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345triangle · Sep 7, 2011

Desiato said:
Anyone got their JLPT results yet? I did, passed N1!

i missed N2 by two points! which, seeing as i took it hungover on my birthday with little prospect of success, is actually better than i was expecting. at least i can be pretty confident for the next time now.

of the people i know who took N2 this time, one failed by one point, two failed by two (including me) and one passed by three.

Kilrogg · Sep 7, 2011

345triangle said:
i missed N2 by two points! which, seeing as i took it hungover on my birthday with little prospect of success, is actually better than i was expecting. at least i can be pretty confident for the next time now.

of the people i know who took N2 this time, one failed by one point, two failed by two (including me) and one passed by three.

Sorry to hear that. You'll get it next time, no question!

Got the N1 by a hair. You need 100/180 to pass. I got 105. Of the people I know took the test and got their results, one failed (by a considerable margin apparently), and the others passed. One got more than 140.

I'm kinda ashamed that my score is so low even though I technically passed. I'm considering taking it again in December. Still, I'm happy

.

Furoba · Sep 7, 2011

Desiato said:
Anyone got their JLPT results yet? I did, passed N1!

So did I, high N1 five!

Mik2121 · Sep 7, 2011

What's the N1? Back when I took the test some 4 years ago it was just "level 1", "level 2", etc... I took level 2 and passes with quite a lot of extra points, but I don't think I wanna even try level 1. Lots of worthless kanjis to remember.

ついでに、またスレage！w
テストに合格した人たち、おめでとうございます！

Gacha-pin · Sep 7, 2011

おめ！！

Mik2121 said:
ついでに、またスレage！w

Should I say

糞スレageんな、sage。。。?　　　　一応お約束ということで

Mik2121 · Sep 7, 2011

Gacha-pin said:
おめ！！

Should I say

糞スレageんな、sage。。。?　　　　一応お約束ということで

やめとけ！GAFにスレsageあったらホンマ怖いw
変なスレいっぱい出来てしまいそうヽ(ﾟДﾟ

ﾉ!!

このスレそんな糞でもないけど！かわいそうやん！

勉強になってるしw

Bomber Bob · Sep 7, 2011

Mik2121 said:
What's the N1?

Old JLPT Level 1+

which I've failed.

oh well, the reading section was like impossible to me

Mik2121 · Sep 7, 2011

Bomber Bob said:
Old JLPT Level 1+

which I've failed.

oh well, the reading section was like impossible to me

ドンマイ！

今はどうか知らないけど、前までは普通に日本で仕事するとき、２級さえあれば、オッケー

てか、面接のときに日本語通じればオッケーw

Gacha-pin · Sep 7, 2011

Mik2121 said:
やめとけ！GAFにスレsageあったらホンマ怖いw
変なスレいっぱい出来てしまいそうヽ(ﾟДﾟﾉ!!

このスレそんな糞でもないけど！かわいそうやん！

勉強になってるしw

ただのお決まりのツッコミだよ。糞なんて全然思ってないよ。
I like this thread a lot. I can ask native English speakers something about English in Japanese and more, someone will answer it in Japanese

こういうくだらないこと書きこむときにいつもGAFにもsageがあったらいいのにと思ってる

Mik2121 · Sep 7, 2011

Gacha-pin said:
ただのお決まりのツッコミだよ。糞なんて全然思ってないよ。
I like this thread a lot. I can ask native English speakers something about English in Japanese and more, someone will answer it in Japanese

こういうくだらないこと書きこむときにいつもGAFにもsageがあったらいいのにと思ってる

ああ、わかるわかるー

ちょっとコメント書きづらいよね・・
しょうもない会話してるのに、毎回スレが上がるのが恥ずかしいかもw

でもまあ、練習よ、練習！そう思ったら大丈夫ちゃう？w

ちなみに、誰かがmixiとかやってないんかな？昔アカウント作ってて、ずっと触ってなかったけど最近またちょこちょこ入るようになって、友達増やしたいー！

louis89 · Sep 7, 2011

さっきミクシのアカウント作成したんだけどFBの方が利用してる友達多いんで意味ないｗ

俺今日携帯ゲットした。古いやつなんだけどかっこいい日本っぽいガラケーだから満足。でも俺ひらがなで打つのめっちゃ遅くてメールのやりとりは大変だわｗ

Masked Man · Sep 7, 2011

Desiato said:
Anyone got their JLPT results yet? I did, passed N1!

Kilrogg said:
Got the N1 by a hair.

