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The Cinematic Platformer Compendium
- Thread starter ichtyander
- Start date
For me this thread like a balsam. Or something like painkillers. So many pictures, images & games I love. Lot of thanks for this. By the way, In my free time I also do cinematic platformer. From November 20 of 2012. I do not want post here links, because didn't like advertise & etc. I just wanted raise another one flag, one of many of another flags of game-developers who love and honor cinematic platformers. This is part of stuff I do. And main gods of my world of course FlashBack, Another World and Prince of Persia. This games is my teachers.
Game controller remind FB, where character move like liquid when steps and animations endind in specific, current position.
Game controller remind FB, where character move like liquid when steps and animations endind in specific, current position.
ichtyander
Member
For me this thread like a balsam. Or something like painkillers. So many pictures, images & games I love. Lot of thanks for this. By the way, In my free time I also do cinematic platformer. From November 20 of 2012. I do not want post here links, because didn't like advertise & etc. I just wanted raise another one flag, one of many of another flags of game-developers who love and honor cinematic platformers. This is part of stuff I do. And main gods of my world of course FlashBack, Another World and Prince of Persia. This games is my teachers.
Game controller remind FB, where character move like liquid when steps and animations endind in specific, current position.
You are very welcome. I'm glad that people are still making games in this genre and let me just say that your character animations look wonderful and incredibly fluid. I'm really looking forward to play your game. Feel free to give more info, if you'd like, and I'll add it in the list of upcoming games as soon as I can.
I've been meaning to update this thread a little bit, but other stuff always seems to crop up.
I don't think Uncharted belongs in here (or the Tomb Raider reboot for that matter). That's a third-person shooter with action-adventure elements, not a platformer. Whether Enslaved counts as a platformer is also highly questionable IMO. Generally speaking, I feel like many of the 3D examples (can't talk about the 2D ones as I haven't played most of them) may be more hybrids or "action-adventures" than actual, pure platformers.
That being said, in theory, this is my favourite game genre (even though I did not know they were called cinematic platformers
). In practice, even though it already is a subgenre I still find that there are only certain types of games inside it that I actually really like. This mostly has to do with the controls and level design. For example, I love the platforming in Core Design's classic Tomb Raider games and Mirror's Edge but I'm extremely underwhelmed by the platforming in Assassin's Creed, Uncharted, Enslaved or Crystal Dynamics' Tomb Raider games. To me the controls have to facilitate precise movement and full player control and the level design has to require precise movement. So anything that has magnetic ledges or automated platforming or that predominantly uses level design elements that don't require aim and precision (like the ledges in Tomb Raider: Anniversary, for example - I call that type of gameplay ledge-hopping as opposed to platforming because you mostly move on fixed tracks in 2D space without any danger of falling down and without any need for aim or precision) is simply not fun to me.
The list with future projects is really cool! Thanks for that!
That being said, in theory, this is my favourite game genre (even though I did not know they were called cinematic platformers
). In practice, even though it already is a subgenre I still find that there are only certain types of games inside it that I actually really like. This mostly has to do with the controls and level design. For example, I love the platforming in Core Design's classic Tomb Raider games and Mirror's Edge but I'm extremely underwhelmed by the platforming in Assassin's Creed, Uncharted, Enslaved or Crystal Dynamics' Tomb Raider games. To me the controls have to facilitate precise movement and full player control and the level design has to require precise movement. So anything that has magnetic ledges or automated platforming or that predominantly uses level design elements that don't require aim and precision (like the ledges in Tomb Raider: Anniversary, for example - I call that type of gameplay ledge-hopping as opposed to platforming because you mostly move on fixed tracks in 2D space without any danger of falling down and without any need for aim or precision) is simply not fun to me.The list with future projects is really cool! Thanks for that
!ichtyander
Member
You could argue that if a genre gets stretched to the limits of what constitutes its mechanics and mixes up various other genres in there, it's barely the same genre, if at all. But for the sake of following a single historical thread of the evolution of cinematic-action-adventure-platformers, I thought it would be appropriate to mention the titles that hold their roots in this sub-genre.
