• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

The Formula 1 2011 Season of Vettel Fingering the Competition |OT|

Status
Not open for further replies.

navanman

Crown Prince of Custom Firmware
ashk said:
If this is true (you didn't post a source), this isn't really KERS then, is it? Since there's no kinetic energy recovery, it's just a sort of one-time speed boost, like a small containter of nitrous. I had no idea the regulations would allow such a system.

Its on Twitter; @adamcooperf1:

Basically saying its not illegal, they can charge it in parc ferme so its ready to go for start of race.
No need for cooling so they save space and weight 2 fold, smaller battery & no cooling solution taking space in rear of car.

James Allen has a piece too:
After qualifying today it became apparent that Red Bull’s drivers did not use KERS during qualifying.
Asked why not, Mark Webber said that the team had internal reasons why not.
But tonight it has emerged that the team may have a lightweight KERS system which is designed for use off the startline only. This is necessary because KERS confers about 7 metres advantage on a car using it over one that isn’t on the start straight.
Without any kind of KERS, the Red Bull would be vulnerable off the startline. Lewis Hamilton in the McLaren starting alongside Sebastian Vettel on the front row and would have the advantage.
This “start only” system would give a gain in terms of weight distribution and packaging because such a system requires only a small battery, which is trickle charged, compared to the 20 kilo system that Red Bull’s rivals use. One of the reasons why the normal KERS batteries are large and heavy is for reasons of rapid charging.
It appears, from investigations, that at least one team currently without KERS is working on a similar system to Red Bull’s.
However, Red Bull may need a full KERS system later in the season, when the other leading teams get close to them on downforce. The 4/10ths it gives will come in useful then.
 
Foliorum Viridum said:
I've not read any posts cos I've not watched quali yet, but it's not up in HD on the iPlayer and I'm fucking angryyyy.

I can't find any HD torrents, either. Even signed up to some sports trackers in hope :( I so want to watch this season in HD, don't mess me around like this, BBC!
Just an FYI as a follow-up to this, I asked a guy on Demonoid and he has uploaded it in HD and will do so for the rest of the season.

:)

Very nice bloke, glad I sent him a PM now.

(I've still not read this thread as it's downloading)
 
ashk said:
If this is true (you didn't post a source), this isn't really KERS then, is it? Since there's no kinetic energy recovery, it's just a sort of one-time speed boost, like a small containter of nitrous. I had no idea the regulations would allow such a system.

I hadn't heard of this but after a quick google:

http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2011/03/red-bull-using-start-only-kers/

EDIT: Beaten.

Anywho, apparently it's legal as it's still an energy recovery system, so meets the regulations.

It negates the straight line disadvantage because of the weight and ballast set-up benefit.
 

navanman

Crown Prince of Custom Firmware
Ark said:
RBR actually run their wing much lower to the ground than McLaren, even without the flexing. Infact, I'd go as far to say that the flexing between RBR & McLaren is very similar, just that RBR runs the wing much lower.

AFAIK, there is a set height the centre of the wing has to be from the ground. Obviously if you manipulate that rule as Red Bull do with the edges touching the tarmac then you gain a large advantage.
 

Lucius86

Banned
navanman said:
AFAIK, there is a set height the centre of the wing has to be from the ground. Obviously if you manipulate that rule as Red Bull do with the edges touching the tarmac then you gain a large advantage.

That's my understanding too. You can't just run your wing as low to the ground as possible.

Psychotext said:
Looks like another season of everyone endlessly going on about this crap. =/

Well, if they continue to bend the regulations where there is a loophole in the testing procedure then people will talk, me included.


Ark said:
http://twitpic.com/4df5oz
http://twitpic.com/4dfbx3

You can see from these two pictures that the centre of the RBR wing is lower than the McLaren centre. You could argue perspective, but only slightly.

The RBR is definitely lower at it's center, no doubt.
 

dalin80

Banned
Regarding DBR's start only KERS system surely it doesn't count as a KERS as the car doesn't recharge the system, if the batter is charged in parc-ferme for the start only then shouldn't the system just count as a battery and motor not KERS?
 
