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[ArtHands]

The games industry is undergoing a 'generational change,' says Epic CEO Tim Sweeney: 'A lot of games are released with high budgets, and they're not selling'

The world of videogames is changing, and the Epic chief believes the future is social.

www.pcgamer.com

Epic Games CEO Tim Sweeney said during his address at today's Unreal Fest in Seattle that while there's still uncertainty about what exactly the metaverse is, the continuing growth of Fornite—and the failure of a number of high-profile big-budget games to meet expectations—is proof that it represents the future of gaming.

Fortnite hit "new records in concurrency," Sweeney said during his opening comments, achieving an all-time peak of 110 million active users over the previous holiday season—an accomplishment he said comes amidst a "generational change" in the games industry.


"One of the manifestations [of that change] we're seeing right now is that a lot of games are released with high budgets, and they're not selling nearly as well as expected," Sweeney said. "Whereas other games are going incredibly strong. What we're seeing is a real trend where players are gravitating toward the really big games where they can play with more of their friends."

The perceived value of a game, he continued, "grows in proportion to the number of your friends that you can connect to," for everything from playing games together to chatting by voice, watching virtual concerts, or "doing other kinds of cool, virtual things online."
"Some people will call it the metaverse," Sweeney said, "And we're not all in agreement on what this means. Some people, when they hear the word 'metaverse,' they think of what Facebook is doing with VR and now AR. Some people use the metaverse to describe everything they don't like about the current Fortnite season."

Regardless of what you think of the moment-to-moment state of Fortnite, though, "it's new, and it's exciting, and it's something that's never happened at this scale in the history of entertainment," Sweeney said. The evolving story and ongoing live content updates are obviously a huge part of that, but he attributed much of Fortnite's success to "all the world's brands participating and dropping in: Musicians reaching users, Disney and Star Wars and others all coming together to create a world class entertainment experience that's ever-evolving and live. That's really what we think the future of gaming is about."

I'm among those who raise an eyebrow whenever the topic of the metaverse comes up, but I won't argue Sweeney's point. Seven years after Fortnite first launched it remains an absolute juggernaut, and the biggest brands in entertainment are still lining up to get in. On the other side of the coin, Sweeney's mention of a slump among some big-budget standalone releases seems on point: Suicide Squad, Final Fantasy 16, Starfield, and most pointedly Star Wars Outlaws have all been letdowns to some extent, even though they all carry the branding Sweeney is so enthusiastic about.

 

[PauloRoberto]

I could agree... but only one guy telling bull*hit is more than enough.

 

[Three]

Yes, it's visible in the charts which have decade old big games in the top 10 continously. A lot of them also happen to be live service as he suggests.

 

[PauloRoberto]

And ignoring some successes like Stellar Blade, Black Myth: Wukong and Astro Bot (and comparing FF 16 with Suicide Squad) is simply bad faith.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

they are chasing what's at the end of the rainbow... and based in the cartoons I used to watch they are gonna get fuk

 

[Bernardougf]

Shitty games made in the DEI development era without respect for the main target audience are not selling well.. news at eleven

 

[Starbuck2907]

Too many games, and too high prices.

Sure, with that combo, something’s gonna change.

I don’t understand why he thinks people playing big budget multiplayer games with their friends is something new.

 

[mendicant wages]

Shitty games made in the DEI development era without respect for the main target audience are not selling well.. news at eleven

Exactly.

 

[Heimdall_Xtreme]

Part of the problem is the forced inclusion, woke elements and censorship, as well as the poor artistic designs and personalities of the characters.

So don't look for the root of the problem where the obvious is...

As the creator of Dragon Quest said... They greatly limit creativity.

 

[onQ123]

The Great Reset is happening.

With the next generation of consoles I'm hoping for a reset to simple graphics (for the kids)

The older generations had the chance to witness games going from simple blocks moving around on screen up to what we have now. I think next generation would actually be a good time for a reset as we move into full Ray-Tracing & Volume Rendering . The last real reset that we had was going from...

www.neogaf.com

 

[March Climber]

Shitty games made in the DEI development era without respect for the main target audience are not selling well.. news at eleven

Exactly.

‘Main target audience’ is the exact thing that is becoming harder to define for devs.

The numbers and opinions don’t match up as often as they could be, and some of the games mentioned in this thread are actually rare outliers, because not everyone can chase what that market wants and fully succeed.

 

[lmimmfn]

Maybe if we had games gamers want, not woke infested slop.

 

[Grildon Tundy]

That, and it taking 5-7 years to develop a game that was started with the intention of chasing a trend that was popular at the game's inception and is no longer the hot thing. Takes too long to turn the boat.

 

[Kacho]

Eh, most people in the west have gravitated towards multiplayer titles over the past 20 years so I don't think much has changed here. People just have more ways to access the games. Like, Lil Billy can play Fortnite on his mom's iPhone while she's working on her winebox for the evening. Lowest common denominator gaming will always attract the largest audience. Look at mobile gaming in general...