But I know what you mean, modern climbing mechanics are all about fluidity and quick, easy traversal. On one hand, I'm really impressed at what Assassin's Creed has done for climbing mechanics in video games, I find the whole system remarkably complex to create and still feel pretty fluid and natural. From a technical standpoint, it's pretty awesome. But from a gameplay standpoint, yeah, it doesn't feel very engaging at all. One of the main things I disliked about the Tomb Raider reboot was not being bold enough to try something different with the climbing mechanics. I'm not claiming I know of a solution, and the route they went with was obviously commercially very sound, but I'd love to see an expensive and polished take on a more robust climbing system in third person (as well as first person) games. The old Tomb Raiders had a dedicated "grab" button and a level design that was very naturally telling the player what's climbable and what's not, since it was all very low poly and blocky. The level design is a big issue I think, since creating a photorealistic and more importantly, natural looking architecture, rock formations etc. that are also completely interactive/climbable is pretty tough. I would love to play a modern "climber" with a low poly level design and unrealistic graphics, just to give the devs the freedom to go wild with the gameplay and level structure.
Anyway, my point in the OP was just that the "platforming" part of cinematic platformers largely revolves around climbing stuff vertically (and realistically), with some horizontal platform hopping involved. If you think about it, Another World can barely be defined as a platformer. Those games were 2D by necessity, but if you think about it, the line between Flashback and Stargate are kinda blurry. Then, the line between Stargate and Doom Troopers gets even blurrier (my mind's all in SEGA Genesis games atm for some reason, lol). Evolutionarily speaking, the two other games were really shooters, just like FPSs and TPSs are today, but with a varying degree (or lack thereof) of "adventure" elements. In that line of thinking, the Doom Troopers and Rolling Thunders could be the Max Paynes and Gears of Wars, and the Flashbacks and Prince of Persias could be the Uncharteds and Assassin's Creeds (oh god what did I just write).
They're also quite different from 3D platformers, so you can't really put those in the same basket then. So, as far as modern games go, the major "climbers" for nearly the last decade have been the Assassin's Creeds and Uncharteds. To me, they feel like the natural evolution of those previous games, even more so since they're directly inspired by Prince of Persia and Tomb Raider. Sure, they've evolved into something kinda different over the years, but they're still "cinematic climbers". Stuff like your squad mate helping you climb onto a ledge in Call of Duty doesn't really count.
In any case, a cinematic platformer should generally have more involving movement and climbing mechanics that feel heavy and are performed with a sense of purpose. Devs should maybe experiment with using physics-based animation and movement system, like Overgrowth, or in this case more importantly like Grow Home. That, mixed with motion capture or a more sophisticated Euphoria (GTA) animation system, grabbing mechanics and a more complicated but precise level design that lets you grab onto anything that's logically physically grabbable could be a nice start. As in, if you see a ledge, it has enough room for your hands to grab onto, isn't impossibly steep or slippery, then you should be able to grab onto it, no matter if it was designed for it or not. Kinda like jumping onto very thin ledges in old shooters like Quake III or Counter-Strike. Yeah, it's a very simple example with extremely simple physics (a jump and a collision box) but innovation is hard and risky. Actually, I'm certain that a lot that's been achieved with Assassin's Creed can be used as a basis for further experimentation with more involving climbing mechanics.
So to summarize, I pretty much agree with you, I was just defending my line of thinking and went on a tangent about certain distinctions between platforming and climbing mechanics and what not. I don't know, it's late.
EDIT:
And with all of this said, I can't stop thinking if I should be adding new stuff, from Crazy Climber to Mount Your Friends and I Am Bread. Damn it!
I was be a very appreciate in case if you add me to upcoming stuff. But on this time I can present only animation you see, plus artwork as part of researching universe of Drake. We have no good mockups on this moment, because I'm still not made backgrounds which I can show to the public. I have opinion that gamers deserve only well made product, even on early stage. Because only well served stuff can save the good feel of taste.
About Drake. I love Flashback, very love cyberpunk, and on the first look I need to do something I love. But I'm sure that each game in gamedev as edge of giant stone. Of course repeating of edge is a good way (not bad), but also good way try to make something new, or at least original. That is why I research the parallel universe which telling story about one famous man also known in world history as Sir Francis Drake.
