wonder what the budget floor is to even get a day inside a studio like that, anything less than a 100 mill+ production can't afford it or are there enough ways to use it even a romcom or indie film could use it?

I'm also not sure if this will accelerate the "all CGI, all the time" push in Hollywood where there are no longer any physical limitations and films feel more and more weightless and cartoony or if this will just free up location work and let the actors spend more time getting fight choreography and such done practically because they don't have such a hard time getting to and from locations.

 

[ResurrectedContrarian]

LTTP (is there another OT thread for The Batman?) but I finally watched it last night.

Amazing. For some reason I went in expecting the mind-numbing dullness of all other comic movies to have finally infested Batman, but that's not the case. The pacing and scope of the film was fantastic. They didn't even need the final "flood" danger in the final hour, in fact it would have been better without it; the strength of the film was its ability to stakes that feel real even with smaller situations and setups. Some of the fight choices were perfect, like filming Batman only in the sudden flashes of gunfire in that dark room.

I think it's already better than the Nolan films. While enjoyable, those always bothered me a bit with their oddly heavy-handed faux intellectual tone, as well as their weirdly offputting use of secondary actors (police, citizens, etc) who never felt real at all, like everyone knew they were in a corny comic film. Overall Nolan's films are fun as a Batman fan but not great films, with so many bizarre missteps. I didn't feel that way at all with The Batman; every shot was what it needed to be, laser focused and visually stunning. And vampire dude works well as Bruce, it turns out.

EDIT: I didn't find it to be infested with "wokeness" either. And believe me, I switch off any film that has the idiotic progressive mind virus. In this case, there were certain obligatory elements you could spot (the new black mayor, some lines of dialogue from Catwoman, etc) but it all felt so secondary. I mean, the film in the end is like a 3-way struggle between Bruce, his mirror image in the orphan Riddler, and his memory or faith in the good man of his father. Every part of the drama emerges from that landscape and conflict. I just shrug at lines like the ones from Catwoman because she's so clearly a secondary force in the film. Actions speak louder than words, and the actual narrative puts her in her insignificant place, frankly.

 

[En Sama]

This was a terrible Batman movie and an even worse detective movie.

 

[FunkMiller]

This was a terrible Batman movie and an even worse detective movie.

I didn’t know Zack Snyder posted on GAF. Cool!

 

[Lunarorbit]

Having rewatched it... It has some serious issues, the length and tedium being a major offender.

The joker looks and sounds ridiculous. Guess they are going for the new 52 joker. I'm completely over the joker. They've pounded him into our brains over and over again. Give him a break already.

 

[BadBurger]

I really enjoyed this movie. Felt like an arc from an old Batman proper comic or Detective Comics. I thought Wright was the best Commissioner Gordon ever.

 

[KyoZz]

#BatmanGate is trending as Chris Wozniak accuses Matt Reeves of stealing his script

https://twitter.com/BatmanGate

"The unsold Batman Plot I gave to Michael Uslan is the Main Storyline in THE BATMAN"

DC Penciler Chris Wozniak Accuses Matt Reeves Of Stealing His Original Ideas For 'The Batman' Film, Provides New Evidence To Back His Claims

Chris Wozniak's crusade to prove Matt Reeves based The Batman on a treatment he submitted years ago continues.

boundingintocomics.com

 

[sinnergy]

#BatmanGate is trending as Chris Wozniak accuses Matt Reeves of stealing his script

http://[URL]https://twitter.com/BatmanGate

[/URL]


"The unsold Batman Plot I gave to Michael Uslan is the Main Storyline in THE BATMAN"

http://[URL]https://boundingintocom...ilm-provides-new-evidence-to-back-his-claims/

[/URL]

If I was him I wouldn’t sue .. movie wasn’t that good..

 

[DKehoe]

#BatmanGate is trending as Chris Wozniak accuses Matt Reeves of stealing his script

http://[URL]https://twitter.com/BatmanGate

[/URL]


"The unsold Batman Plot I gave to Michael Uslan is the Main Storyline in THE BATMAN"

http://[URL]https://boundingintocom...ilm-provides-new-evidence-to-back-his-claims/

[/URL]

This doesn't really seem like anything

 

[ResurrectedContrarian]

The joker looks and sounds ridiculous. Guess they are going for the new 52 joker. I'm completely over the joker. They've pounded him into our brains over and over again. Give him a break already.

This one I can agree with. There was no need for that Joker cameo, the portrayal was not interesting and we’ve all grown tired of each new actor trying to show how crazy they can be (yawn... Leto was the turning point where I realized I’m so tired of every actor trying this bit). I hope they don’t actually make the 2nd film another joker story.

 

[Javthusiast]

movie wasn’t that good..

 

[GeekyDad]

 

[I collect VHS tapes]

I think this one is probably the best Batman movie ever tbh

 

[TaylorSwiftFan]

I think this one is probably the best Batman movie ever tbh

Better than TDK or BB?

 

[FunkMiller]

#BatmanGate is trending as Chris Wozniak accuses Matt Reeves of stealing his script

https://twitter.com/BatmanGate

"The unsold Batman Plot I gave to Michael Uslan is the Main Storyline in THE BATMAN"

DC Penciler Chris Wozniak Accuses Matt Reeves Of Stealing His Original Ideas For 'The Batman' Film, Provides New Evidence To Back His Claims

Chris Wozniak's crusade to prove Matt Reeves based The Batman on a treatment he submitted years ago continues.

boundingintocomics.com

It's clearly horseshit, propped up by and spread by Snyder Cultists, who really should go outside and get a breath of fresh air.

 

[KyoZz]

It's clearly horseshit, propped up by and spread by Snyder Cultists, who really should go outside and get a breath of fresh air.

Show me on the puppet where Snyder or his fans touched you, it's gonna be ok.

 

[CrankyJay™]

#BatmanGate is trending as Chris Wozniak accuses Matt Reeves of stealing his script

http://[URL]https://twitter.com/BatmanGate

[/URL]


"The unsold Batman Plot I gave to Michael Uslan is the Main Storyline in THE BATMAN"

http://[URL]https://boundingintocom...ilm-provides-new-evidence-to-back-his-claims/

[/URL]

When the fuck are writers going to come up with written and notorized proof of script ownership then? If I wrote any script to try to sell to Hollywood I would be documenting everything.

 

[Javthusiast]

 

[FunkMiller]

Show me on the puppet where Snyder or his fans touched you, it's gonna be ok.

you obviously aren’t paying much attention to the story, as it’s clearly the Snyder cult behind it.

 

[KyoZz]

you obviously aren’t paying much attention to the story, as it’s clearly the Snyder cult behind it.

?? How so?

I've just watched this video and while it's clearly not a 1:1 copy, there is some similarities.




But I'm not a judge. And we all know this kind of stuff may be pretty hard to prove.
Not sure if it's illegal too, as if he sent this story with the legal rights to use it for WB/DC, well they can modify it and use it. It's that simple.
And not to mention that Year One and Long Halloween influences are very clear for The Batman.
That would just mean Reeves didn't write a totally original script, as opposed to what he said.

In the End, Reeves and WB probably don't give a fuck about this.

 

[GeekyDad]

Fair enough. To each their own. It had a lot of things I liked about it, but ultimately a miss for me. Perhaps they'll do better with the (assumed) sequel.

 

[Javthusiast]

Fair enough. To each their own. It had a lot of things I liked about it, but ultimately a miss for me. Perhaps they'll do better with the (assumed) sequel.

 

[FunkMiller]

?? How so?

I've just watched this video and while it's clearly not a 1:1 copy, there is some similarities.




But I'm not a judge. And we all know this kind of stuff may be pretty hard to prove.
Not sure if it's illegal too, as if he sent this story with the legal rights to use it for WB/DC, well they can modify it and use it. It's that simple.
And not to mention that Year One and Long Halloween influences are very clear for The Batman.
That would just mean Reeves didn't write a totally original script, as opposed to what he said.

In the End, Reeves and WB probably don't give a fuck about this.

The only things it has in common are pretty generic aspects of Batman that have been used and reused in different ways for years. Reeves has been pretty candid about his influences. The same way Nolan was. This is a nothingburger, cooked up and pushed by people who are still salty Affleck isn’t Batman anymore. You only have to Google the hashtag #Batman gate to see that.

And no, they definitely don’t give a fuck.