Ark said:
RBR actually run their wing much lower to the ground than McLaren, even without the flexing. Infact, I'd go as far to say that the flexing between RBR & McLaren is very similar, just that RBR runs the wing much lower.

Do you mean the car is running lower? I thought all teams have the base of the wing 75mm above the floor? Suspension under load may play a part in the nose height too.

Seems to be some evidence the wing is pivoting, so the front of it would scrape the ground while the back goes higher.
Although this guy seems to think the whole nose is bending.
http://www.f1technical.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=234080#p234080
 
I think people just get confused by the uneven shape of the RB wing and the fact that they run it so low over the ground. I looked at several photos and seriously i can't see much flexing there.
 

Ark

Member
Graphics Horse said:
Do you mean the car is running lower? I thought all teams have the base of the wing 75mm above the floor? Suspension under load may play a part in the nose height too.

Seems to be some evidence the wing is pivoting, so the front of it would scrape the ground while the back goes higher.

Possibly, but even I think that's too far fetched.

I'm still yet to see Vettel show some racecraft. He says he wants to beat Schumacher's record, but at least Schumacher is a great race driver. What pisses me off the most about Vettel, is his inability to praise his team mate. Webber (even Schumacher does it now) always praises Seb when he does well, but the favour is never returned.

Graphics Horse said:
Seems to be some evidence the wing is pivoting, so the front of it would scrape the ground while the back goes higher.
Although this guy seems to think the whole nose is bending.
http://www.f1technical.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=234080#p234080

I can't do anything else but laugh at this lol.
 

dalin80

Banned
Ark said:
RBR actually run their wing much lower to the ground than McLaren, even without the flexing. Infact, I'd go as far to say that the flexing between RBR & McLaren is very similar, just that RBR runs the wing much lower.


Both teams (all of them infact) run the wings at the set minimum height set by the FIA, 75mm IIRC its just under racing the red bulls scrape the floor ignoring the 'nothing flexi' rule.
 

Lucius86

Banned
F1.2011.AUS.03.AE-HD.FP1.hamilton.jpg
 

ashk

Member
Thanks for the Red Bull KERS link. It's definitely a interesting concept, but what will be more interesting is seeing if it will hurt them while trying to overtake someone who has proper KERS. Obviouosly they are quickest over a lap, I just hope they don't complain "He just pushed his little button" like they did two years ago :p
 

Wes

venison crêpe
He's fine as the details guy, the role Coulthard is now in. I just don't like him doing the general work.

Not that it'll effect me. This is just the replay I have to watch. I always put on the Radio Five Live commentary on race weekends. David Croft and Anthony Hamilton are really fantastic.
 

markot

Banned
Hm, well I think he did pretty good. I think the worse thing about the races is what the camera dudes decide to concentrate on at any particular time. It seems so random, like they just switch to a camera, show a replay of nothing happening, especially when the commentaters are really talking about whats going on, and then they just switch to a driver wakling back to the pits... >.<
 

mclem

Member
navanman said:
Its on Twitter; @adamcooperf1:

Basically saying its not illegal, they can charge it in parc ferme so its ready to go for start of race.
No need for cooling so they save space and weight 2 fold, smaller battery & no cooling solution taking space in rear of car.

James Allen has a piece too:

I think that they need to change the rules so it only kicks in if you start accelerating exactly on the second light on the start signal.
 

Ark

Member
Wes said:
He's fine as the details guy, the role Coulthard is now in. I just don't like him doing the general work.

Not that it'll effect me. This is just the replay I have to watch. I always put on the Radio Five Live commentary on race weekends. David Croft and Anthony Hamilton are really fantastic.

Brundle suits the role perfectly, Brundle and DC make a great pair.
 