We know that Drake sail on vessel Pelican. And also we know that after some time Pelican was renamed in Golden Hind. After this Drake never was defeated. For me it's a good point to start my story of Drake. Somewhere near real historical 1563 year when he was trapped by the Spaniards in the Mexican port of San Juan de Ulúa. He was lucky to escape.
Here we little bit change the history and make alternate branch of historical events. Vessel of Drake сrashed in storm (we assume that this vessel was Pelican) and he falls on a strange island. Story begins. You need to know, what the hell is going on here, where are you, and how you can go back in your world. It's a story of Golden Hind.
Setting you can see from artwork. It's a something between fantasy and steampunk. Do not afraid, elves and gnomes... little bit different than you be used to. Honestly I don't know no one creature in Hind named as elves. But I know that Hindale settled by human and dwarves. And mentioned race just a junior race. The city ruled by a queen (rumored Undying), and this city have a lot of problems. For you main problem that you in it. Someone thinks that you are legend which come true. Reality that you're just in the wrong place. I suppose that the time choosen also was wrong.
Short list of features:
As you can see nothing of the super-original (smile). No innovation. But I do not need innovation. I miss the good old platformer.
I forget add another one sample. To show our progress in comparsion. First test builds used this animation. After testing I understand that I need to make count of frames like in old good Flashback or Prince of Persia, because this specific type of controller need a flow motion. Very hard to reach it with animation like this. So I'm rework all cooked animations now.
Note: I don't know how I can made images little bit smaller. If you can give me advice to do this, I will be really appreciate. Because lot of people hate a large pictures.
About Drake. I love Flashback, very love cyberpunk, and on the first look I need to do something I love. But I'm sure that each game in gamedev as edge of giant stone. Of course repeating of edge is a good way (not bad), but also good way try to make something new, or at least original. That is why I research the parallel universe which telling story about one famous man also known in world history as Sir Francis Drake.
We know that Drake sail on vessel Pelican. And also we know that after some time Pelican was renamed in Golden Hind. After this Drake never was defeated. For me it's a good point to start my story of Drake. Somewhere near real historical 1563 year when he was trapped by the Spaniards in the Mexican port of San Juan de Ulúa. He was lucky to escape.
Here we little bit change the history and make alternate branch of historical events. Vessel of Drake сrashed in storm (we assume that this vessel was Pelican) and he falls on a strange island. Story begins. You need to know, what the hell is going on here, where are you, and how you can go back in your world. It's a story of Golden Hind.
Setting you can see from artwork. It's a something between fantasy and steampunk. Do not afraid, elves and gnomes... little bit different than you be used to. Honestly I don't know no one creature in Hind named as elves. But I know that Hindale settled by human and dwarves. And mentioned race just a junior race. The city ruled by a queen (rumored Undying), and this city have a lot of problems. For you main problem that you in it. Someone thinks that you are legend which come true. Reality that you're just in the wrong place. I suppose that the time choosen also was wrong.
Examples of places:
Examples of tech & characters:
Short list of features:
- Genre: Platform arcade with the little RPG elements.
- Style: Non-realistic
- Art and color style: Old games by Westwood Studios
- Setting: Mix of steam-punk + medeival
- Time Period: 1563 AD
- No slow-motion or bullet time
- No rolling time back
- No casual modes
- Funny Achievements
As you can see nothing of the super-original (smile). No innovation. But I do not need innovation. I miss the good old platformer.
I forget add another one sample. To show our progress in comparsion. First test builds used this animation. After testing I understand that I need to make count of frames like in old good Flashback or Prince of Persia, because this specific type of controller need a flow motion. Very hard to reach it with animation like this. So I'm rework all cooked animations now.
Note: This is samples of early animation. Cancelled & reworked.
Note: I don't know how I can made images little bit smaller. If you can give me advice to do this, I will be really appreciate. Because lot of people hate a large pictures.
ichtyander
Member
Thanks for the artwork, there's some interesting stuff in there. The setting and time period is definitely something that hasn't been used in cinematic platformers very much (if at all), looking forward to it. I'll be adding the info when I get the chance.
