Holy Order Sol
Member
you're playing eat shit and die: the game what did you expect
The Fighting Game Noob Thread: From Scrub to Master
- Thread starter Cindi Mayweather
- Start date
you're playing eat shit and die: the game what did you expect
CountBlack
Member
some tips idk
Teknopathetic
Member
"i dont know what to say about this statement."
I agree will suffice, they're very different games.
"So what exactly am I supposed to do about this
kinda just feels like eat shit and die: the character"
I wish I could offer tips, but I've yet to actually encounter a Zato on PC, despite playing Sin. DP more?
I agree will suffice, they're very different games.
"So what exactly am I supposed to do about this
kinda just feels like eat shit and die: the character"
I wish I could offer tips, but I've yet to actually encounter a Zato on PC, despite playing Sin. DP more?
Phantasmal Repose
Member
Killing Eddie limits his options so you want to try to do that. Once you do that then you go in and pressure. Zato has no real reversal other than his shark super so he'll be forced to block.
Cindi Mayweather
Member
I know I'm new to the game as well but that red/pink overhead slash move you use looks slightly fast and has a lot of range. Your slide seems to work well too.
You're pushing a lot of buttons in places that are not very good places to push buttons, like on wakeup. Bargain sale on Counter Hits. Shouldn't have given up the corner with the RTL in game 2, round 1 -- you got him back in later, but you ran out of Meat along the way and took a ton of damage trying to eat.
You want to look for places where you can try to safely take out Little Eddie with a jab or something and shift back to offense, though Zato's going to try and prevent you from doing that with his buttons. If Little Eddie is out and pressuring you, sometimes you're just going to have to chill and wait for his meter to run low. That's fighting Arcsys Puppet Characters.
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
Play sorta safe, Dont get knocked down, kill eddie, keep pressure up after
It's super slow
Tornix
Member
A good Zato is hard to deal with so I feel your pain lol
You have to be aware of his Eddie meter just as much as he does. If Eddie is unsummoned it makes it far easier to pressure him since he doesn't have a good meterless get-off-me move. If you hit Eddie or he runs out of meter he'll take longer to resummon (meter will be red). Eddie can also eat a hit for Zato so watch out for that.
After a drill, you can destroy the puddles with a low attack. That'll prevent Eddie being summoned from the puddle.
If you recover in the air when Eddie's out FD and try to get away. He can get a lot of extra damage that way.
BumblebeeCody
Member
Ahahaha
Yeah, don't play it.
Is this your first Smash game or, is it your first Smash game that you're taking seriously?
Cindi Mayweather
Member
Slide or the slash? Looks like a heavy slash? What's a good horizontal poke that Sin has?
Eddy eats attacks hitboxes so when your attack hit Eddy, it wont hit Zato and good Zatos will make sure you're punished for attacking Eddy, so when you hit Eddy you need to cancel the attack into something else, or YRC to safety.
You were doing fine the first round, Sin's slide is great at killing Eddy and relatively safe thanks to Sin's cancels. You want to use that more.
Zato's pressure is the safest in the game though so, if you have the meter, DAing(GG's alpha counter) out of it is a good investment. You need to pay attention to Eddy, when Eddy's attack ends Zato comes in to keep the pressure going, that's your window to DA.
Also, should have bursted after the dizzy at the end. ;p
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
The overhead
The charging staff thrust, is really his only good horizontal range poke, slide is ok when canceled into other stuff
drotahorror
Member
Can someone throw me a tip on how to remove the wires from a fightstick's buttons? I need to rewire this xb1 LB and RT since the triggers don't work. I tried tugging on them but I don't want to pull too hard and break something. atrox btw, I'm sure it's a similar process on Mad Catz ones too.
CountBlack
Member
I can't get a DP out on wakeup to save my life, that's why I ended up taking so much damage/counter hits on wakeup. The reversal window is so tiny. Two times I tried to chip him out. First time he flies over it; okay, I'm going to air beak driver him. Second time he goes underground..
It's hard to concentrate on Zato and Eddie, then the drills and etc.
Playing safe = L. I tried to look for opportunities but there's just so much shit going on. It's like playing against Morrigan/Soul fist. I have enough trouble paying attention to Zato that Eddie is just added pressure.
oh and he's got a command throw if I decide to block for too long, so much fun
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
Playing safe = W
you need to secure the field
playing safe doesn't mean just blocking
CountBlack
Member
You know there's tons of bullshit in ST right
Cindi Mayweather
Member
There's bullshit in every SF it seems.
direct_quote
Member
Just play Vega.
I had more success against Zato while going ham, lol, playing it safe just gives him room to set-up and summon comfortably, dude has so many options.
Option select out of it. You get few frames where you're unthrowable after wake up/hit stun/block stun, spend those frames blocking low, then jump and FD as the throw invul frames ends. You'll block his meet and jump if he goes for a throw.