S. L.

Member
Ark said:
Webber (even Schumacher does it now) always praises Seb when he does well, but the favour is never returned.
What's the point? Webber and Vettel don't like each other. Seems more like a silly thing from webbers side.
Plus Vettel is faster, why should he praise Webber for second place? :p
 
markot said:
Hm, well I think he did pretty good. I think the worse thing about the races is what the camera dudes decide to concentrate on at any particular time. It seems so random, like they just switch to a camera, show a replay of nothing happening, especially when the commentaters are really talking about whats going on, and then they just switch to a driver wakling back to the pits... >.<

There's one tv feed that all broadcasters use, which is directed by FOM.
 
Jinjo said:

I think not using KERS apart from the start could be related to the way braking is hampered during the race. They still need to fill the minimum weight, and the ballast rules have been tightened up, so I'm not sure if 'small batteries' is a good enough reason.
If they can charge up KERS on the grid, or during the outlap and then 'decouple' the charging system or whatever, they lose the negative effects of KERS whilst keeping the launch boost. As long as their performance is good enough to get them on pole, they can carry on with last year's strategy.
Having said that, I'd have thought deploying KERS on the qualifying lap should work, even if they weren't charging it at the time.
 

Dibbz

Member
Qualy was fun. God I love watching F1 in HD. So good.

I'm happy for Di Resta got a good spot on the grid. Kobayashi is a beast, great work from him.

Surprised at Hamilton's result and at Ferrari's lack of pace.

Can't wait for the race tomorrow. Wonder how many stops teams will actually take.
 

S. L.

Member
Graphics Horse said:
I think not using KERS apart from the start could be related to the way braking is hampered during the race. They still need to fill the minimum weight, and the ballast rules have been tightened up, so I'm not sure if 'small batteries' is a good enough reason.
If they can charge up KERS on the grid, or during the outlap and then 'decouple' the charging system or whatever, they lose the negative effects of KERS whilst keeping the launch boost. As long as their performance is good enough to get them on pole, they can carry on with last year's strategy.
But that still doesn't explain why they didn't use it during quali.
dat mystery!

Anyways, McL and Sauber have been a good surprise for me. McL came around much quicker than expected and Sauber seemed an okayish midfielder during testing. Kobayashis "the car is okay" talk didn't sound tooo promising, but now it looks like they can potentially compete with Merc and Renault.

Dibbz said:
Can't wait for the race tomorrow. Wonder how many stops teams will actually take.
two stops seems potentially possible for RBR and maybe a few others. But i doubt there will be more than three stops.
 

Ark

Member
S. L. said:
What's the point? Webber and Vettel don't like each other. Seems more like a silly thing from webbers side.
Plus Vettel is faster, why should he praise Webber for second place? :p

I know it's a bit silly, but it's just good sportsmanship.
 

Ponti

Member
S. L. said:
What's the point? Webber and Vettel don't like each other. Seems more like a silly thing from webbers side.
Plus Vettel is faster, why should he praise Webber for second place? :p
I think that's just Webber really, always seems like a nice guy.

Good result for Di Resta, and Kobayashi was great as always. Was expecting Hispania to fall victim to the 107% rule... Why are they still in F1? Ugh.
 

S. L.

Member
Ponti said:
I think that's just Webber really, always seems like a nice guy.
Vettel comes of as an incredibly likable guy in interviews, with some cheeky kind of humor.
He can be pretty ruthless on the the track, but eh - that's how it should be.
 

dalin80

Banned
S. L. said:
Vettel comes of as an incredibly likable guy in interviews, with some cheeky kind of humor.
He can be pretty rubbish on the the track, but eh - that's how it should be.

Fixed that for you.

Qual = good
other cars on track = ohgodohgodohgod CRASH
 

Igo

Member
If Lewis can get past at the first corner we might get to see what Seb is really made of.

God i've missed F1.
 

duckroll

Member
Really surprised by how quickly McLaren turned their fortunes around before the season even started. Great qualifying session from both drivers. Vettel is a fucking monster. Poor Schumie couldn't even make Q3 after talking up all his chances this year. Lol.