So while there's truth to what he's saying, ignoring the elephant in the room about why some AAA games underperform is wack. Alan Wake 2 sold poorly because Tim wanted it exclusive to his store front. That game's failure is on him. Other stuff underperforms for a variety of reasons, but it's generally because they missed the mark in some way. Harry Potter was an absolute juggernaut last year. This year we've seen an unlikely success story with Space Marine 2. Consumers are hungry for quality AAA experiences, just make sure you're giving them something they want. Don't rely on analytical data about how much diversity your game needs to be successful. People can smell your unauthentic product from a mile away.

 

[EverydayBeast]

Loot boxes, cosmetics, is a tragedy, and I’m sure many people agree with me, personally subscriptions makes people suffer, games launching incomplete is an issue, we want games but not when there’s concerns about connecting to lobbies (Battlefield 4 at launch), developers need to produce AAA games on a low budget.

 

[Mister Wolf]

What guys like in videogames hasn't changed one bit. Their attempts to get us to conform have failed, costing millions.

 

[Jetpac]

Originality and listen to the dedicated gamers vs TELLING them what they want is the way

 

[LectureMaster]

I said that before and want to say it again. The AAA game production needs to scale back.

Focus on condense gameplay experience, drop the obsession with graphic fidelity, houseclean all unnecessary positions/consultings. Your games will sell good

 

[Heimdall_Xtreme]

. Lowest common denominator gaming will always attract the largest audience.

Any denominator you would find on Sony... It's so common.

 

[TheChumpNation]

The big budget games flopping are usually pretty shit. I feel like he omitted that from his analysis.

Are there any examples of games that are genuinely of high quality and value that completely flop in Suicide Squad or Concordian fashion? I guess maybe Alan Wake 2? (haven't played it, but going off general impressions).

 

[RodriGames40]

The Great Reset is happening.

With the next generation of consoles I'm hoping for a reset to simple graphics (for the kids)

The older generations had the chance to witness games going from simple blocks moving around on screen up to what we have now. I think next generation would actually be a good time for a reset as we move into full Ray-Tracing & Volume Rendering . The last real reset that we had was going from...

www.neogaf.com

That won't happen. If anything everyone will end up embracing the Unreal Engine and put out better looking games than we have right now, simply because their engine is so far ahead.

 

[MikeM]

.

 

[TGO]

When you make a AAA game and expect me to fork out £70 for it I expect it to be a AAA game that succeeds a AAA game from 2010 and doesn't lecture me with the developers ideology and force woke crap down my throat.
That is the reason most western AAA games aren't selling, and as soon as they get that through their fucking heads the sooner we'll be happier and buying their games and they'll be talking it to the bank.
It's not fucking hard

 

[onQ123]

That won't happen. If anything everyone will end up embracing the Unreal Engine and put out better looking games than we have right now, simply because their engine is so far ahead.

The games will look better anyway

 

[Moriarty1889]

Shitty games made in the DEI development era without respect for the main target audience are not selling well.. news at eleven

100% TRUTH. This is definitely the DEI era of games and people are letting devs know what they think of them. Inflated budgets and inflated virtue signaling egos pushing ideologies and personal agendas poisoning gaming. Most gamers don’t want that shite they just want good games. The results speak for themselves.

 

[Three]

And ignoring some successes like Stellar Blade, Black Myth: Wukong and Astro Bot (and comparing FF 16 with Suicide Squad) is simply bad faith.

I think this is not really a trend, neither is the go woke go broke nonsense others post as the reason for the shift that's happening right before them. If you look at August top UK sales you see that Black Myth isn't even in the top 10 there (it released mid August), GTAV is. It's mainly because the IP is popular in China.
Stellar Blade also didn't last very long in the chart, I just hope it did well enough to cover its costs. There are big games without woke stuff not selling very well either like FF16 or FF7 Remake. There is a general trend that the market is contracting to only a few big IP games that are live service.

 

[ByWatterson]

This is a bit like an Ozempic sales rep telling me we don't need gyms anymore.

 

[chakadave]

This board has been saying that for a decade or more. And that is why games like Vampire Survivors, and so many other really breakthrough the industry.

 

[Angry_Megalodon]

‘Main target audience’ is the exact thing that is becoming harder to define for devs.

Especially if their communication towards the gaming community is condescending and insulting. Most western devs nowadays behave like narcissistic brats who believe themselves too good for us, as if they were a gift from God. They only care about the gaming media, which is equally disconnected from their target audience so they live together in an echo chamber.

What I see from gacha devs is the opposite. They ask for honest feedback and listen to people's complaints so they correct course before the worst happens. No surprise they are thriving.

Knowing what your audience wants is very easy, barely an inconvenience.

 

[FunkMiller]

'Please ignore all the massively successful single player games of the past few years that aren't stuffed with political agenda bullshit, because I need to push mow own agenda that online, multiplayer games are where we should be putting our efforts in, because that's where I make my money'.

One has to wonder if these cunts even think anybody is still being taken in by their bullshit.

 

[OccamsLightsaber]

Video games are losing in the attention economy more (young) people than ever are watching streamers and browsing Tiktok and being sucked into other forms of social media. Conventional high-budget video games requiring expensive specialized hardware and software will never be able to compete with the phones in everyone's pocket. People get their dopamine hits in other cheaper ways these days, simple as that.

