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The Formula 1 2014 Season |OT2| Louder Than Formula E
- Thread starter Addnan
- Start date
Oh yeah car reveals themselves are anticlimactic, but seeing all the new drivers in their garb, the new McLaren-Honda livery, and the feeling that the off-season seems to feel shorter every year.
nature boy
Member
Nope, wait for the car launch. But rumors were Ron was asking for a lot of money.
Mclaren is busy lowering expectations.
And Kimi isn't (yet) a father.
Mclaren is busy lowering expectations.
And Kimi isn't (yet) a father.
nature boy
Member
They're not desperate for cash, so why give a discount?
A big sponsor isn't their biggest concern right now.
Isn't Lotus in good financial standing? I remember Lopez boasting that his team is at least breaking-even.
Wax Free Vanilla
Member
Lowering expectations? Just the other week Ronbo was talking about domination and Honda stating that "we will win next year in Melbourne and start a new era."
Peter P's rocketship, he must have cut the gardening short and started earlier than expected.
nature boy
Member
And then Boullier said they wanted no engine freeze otherwise Mercedes will dominate for years.
2015 will be a learning year more than anything else, so keep your expectations in check.
Wax Free Vanilla
Member
And then nothing, Boullier was answering Crofty on Sky Sports back in November when he asked him if they need to unfreeze the engine rules for the good of the sport. For some reason, a month later, the degenerates at Autosport have used this interview and put their own spin on it.
"if you could unfreeze the engine regs, you will see some catch up"
"some" being Ferrari and Renault, there's no need for Honda to catch up as they have a jewel of an engine with exceptional performance according to McLaren.
"if you could unfreeze the engine regs, you will see some catch up"
"some" being Ferrari and Renault, there's no need for Honda to catch up as they have a jewel of an engine with exceptional performance according to McLaren.
nature boy
Member
The ICE yes, it seems it will competitive, but everything else, in particular when it comes to reliability, is still far from clear.
Mastah
Member
Raffaele Marciello will be test and reserve driver at Sauber:
http://formula1.ferrari.com/news/fda-marciello-appointed-test-reserve-driver-sauber-f1-team
http://formula1.ferrari.com/news/fda-marciello-appointed-test-reserve-driver-sauber-f1-team
something something announcement.....
nature boy
Member
Yeah they've had serious losses and they just lost two sponsors, so they might be the next team to fall.
Mastah
Member
nature boy
Member
Sauber is the next team in line, Lotus will be fine.
Nice!
No problems with Sauber, especially since it's now the only Ferrari customer. Don't think Ferrari want to see Sauber go bust when they lost millions with Marussia.
Mastah
Member
No problems with Sauber? They somehow survived through 2010, barely made it to Australia in 2012 (as confirmed by Perez), had to appease creditors during 2013 summer break, took money from anyone interested with a bag of cash in 2014 (Fong, Nissany) and now for 2015 hired 2 highest bidders, Nasr and Ericsson, with Swedish money grabbed already, so Sauber can survive winter. That's no problems?
In other news, former F1 driver and current Formula E driver Franck Montagny was positively tested for cocaine during Malaysian round:
http://www.lequipe.fr/Sport-auto/Actualites/Montagny-je-suis-fautif/525172
nature boy
Member
Sauber will be in Australia. That's what I meant. Obviously they're not swimming in cash, but Lotus is in bigger trouble.
zomgbbqftw
Banned
Lotus could be about to lose their biggest sponsor and pay driver. It is going to be very difficult for the Venezuelan government to justify such an expensive sponsorship programme of Lotus and Maldonado now that the country is deep in recession and PDVSA is in trouble.
Wax Free Vanilla
Member
Didn't realise BBC Racing Legends was back, the second episode this Sunday sees Jeremy Irons examining the life and cars of Graham Hill, final episode is some baker / John Surtees.
Marussia owed Glock quite a bit of money http://www.scribd.com/doc/251338328/Marussia-Creditors
Toto for Gazetta dello Sport:
- They will discuss Hamilton contract extension during the season, Alonso first and Bottas second alternative
- 2015 car is on schedule, they are planning shakedown in mid January in Silverstone. Unveil probably on the first day of testing
- Williams main rival in 2015, RBR will be also dangerous
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/117254
- They will discuss Hamilton contract extension during the season, Alonso first and Bottas second alternative
- 2015 car is on schedule, they are planning shakedown in mid January in Silverstone. Unveil probably on the first day of testing
- Williams main rival in 2015, RBR will be also dangerous
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/117254
nature boy
Member
Oh shit
Ferrari, Mercedes and Renault can all develop their PUs during the season, but Honda can't. So Honda has until the 28th of February to freeze their engine.
Ferrari, Mercedes and Renault can all develop their PUs during the season, but Honda can't. So Honda has until the 28th of February to freeze their engine.
The 2015 season just got a whole lot more exciting. God bless FIA and their ability to write rules with loopholes.
What?
Psychotext
Member
lol... what a fuck up.
Adam Scott Aukerman
Member
Please post sources to claims. It's awfully tedious to try and guess where people are getting information from in order to read more about it.
Adam Scott Aukerman
Member
Funnily enough I'd just copied exactly that block of text in order to comment on it. I honestly can't see (in a logical world), a scenario in which Honda don't attempt to mount a legal challenge to that as it seems an awfully arbitrary way to fuck over their 2015 (and potentially 2016) campaign.
There's your mistake, thinking anything about the FIA and F1 is logical.