As for the image size, just put the images inside quote brackets, it's the little speech bubble icon, between Insert Image and Code Tags. Also, you can put groups of images inside a quote, no need to put individual quotes for each image, just select all of the images in the group and click the Quote icon.
As for the image size, just put the images inside quote brackets, it's the little speech bubble icon, between Insert Image and Code Tags. Also, you can put groups of images inside a quote, no need to put individual quotes for each image, just select all of the images in the group and click the Quote icon.
I thought Mirror's Edge solved this problem very well. Even without the Runner Vision it was always apparent which parts of the environments could be interacted with and everything that felt like it should be climbable was climbable. Core Design also managed to do this pretty well in Angelf of Darkness (though that game's controls obviously had some other problems. To me Mirror's Edge really is the answer to what modern 3D platformers should be like (the mechanics are easily transferable from first to third person).
foxuzamaki
Doesn't read OPs, especially not his own
Op is mama robotnik tier.
Let me present what I believe is a cinematic platform game but very different from the definition you gave in the OP.
This is what I would call a comedy platform game.
Enters Bakushou Yoshimoto Shinkigeki for PC Engine:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3vW7wJDnQsI
The basic gameplay structure of BTS is that of a very simple platform game from the eighties (but the game came out in 1994).
There is very little challenge and power ups are there just for laughs.
Actually the whole game is there just to make you laughs and constantly throws at you different comedy situations, some far from what you would expect from a platform game.
This is a game where the experience counts more than the actual game play.
This is what I would call a comedy platform game.
Enters Bakushou Yoshimoto Shinkigeki for PC Engine:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3vW7wJDnQsI
The basic gameplay structure of BTS is that of a very simple platform game from the eighties (but the game came out in 1994).
There is very little challenge and power ups are there just for laughs.
Actually the whole game is there just to make you laughs and constantly throws at you different comedy situations, some far from what you would expect from a platform game.
This is a game where the experience counts more than the actual game play.
Lord Error
Insane For Sony
Wow, what an incredibly well researched topic. I thought for sure you wouldn't know to include onEscapee what with it being an especially unknown Amiga game released when Amiga was already dead, and also being a horribly bad game - but sure enough you had it listed!
ichtyander
Member
It's been a while since I've played Mirror's Edge, but yeah, it's definitely a more involving parkour system with one very distinct difference - it has a dedicated jump button. It still has "magnetic" surfaces, you snap onto the ledge, pipe or other objects you're facing or the game's system thought you were going for, and you obviously guide this motion by going forward and rotating your view, much like in Assassin's Creed (or any game really), but the addition of jumping or ducking/sliding at the appropriate time makes it more involving for the player and gives a bit of a rhythmic mechanic to it. On the other hand, as far as I can remember, Mirror's Edge doesn't really have steep/90 degrees vertical/rock climbing mechanics, not that it's all that relevant for this discussion but it's still lacking in that department, I imagine for various reasons.
I don't know, I felt that Mirror's Edge was a little clumsy, but then again, so are cinematic platformers in general. It could probably be made smoother while still keeping the involving movement, we'll see what the reboot will be like. I just watched a speedrun of Mirror's Edge and I realized I probably didn't play that game all that well in the first place.
Another interesting thing, lots of stealth games have climbing mechanics as well, going in the completely opposite direction of slow movement and very deliberate actions. Splinter Cell and even Metal Gear Solid have some pretty neat ledge climbing/hanging, and are a good example of what cinematic platformers are about in terms of realistic movement and what they can look like in 3D space. That footage of MGSV where Big Boss climbs a vertical ledge using very realistically looking rock climbing motions is pretty cool, at least from an animation point of view.
Let me present what I believe is a cinematic platform game but very different from the definition you gave in the OP.
This is what I would call a comedy platform game.
Enters Bakushou Yoshimoto Shinkigeki for PC Engine:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3vW7wJDnQsI
The basic gameplay structure of BTS is that of a very simple platform game from the eighties (but the game came out in 1994).
There is very little challenge and power ups are there just for laughs.