In before mistimed meeties stuff your jumping start up frames. 
drotahorror
Member
Yeah sure, but you're not likely to run into someone skilled enough to be pulling off t hawk option selects, and if you do, they'll most likely smash you at every other aspect of the game.
Pull on the connector. Harder than you think. It might require pliers if they're on really tight (and they probably are).
Stuff like O. sagat, Vega and Ryu's sometimes unblockable tatsu come up a lot even at a low level on Fightcade.
drotahorror
Member
The larger round part or square part where the wires are connected? Sorry if this is stupid, I just don't want to break something that I could just sell and a ps4 stick.
Snacks the sober sea lion
Member
The rubber things that I don't know what they're called on the prongs. Wrap them in cloth for grip and pull them out, it can be pretty tough but they aren't going to snap in half.
Yeah, grab the metal connector that's under the soft plastic shielding, it should be "wrapping" a prong. It will probably take a pretty good amount of force to pull them off if the Atrox is anything like MCZ's sticks, but you're not likely to break anything.
CountBlack
Member
the only people still playing ST are skilled enough to do that type of shit.
I feel like people that say ST is an honest fighting game only picture it as Ryu vs Ken or Ryu vs Sagat.
We got Vega
Balrog throw loops
Touch of death combos
Lots of bullshit in that game tbh
edit: looks like the Vega video was already linked lol
Cindi Mayweather
Member
ST isn't an honest or fully balanced fighting game but it will teach you fundamentals because there's no extra mechanics. Its barebones structure is good for someone new to serious 2d fighters. Modern fighters have a lot of systems and mechanics and yadda yadda. ST is straight to the point. The fights are fast, brutal, and powerful. Fights can end in mere seconds in ST, and that's why it's great for teaching fundamentals. It is completely and utterly no nonsense.
ShinMaruku
Member
Could also be argued it builds more connections in your brain as well.
BumblebeeCody
Member
Hahaha! I forgot about that video
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
and then someone picks vega
Yikes, bodied by his own words.
Karsticles
Member
Reposting for the benefit of this thread as well:
0:17
If Zato has Eddie out, don't just charge in through the air. Zato AND Eddie have amazing anti-airs. You need to play footsies with Eddie to kill him so you have access to Zato. You should never back off of Zato. You can't give him space to summon Eddie.
0:22
Zato's command grab pretty much ends a character. It's usually better to risk getting hit by the low unless your opponent is consistent on -P- strings into knockdown, which most Zato players aren't.
0:30
You absolutely should not be losing to a solo Zato approach. Solo Zato is the worst character in the game, and all of his normals are weak, even if they seem strong. You should have been anti-airing here.
0:38
If Zato and Eddie are together, Eddie will absorb a hit when he dies. Use multi-hit attacks so you don't trade your health for Eddie's death (not a good trade).
0:41
Red flash = block high.
0:53
Zato shouldn't be able to start the match on the offensive. He has bad normals, again. If Zato's opponent knows what he/she is doing, Zato should always have to run away at the start of the match to try and get Eddie out.
1:14
A blocked drill leads to nothing. I think it's +2 on block or something small. If he summons -H- under you (shark bite), then you sat there too long. It's not a block string, get out of there.
1:37
Don't run into drills, lol.
1:39
Always block down-back or DP against Zato on oki. He doesn't have any good overheads, and a good Zato will never leave you alone on oki.
2:33
Pause the video here, and notice that the buzzsaw, -K-, is coming for you, but you aren't in blockstun yet, but you're still sitting here. Your opponent messed up his oki setup, and you should have gotten out of there.
2:35
If you are with Eddie and Zato, and they've got you in blockstun, you just need to chill there until Eddie is gone unless you're prepared to take a big risk and lose health.
2:47
Eddie is here with -K- going toward you, and no support. You back off - this was a free Eddie kill. Eddie CANNOT mount an offense alone, and neither can Zato. If Zato and Eddie aren't supporting each other, you're only dealing with half a character.
3:00
Zato does drill into -H-, and you get hit. If your opponent has a habit of this, mash out crouching jabs and you'll hit Eddie as he's summoned. Also, those little orange/yellow portals on the ground can be killed as of the last patch (believe it or not, Zato used to be way better than he is now). Any time Zato throws a solo drill out across the screen, just take a moment and kill the portal so you don't have to worry about Eddie. After you've trained your opponent to expect you to do this, you can use it as a mixup airdash on Zato.
3:09
If Zato airdashes toward you, he will ALWAYS double overhead. It's unsafe for him not to, and you'll get a free grab.
3:21
You can't kill the drills.
But if you hit Zato, the drill loses its hitbox (but won't disappear - it's misleading).Also, some general anti-Zato tips:
Hitting Zato makes Eddie disappear. That INCLUDES blocked attacks. So if you can even get a crazy attack in and force Zato to block it, you got rid of Eddie and put Zato back down to half a character - congrats.