HRT = ROFLMAO

Fucking LOSERS. That is all. :)
 

Leunam

Member
Wow, so much to take from qualifying:

-McLaren seems to be over their testing woes
-Red Bull beasting all over again
-Sauber in 9th and 13th? I have high hopes for a way better finish in the constructors championship this year
-If Petrov can beat Heidfeld by that big a gap, I wonder where Kubica would have been

Man, Sutil didn't really show up today. Odd since except for Korea, he had a really solid last year given what he had. And what can be said about HRT, jesus.
 

Deadman

Member
It will be interesting to see whether this causes hrt to stop existing. No one will sponsor a team that doesnt get seen.

Hope it does.
 

duckroll

Member
Deadman said:
It will be interesting to see whether this causes hrt to stop existing. No one will sponsor a team that doesnt get seen.

Hope it does.

I think the odds of HRT remaining in F1 is pretty much zero. And it's definitely a good thing. F1 needs to have standards, and having a team which is significantly inferior to every other car on the grid is just completely pointless. If they're not competitive at all in F1, go find a lower-tier championship to practice in. :p
 

Fixed1979

Member
I gotta say fuck TSN for their incredibly shitty F1 coverage. It's truly embarrassing and I'm not sure who's best to complain to, maybe TSN or F1 media?

I can understand blacking out SPEED's coverage if you have the rights, not a problem with that. But you don't show the qualifying live (or the race) and on top of that you cut in after Q1 started, followed by missing announcers (not always a bad thing as I personally think they should shut up more often and let us listen to the cars) for most of Q1, parts of Q2 was missing the announcers and about a minute of it was just a loud beep. It's obvious that TSN don't give a shit about F1, unless there's cars on the track they don't offer any additional coverage (post-race, pre-race etc.) It's pretty frustrating that this is the only option we have in Canada.

EDIT: On Q - Vettel; Holy fuck, I really don't like the guy but he's fast as hell. Really impressive performance, hopefully he blows it and ends up back in 5th+.

Great result for Kobayashi, good to see him have a successful qualify.
 

AndyD

aka andydumi
dalin80 said:
Regarding DBR's start only KERS system surely it doesn't count as a KERS as the car doesn't recharge the system, if the batter is charged in parc-ferme for the start only then shouldn't the system just count as a battery and motor not KERS?

If it is charged on the formation lap, then it is still car charged and ready for start. No way to know though.
 

S. L.

Member
AndyD said:
If it is charged on the formation lap, then it is still car charged and ready for start. No way to know though.
They are allowed to charge the system before the race. Still it doesn't explain why they didn't use it in quali
 

Leunam

Member
7aJR5.png


The grid has been set and the 2011 Formula 1 season will begin it's inaugural race with a Red Bull on top with Sebastian Vettel blowing away the rest of the field with an untouchable time in Q1. Everyone is eagerly waiting for the red lights to turn off and hear the roar of the new season. Let's hope this season is as exciting as the last.

2010 Race Summary

The event was declared wet shortly before the start, therefore allowing the drivers to change tyres from those they qualified on, with all opting to run on intermediates. Sebastian Vettel led comfortably into the first corner from pole, and Felipe Massa jumped up to second from fifth, pushing Mark Webber down to third. The first corner saw a tangle between second-row starters Fernando Alonso and Jenson Button at the first corner, with the Spaniard sent spinning, and rejoining at the tail of the field. Michael Schumacher was also caught up in the incident, and had to change his front wing. Kamui Kobayashi suffered another front wing failure on the approach to the third turn, the accident sending his BMW Sauber rebounding off the barrier into the path of Nico Hülkenberg and Sébastien Buemi; the three drivers joined Jarno Trulli – who failed to start owing to an hydraulics problem – on the sidelines. The safety car was deployed following the accident with the race order being: Vettel, Massa, Webber, Robert Kubica, Rosberg, Button, Hamilton and Adrian Sutil. Soon after the race resumed, Bruno Senna also retired, the result of a hydraulic failure.