Actually the whole game is there just to make you laughs and constantly throws at you different comedy situations, some far from what you would expect from a platform game.
This is a game where the experience counts more than the actual game play.
Man, I'm really not well acquainted with the PC Engine system, some really unique stuff there. I've never heard of this game but it looks extremely interesting, thank you for mentioning it here. From the purely platforming mechanics it's really straightforward and unrealistic, like a mascot platformer, but the sheer amount of unique and custom actions that happen on screen, along with the various minigames does make it feel cinematic, as you said, in a very different way. Admittedly, the term "cinematic platformer" is not very accurate and descriptive but it seems to have stuck. It certainly doesn't refer to games like Bakushou Yoshimoto Shinkigeki, so it seems it's a flawed genre name in this case.
Candescence
Member
I was hoping 1213 would be listed, and you didn't disappoint. It's absolutely astonishing that Yahtzee was able to make that game in the AGS engine, which was built for an entirely different genre, a feat he repeated with Trilby: The Art of Theft, though he's moved on to Game Maker and Unity now, as he's gotten over the novelty of contorting a genre-specific engine into doing what it wasn't built to do.
ichtyander
Member
Yeah, I was surprised when I found out these games were made in AGS. And they're pretty decent games at that.
Loving this thread.
I remember when I first played Prince of Persia and Flashback many years ago, probably Out of this World too ( I always get these 2 mixed up but I definitely remember playing Flashback) I was amazed. If all these games are cinematic platformers...I am a fan.
I got some of these...Limbo remains a favorite. How in the hell did I miss War of the Worlds on XBL? And I think I played Deadlight non stop until I finished it. These games are one reason why I stay browsing PSN and XBL for games.
I remember when I first played Prince of Persia and Flashback many years ago, probably Out of this World too ( I always get these 2 mixed up but I definitely remember playing Flashback) I was amazed. If all these games are cinematic platformers...I am a fan.
I got some of these...Limbo remains a favorite. How in the hell did I miss War of the Worlds on XBL? And I think I played Deadlight non stop until I finished it. These games are one reason why I stay browsing PSN and XBL for games.
It's been a while since I've played Mirror's Edge, but yeah, it's definitely a more involving parkour system with one very distinct difference - it has a dedicated jump button. It still has "magnetic" surfaces, you snap onto the ledge, pipe or other objects you're facing or the game's system thought you were going for, and you obviously guide this motion by going forward and rotating your view, much like in Assassin's Creed (or any game really), but the addition of jumping or ducking/sliding at the appropriate time makes it more involving for the player and gives a bit of a rhythmic mechanic to it. On the other hand, as far as I can remember, Mirror's Edge doesn't really have steep/90 degrees vertical/rock climbing mechanics, not that it's all that relevant for this discussion but it's still lacking in that department, I imagine for various reasons.
I don't know, I felt that Mirror's Edge was a little clumsy, but then again, so are cinematic platformers in general. It could probably be made smoother while still keeping the involving movement, we'll see what the reboot will be like. I just watched a speedrun of Mirror's Edge and I realized I probably didn't play that game all that well in the first place.
Another interesting thing, lots of stealth games have climbing mechanics as well, going in the completely opposite direction of slow movement and very deliberate actions. Splinter Cell and even Metal Gear Solid have some pretty neat ledge climbing/hanging, and are a good example of what cinematic platformers are about in terms of realistic movement and what they can look like in 3D space. That footage of MGSV where Big Boss climbs a vertical ledge using very realistically looking rock climbing motions is pretty cool, at least from an animation point of view.
Mirror's Edge does not have magnetic ledges. It has "sticky ledges", if you will. What I mean is that Faith does not get pulled towards a ledge or platform just because she's close to it. You have to aim precisely. If you don't or if the ledge is too far away, you'll fall (as opposed to what happens in Crystal Dynamics' Tomb Raider games or the Assassin's Creed games, for example) so they are not magnetic. However, you don't have to press a grab button, either. If you do aim precisely and do reach the ledge, then Faith will grab it automatically and "stick" to it. But I don't think it is at all comparable to the disgustingly automated controls of Assassin's Creed. It feels much more like a spiritual successor to the classic Tomb Raiders' control system which, to me, is the complete opposite of Assassin's Creed's controls as far as platforming is concerned. I also don't really understand why you would consider Mirror's Edge's controls clumsy. I found them to be quite smooth, they simply took some time/skill to master.