Furoba said:
So did I, high N1 five!

合格おめでとうございます！\(^^)/ 履歴書の更新はお忘れなく♪
同輩がまた増えてきて、何だか嬉しい気分ですね。
ちなみに、今回のN１級はいかがでしたか？自分が受けたときは新試験の２回目だったし、そのときからテストがどう変わったのかを知りたくて、よかったらご感想を聞かせてください！

Mik2121 · Sep 7, 2011

louis89 said:
さっきミクシのアカウント作成したんだけどFBの方が利用してる友達多いんで意味ないｗ

俺今日携帯ゲットした。古いやつなんだけどかっこいい日本っぽいガラケーだから満足。でも俺ひらがなで打つのめっちゃ遅くてメールのやりとりは大変だわｗ

なれたら、わりと打ちやすいよー　でもスマホのほうが打ちやすいと思うんだけどー

日本に着いて、もう３日間かな？どうだー？楽しんでる？w

ちなみに、俺って結構使うよね？w　わかってると思うけど、一応念のため・・・先生とか目上の人と喋るときは使わないように・・・wてか、つかったらあかんw

（まあまあ、知ってたはずだけど、ごめんw）

あ、mixi（ミクシィ）使ってたら、少なくとも日本人の友達とやりとりする時は役立つと思う。fb使ってる人たまにおるけど、基本的にはmixiかな？

Furoba · Sep 7, 2011

Masked Man said:
合格おめでとうございます！\(^^)/ 履歴書の更新はお忘れなく♪
同輩がまた増えてきて、何だか嬉しい気分ですね。
ちなみに、今回のN１級はいかがでしたか？自分が受けたときは新試験の２回目だったし、そのときからテストがどう変わったのかを知りたくて、よかったらご感想を聞かせてください！

日本語能力試験を受けるのは初めてでしたが、読解はそこそこ難しかった一方、聴解はあまりにも簡単だと感じてちょっと1級に値しない気がしました。後、会話の能力は含まれないので、日本語が全然喋れなくても、合格できることは意味不明。

後数年間で漢字検定2級でも取ろうか。

AngryMoth · Sep 7, 2011

Starting learning Japanese this last month has given me huge respect for anyone who has mastered a second language. Huge props to you guys doing the N1. N5 is challenging enough for me. I'm willing to putting in a lot of hard work but its difficult to imagine ever learning all those kanji. I'm up to about 50 but its getting a lot harder to keep learning new ones whilst retaining all the others. Remembering the different readings is by the far the most challenging aspect.

Mik2121 · Sep 7, 2011

Furoba said:
日本語能力試験を受けるのは初めてでしたが、読解はそこそこ難しかった一方、聴解はあまりにも簡単だと感じてちょっと1級に値しない気がしました。後、会話の能力は含まれないので、日本語が全然喋れなくても、合格できることは意味不明。

後数年間で漢字検定2級でも取ろうか。

そう。そういうことw

日本語勉強してたとき、クラスメートみんな中国人とか韓国人ばっかりやったんだけど、みんな従業中あまりにも不自然な日本語ばっか喋ってて、１級合格したときほんま意味不明やったw

あと、「○○一方、○○」って言い方あまりにもかたいっていうか、なんというか・・とりあえずこういう掲示板でそういう書き方じゃちょっと不自然に感じてしまう。よっぽど偉い人らと思われてないかぎり・・w（んで、そうでもないでしょ？w）

僕やったら、「そこそこ難しかったくせに、聴解はあまりにも簡単だと・・・」って書くんだけど、それもそれで、あかん気がするw　失礼っていうんかね。

Masked Man · Sep 7, 2011

Furoba said:
日本語能力試験を受けるのは初めてでしたが、読解はそこそこ難しかった一方、聴解はあまりにも簡単だと感じてちょっと1級に値しない気がしました。後、会話の能力は含まれないので、日本語が全然喋れなくても、合格できることは意味不明。

後数年間で漢字検定2級でも取ろうか。

それなら何も変わっていないみたいですねw 自分もN１級を受けたとき、まさに同じように感じたのです。
読解の文を全部読むには時間がかかりすぎて（いちおう自分の能力不足を認めますが）間に合わなさそうでしたが、おかげさまで何とか終えたのです。合格できたとしても、Furobaさんの言った通り、話す能力を測らない言語能力試験なんて、とても疑問に思っています。