Don't respect Zato while he's hovering and trying to attack you. All of his attacks have crap hitboxes except for j.K, and even that's not really good.
None of his attacks are disjointed. Those big attacks Zato has? You can counterpoke them if he whiffs.
Zato will end pretty much every blockstring into a drill. Don't stop blocking until you see the drill.
There's a hidden cooldown on each drill Zato can do. If he does the far drill and it misses, you have about 1 second before he can activate another one. Use that moment.
Eddie has limited power before he dies or has to be unsummoned. Don't look at Zato's neutral as "oh crap I need to get in now", but instead, like a powerful gun with limited ammunition. Waiting the ammo stock out is a reasonable strategy at times.
I think the fast nature, smaller online community and lack of in-game resources to learn make it a bad choice for someone trying to learn 2D fighters.
While somethink like SFIV, MKX, MvC3, Sm4sh or Xrd have more mechanics to learn, the amount of info given in-game combined with thriving online communities really helps new players. They'll all teach you fundamentals and newer and older players have learned great fundamentals in the mechanically dense games. Playing whats popular is more helpful than playing what's more pure.
ShinMaruku
Member
Only works if something that is popular fits with you, if you think something is stupid as all hell it will take longer to learn it. It's a mix ideally it would be what's popular and what fits you. I would never tell somebody who is new to mechanics to go into something that they don't like because it's popular.
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
How to learn a fighting game fast.
Step 1 . Pick a game that's popular in japanese arcades or tournaments
Step 2. Find a character you really like mess around with their buttons
Step 3. Find out who the best players are for that character and watch videos nonstop, take notes if you have to.
Step 4. Cue rocky montage
Step 5. go play some people and get blown up or be victorious
Step 6. Repeat step 3 vs a match you got blown up in.
Step 7. cue punch out theme
Step 8. repeat steps 3 - 7 for the rest of your life
Step 1 . Pick a game that's popular in japanese arcades or tournaments
Step 2. Find a character you really like mess around with their buttons
Step 3. Find out who the best players are for that character and watch videos nonstop, take notes if you have to.
Step 4. Cue rocky montage
Step 5. go play some people and get blown up or be victorious
Step 6. Repeat step 3 vs a match you got blown up in.
Step 7. cue punch out theme
Step 8. repeat steps 3 - 7 for the rest of your life
ShinMaruku
Member
You also forget the key part, be insane.
petran79
Banned
I think KOF98UM is more polished than ST in that regard for newcomers. I prefer playing Ryo to Ryu really.
shaowebb
Member
This is how it looks if anyone can help me (not my pic but looks just like this)
Get a microscrewdriver (flathead type). Just one of those little screwdriver kits like they use for glasses or that they sell all the time is good.
Leverage the flat tip under the plug of the wire where it pushes up over the metal prongs of the button. You want to get it in between where the button is and where the metal sleeves on your wires fit over the plug. Then Gently leverage the wires up off the prongs. Some types have a small area to push in before they can be leveraged off.
DO NOT JUST YANK HARDER. Thats a good way to fuck up the wire because it'll rip off either the metal that fits over the button prongs or it'll yank off your PCB.
Also from the looks of those buttons I have to ask...have you tried twisting the square block on the buttons that everything is plugged into counterclockwise? Many button types look like that and some twist right out of the base of your button. If it does that you can just unscrew it off by twisting it a little then swap the buttons by changing which block goes to what. Dont force it though...if its a twist type it'll come right over. NEVER USE FORCE.
I've made several major mods to 3 or 4 sticks of my own and IMO the microscrewdriver is your safest option.
ShinMaruku
Member
I am partial to KOF because of the dance of the will o wisps.
Tornix
Member
Yup, pretty much this. Sub in any 80's montage music of your choice tbh.
BumblebeeCody
Member
Neutral was pretty poor honestly. Against jump-ins you have 6p or air throw constantly
Killing Little Eddie should be you primary objective on the floor. fS Gatling 2S or fS Elk Hunt to get in and be on plus afterwards
Drills are the biggest problem you'll have, but if you harass Zato on the floor with fS cS into specials, he shouldn't have time to: if he jumps to dodge them, 6P or Anti-Air Throw.
Full screen Beak Driver will fuck up the drills. Zato can break the law underneath them so be careful of his movement.
Alternatively some Liquid Drum and Bass/ Speed Metal will suffice.
CountBlack
Member
When I'm thinking of AA'ing with 6P there's so much other shit going on sometimes. Hard to juggle all of them.
I've only been playing Sin for a week so I don't really know what to do in
Holy Order Sol
Member
ShinMaruku
Member
Ok Some Ayane combos for folks to jam to:
www.twitch.tv/shinmaruku
www.twitch.tv/shinmaruku
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