At the restart, Webber passed Massa to take second, and Hamilton also passed teammate Button. As the track dried out, Button was the first to make his stop, switching from the intermediate tyres to the soft options in an alternative strategy move, especially as he ran wide at the third corner on his new slicks. The track continued to dry out, and many of the other drivers followed suit, with the Red Bulls of Sebastian Vettel and Mark Webber notably staying out longer. After making up eight positions on the opening lap, Renault's Vitaly Petrov was caught out by the conditions, sliding off and beaching himself in a gravel trap. Red Bull's late tyre change had no big repercussions for Vettel, who maintained his lead (even though it was reduced), but Webber lost out badly, dropping from second to sixth.

The race order was completely shuffled after the round of stops; Vettel leading from Button whose tyre strategy jumped him up to second, with Kubica third, followed by Rosberg, Massa, Webber, Hamilton, Rubens Barrichello, Pedro de la Rosa and the recovering Alonso. Having been forced to pit on the first lap to change his front wing, Schumacher struggled to make his way through the field, spending twenty laps trapped behind the Toro Rosso of Jaime Alguersuari. Elsewhere, Adrian Sutil retired with engine problems. Webber went off while battling with Hamilton, and rejoined eighth, behind Alonso who continued his charge up the field. Hamilton then started on a charge up the order, first taking fifth from Massa.

Button inherited the lead on lap twenty-five when Vettel suffered from what was believed at the time to be brake failure. It was later announced that he actually suffered from lost torque drive between the front left axle and wheel. His Red Bull speared off the circuit and become trapped in the gravel on the outside of turn twelve. Lucas di Grassi was also sidelined a lap later with hydraulic problems. Webber meanwhile passed both Ferrari drivers and took fifth, whereas Hamilton overtook Nico Rosberg with a move around the outside at Turn 11, and then caught up to Kubica. Button, Kubica, Massa and Alonso all chose not to pit for a new set of tyres whereas Hamilton, Rosberg and Webber did so from third, fourth and fifth respectively. Hamilton reeled in both Alonso and Massa at a rate that was mostly over two seconds a lap, bringing Webber along with him, but tyre degradation meant that he struggled to pass. The struggle came to a head on lap 56 when Hamilton attempted to go around the outside of Alonso on the approach to turn twelve, but the Spaniard blocked him and as Hamilton re-took the racing line, he was hit from behind by the pursuing Webber. Hamilton recovered, but Webber's nose cone was damaged and he was forced to pit for another one. Webber later received a reprimand from the race stewards for his role in the incident.

Button went on to win the race by twelve seconds from Kubica, with Massa taking the third place on the podium and Alonso finishing fourth to retain his championship lead. Mercedes' Rosberg took advantage of the Hamilton-Webber incident to claim fifth, with Hamilton himself crossing the line in sixth position. Vitantonio Liuzzi finished in seventh place, a minute behind Button, with Barrichello eighth and Webber ninth after his forced pit stop. Schumacher eventually found a way past Alguersuari and BMW Sauber's Pedro de la Rosa to take tenth and the final championship point. Heikki Kovalainen and Karun Chandhok were the only drivers of the new teams to finish the race; Kovalainen's Lotus was thirteenth, two laps down, and Chandhok's Hispania was the final classified finisher, five laps adrift of Button.

Circuit Info

[Click map for onboard lap]


XR8gX.png


Laps
58​
Circuit length
5.303 km (3.295 mi)​
Race length
307.574 km (191.071 mi)​
Most Wins (Drivers)
Michael Schumacher (4)​
Most Wins (Constructors)
McLaren (11)​

Previous Winners

9AYf0.png


Videos highlighting the Australian Grand Prix

Highlights from the 2007 Australian Grand Prix

[Just a warning, some of these videos may have shit music]

MUBIM.jpg


[Standings for the drivers, constructors, and fantasy league championship will be updated after the first race]

Last Minute News

Qualifying: Untouchable Vettel wows with Albert Park pole
Jenson Button Q&A: McLaren have made a massive step forward
Qualifying: Selected team and drivers quotes
Ferrari can do better says Fernando Alonso
Hispania duo not allowed to race
Red Bull coy on start-only KERS talk
Di Resta: Result above expectations
Kobayashi: Top six slot was possible
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom