The Flash |OT| Gotta Go Fast - Tuesdays 8/7c

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Malvingt2 said:
NunsUCI.jpg


stole it from another forum.
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Dr. Wells: No! It can't be; I just sent you back to the future!
Barry: No, I know; you did send me back to the future. But I'm back - I'm back from the future.
Dr. Wells: Great Scott!
 
guek said:
Wells presumably traveled back to 2024 (or whatever year that newspaper is from) to fight Flash in his prime and then somehow ended up going back even further to the night Barry's mom died. The question with no clear answers at the moment is what happened to 2024 Barry when he came back with RF,
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I think since Wells owns a computer that somehow has a newspaper clipping in a time stasis field (surrounded by a futuristic AI, Gideon, that he presumably built from scratch in the last 15 years) and knows a shit ton about Tachyon particles, time travel was discovered by technological means in whatever century he was from.

If he's anything like his comic counterpart, he used/abused this time traveling technology and his super-speed (which he acquired by reproducing the original Flash's accident) to wreak havok both on his time and in other times in the centuries between 21-25. This is until he bumps into the Flash at some point in the 21st century, who manages to not only defeat him then, but also has the power to follow him back to the future, and undo most of his villainy across time. Thawne, frustrated that he's losing his cross-centuries empire, tries one last time to defeat the flash in 2024 (the Crisis), is defeated and humiliated, and in his desperation and as a final FU to Barry, decides to go back in time and eliminate him from the timestream. Barry follows him back, thwarts him (though Nora dies in the struggle and his father is arrested for it), and somehow damages the time travel mechanism in his suit permanently (or drags it off somewhere else in time, probably the far future) so Thawne can't reacquire it in his lifetime.

Thawne, armed only with his shred of 2024 newspaper and his knowledge of future tech, builds Star Labs and his AI to monitor the future, while patiently waiting for Barry to become the Flash so he can kill him, usurp the Speed Force, and return to his time. Alarmingly, he finds that the Flash no longer exists due to his meddling with Barry's upbringing, which have altered events enough (Barry grows with Joe instead of his parents, after all) that Barry is never hit by the original lighting bolt on that fateful night in his lab. Even worse, since his acquiring Super Speed depends on the original Flash doing so in the 21st century, he notices that his own powers begin to wane as the timestream corrects itself. So he spends all of his time and considerable resources to create the particle accelerator, with the intention of forcing Barry to become the Flash as soon as possible.

Irresponsibly, the accelerator kills or mutates hundreds of other citizens of Central City, which creates metahumans with the potential to kill or depower the Flash. This explains why Wells is quick to be heavy-handed with all of the metahumans they come across, why he's totally alarmed at Blackout's ability to siphon the speed force (which erases the Flash from the timestream briefly before Wells intervenes by sacrificing another metahuman), why he steals the Tachyon device (which he describes as a 'stopgap' to stabilize his powers), why he kills off known troublemakers like Stagg & Eiling who are too interested in Barry, and why he keeps Grodd around for the lulz.

So the plan is still to kill Barry, usurp the Speed Force, and return to his time, though this time the priorities are reversed. He MUST return to his time, so he MUST usurp the Speed Force, so Barry MUST become a time-traveling Flash before he can kill him. I'd expect another appearance by the man in yellow sooner than later once Wells discovers that Barry has broken the time barrier.

*exhales*
 
Holy shit at this episode. That's some great television.

But I have a feeling that all the events will be played out different next time around. There was just too much shit happening this episode.... Wells revealing himsels as reverse Flash to Cisco, killing Cisco. Barry and Iris kissing, Barry then revealing himself to her.

Everything will be different next episode, I'm sure.
 
Just watched the episode on hulu. Holy fucking shit. What an amazing episode. I'm consistently shocked at how good this show is.
 
MHWilliams said:
Think of the Speed force as an entire lake of water. Barry is currently the only natural valve on that pool. Wells can tap into it using Barry, but he's stuck with pit stops; he's working with a cup or 2-liter bottle, so he has to keep going to the source, Barry, to refill. The suit probably confers the stored energy to him, or he has some natural ability and his proximity to Barry is enough to catch a charge.