MatrixMan.EXE
Member
Whats the easiest way to play Heart of Darkness now, legally. I remember playing it on PS1 as a kid and could barely get past the first few stages. But at the same time I found it incredibly captivating artistically and atmospherically. Think it might have been one of the first games that gave me that kind of feeling.
ichtyander
Member
You're right. While I did mean to say that you automatically stick to ledges, I didn't really consider that "magnetic" exactly described the system in games like Assassin's Creed. I mainly meant you stick to those surfaces automatically, without a grab button, as you described. Once you're airborn, are facing the surface correctly and are close enough/touching it, you get an automatic grabbing action. My bad.
As for the clumsy bit, my comment about speedrunners and me not playing the game right was aimed at that. I haven't played ME since it came out 6 years ago. I remember dying a lot in certain places while feeling it wasn't really my fault, and also reading some critique about that, but seeing what people are doing and how they move in the game makes me think that maybe I just didn't do a very good job at it.
In any case, I would like to see a more methodical, slower paced movement system be explored, with grabbing, physics, maybe even moving individual limbs, being able to manually grab onto geometry that hasn't been necessarily designated as grabbable and so on. I like that feeling of physicality in a game world, where everything is a polygon (as in even stuff that usually isn't, like explosions, fire etc.), has more detailed collisions, manually movable and destructible geometry (blocks, dynamic destruction and mutilation) and overall greater interactivity. Stuff like the first Quake and Blade of Darkness are good examples (nothing to do with cinematic platformers really). I'm just trying to describe where I'm coming from in putting AC and ME in the same basket, since they're more fast paced, parkour oriented. It's probably a silly comparison to make from a modern games standpoint.
So with all that said, Mirror's Edge has a pretty great movement system (and it miraculously works in first person), so I'm all for it. But I'd also like to see development regarding movement/climbing systems going in other directions, that's all.
I'm not sure to be honest. There's a PC version but it's not on GOG sadly. The PS1 should be good, and you could always play it in an emulator if you don't have/don't want the real hardware. I'm sure the PS1 version can be found relatively cheap. Have no idea about the PC version. It apparently works on Windows 7 but I'm not sure how hassle free is the whole experience.
You're right. While I did mean to say that you automatically stick to ledges, I didn't really consider that "magnetic" exactly described the system in games like Assassin's Creed. I mainly meant you stick to those surfaces automatically, without a grab button, as you described. Once you're airborn, are facing the surface correctly and are close enough/touching it, you get an automatic grabbing action. My bad.
As for the clumsy bit, my comment about speedrunners and me not playing the game right was aimed at that. I haven't played ME since it came out 6 years ago. I remember dying a lot in certain places while feeling it wasn't really my fault, and also reading some critique about that, but seeing what people are doing and how they move in the game makes me think that maybe I just didn't do a very good job at it.
In any case, I would like to see a more methodical, slower paced movement system be explored, with grabbing, physics, maybe even moving individual limbs, being able to manually grab onto geometry that hasn't been necessarily designated as grabbable and so on. I like that feeling of physicality in a game world, where everything is a polygon (as in even stuff that usually isn't, like explosions, fire etc.), has more detailed collisions, manually movable and destructible geometry (blocks, dynamic destruction and mutilation) and overall greater interactivity. Stuff like the first Quake and Blade of Darkness are good examples (nothing to do with cinematic platformers really). I'm just trying to describe where I'm coming from in putting AC and ME in the same basket, since they're more fast paced, parkour oriented. It's probably a silly comparison to make from a modern games standpoint.
So with all that said, Mirror's Edge has a pretty great movement system (and it miraculously works in first person), so I'm all for it. But I'd also like to see development regarding movement/climbing systems going in other directions, that's all.
Gotcha. And I'm totally with you on wanting to see slow platforming (not in Mirror's Edge but generally speaking) and generally having more diversity in platforming controls and mechanics across different games. I am a big fan of Core Design's TR games, after all, so it'd be kind of hypocritical if I didn't like slow platforming
. Regarding the grabbable surfaces, though, I think Mirror's Edge did do a pretty good job of making almost everything climbable that looked climbable. I'm pretty sure that a system such as the one you describe wouldn't be THAT difficult to design (it would be difficult, sure, but probably not any more difficult than any other complex game mechanics). It's just that nobody thinks there's a market for it .ichtyander
Member
Gotcha. And I'm totally with you on wanting to see slow platforming (not in Mirror's Edge but generally speaking) and generally having more diversity in platforming controls and mechanics across different games. I am a big fan of Core Design's TR games, after all, so it'd be kind of hypocritical if I didn't like slow platforming
I should really give another go at Mirror's Edge one of these days, it's one of those games I feel I haven't spent enough time with.
Luckily, indies and smaller more professional teams have been delving into 3D territory more and more in recent years, so we might see some good stuff there. I guess, especially for third person games, there needs to be an extremely well made and robust animation system, to make it all look good, but physics based procedural animation systems might help out in the future. Overgrowth has a pretty great system that looks deceptively simple but is very versatile. Even Rain World, although 2D, does some wonderful animation and movement that's pretty unusual.
There's really still a lot of space for experimentation in game design, and I'm feeling more optimistic right now than I was say 10 years ago, I'm sure we'll see some great stuff in the coming years.
godofcookery
Member
Do you have a PS3? I would say find a copy of the PS1 version on eBay and go w/ that. As I recall its also the tehnically superior version of the game w/ a richer color palette. The 256 color PC version does have the correct aspect ratio though. Never found that to be distracting on the PS1 though.
ichtyander
Member
Felt bad about not adding anything here for a while but slowly going through the Amiga TOSEC library I ran into a very interesting and unique game called Enemy: Tempest of Violence, a sci-fi, Alien inspired action adventure set inside apparently derelict alien spaceships filled with dangers, scientists to rescue and aliens to kill. It's got its fair share of weird design decisions and ungodly control schemes characteristic for the time, but the presentation really surprised me. It's got a lot of unique loading screens with big, menacing letters, ambient sounds and music that stops when you're about to run into gory hell, and a weird control scheme where you can literally creep step by step by rhythmically tapping the direction key while rotating your aim in very nicely animated 360 degrees.
So here are the few additions:
Contact: Sam Cruise (1986, ZX Spectrum) (thanks to mclem)
Obliterator (1988, Amiga)
The Last Ninja series (1987-1991, C64) (thanks to retroman)
Enemy: Tempest of Violence (1997, Amiga)
Drake: The Golden Hind Story (upcoming, thanks to Rick)
So here are the few additions:
Contact: Sam Cruise (1986, ZX Spectrum) (thanks to mclem)
Obliterator (1988, Amiga)
The Last Ninja series (1987-1991, C64) (thanks to retroman)
Enemy: Tempest of Violence (1997, Amiga)
Drake: The Golden Hind Story (upcoming, thanks to Rick)
Dragoon En Regalia
Member
I can recommend the PC-98 (multi-platform) game RELICS for this list. Judging by your bullet points it matches in most ways, even if the game preceded PoP by three years (I find it similar in ways to Another World but with items and less set-pieces). You have a number of platforming challenges peppered throughout in addition to combat and figuring out the layout of the dungeon.
ichtyander
Member
Wow, thanks, this game is really interesting, reminds me of some early 90s Amiga/DOS action adventures, only this one came out much earlier.
Looks ahead of its time and that possessing mechanic is probably one of the earliest such examples I can think of, really cool stuff, added to the "Distant Relatives" section. Also added Silmarils' StarBlade.
KentBlake
Member
What an amazing thread.
I didn't see any mention to Shadow of the Beast (the Amiga ones)...I think this game deserves a place in your list, especially with the remake just around the corner.
Edit: Sorry, just saw the explanation about it in the first post, although I still think it's different from "regular Metroidvanias"
I didn't see any mention to Shadow of the Beast (the Amiga ones)...I think this game deserves a place in your list, especially with the remake just around the corner.
