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[Deleted member 17706]

だく　is more physical, like an embrace or a hug.
いだく is less physical and shares a similar meaning to かかえる. You can use both of them for more mental things. 精神病を抱える。コンプレックスを抱く。　etc... etc... They aren't interchangable and it would be really strange to say コンプレックスをだく or something like that.

 

[YYZ]

ok I don't know if this is a dumb question, but what the heck does です mean? I'm reading the dictionary of basic Japanese grammar and it says:

です means a declarative sentence.

ですか means a question.

ですねmeans it's a confirmation.

There are other sentence-final particles listed (such as &#12394, some with です and some without.

 

[zoku88]

です is kinda like saying 'it is' Ex: きれいです。 She is pretty.

ですか is like saying 'is it that... ?' きれしですか。 Is she pretty?

ですね is like saying errr I'll just give an example きれいですね. She's pretty, right? (unless im confused with ねえ..) More or less, you say it when you expect someone to agree with you.

Also note, です　is the distal (or wtv you call it) form of だ
きれいです　＝きれいだよ

 

[takotchi]

Try not to think of です and だ being the same thing, lest you start saying things like いいだ or きれいだか？. To me, です just is what it is; it's the polite copula.

 

[zoku88]

Try not to think of です and だ being the same thing, lest you start saying things like いいだ or きれいだか？. To me, です just is what it is; it's the polite copula.

Imagining those in my head sounds hilarious. They seem to correspond for most (non-questioning) sentences, though.

 

[YYZ]

Sorry, but that still doesn't answer what does です mean exactly. What is its purpose?

The か and ね things aren't really questions of mine, I understand what they mean since the concept is pretty straightforward. I just put those in my post to add some context to my question of what です means. I don't know since the dictionary doesn't say explicitly what です means, or it did and I forgot or haven't read that part yet.

 

[zoku88]

Sorry, but that still doesn't answer what does です mean exactly. What is its purpose?

One of the posters called it a polite copula

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copula

Judging from that page, that seems like the best way to describe it.

EDIT: Are you trying to learn vocab before grammar or something?

 

[YYZ]

I get it now, thank you. I forgot that the sentence structure is subject+object+verb so that being on the end confused me.

What order should I be learning stuff in? I thought it makes more sense to learn vocab before grammar. I'm using Heisig's method so pronunciations aren't taught in his book.

 

[zoku88]

I get it now, thank you. I forgot that the sentence structure is subject+object+verb so that being on the end confused me.

What order should I be learning stuff in? I thought it makes more sense to learn vocab before grammar. I'm using Heisig's method so pronunciations aren't taught in his book.

Well, the way my class does it (and I assume most language classes) was to introduce vocab whilst doing grammar stuff.

Of course, there are always different way of doing things.

 

[RevenantKioku]

I get it now, thank you. I forgot that the sentence structure is subject+object+verb so that being on the end confused me.

Don't force yourself to abide by that too much though. Remember:
A grammatically complete sentence requires a verb only (including state of being).

What order should I be learning stuff in? I thought it makes more sense to learn vocab before grammar. I'm using Heisig's method so pronunciations aren't taught in his book.

Well, did you finish book one yet?

 

[YYZ]

Well, did you finish book one yet?

no

I figured that after doing book one, I can fully concentrate on grammar and informally learning pronunciations without having to worry about various kanji since it is distracting and not very helpful to learn grammar with example sentences when not knowing most of the kanji I come across. I haven't fully dedicated myself yet though, stuck between working full time, and wanting to read a lot of books, and computer time.

 

[Rpgmonkey]

Well I finally stopped putting it off and downloaded Firefox in Japanese.

I expected more Katakana. :|

And I like to learn vocab as I learn grammar, since it usually cements the vocab in my mind a little easier, but of course that's just the method that works for me.