But yeah, can't see that reasoning flying with Honda.Even Honda knew it would be that way for years now. They will have to live by the same rules the other teams had - only one year later. That's neither new nor surprising.
nature boy
Member
If you're talking about civil courts, the FIA won't take kindly to that.
That's why they have the ICA. If anything, Honda will go the ICA route, never a civil court. But I doubt Honda will even go down that route.
nature boy
Member
Here's the situation:
- The spirit of the law was to forbid in-season development of PUs unless there were reliability issues. That required the agreement of the FIA and the other manufacturers;
- However, the rules were poorly written and a couple of months ago they were rumors that Ferrari and Renault were going to take advantage of that loophole. The FIA (Charlie Whiting) accepted the view of Renault and Ferrari during the Christmas period;
- Ferrari, Mercedes and Renault can continue to develop mid-season in 2015, and according to reports (AMuS) Ferrari and Renault have 5 tokens left;
Also, homologation of the PUs can happen after the 1st GP. So teams can run with 2014 PUs until their 2015 PU is ready (very unlikely to happen, but in theory possible). Obviously inside the token rules.
- Honda will have the treatment that the other manufacturers had in 2014: complete freeze on introducing new developments unless there are reliability problems. So any introduction of new parts requires the approval of all the other manufacturers.
- The spirit of the law was to forbid in-season development of PUs unless there were reliability issues. That required the agreement of the FIA and the other manufacturers;
- However, the rules were poorly written and a couple of months ago they were rumors that Ferrari and Renault were going to take advantage of that loophole. The FIA (Charlie Whiting) accepted the view of Renault and Ferrari during the Christmas period;
- Ferrari, Mercedes and Renault can continue to develop mid-season in 2015, and according to reports (AMuS) Ferrari and Renault have 5 tokens left;
Also, homologation of the PUs can happen after the 1st GP. So teams can run with 2014 PUs until their 2015 PU is ready (very unlikely to happen, but in theory possible). Obviously inside the token rules.
- Honda will have the treatment that the other manufacturers had in 2014: complete freeze on introducing new developments unless there are reliability problems. So any introduction of new parts requires the approval of all the other manufacturers.
It says Ferrari and Renault have 5 tokens left. How many does Mercedes have left? Also, does this allow for the other teams to copy Merc's split turbo design? The packaging of the engine was small because they had the exhaust spool and intake compressor on opposite ends of the cylinder banks, with the shaft running down the middle of the V. That was my understanding of it, and why Merc was able to deliver such a compact engine.
Anyway, Honda knew the rules coming in. It wouldn't be fair to allow them more prep than the other manufacturers had. PEACE.
Anyway, Honda knew the rules coming in. It wouldn't be fair to allow them more prep than the other manufacturers had. PEACE.
Nicktendo86
Member
The rumours are that Merc wanted to use all of their tokens for season start but are holding back 5 'just in case'. That Renault and Ferrari are so incompetent that they need more time to use theirs is staggering.
Honda have had no more prep time than anyone, where have you got that from? They are a full year behind on development and have no track data to use compared to the others. Only advantage they have is that they can freeze their basic design later than the others.
This is yet another clusterfuck.
Honda have had no more prep time than anyone, where have you got that from? They are a full year behind on development and have no track data to use compared to the others. Only advantage they have is that they can freeze their basic design later than the others.
This is yet another clusterfuck.
Yeah, but they should be able to do that and then use this years tokens like any other team. Saying a team has to make no changes in their first year 'just because that's the what was intended' when the other teams get to use the loophole is bullshit.
It made sense when the other teams were going to be held to the same standard. First year or not, the same rules should apply to every team in every season.
Wax Free Vanilla
Member
The 30 state of the art dynos have them all shook up.
I really hope Williams do well again this year. Really really. Think we'll end up Mercedes, Williams, Red Bull, Ferrari/McLaren. Lotus are a bit of a wildcard with the Merc engine.
The issue with Honda being allowed the same extra toeksn is that then they would either a) homoglate twice in one year or b) not homoglate at all until they see fit.
The other three can get away with it because they already have an engine which is homoglated to the spec.
The concern here is whether the FIA are just going to allow open development all season or if they are going to stick to the one homoglation per season part of the rule or not, the press release wasn't clear for me. If they are still only allowed one homoglation then I doubt Ferrari and Renault are going to wait much more than 1 or 2 races as the performance gap to Merc will be even larger assuming they homoglate for Australia, and they don;t know how good the Honda will be.
It made sense when the other teams were going to be held to the same standard. First year or not, the same rules should apply to every team in every season.
Not a word.
Unfortunatly the FIA being soft as a sack of shite when it pleases them is part of F1 and has been for some years.
The issue with Honda being allowed the same extra toeksn is that then they would either a) homoglate twice in one year or b) not homoglate at all until they see fit.
The other three can get away with it because they already have an engine which is homoglated to the spec.
The concern here is whether the FIA are just going to allow open development all season or if they are going to stick to the one homoglation per season part of the rule or not, the press release wasn't clear for me. If they are still only allowed one homoglation then I doubt Ferrari and Renault are going to wait much more than 1 or 2 races as the performance gap to Merc will be even larger assuming they homoglate for Australia, and they don;t know how good the Honda will be.
It made sense when the other teams were going to be held to the same standard. First year or not, the same rules should apply to every team in every season.
Not a word.
Which would give Honda an advantage. They will have the same rules as the other teams - starting next year.