The problem is time travel, as shown at the end of this episode, requires a great deal of energy from Barry and even then he went back maybe 24 hours? For Wells to go back home not only requires Barry at the height of his powers, but it also making his metaphorical cup bigger. The Tachyon device is his method for doing so.
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Alright alright makes a lot more sense to me. I appreciate all the explanations.
call_kotaku said:
Conceivably in the "original" timeline Barry could've gotten his powers from a different event when he was older, and Wells just tried to replicate the effects with a particle accelerator failure in order to hasten the process. Maybe creating other metahumans was an unintended consequence of Wells trying to create the Flash.
Click to expand...
See that's another really curious part, because Wells is clearly responsible for Grodd. He is clearly very familiar with Grodd and who/what Grodd is. Unless of course, he was replicating an event that had occurred naturally at some point in his previous timeline. At which point, I'm now extremely curious.
 
Sho_Nuff82 said:
I think since Wells owns a computer that somehow has a newspaper clipping in a time stasis field (surrounded by a futuristic AI, Gideon, that he presumably built from scratch in the last 15 years) and knows a shit ton about Tachyon particles, time travel was discovered by technological means in whatever century he was from.

If he's anything like his comic counterpart, he used/abused this time traveling technology and his super-speed (which he acquired by reproducing the original Flash's accident) to wreak havok both on his time and in other times in the centuries between 21-25. This is until he bumps into the Flash at some point in the 21st century, who manages to not only defeat him then, but also has the power to follow him back to the future, and undo most of his villainy across time. Thawne, frustrated that he's losing his cross-centuries empire, tries one last time to defeat the flash in 2024 (the Crisis), is defeated and humiliated, and in his desperation and as a final FU to Barry, decides to go back in time and eliminate him from the timestream. Barry follows him back, thwarts him (though Nora dies in the struggle and his father is arrested for it), and somehow damages the time travel mechanism in his suit permanently (or drags it off somewhere else in time, probably the far future) so Thawne can't reacquire it in his lifetime.

Thawne, armed only with his shred of 2024 newspaper and his knowledge of future tech, builds Star Labs and his AI to monitor the future, while patiently waiting for Barry to become the Flash so he can kill him, usurp the Speed Force, and return to his time. Alarmingly, he finds that the Flash no longer exists due to his meddling with Barry's upbringing, which have altered events enough (Barry grows with Joe instead of his parents, after all) that Barry is never hit by the original lighting bolt on that fateful night in his lab. Even worse, since his acquiring Super Speed depends on the original Flash doing so in the 21st century, he notices that his own powers begin to wane as the timestream corrects itself. So he spends all of his time and considerable resources to create the particle accelerator, with the intention of forcing Barry to become the Flash as soon as possible.

Irresponsibly, the accelerator kills or mutates hundreds of other citizens of Central City, which creates metahumans with the potential to kill or depower the Flash. This explains why Wells is quick to be heavy-handed with all of the metahumans they come across, why he's totally alarmed at Blackout's ability to siphon the speed force (which erases the Flash from the timestream briefly before Wells intervenes by sacrificing another metahuman), why he steals the Tachyon device (which he describes as a 'stopgap' to stabilize his powers), why he kills off known troublemakers like Stagg & Eiling who are too interested in Barry, and why he keeps Grodd around for the lulz.

So the plan is still to kill Barry, usurp the Speed Force, and return to his time, though this time the priorities are reversed. He MUST return to his time, so he MUST usurp the Speed Force, so Barry MUST become a time-traveling Flash before he can kill him. I'd expect another appearance by the man in yellow sooner than later once Wells discovers that Barry has broken the time barrier.

*exhales*
Click to expand...
One thing: Wells has a list of all the other metahumans created/affected by his particle accelerator, so that should imply that he knew exactly what would result from it.
 
Penguin said:
I watch and get diff stuff out of Arrow and The Flash.

I don't expect Arrow to be the "fun" show because that's not who the character is. Same way, I don't expect Flash to be the high body count show with sword fights and ninjas.
Click to expand...

Isn't it? Green Arrow isn't exactly 24/7 brooding like Batman. Arrow the show is, yes, but the comics Green Arrow?
 
I wish they would release the score by Blake Neely already, I know they have to wait until the season is over to do that, with all the track name spoilers and all.

Music on this show is so good.
 
Wonder if Eddie's going down the Zolomon path now that Wells is confirmed Eobard.

Would establish five centuries of animosity between the Allen and Thawne clans too. Eddie's probably too old to follow the traditional Cobalt Blue origin.
 
I like how they seemed to have sidestepped a paradox by having Barry replace his past self. He has the knowledge from the future but doesn't have to deal with meeting himself.
 
I was kind of hoping Eddie would turn out to be Eobard. He's such a straight character, no one is suspecting him, it'd be great to see him do a total 180. Whereas I like Wells because he has to play the villain but deep down he's doing things for a good reason.

Amazing stuff though, how do they keep uping the ante from here?
 
ZeroX03 said:
Wonder if Eddie's going down the Zolomon path now that Wells is confirmed Eobard.

Would establish five centuries of animosity between the Allen and Thawne clans too. Eddie's probably too old to follow the traditional Cobalt Blue origin.
Click to expand...

Yeah this is my thinking too. Maybe
Grodd paralyses him and he goes crazy, thus becoming Zolomon and RF.

Btw, I still think there'll be another RF (apart from Eobard ofc, lol) in this season.
 
hey, its another amazing Flash episode making me more and more angry at Arrow insisting on being all "realistic" and shit
 
Sho_Nuff82 said:
I think since Wells owns a computer that somehow has a newspaper clipping in a time stasis field (surrounded by a futuristic AI, Gideon, that he presumably built from scratch in the last 15 years) and knows a shit ton about Tachyon particles, time travel was discovered by technological means in whatever century he was from.

If he's anything like his comic counterpart, he used/abused this time traveling technology and his super-speed (which he acquired by reproducing the original Flash's accident) to wreak havok both on his time and in other times in the centuries between 21-25. This is until he bumps into the Flash at some point in the 21st century, who manages to not only defeat him then, but also has the power to follow him back to the future, and undo most of his villainy across time. Thawne, frustrated that he's losing his cross-centuries empire, tries one last time to defeat the flash in 2024 (the Crisis), is defeated and humiliated, and in his desperation and as a final FU to Barry, decides to go back in time and eliminate him from the timestream. Barry follows him back, thwarts him (though Nora dies in the struggle and his father is arrested for it), and somehow damages the time travel mechanism in his suit permanently (or drags it off somewhere else in time, probably the far future) so Thawne can't reacquire it in his lifetime.

Thawne, armed only with his shred of 2024 newspaper and his knowledge of future tech, builds Star Labs and his AI to monitor the future, while patiently waiting for Barry to become the Flash so he can kill him, usurp the Speed Force, and return to his time. Alarmingly, he finds that the Flash no longer exists due to his meddling with Barry's upbringing, which have altered events enough (Barry grows with Joe instead of his parents, after all) that Barry is never hit by the original lighting bolt on that fateful night in his lab. Even worse, since his acquiring Super Speed depends on the original Flash doing so in the 21st century, he notices that his own powers begin to wane as the timestream corrects itself. So he spends all of his time and considerable resources to create the particle accelerator, with the intention of forcing Barry to become the Flash as soon as possible.

Irresponsibly, the accelerator kills or mutates hundreds of other citizens of Central City, which creates metahumans with the potential to kill or depower the Flash. This explains why Wells is quick to be heavy-handed with all of the metahumans they come across, why he's totally alarmed at Blackout's ability to siphon the speed force (which erases the Flash from the timestream briefly before Wells intervenes by sacrificing another metahuman), why he steals the Tachyon device (which he describes as a 'stopgap' to stabilize his powers), why he kills off known troublemakers like Stagg & Eiling who are too interested in Barry, and why he keeps Grodd around for the lulz.

So the plan is still to kill Barry, usurp the Speed Force, and return to his time, though this time the priorities are reversed. He MUST return to his time, so he MUST usurp the Speed Force, so Barry MUST become a time-traveling Flash before he can kill him. I'd expect another appearance by the man in yellow sooner than later once Wells discovers that Barry has broken the time barrier.

*exhales*
Click to expand...

Thanks man. I like that explanation. Answers some of my questions.
 
Ignatz Mouse said:
Great review at io9 gets at some of the reason the Cicso scene is so powerful.
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ET Online reinforces the point by revealing that Cisco's tears were unscripted!

What’s more amazing is that Cisco’s tears during Wells’ speech weren't scripted. “Tom and Carlos [Valdes] worked out that the minute Tom walks into the room, [Cisco] knows he’s going to die,” Kreisberg revealed. “I get chills thinking about it and it wasn’t something we intended, it was something they brought to it.”
Click to expand...
 
Sho_Nuff82 said:
snip
Click to expand...

If they stick to John's retcons of RF then yes that is pretty much the current origin. I hope they would eliminate all the extra time travel jargon as that will most likely confuse the average television viewer. Also the early abuse and psycho crap when he was a kid seems unnecessary for a WB tv show. They are definitely on the right track with this character/show/season.
 
i dont know how i feel about wells, i know he is the villain but even on its most evil form the guy has a charm that cant be denied, like when he was explaining cisco about the speed mirage, he looked so cool and like he truly wanted cisco to understand and than right before
killing cisco telling him that he had learn to care about him and bam! he kills him and out of nowhere that coldness, "to me you've been dead for centuries"
and im like WTF!
 
Skux said:
I like how they seemed to have sidestepped a paradox by having Barry replace his past self. He has the knowledge from the future but doesn't have to
deal with meeting himself.
Click to expand...

As mentioned they're probably doing split timelines. Barry's time travel splinters the timeline so there's no paradox but things happen differently and usually not for the better. The old timeline which Barry left will just be forgotten.

Freewheelin' said:
Yeah this is my thinking too. Maybe
Grodd paralyses him and he goes crazy, thus becoming Zolomon and RF.

Btw, I still think there'll be another RF (apart from Eobard ofc, lol) in this season.
Click to expand...

I don't know about this season. The promo did show
Eddie shooting some cops but there's a good chance that's Grodd related
. I'm not sure they want to play their Eddie cards too soon, and they've largely ignored him in the latter episodes.
 
wasnt Cisco supposed to be some actual character / villain eventually? like Katelyn /
Killer Frost
?
 
Skux said:
I like how they seemed to have sidestepped a paradox by having Barry replace his past self. He has the knowledge from the future but doesn't have to deal with meeting himself.
Click to expand...

But do we know what has happened to Barry's past 24 hour self? And, what about his "original" timeline with Cisco dead and the Tsunami about to hit? Does this mean that assuming he stays in this alternate timeline that the Flash "disappeared" in his timeline, the Tsunami hit the city, and Joe, Iris, Cisco and a bunch of other people are dead?
 
Volimar said:
Yes, he's
Vibe.
It's pretty well known so you probably don't need the tags.
Click to expand...

dude the spoiler culture on gaf is so beyond ridiculous I take zero chances. Ever since I saw people crying about spoilers about fighting game special moves ive taken a zero tolerance policy (mainly because I dont want the hassle). But just because I find it silly, I still respect it hence the tags
 
I don't think they'll do alternate timelines. It would cheapen the characters - why care about death when you can just skip over to another dimension to find them alive.
 
Rhaknar said:
dude the spoiler culture on gaf is so beyond ridiculous I take zero chances. Ever since I saw people crying about spoilers about fighting game special moves ive taken a zero tolerance policy (mainly because I dont want the hassle). But just because I find it silly, I still respect it hence the tags
Click to expand...


Yeah I get it. And yeah, Vibe is a hero.
 
foxtrot3d said:
But do we know what has happened to Barry's past 24 hour self? And, what about his "original" timeline with Cisco dead and the Tsunami about to hit? Does this mean that assuming he stays in this alternate timeline that the Flash "disappeared" in his timeline, the Tsunami hit the city, and Joe, Iris, Cisco and a bunch of other people are dead?
Click to expand...
Idk, i think you might be overthinking it. Barry went back in time. Those past 24 hours that we saw haven't happened yet. He remembers it, but since time looped back to that point the day before, things will happen differently now
 
Also shoutout to the nonchalant progressiveness of having a gay couple on screen and treating it like it's no big deal.

"Can I see him?"
"Family only, sorry."
"But he's his fiance."
"Oh true, go right in."
 
Rhaknar said:
dude the spoiler culture on gaf is so beyond ridiculous I take zero chances. Ever since I saw people crying about spoilers about fighting game special moves ive taken a zero tolerance policy (mainly because I dont want the hassle). But just because I find it silly, I still respect it hence the tags
Click to expand...

Flash and Arrow GAF have largely abandoned spoiler tags for anything other than promos. And if the break is longer than a week the news usually gets spoiled anyway. Even casting doesn't often stay secret.
 
More_Badass said:
Idk, i think you might be overthinking it. Barry went back in time. Those past 24 hours that we saw haven't happened yet. He remembers it, but since time looped back to that point the day before, things will happen differently now
Click to expand...

Yep, just like Groundhog Day, lol.

Skux said:
Also shoutout to the nonchalant progressiveness of having a gay couple on screen and treating it like it's no big deal.

"Can I see him?"
"Family only, sorry."
"But he's his fiance."
"Oh true, go right in."
Click to expand...

This was lovely to see <3
 
More_Badass said:
Idk, i think you might be overthinking it. Barry went back in time. Those past 24 hours that we saw haven't happened yet. He remembers it, but since time looped back to that point the day before, things will happen differently now
Click to expand...

Except that we know that Barry has traveled in the past before to save himself and thus that meant two Barry's occupied the same space. Why is this situation different?
 
Skux said:
Also shoutout to the nonchalant progressiveness of having a gay couple on screen and treating it like it's no big deal.

"Can I see him?"
"Family only, sorry."
"But he's his fiance."
"Oh true, go right in."
Click to expand...

Noticed that as well. I wonder how stuff like that is seen by the gay community. Is it too on the nose or is it a matter of well, let's take whatever positive depiction we can get sort of thing.
 
DrBo42 said:
Noticed that as well. I wonder how stuff like that is seen by the gay community. Is it too on the nose or is it a matter of well, let's take whatever positive depiction we can get sort of thing.
Click to expand...

I don't really see how it's "on the nose." I was more surprised at how young the Cpt.'s partner was, like alright Cap I see what you're into.
 
foxtrot3d said:
Except that we know that Barry has traveled in the past before to save himself and thus that meant two Barry's occupied the same space. Why is this situation different?
Click to expand...
Maybe since young Barry didnt have the Speedforce, he wasn't affected?

But there is evidence that there is only one timeline and what happens now directly affects the future. When Barry had his powers stolen, the future of the timeline changed. I'd take to mean that rather than time branching off into alternate timelines, the timeline is fluid. So the reset would essentially erase the events we saw as Barry will now act differently than he did before
 
What a lovely episode, might I say the best this season. So many twists and turns, and time travelling is here, and it's real. Wonder if they can keep it up and not make everything seem confusing with the time travelling aspect.

The Flash were the strongest of all the shows I watch, this week.
 
So the term Flashpoint has been mentioned a couple of times in the last pages... Is that something non comic readers should know about? Can't remember it being a topic in the show so far.
 
cw_sasuke said:
So the term Flashpoint has been mentioned a couple of times in the last pages... Is that something non comic readers should know about? Can't remember it being a topic in the show so far.
Click to expand...

flashpoint is when barry goes back in time and manages to save his mom, so everything changes
 
foxtrot3d said:
I don't really see how it's "on the nose." I was more surprised at how young the Cpt.'s partner was, like alright Cap I see what you're into.
Click to expand...

Haha. I dunno, when writers go out of their way to make a social point like that it plays off kinda on the nose to me. But considering Caitlin-gate, I'm often wrong. It's a sweet scene.
 
cw_sasuke said:
So the term Flashpoint has been mentioned a couple of times in the last pages... Is that something non comic readers should know about? Can't remember it being a topic in the show so far.
Click to expand...
Barry goes back to save his mom, resulting in a drastically altered timeline. I.e. Bruce Wayne was killed and Thomas became a Batman who has no qualms about killing

It could take work in the Arrowverse. It's the only way I could see them topping this episode
 
cw_sasuke said:
So the term Flashpoint has been mentioned a couple of times in the last pages... Is that something non comic readers should know about? Can't remember it being a topic in the show so far.
Click to expand...
It was a comic (now an animated movie) about how Flash went back to save him mom from dying but in doing so caused a massive ripple that affected the lives of a lot people including various super heroes. The focal point is on a war between Atlanteans (led by Aquaman) and Amazons (led by Wonder Woman) that has caused major catostrophe in the world.

It's a great storyline, at least watch the animated movie "Flashpoint Paradox". I don't think the TV series will follow that exact storyline because it involves a lot of other heroes and would require like a huge budget to represent that scope but they can take some cues from it.
 
cw_sasuke said:
So the term Flashpoint has been mentioned a couple of times in the last pages... Is that something non comic readers should know about? Can't remember it being a topic in the show so far.
Click to expand...

it seems they are building up to it. The future newpaper talks about red skies. Flashpoint was the jumping off point for DC to relaunch its brand into The New 52.
 
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