 

[Heidalloon]

I'm going to have a lot of time from now on, so I'm picking up studying Japanese again. When I was first starting, I was going through Tae Kim's guide on grammar, but after finishing it I found myself retaining very little. Are there any better approaches to learning grammar? I have the Dictionaries of Japanese Grammar.

I already know the kana, so I'm looking to move onto learning Kanji. I tried Heisig and did about 200 of them, but I didn't like the method very much. I'd rather just learn all of the information at once and use an SRS or something else to review them. Maybe I'll see the appeal in Heisig when I get further into Japanese and realize that most people's claims of how much a monster Kanji is a true, though I hope that doesn't happen. Some people have said that drill books are the way to go. Could anyone give me a link to where I can find these?

 

[Arctic Feather]

I'm pretty sure this has been mentioned before, but I can't find it. How do I set up anki to only show the Heisig lessons that I've already read?

 

[Heidalloon]

Bumping for answers.

 

[RevenantKioku]

I'm pretty sure this has been mentioned before, but I can't find it. How do I set up anki to only show the Heisig lessons that I've already read?

Go to edit deck, select the cards you want to go away, add a tag and make that tag "Suspended", no quotes obviously. To get them back in the queue, remove that tag.

Heidalloon, not to be a dick but it sounds like you have your answers you just need to actually do work.

 

[Heidalloon]

Heidalloon, not to be a dick but it sounds like you have your answers you just need to actually do work.

For the most part I do. I'm mainly wondering where to buy the kanji drill books and the elementary school textbooks that Zefah and others mentioned before.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

For the most part I do. I'm mainly wondering where to buy the kanji drill books and the elementary school textbooks that Zefah and others mentioned before.

I personally bought them in Japan, but depending on where you live you may have access to a store that sells Japanese books and they might carry them too. I know Kinokuniya has stores outside of Japan (there is one in Seattle where I am from) and I think they have an online website as well where you might be able to pick up books. You could also try searching eBay and Amazon.co.jp, although Amazon charges a lot for overseas shipping. If you are dedicated, the purchase will be worth it, though.

 

[Heidalloon]

I personally bought them in Japan, but depending on where you live you may have access to a store that sells Japanese books and they might carry them too. I know Kinokuniya has stores outside of Japan (there is one in Seattle where I am from) and I think they have an online website as well where you might be able to pick up books. You could also try searching eBay and Amazon.co.jp, although Amazon charges a lot for overseas shipping. If you are dedicated, the purchase will be worth it, though.

Thanks. Are there any particular ones I should look for or are they all basically the same?

 

[Deleted member 17706]

Thanks. Are there any particular ones I should look for or are they all basically the same?

They should all be pretty similar because Kanji are taught in a certain order based on the school year in Japan. The example vocabularly and sentences that are introduced may be different, but they should all teach you the readings and stroke order in the proper order.

 

[Zoe]

Just realized that registration for this year's JLPT is open :O

Anybody else planning on taking it? I'm not sure which site I should register for... I'd have to make a trip out of it :\

 

[zoku88]

JLPT?

 

[RevenantKioku]

日本語能力試験
Japanese Proficiency Test. I hate how you have to fill out the paper forms here. Why the fuck can't I do it online? I gotta register for 2級 soon.

 

[zoku88]

日本語能力試験
Japanese Proficiency Test. I hate how you have to fill out the paper forms here. Why the fuck can't I do it online? I gotta register for 2級 soon.

I see.

I wonder if I even qualify for level 4 :lol

 

[Zoe]

http://www.jflalc.org/?act=tpt&id=8

I'm gonna go for 3級... the jump between 3 and 2 is supposed to be pretty big, right?

 

[RevenantKioku]

The reading sections were huge in 2級 if I remember correctly. I got 37% if I remember correctly? That was two years ago so I hope I'm fine for this year, but we'll see.

 

[Zoe]

The reading sections were huge in 2級 if I remember correctly. I got 37% if I remember correctly? That was two years ago so I hope I'm fine for this year, but we'll see.

Just took a peek at a sample reading for 2級... yeah, I think I'm gonna be conservative this year.

Looks like they'll be revising the test in 2010 though to add a level between 2級 and 3級.

 

[Askia47]

Reached 1400 kanji in Heisig. getting higher and higher! surprisingly ive failed the JPLT 4 twice. last year i failed by two points. i have a long way to go. Not sure if ill take it this year or not.

 

[takotchi]

Oh, dammit, it's JLPT time already? Nah, forget it. I think I'll take the 2kyuu in July... December is just too soon.

 

[Blackace]

Oh, dammit, it's JLPT time already? Nah, forget it. I think I'll take the 2kyuu in July... December is just too soon.

you can take it twice in a year???

Only one shot in Japan

 

[takotchi]

It's a new change. July 2009 the current 2kyuu and 1kyuu will be offered. July 2010 the new format with 5 levels starts.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

Is a fifth level really necessary? I've only taken the JLPT once, but is the difference between levels really that large?

 

[Stocka]

Is anyone here studying Japanese at University? Is it or is it not a good idea to take it as a degree in an attempt to learn the language?

 

[Dabookerman]

Is anyone here studying Japanese at University? Is it or is it not a good idea to take it as a degree in an attempt to learn the language?

It is a good idea as long as it's for more than 3 hours per week.
If you take it as a course, and you go to the country, which you're doing right? And motivation, then yeah, it's all good.

 

[Mœbius]

Just realized that registration for this year's JLPT is open :O

Anybody else planning on taking it?

I'm going for 3kyuu this year too. Have been studying like crazy for it since May and will continue at this pace for the remaining months, but still quite nervous about it.

Reached 1400 kanji in Heisig. getting higher and higher! surprisingly ive failed the JPLT 4 twice. last year i failed by two points.

Unlucky dude How many kanji did you know when you took the tests (sounds like you should have been fine on the kanji side of things), and which sections did you have most difficulty with if you don't mind me asking?

Edit: I think the dates might be different here in the UK; the test site here doesn't open its office (and i assume by extension doesn't start registration) until the 11th - http://www.soas.ac.uk/languagecentre/awards/jlpt/.

 

[sprsk]

I keep skipping out on taking the test.

Maybe I'll take 2kyuu this year.

 

[Cheesemeister]

I passed ２級 in 2006 with 62.25% and failed １級 in 2007 with 47.5%.

I took the 2004 １級 test last week for practice and scored 56%.

 

[takotchi]

Is a fifth level really necessary? I've only taken the JLPT once, but is the difference between levels really that large?

Yes, between 3 and 2 there is a large gap. Going from about 300 kanji to about 1000, and vocab goes from about 1400 words to about 5000. Of course, the new level will be between 3 and 2. 1 is supposed to become slightly harder too.

 

[Stocka]

It is a good idea as long as it's for more than 3 hours per week.
If you take it as a course, and you go to the country, which you're doing right? And motivation, then yeah, it's all good.

Yeah. I've applied with deferred entry to do a Philosophy and Japanese degree a long time ago and that is my firm choice providing A Level results go well next week. I just can't help having the occasional doubt about whether i'm capable of doing it at university or not. Thanks for the re-assurance, yeah, i'm sure the 10 months I spend in Japan will give me a solid grasp prior to the course at least, particularly if I attend language classes when i'm there to help develop it. How's your learning going?

 

[Zoe]

Oh, dammit, it's JLPT time already? Nah, forget it. I think I'll take the 2kyuu in July... December is just too soon.

Where is there information on the July test? I'm only seeing stuff about December.

 

[Askia47]

I'm going for 3kyuu this year too. Have been studying like crazy for it since May and will continue at this pace for the remaining months, but still quite nervous about it.


Unlucky dude How many kanji did you know when you took the tests (sounds like you should have been fine on the kanji side of things), and which sections did you have most difficulty with if you don't mind me asking?

Edit: I think the dates might be different here in the UK; the test site here doesn't open its office (and i assume by extension doesn't start registration) until the 11th - http://www.soas.ac.uk/languagecentre/awards/jlpt/.

Grammar for me both times. My vocab was fine both times. Listening improved a bit. Grammar still sucked alot. I expect to pass in 07 but alas nothing.After my 05 test I was very inconsistent with studying, so I had to make up for alot of lost time. So close yet so far. Oh well that’s life. Right now, im trying to focus on mostly the Kanji from hesig and then back to AJATT, which I started in summer 2007 but the stopped because I just did not know enough kanji. Japanese has been one of my major hurdles to conquer in life these past 4 years lol.

 

[cvxfreak]

They're set to change the JLPT starting 2010. They're going to introduce a new level between the current 2 and 3, and offer the test more than once per year.

http://www.jlpt.jp/e/info/index.html

Anyway, I registered for 2. I have a 50/50 chance of passing (and failing) but I figure it's worth it. My Japanese ability shot up after spending a year in Japan, so at the very least I'll have a rough idea of where I'm at by taking the test.

 

[Zoe]

Well I just ordered a couple of 3級study books (Unicom and Kanzen Master) as well as a reading comp one for 2級 (just to get a peek). *knock on wood*

I'm a little worried though if I'll ever be able to be confident about 2級 without ever staying in Japan. My friend just barely passed it this past year, and he'd been there for 2 years already.

 

[cvxfreak]

Well I just ordered a couple of 3級study books (Unicom and Kanzen Master) as well as a reading comp one for 2級 (just to get a peek). *knock on wood*

I'm a little worried though if I'll ever be able to be confident about 2級 without ever staying in Japan. My friend just barely passed it this past year, and he'd been there for 2 years already.

It's possible to become good without visiting Japan. Had a friend who I studied abroad with, and he spent two years in the U.S. doing nothing but learning Japanese. He did it by reading tons and tons of manga, playing Japanese games, watching Japanese movies. In two years, he was damn near fluent. He came to Japan, spoke the language like he'd studied it for many years. When taking Waseda's Japanese language placement tests (Waseda has VERY good language classes btw), he entered the same level as a Caucasian American who had been born in Fukuoka and lived there for 17 years before moving back to the U.S. He ranked ahead of someone half-Japanese who lived in Japan until she turned 9 or 10. His kanji skills were also terrific.

Of course, few people are afforded that time luxury, nevermind the patience factor. His brain also seems to possess the ability to acquire languages above all, since academically he wasn't a genius or anything. He spent 6 months or so in Brazil and became fluent in Portuguese very quickly before studying Japanese. He'll tackle Chinese next.

Still, I recommend coming to Japan. When you hear words over and over again by talking to locals, your skills will build up. Outside Japan, you have to make the effort to retain what you know.

 

[Kilrogg]

It's possible to become good without visiting Japan. Had a friend who I studied abroad with, and he spent two years in the U.S. doing nothing but learning Japanese. He did it by reading tons and tons of manga, playing Japanese games, watching Japanese movies. In two years, he was damn near fluent. He came to Japan, spoke the language like he'd studied it for many years. When taking Waseda's Japanese language placement tests (Waseda has VERY good language classes btw), he entered the same level as a Caucasian American who had been born in Fukuoka and lived there for 17 years before moving back to the U.S. He ranked ahead of someone half-Japanese who lived in Japan until she turned 9 or 10. His kanji skills were also terrific.

Of course, few people are afforded that time luxury, nevermind the patience factor. His brain also seems to possess the ability to acquire languages above all, since academically he wasn't a genius or anything. He spent 6 months or so in Brazil and became fluent in Portuguese very quickly before studying Japanese. He'll tackle Chinese next.

Still, I recommend coming to Japan. When you hear words over and over again by talking to locals, your skills will build up. Outside Japan, you have to make the effort to retain what you know.

Yeah, there's a huge chance the guy is a genius when it comes to languages then, and/or you're absolutely not exaggerating when you say studying Japanese was the only thing he's been doing for those 2 years. Most people can't reach that level in such a short amount of time, let alone speak fluently without living in the country or knowing native people. I'm a bit envious right now :/.

Also, this new JLPT level is great news. Well, not for me personally, because I hope to pass level 2 in 2009 at the latest, but still. If there was a 2.5 exam, I would have taken it this year. I don't know if I'll take lvl 2 this year, because I've been kinda lazy since I've returned from Japan, but anyway.

The kikitori (listening) part of lvl 3 is clearly the hardest part if you ask me. I assumed the vocabulary/kanji part would be the hardest, so I studied that more than the rest, and I ended up getting 99/100, so, to those who want to take the exam, I'd advise you to focus more on oral comprehension, unless you're good at it and lack vocabulary and kanji. Grammar is pretty much what you'd expect. I was a bit taken aback by some questions, as they tackled things I hadn't technically learnt, but overall, nothing out of reach.

The problem with the JLPT, at least up to lvl 3 (don't know if that's the case for lvl 2 and 1), is that it's far from being a clear picture of your actual Japanese level. When taking the exam, you're not tested on your ability to write or speak in Japanese, and, since there's not penalty if you choose a wrong answer (you just don't get the points), you can get away without any sound knowledge of the language. Well, I'm exaggerating a bit, I guess, but you get the point.

Not to say it's completely worthless, though. It's useful as a diploma.

 

[Zoe]

Still, I recommend coming to Japan. When you hear words over and over again by talking to locals, your skills will build up. Outside Japan, you have to make the effort to retain what you know.

Well, easier said then done. That would require a huge career change that I'm not ready/willing to take. Who knows though.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

.

 

[FINALFANTASYDOG]

I highly recommend if you already have Japanese vocab knowledge, to use the Heisig Method, Except use Japanese words as your keywords.

This book really is what got me into doing it, I was doing Heisig using a single Japanese/English Keyword without even realizing I was doing Heisig.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/4893580914/?tag=neogaf0e-20


Great part of the book You also get SRS practice

The book is probably actually better then Hesig, because while it uses the general principles of Hesig it immerses you in Japanese at the same time.

An Amazon.com reviewer says it better then I ever could


"The constant reinforcement in each chapter is really the strong point, as each exercise compounds on previous chapters, allowing for true learning "

"This book is different. ... Instead, you look at Kanji as a set of characters composed of other characters, and see how they interrelate. You compare pronunciations of similar looking Kanji, of those with the same radical (root character), and those with opposite meanings, etc. You look at the various Kanji with the same reading but different meaning, and you compare groups to see what they have in common (commonality, such as the shape, meaning, use, and pronunciation). You will also look at characters attached to other combinations that are used as suffixes and prefixes, such as characters that negate meaning (turning "convenient" into "inconvenient").

"You will be able to tell the difference between very similar Kanji, find it easier to write them by breaking them down into parts, and easily recall and use Kanji with opposite or similar meanings as well as apply suffixes and prefixes to make your language use more particular. "


It has cumulative examples each lesson, putting together all the kanji you have learned from all the previous lessons into example Sentences. The book really stresses repetition/review through reading example sentences that contain a wide variety of kanji you have so far learned. The example sentences get more difficult in grammar as you go along too. , so you can use this as an SRS grammar learning tool at the same time.

 

[rotaryspirit]

Those books are awesome, but the problem was a few years ago they were out of print. I don't know if they've started back up due to demand, but if they are - get them.

 

[BuRT!]

I've been trying to do the AJATT method, but I can't stop reading gaf :lol Does anyone know some japanese gaming forums, podcasts and review sites to temporarily replace gaf/1up/ign ?