 

[hemo memo]

Perhaps more people are moving away from day-one releases, considering how games are taking longer to complete and decreasing in price more rapidly than ever before.

 

[PauloRoberto]

I think this is not really a trend, neither is the go woke go broke nonsense others post as the reason for the shift that's happening right before them. If you look at August top UK sales you see that Black Myth isn't even in the top 10 there (it released mid August), GTAV is. It's mainly because the IP is popular in China.
Stellar Blade also didn't last very long in the chart, I just hope it did well enough to cover its costs. There are big games without woke stuff not selling very well either like FF16 or FF7 Remake. There is a general trend that the market is contracting to only a few big IP games that are live service.

And you are showing the biggest problem with game industry - the necessity to show that the product is always selling well, does matter planning, budget, etc etc. And no, the market is absolutely NOT compressing into live service, only fools believe this kind of shit, fools that, thank God, can be ignored.

 

[MujkicHaris]

"The world of videogames is changing, and the Epic chief believes the future is social."

The future is single player only.

 

[Pejo]

High budgets don't equal good games. I think we've seen more than enough of that already this year.

 

[Gamer_By_Proxy]

Another MF thinking single player is dead.

 

[Three]

And you are showing the biggest problem with game industry - the necessity to show that the product is always selling well, does matter planning, budget, etc etc. And no, the market is absolutely NOT compressing into live service, only fools believe this kind of shit, fools that, thank God, can be ignored.

We're talking specifically about high budget games if you look at the title of the thread. I'm not saying lower budget games can't find success but the bigger games are struggling and contracting to only known IPs. It's also why licenced games are becoming more and more important.

 

[RoboFu]

Meanwhile Nintendo is selling 30+ million per game with modest budgets.

Great games don't have to be high budget summer block busters. That's what's killing the industry.

 

[Kotaro]

- Get rid of DEI policy and ideology from gaming company
- Go back to hiring real coders/developers, not some bunch of DEI hires/activists
- No Woke/DEI messaging in your game
- Cut your development cost, believe it or not DEI policy also contributes for higher development cost. When your character designs, stories, dialogs, have to go thru round of scrutiny and approval by DEI team/consultants, that just add to your budget

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

There is literally no difference between Tim Sweeney and myself. Preach it Tim.

This is a phenomenal way to explain the monumental shift the industry has experienced in recent times...

"The perceived value of a game, he continued, "grows in proportion to the number of your friends that you can connect to."

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

There is literally no difference between Tim Sweeney and myself.

 

[mckmas8808]

Originality and listen to the dedicated gamers vs TELLING them what they want is the way

THIS! I wish CEOs start listening to gamers more.

 

[mckmas8808]

There is literally no difference between Tim Sweeney and myself. Preach it Tim.

This is a phenomenal way to explain the monumental shift the industry has experienced in recent times...

"The perceived value of a game, he continued, "grows in proportion to the number of your friends that you can connect to."

So why did Black Myth Wokung sell 20 million units in one month with no multiplayer?

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

So why did Black Myth Wokung sell 20 million units in one month with no multiplayer?

Both types of games benefit from the social effect. Black Myth Wukong was all the rage for a few weeks. People bought that game to be a part of the buzz.

GAAS just benefits from the social effect to a far larger degree.

 

[Stu_Hart]

Mark cerny's statement on game development times being shorter on ps4 aged like spoilt milk. The hardware is more accessible and more powerful, but devs have even bigger ambitions due to what's possible and it will grow. We had 3 full uncharted games and last of us in the ps3 era, all created with high quality despite the ps3 being a bitch to work with.

 

[Hawk The Slayer]

More games like

Resident Evil games
Ratchet and Clank games
Space Marine games
Stellar Blade games
Wukong
GTA VI
Elder Scrolls VI
Fallout 5

Less games like
Star Wars Outlaw
Dustborn
Concord

 

[Gambit2483]

When you make a AAA game and expect me to fork out £70 for it I expect it to be a AAA game that succeeds a AAA game from 2010 and doesn't lecture me with the developers ideology and force woke crap down my throat.
That is the reason most western AAA games aren't selling, and as soon as they get that through their fucking heads the sooner we'll be happier and buying their games and they'll be talking it to the bank.
It's not fucking hard

 

[bitbydeath]

Both types of games benefit from the social effect. Black Myth Wukong was all the rage for a few weeks. People bought that game to be a part of the buzz.

GAAS just benefits from the social effect to a far larger degree.

Remember when Concord and other long forgotten GaaS games (that aren’t Fortnite/CoD) were talked about?

Pepperidge Farm remembers.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Remember when Concord and other long forgotten GaaS games (that aren’t Fortnite/CoD) were talked about?

Pepperidge Farm remembers.

Failed GAAS games don't leverage the social effect as well as good GAAS games.

More news at 11:00pm.

 

[strike670]

Stop making bloated open world games that take several hundred employees and cost hundreds of millions to make. Adjust cost to what you think the demand is for your title and start making fun games that make people happy while playing. Not sure why more of these companies are not just copying Nintendo's lead.