そして自分もそろそろ漢検を受けようかと思っているので、漢字勉強会でも作りましょうか？

お互い頑張りましょう！

Mik2121 said:
あと、「○○一方、○○」って言い方あまりにもかたいっていうか、なんというか・・とりあえずこういう掲示板でそういう書き方じゃちょっと不自然に感じてしまう。よっぽど偉い人らと思われてないかぎり・・w（んで、そうでもないでしょ？w）

僕やったら、「そこそこ難しかったくせに、聴解はあまりにも簡単だと・・・」って書くんだけど、それもそれで、あかん気がするw　失礼っていうんかね。

そう言ったら元の意味から少しずれてしまいますね。「くせに」というのは、逆接の「のに」に似ていますが、主に相手を非難したりちゃかしたりするときに相応しい文法です。なので、この場合は「のに」でいいと思います。「が」や「けれど」なども全然使えます！
訂正：「読解はそこそこ難しかったのに、聴解はあまりにも簡単だと」、はいかがでしょうか？

GloomyHitsuji · Sep 7, 2011

えっ、皆すごいですね。私はすでに五年勉強しましたが、まだN2を通っていません。>.<

あと、私もミクシィ持ってますので、良かったら、友達になってください。
（使い方は全然分かりません、そこもよろしくお願いします）m(_ _)m

louis89 · Sep 7, 2011

Mik2121 said:
なれたら、わりと打ちやすいよー　でもスマホのほうが打ちやすいと思うんだけどー

日本に着いて、もう３日間かな？どうだー？楽しんでる？w

ちなみに、俺って結構使うよね？w　わかってると思うけど、一応念のため・・・先生とか目上の人と喋るときは使わないように・・・wてか、つかったらあかんw

（まあまあ、知ってたはずだけど、ごめんw）

あ、mixi（ミクシィ）使ってたら、少なくとも日本人の友達とやりとりする時は役立つと思う。fb使ってる人たまにおるけど、基本的にはmixiかな？

うん、今日で４日間目。来たばっかりなんでまだそんなに楽しいことやってないけど楽しい一年を過ごしたいから今いろいろ友達を作ろうとしてる。でMik2121が言った通りにやっぱmixiをやった方がいいんだよね。

先生と話してたら一人称が「俺」の人いないだろうｗ　いたらどんだけ勉強不足なんだよお前ってなるよねｗ

Mik2121 · Sep 8, 2011

louis89 said:
うん、今日で４日間目。来たばっかりなんでまだそんなに楽しいことやってないけど楽しい一年を過ごしたいから今いろいろ友達を作ろうとしてる。でMik2121が言った通りにやっぱmixiをやった方がいいんだよね。

先生と話してたら一人称が「俺」の人いないだろうｗ　いたらどんだけ勉強不足なんだよお前ってなるよねｗ

ほんじゃ、mixi持ってたらマイミクにしてくださーいw
多分の僕の名前「Miguel　Alonso」かニックネーム（ここと同じ）で調べて、住所も大阪市にしてくれれば、すぐ出てくると思う。写真も自分ののせてるから、めちゃくちゃモテそうな外人の顔出てきたら、俺や！www　（ごめんごめん・・）

Masked Man said:
そう言ったら元の意味から少しずれてしまいますね。「くせに」というのは、逆接の「のに」に似ていますが、主に相手を非難したりちゃかしたりするときに相応しい文法です。なので、この場合は「のに」でいいと思います。「が」や「けれど」なども全然使えます！
訂正：「読解はそこそこ難しかったのに、聴解はあまりにも簡単だと」、はいかがでしょうか？

そうだねー　僕はその「くせに」を使うくせが付いてしまったかもー
「〜のに」でも全然いいと思う。まあ、自分好きな単語使ってたらええんちゃうー？w

Masked Man · Sep 8, 2011

Mik2121 said:
そうだねー　僕はその「くせに」を使うくせが付いてしまったかもー
「〜のに」でも全然いいと思う。まあ、自分好きな単語使ってたらええんちゃうー？w

そうですね、誰にでも口癖というのがあるし、好きな単語を好きなだけ使えば別にいいと思いますが、この場合は「くせに」を使ったら不自然に感じます。もちろん自分は母国語話者ではないし、しかも使い方が間違っていないかも知れませんが、同じような言語学習者として、自分の意見を伝えたいだけです。たまには文法の議論でもしようか、と（笑）

Mik2121 · Sep 8, 2011

Masked Man said:
そうですね、誰にでも口癖というのがあるし、好きな単語を好きなだけ使えば別にいいと思いますが、この場合は「くせに」を使ったら不自然に感じます。もちろん自分は母国語話者ではないし、しかも使い方が間違っていないかも知れませんが、同じような言語学習者として、自分の意見を伝えたいだけです。たまには文法の議論でもしようか、と（笑）

ああ、意味が完全に同じとは言ってないよー　ただ、似たような意味で、「○○が難しかったくせに、○○簡単だと感じました」って言っても、別に通じるよーってことかな？。　100％正しいかって聞かれたら、そうとは言えないけど・・大体同じ意味にはなってる。不自然とは思わないよー（てか、普通に似たような時に他の友達とかも使ったことがあるよー　日本人の友達ね）。

まあ、どっちにせよ、意味通じたし、それでいいやんw

文法の議論とかしたいの？もう想像するだけで頭痛いわw　自分らでやって、僕がここで見とく(・∀&#12539

Edit: I just noticed that since I started with the all-Japanese posts, other people has stopped posting in English. I didn't meant to do that! If anyone got any question, don't worry, go ahead and post whatever it is in English. These Japanese posts are just to practice a bit, and get to use more Japanese (mainly for those who might not be able to write in Japanese on a daily basis because of where they live, etc..)

Randomizer · Sep 8, 2011

So I've started my journey into learning Japanese. I have ordered all of Heisig's books and using his method I have started learning the hiragana. I assume with regards to the Kanji his 1st book along with Anki are all I will be needing for now as a complete beginner?

Also does anyone have any suggestions for learning actual words and phrases, the OP seems dedicated to reading more than anything. I know some people say you should learn to read before learning to speak but I'd rather do abit of both. What's the point of knowing how to read a specific word if I don't know it's meaning.

Thanks in advance!

Jintor · Sep 8, 2011

The all Japanese posts are frightening, but inspiring also :<

Randomizer · Sep 8, 2011

Jintor said:
The all Japanese posts are frightening, but inspiring also :<

I've looked at his site a few times. I like his writing style it's very funny and unique. But the website is really confusing and his explanations can be quite long winded. It's really just a blog as I can find no real lessons. Other than his philosophy I didn't find it very helpful but it was inspiring and shows that you can achieve the goal if you are really dedicated.

Hopefully I can start putting his philosophy into practice when I have a basic grasp of the language. Right now it would be no use to me as I can neither read or speak more than 10 words. The idea of playing a game or watching an anime in pure Japanese right now seems pretty pointless.

Edit: Yay finally a member, only took me 3 years lol!

Jintor · Sep 8, 2011

lol, I was talking about the posts in this thread. They're frightening... but the fact that I can recognise some of the kanji and the sentence structures is reassuring.

I was trying to read the Persona 4 card in the other thread. I got the first two sentences... ish... well, not really.

Randomizer · Sep 8, 2011

Jintor said:
lol, I was talking about the posts in this thread. They're frightening... but the fact that I can recognise some of the kanji and the sentence structures is reassuring.

I was trying to read the Persona 4 card in the other thread. I got the first two sentences... ish... well, not really.

Lol I just re-read your post and now I feel silly.

How long have you been studying Japanese to be able to almost read a few sentences? The only Kanji I can recognize in their posts is 日本

Mik2121 · Sep 8, 2011

Randomizer said:
So I've started my journey into learning Japanese. I have ordered all of Heisig's books and using his method I have started learning the hiragana. I assume with regards to the Kanji his 1st book along with Anki are all I will be needing for now as a complete beginner?

Also does anyone have any suggestions for learning actual words and phrases, the OP seems dedicated to reading more than anything. I know some people say you should learn to read before learning to speak but I'd rather do abit of both. What's the point of knowing how to read a specific word if I don't know it's meaning.

Thanks in advance!

It really depends on the person. Some people learn more by just reading textbooks, other people learn more if they actually practice the language by reading books or watching movies in said language.

If you wanna learn actual words and phrases, I'd suggest jumping straight into either:

1) A book that includes furigana (so you spend less time trying to understand what kanji are you reading).

2) Some internet forum. I wouldn't suggest 2ch as they use way too many internet slang though. Like some of the stuff gacha-pin and I have been using around here (スレage ,sage etc..) which actually reminds me I'll probably make another post explaining some of the internet slang used in Japan. I'd also recommend getting an account on mixi and join some communities for people studying Japanese. Or just communities for whatever you like, that way you'll be sure you'll only be reading Japanese

.

3) Games like Professor Layton, but obviously in Japanese. I have the 3DS one (which is AWESOME, btw) and I've already learnt a few words here and there. The Zelda games for DS also have furigana if you touch a word. Pretty nice stuff.

I would obviously also suggest getting a good electronic dictionary to look up kanjis or the 'Kanji sonomama Rakubiki jiten' title for DS, which you might or might not find around on some stores... But if you'll be using just your computer, use this site:

http://www.csse.monash.edu.au/~jwb/cgi-bin/wwwjdic.cgi?1C (wwwjdic)

It's great, it has lots of examples and the database is huge. You can search words in English to get the translation in Japanese, or the other way.

Other than that.. the best and most expensive way to learn lots of words and phrases is by going to Japan, make a bunch of friends there and just hang out with them. Otherwise, I'd say the best way (for me at least) is getting into some website like mixi, make friends there and just keep reading whatever. If you get to add a bunch of friends to your friend list, you can also read their diaries and whatnot, so you also get to read more 'personal' stuff (I say this because of the words they use, which aren't the same as when they post on community threads).

If you want a mixi account, send me your email via PM and I'll invite you

Randomizer · Sep 8, 2011

Mik2121 said:
*Advice*

Wow, thanks for this!

That dictionary site will be really useful and I'll look into getting that Nintendo dictionary as well. The idea of playing a game in Japanese now seems strange as I literally only know like 20 Kanji and some of the hiragana lol. I might as well jump in feet first though. So Professor Layton and the DS Zeldas are good for beginners. That's good as I love Professor Layton and I haven't played the fourth Layton yet so that should be some good motivation. Pokemon is supposed to be good for beginners to right?

I really don't think I am at the level to join any Japanese speaking/writing forums or communities. But I will definitely look into it when I become a bit more proficient. At the minute I would like to finishing learn the kana, whilst continue to learning new Kanji. I was thinking of watching some anime without the subs as well. Something that I've seen before so am aware of the general gist of the conversations and story.

Mik2121 · Sep 8, 2011

Randomizer said:
Wow, thanks for this!

That dictionary site will be really useful and I'll look into getting that Nintendo dictionary as well. The idea of playing a game in Japanese now seems strange as I literally only know like 20 Kanji and some of the hiragana lol. I might as well jump in feet first though. So Professor Layton and the DS Zeldas are good for beginners. That's good as I love Professor Layton and I haven't played the fourth Layton yet so that should be some good motivation. Pokemon is supposed to be good for beginners to right?

I really don't think I am at the level to join any Japanese speaking/writing forums or communities. But I will definitely look into it when I become a bit more proficient. At the minute I would like to finishing learn the kana, whilst continue to learning new Kanji. I was thinking of watching some anime without the subs as well. Something that I've seen before so am aware of the general gist of the conversations and story.

I believe the more recent Pokemon titles have two methods of text display: Kana only (hiragana and katakana) or Kanji+Kana. But the one with Kanji doesn't have furigana. So you're stuck either just reading kana, or having Kanjis that you might potentially not understand (not many of those thankfully).

If you don't know much Japanese, the all-kana one could be helpful. But I personally don't like to use it because sometimes actually seeing the Kanji is more helpful 'cause you can better guess what they're saying (remember many Kanjis have the same pronunciation).

You can also tell from the phrase, but still, sometimes all-kana is a bit messy, and it's easier to understand if you're native, rather than foreigner.

shanshan310 · Sep 8, 2011

MIK - I have soul silver and thats kana only

At first I thought it would be easier but now I think the kanji might be better. If I see the kanji I can probably tell what kind of attack it is etc.

Side note: I'm reading 窓きわのトットちゃん in class. Vocabs not that hard, nor is the kanji (but you can also get it with furigana). Its working well for me as a way to break into Japanese novels.

louis89 said:
さっきミクシのアカウント作成したんだけどFBの方が利用してる友達多いんで意味ないｗ

俺今日携帯ゲットした。古いやつなんだけどかっこいい日本っぽいガラケーだから満足。でも俺ひらがなで打つのめっちゃ遅くてメールのやりとりは大変だわｗ

ええ、私もミクシを使いたかったのに、携帯からregisterしなければならなそうだ。私の携帯は古くて、出来なかった。最近日本の友達にＦＢのアカウントをゲットさせたのに、あまり使ってないんだ。

Mik2121 · Sep 8, 2011

shanshan310 said:
MIK - I have soul silver and thats kana only At first I thought it would be easier but now I think the kanji might be better. If I see the kanji I can probably tell what kind of attack it is etc.

ええ、私もミクシを使いたかったのに、携帯からregisterしなければならなそうだ。私の携帯は古くて、出来なかった。最近日本の友達にＦＢのアカウントをゲットさせたのに、あまり使ってないんだ。

register　➡　登録

ミクシィに携帯からしか登録できなかったっけ？友達招待できるとこへ行ってみたんけど、携帯の話何もないよー
普通のメールからも登録できると思う。やってみる？

Pokemon only had kana? That blows. And yeah, it's harder to understand, at least for me

shanshan310 · Sep 8, 2011

Mik2121 said:
register　➡　登録

ミクシィに携帯からしか登録できなかったっけ？友達招待できるとこへ行ってみたんけど、携帯の話何もないよー
普通のメールからも登録できると思う。やってみる？

ありがとう＾＾　I was actually looking around the website for the registration button

Now I can find it!

そうなんだ！も一回してみるよ。

EDIT:

Noooooooooooooooo.

Mik2121 · Sep 8, 2011

shanshan310 said:
ありがとう＾＾

そうなんだ！も一回してみるよ。

日本語うまいのよ。どんなぐらい勉強したの？

もう一回やってみるって？自分だけではできないぞw

もうすでにmixiに入ってる人に誘ってもらわないと、入れないよー

日本語勉強したのは２年間。勉強したと言っても、従業受けてたんだけど、家では全然勉強しなかったw　ただ、その時日本におったから、勉強しない分、友達と遊んでたから日本語の練習にもなってたヾ(●´∀&#65344

ﾉ
それから３年間専門学校通ってて、それから数ヶ月仕事してたよー

今は一旦仕事やめて、シンガポールに来たんだけど、それからまた戻って、仕事し続けるつもりです。

ちなみに、「日本語うまいのよ」って、わりと女っぽい発言w　shanshanって、女子なん？

あと、「どんなぐらい勉強したの？」は「どんな」じゃなくて、「どれ」が正しいー。

そっちはどれぐらい日本語勉強してきたの？

Edit: Wait what? You can register on Mixi without getting invited? That didn't use to be the case back a few years ago..

Edit 2: Maybe if I invite you, you don't need to register your phone mail? Or else, press the 「なぜケータイから登録するの？」 and see what it says...

Edit 3: Are you in Japan now? If so, I just saw this:

http://hitoxu.com/048

Basically you need to use a proxy to enter the Mixi site. If you do so, you won't need to put any email address. I'm in Singapore now, so if you want I can help you out. I would need to make your account, then give you the password data and then you just change it back to whatever language you wanted to use.

That, or you find yourself a proxy so you can go to mixi from overseas.

warthog · Sep 8, 2011

Urgh, I need to learn more Japanese. It's so frustrating to me that I can't read any of this. On the other hand I shouldn't forget that this doesn't happen in the blink of an eye. People who have managed to get to this level have put countless hours in it.

I purchased a Q2 wifi radio to listen to Japanese internet radios. I hope it helps a little bit to get the feel for the language. It's easy to use and I can take it anywhere in the house.

I've decided to abandon evening classes after 2 years. It was handy to practice speaking Japanese, but things advanced ever so slow. I'm more hungry than ever before to try and study this on my own now.

StevePharma · Sep 8, 2011

So I'm practicing sentences and Heisig on my Anki-android app during the daily commute, and in my spare time going slowly through Genki and Japanese in Mangaland. Thanks GAF for all the tips and stuff. I think in 1 or 2 years I'm going to take a shot at the JLPT (not sure which level yet) just for kicks.

Doing the Heisig method seriously made me wonder why so few Japanese classes (if any at all) use it. It seems so easy to use for adults learning Japanese. A friend of mine also had a Kanji pictograph book but that method of learning seriously conflicted with Heisig's method for me, so I stopped doing that.

louis89 · Sep 8, 2011

Mik2121 said:
ちなみに、「日本語うまいのよ」って、わりと女っぽい発言w　shanshanって、女子なん？

そうなのかしら :3

Mixi: After trying to do the phone registration thing yesterday and failing due to not being able to access the internet on my phone, I searched around a bit and found out that they only make you do that if you try to register with a free email account. A bit like GAF.

So if you want to register on Mixi without any hassle, just use a non-free email address (such as the one you registered on GAF with). I used my university address and everything was cool.

shanshan310 · Sep 8, 2011

うん、女子だよ！

I tried using my university email, but I got the same result. I'm not in Japan right now. Do I need to be to register??

what's a proxy? >.<

louis89 · Sep 8, 2011

Oh, actually I think read something about .edu addresses or whatever the US uses being blocked as well.

Zoe · Sep 8, 2011

They've changed Mixi registration? Last time we were in Japan I tried to register with a pre-paid phone, but it didn't have internet access

Gacha-pin · Sep 8, 2011

Masked Man said:
そう言ったら元の意味から少しずれてしまいますね。「くせに」というのは、逆接の「のに」に似ていますが、主に相手を非難したりちゃかしたりするときに相応しい文法です。なので、この場合は「のに」でいいと思います。「が」や「けれど」なども全然使えます！
訂正：「読解はそこそこ難しかったのに、聴解はあまりにも簡単だと」、はいかがでしょうか？

「そこそこ難しかったくせに、聴解はあまりにも簡単だと」

これ自体はすごく自然だよ。バランスが悪いから聴解をもっと難しく（又は読解をもっとやさしく）みたいな気持ちが込めらた響きになる。
＃2671のFurobaさんの口調が丁寧なのですこし合わないかもしれないけど。

Mik2121さん（どうやらイケメンらしい←要出典）は大阪の人みたいなので普通の人にはすこし乱暴に聞こえる言葉使いをするというのもあるのかも。

Mik2121 said:
I believe the more recent Pokemon titles have two methods of text display: Kana only (hiragana and katakana) or Kanji+Kana. But the one with Kanji doesn't have furigana. So you're stuck either just reading kana, or having Kanjis that you might potentially not understand (not many of those thankfully).

If you don't know much Japanese, the all-kana one could be helpful. But I personally don't like to use it because sometimes actually seeing the Kanji is more helpful 'cause you can better guess what they're saying (remember many Kanjis have the same pronunciation).

You can also tell from the phrase, but still, sometimes all-kana is a bit messy, and it's easier to understand if you're native, rather than foreigner.

reminds me of my childhood. Famicom didn't support kanji, it only displayed あいうえお、かきくけこ.
We all grew up reading そなたに　ゆうしゃの　あかし　ロトのしょうごうを　あたえよう

shanshan310 · Sep 8, 2011

Zoe said:
They've changed Mixi registration? Last time we were in Japan I tried to register with a pre-paid phone, but it didn't have internet access

That was my problem. Only I'm not in Japan anymore, making it even harder.

I don't understand :'( Why make it so hard to register?!? Don't they want people using their site?!

Lostconfused · Sep 8, 2011

StevePharma said:
Doing the Heisig method seriously made me wonder why so few Japanese classes (if any at all) use it.

Because it doesn't teach readings. So there is absolutely no connection being formed between learning to speak and learning to read/write. For it to be taught in class you would have to learn readings anyways which kind of defeats the point of heisig.

I've been trying to learn kanji by brute force for the past week and it's been slow going. I am against Heisig method because I don't like the idea of making connections between kanji and english. But I will give it a shot anyways. Because it's too slow and too difficult to learn the meaning of kanji and one or two readings for it. You need some kind of basis or foundation to start forming associations with.

Also it would probably help out with playing games as well and being able to do that should provide a new means of learning for me.

shanshan310 · Sep 8, 2011

I don't think Heisig would work for me. I'd get way too frustrated knowing all these English meanings for characters but not having a clue how to read them or what compounds meant. Sure you learn the readings later - but that's after you learn all the individual characters right? Also the way I study kanji I'm learning a whole lot of new words at the same time. Heisig doesn't teach that.

Also after a while you do get "associations". Kanji with same radicals often have the same pronunciation and similar meanings.

Lostconfused · Sep 8, 2011

Trying to go through JLPT5/4 or whatever the beginner level kanji is not working out too well for me. The words that are familiar, I heard, or kind of knew before I can remember. But the ones that are new or unfamiliar, I can't remember them at all. Even if I have been reviewing some of them for half a week already. They just don't stick because I cant form any kind of associations.

And I am not even saying use heisig method to learn all the kanji. I am just starting out so it's best to get a quick run through a bunch of kanji and the ones that stick will stick and the ones that don't I can focus on later. I need some kind of a foundation to start working with. With Heisig's method they are already organized in some kind of a logical order that they can be learned in which saves me time and effort of trying to do that on my own.

KidA Seven · Sep 8, 2011

shanshan310 said:
Also the way I study kanji I'm learning a whole lot of new words at the same time.

This is what I do as well.

Masked Man · Sep 8, 2011

Gacha-pin said:
「そこそこ難しかったくせに、聴解はあまりにも簡単だと」

これ自体はすごく自然だよ。バランスが悪いから聴解をもっと難しく（又は読解をもっとやさしく）みたいな気持ちが込めらた響きになる。
＃2671のFurobaさんの口調が丁寧なのですこし合わないかもしれないけど。

実はGacha-pinさんに助けてもらおうかと思いましたが、なんと、救済者が登場してくれましたねw

なるほど、そいういうことですね。非難だけでなく、不平を言うときにも合っていますよね。たぶんFurobaさんの口調に合わなかったので、少し違和感を感じただけかも知れませんw
説明してくれてありがとうございます！

勉強になりました♪　

Gacha-pin said:
Mik2121さん（どうやらイケメンらしい←要出典）は大阪の人みたいなので普通の人にはすこし乱暴に聞こえる言葉使いをするというのもあるのかも。

それもあるかも知れませんね。自分も大阪人の友達が何人かいますが、もしかしてMik2121さんの言葉遣いの方が乱暴かも知れません。（余計に乱暴ということかな？w）

Lostconfused said:
Because it doesn't teach readings. So there is absolutely no connection being formed between learning to speak and learning to read/write. For it to be taught in class you would have to learn readings anyways which kind of defeats the point of heisig.

Yeah, that's why I can't see the value in Heisig. Plus, by the time I heard about Heisig, I was already well underway with my own kanji studies, and I didn't see much point in changing what I was doing when my own methods were working well enough. (I also wouldn't be able to deal with not learning the readings for characters.)

Mik2121 · Sep 8, 2011

Masked Man said:
それもあるかも知れませんね。自分も大阪人の友達が何人かいますが、もしかしてMik2121さんの言葉遣いの方が乱暴かも知れません。（余計に乱暴ということかな？w

おいおい、僕のイメージ崩れてきてるんじゃないか！？w

僕の言葉がそんな乱暴ちゃうし？とくのこういう掲示板だと、別にそんな丁寧な言葉使わなくていいやん！丁寧な言葉も使えるんだけど、こっちのほうが色々と伝えやすいよーw

大阪人バカにすんなよw　（⬅僕大阪の人ちゃうけど、一応・・・　そもそも、日本人でもないしなw）

ちなみに、ガチャピンさんって日本人だっけ？わからなくなってきたw　なんか普通に外国人やと思ったけど、さっきのコメント見たらわからなくなってきた・・

Masked Man · Sep 8, 2011

Mik2121 said:
おいおい、僕のイメージ崩れてきてるんじゃないか！？w

僕の言葉がそんな乱暴ちゃうし？とくのこういう掲示板だと、別にそんな丁寧な言葉使わなくていいやん！丁寧な言葉も使えるんだけど、こっちのほうが色々と伝えやすいよーw

いや、冗談のつもりでw　それが通じなかったのはやっぱ丁寧すぎる言葉遣いのせいか。
じゃ、オレも普通に喋ろうか。

大阪人バカにすんなよw　（⬅僕大阪の人ちゃうけど、一応・・・　そもそも、日本人でもないしなw）

喧嘩を売る気はあらへんでーw
ちなみに１年間滋賀に住んでたし、オレもいちおう日本人でもない関西人って勝手に名乗ってんねんw

ちなみに、ガチャピンさんって日本人だっけ？わからなくなってきたw　なんか普通に外国人やと思ったけど、さっきのコメント見たらわからなくなってきた・・

日本人ちゃう？英語の質問をときどきするし、しかも子供のころ日本語でドラクエをやってたってのは、日本人に限ると思うけどw

Mik2121 · Sep 8, 2011

Masked Man said:
日本人ちゃう？英語の質問をときどきするし、しかも子供のころ日本語でドラクエをやってたってのは、日本人に限ると思うけどw

そう、子供のごろの話とかしてたから、えっ？日本人？！ってなった・・w

でも英語の質問するのも、日本人じゃなくてもあり得るやんw　僕もだって、母国語がスペイン語だよ？英語じゃないよーw

Masked Man said:
いや、冗談のつもりでw　それが通じなかったのはやっぱ丁寧すぎる言葉遣いのせいか。

通じなかったってか、あまりにも真面目にいってたし、全然笑ってもいなかったから、ほんまにそう思われてるかと思ってたw　普通に通じないやろ、そういうのw

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