Edit: Sorry, just saw the explanation about it in the first post, although I still think it's different from "regular Metroidvanias"
ichtyander
Member
Thanks! Yeah, I've been thinking about adding the SotB games. Looking back on all of the stuff I've added, there's a lot of variety in there that deviates from the genre, so maybe I'll add them as well. The thing is, Shadow of the Beast has a very arcadey approach to movement, combat and the overall lack of realism, which may sound like somewhat minor differences, but I think they're still important distinctions, especially when trying to define sub-genres etc. SotB III is probably the closest of the three but I'm still not really sure. The adventuring and puzzle aspects are what makes the SotB games special and similar in that regard, and they do have a lot of those key elements I've mentioned in the OP, but they kinda feel like an evolution of platform adventures like Pyjamarama, Knight Tyme or the Dizzy games, with actual combat similar to arcade titles like Kung Fu Master or Rygar. The first two key elements, grounded in reality and realistic movement are really important (although very few of the games I've added do have some dose of unrealistic movement), so jumping three times your height, lack of falling damage, killing hordes of grotesque enemies with one punch, enemies exploding on contact or collecting floating or bouncing items, floating score counters flying out of dead enemies, all of it together creates a notably different experience.
Btw, in my mention of SotB at the beginning of the OP, I didn't exactly mean it was similar to metroidvanias, I was mostly mentioning different sorts of platformer action adventures that I thought were far away enough from the definition of a "cinematic platformer". They are indeed pretty different from regular metroidvanias.
Someone mentioned Myth a while back, which also has a lot of these similarities, even with SotB, is also very arcadey, and this list might get a lot bigger if I start adding all of this stuff. So I'm still not sure what to do, maybe I should do more research into these Amiga action adventures, maybe put them in a genre of their own. Euro-action-adventure-platformers. I just played Elf for the first time a few days ago, and man what an interesting game that is. So many adventure aspects in there, yet the core gameplay is still a very arcadey action platformer, and I'm sure there's still a bunch of 'em like that I haven't even heard of yet.
ichtyander
Member
Man, time flies, can't believe my last post in this thread was a year ago. I should add some stuff and tidy it up a bit when I get the time.
Thanks! I still haven't had the chance to play INSIDE, but from what I've seen and heard, it's pretty much the modern equivalent of Another World, which makes me very happy.
Oh man, thank you very much for the kind words!
So am I understanding this right, did Another World really inspire you guys, especially the "Kill Shepherd" ending you mentioned? It certainly fits that narrative trope of a major insurmountable conflict, opposite sides clashing, villain falls off a cliff sort of thing, especially since it's not the hero fighting the villain but his best friend, while the hero is wounded, dragging himself to help out.
I've obviously made some parallels in this topic to the Call of Duty series since it's kinda inevitable that games in the cinematic platformer genre have the emphasis on "cinematic", just as COD and pretty much every FPS since, so I wouldn't be surprised that the team at Infinity Ward just came to the same conclusions and sources of inspiration (i.e. action/adventure movies), but it would be pretty cool if Another World was a direct source of inspiration.
And good luck with Titanfall 2, wish you all the best!
Thanks! I still haven't had the chance to play INSIDE, but from what I've seen and heard, it's pretty much the modern equivalent of Another World, which makes me very happy.
Oh man, thank you very much for the kind words!
So am I understanding this right, did Another World really inspire you guys, especially the "Kill Shepherd" ending you mentioned? It certainly fits that narrative trope of a major insurmountable conflict, opposite sides clashing, villain falls off a cliff sort of thing, especially since it's not the hero fighting the villain but his best friend, while the hero is wounded, dragging himself to help out.
I've obviously made some parallels in this topic to the Call of Duty series since it's kinda inevitable that games in the cinematic platformer genre have the emphasis on "cinematic", just as COD and pretty much every FPS since, so I wouldn't be surprised that the team at Infinity Ward just came to the same conclusions and sources of inspiration (i.e. action/adventure movies), but it would be pretty cool if Another World was a direct source of inspiration.
And good luck with Titanfall 2, wish you all the best!
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