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[MazeHaze]

Games like OG OoT hover around 15 IIRC. As long as it's playable i don't really care. I was 100% fine with launch AC Unity, for instance. It was completely playable. The gameplay wasn't hindered. Obviously that's not ideal but it's just not a big priority for me. If the gameplay is good enough i find it easy to forget.

When it becomes a slide show obviously that isn't playable. I really doubt that will happen with TLG.

OoT was also an early 3d era game, that launched almost 20 years ago.

 

[GwyndolinCinder]

Are you guys fucking around with this 20 fps shit, cause ive read some crazy stuff in the xv thread, i cant tell whats a joke anymore.

 

[More_Badass]

How is 15 FPS acceptable? Anything below 30 is extremely hard to play for me.

Completely unacceptable, especially for a game designed for last gen hardware and in development for 8 years.

It's playable for me. That's what matters (for me)

And no, that notion is wrong. It was designed for last gen hardware...that was absolutely unable to handle it. So saying "but it started as a PS3 game" really doesn't mean anything

 

[silva1991]

Pointing out, only FEW areas chug, not the whole game. Game on average runs between 25 and 30

Good.

 

[More_Badass]

Agree to disagree. Still not sure how those videos prove any of your points. :shrug:

I guess I just didn't get what Ico was going for. But I can't help feel that everytime people mention they dislike an aspect of any Team Ico games, some users here can't help but defend what otherwise would be considered flaws in other games.

He touches on the controls and how the animations influence them

Consider, would DMC feel and play the same if the animation were as slow as Souls? Speed of animations absolutely influences the controls

 

[SomTervo]

Is this a joke?

Once you understand how your controls influence an on-screen character it's easy to compensate for animation matching or slow controls. This means every game can have its own feel, which may be more relevant to the pace or story/character. It's a pity if you don't like it but it doesn't necessarily mean the controls are "objectively" bad.

Not every game has to be MGSV.

Good design is still what prevails - for instance RDR's and GTA IV's controls can be infuriating because of how they designed the character turning animations.

 

[DangerMouse]

Alright so I'm about 3 or 4 hours into the game so far. Still think I'm pretty much at the beginning because I've taken it pretty slow. First off, the game is beautiful, Toriko moves amazingly, the boy does as well. I don't think I've ever seen ragdoll physics like this. I feel down a cliffside and the way the boy bounced around on the rocks was eerily realistic and a bit disturbing. Love the way Trico moves and acts like an animal. He is a bit stubborn, so you'll need a bit of patience with this game. The puzzles are also spectacular even at this early stage. Everything feels organic, like the solutions aren't spelled out to you and it feels less like a straight up puzzle-to-puzzle type game but something that flows way more naturally.

So generally positive so far. Feels like an Ueda game and the atmosphere is incredible. I'm a bit put off by the camera control, especially in tight areas. They seem to solve some of it by just making the screen fade to back if the camera goes awry, but moments like this are few and far between (so far). You can change the camera control speed in the options to help a bit, but it still feels off. The controls, as many would expect, are a bit janky. I've only really had some frustration at times with climbing Trico.

But yeah, from the first few hours, the game opens with a unique mechanic I haven't seen in any previews yet, and a bit more in-your-face storytelling than what I'm typically used to in an Ueda game (still subtle though). I can't wait to dive back in and keep going forward. Might take a bit because I love just petting Trico so much haha.

If anyone has any questions let me know. OH and also, there are, as of now, no ps4pro options in the menus that I can see. Might be automatic?

Can't wait.

 

[MazeHaze]

Are you guys fucking around with this 20 fps shit, cause ive read some crazy stuff in the xv thread, i cant tell whats a joke anymore.

Apparently as long as it runs at least 15 FPS it's perfectly fine, because an N64 game from two decades ago did it, so no one should care.

 

[KevinG]

I just want a Pro patch that makes the game run at a smooth frame rate throughout.

 

[SomTervo]

Apparently as long as it runs at least 15 FPS it's perfectly fine, because an N64 game from two decades ago did it, so no one should care.

Yeah, that's exactly what i said.

Good reading.

 

[Asriel]

He touches on the controls and how the animations influence them

Consider, would DMC feel and play the same if the animation were as slow as Souls? Speed of animations absolutely influences the controls

Fair enough. But feel and play for Shadow of the Colossus just isn't there, despite the slower more deliberate animations. I've never had these kid of issues with Dark Souls controls, despite it being a slower game.

 

[Lionel Richie]

Apparently as long as it runs at least 15 FPS it's perfectly fine, because an N64 game from two decades ago did it, so no one should care.

That argument is also kind of senseless considering the contemporary 3DS remake fixes most of the FPS issues with the game.

 

[MazeHaze]

It's playable for me. That's what matters (for me)

And no, that notion is wrong. It was designed for last gen hardware...that was absolutely unable to handle it. So saying "but it started as a PS3 game" really doesn't mean anything

8 years in development means something though, and it's not like this game is a graphical showpiece.

 

[SomTervo]

Fair enough. But feel and play for Shadow of the Colossus just isn't there, despite the slower more deliberate animations. I've never had these kid of issues with Dark Souls controls, despite it being a slower game.

Dark Souls doesn't prioritise movement animations at all. (Attack ones i guess so.) Team Ico games definitely do.

 

[GIANKRATOS]

As long as it's 15 FPS or up it's fine? What the fuck am i even reading.


Edit: These performance impressions are extremely disappointing. I guess I'll hold off and hope for a patch.

He's saying that for HIM(/HER? lol) low fps are fine. It doesn't hurt his personal enjoyment of a game, he's not saying it's something objective and others should feel the same way. I think he was pretty clear.

 

[Ridley327]

Sucks to hear that there are framerate problems on a regular PS4. I really could not appreciate SotC until the HD version, since the framerate was just so detrimental to the gameplay on the PS2. That's why I've always been more of an Ico guy, since that's always been solid in the performance department.

 

[Unknown?]

I like my controls to be snappy and precise.

And regardless of the intention, controls can be bad.

Is this a joke? Because you don't like it, it means they are bad controls? Lol

 

[ironcreed]

People worried about the performance should just watch some of the footage on Youtube. What I have seen makes it seem to play great. A few dips here and there would not even make me blink.

 

[Newtype-001]

oh, its a lot worse than witcher 3 (pre-october 2015 patch). the swamp area (locked 20 fps before the patch) felt smoother and more responsive than most areas here.

I was mostly referring to end game wild hunt with the ice lake battle. That area was worse than anything that came before it even the swamp. Is it as bad as that? Disappointed if it is.

 

[MrHoot]

To put it very simple for people on the fence:

If you were fine playing Shadow of the Colossus on the ps2, you'll be fine playing this.

If not, wait for a sale or get a rental. Or if you're loaded, get a pro.

Personally, the overall experience (music, setting, spectacular AI) leverages well against the so-so performance. Controls I don't mind because I think it fits the overall design that team ICO always went for, but it not might be everyone's cup of tea

 

[Dascu]

Not at all..

You should watch this.

Thanks, bookmarked for future reference.

 

[More_Badass]

8 years in development means something though, and it's not like this game is a graphical showpiece.

Not 8 in development because the game was on hold for several times, and just because the game isn't Uncharted 4 doesn't mean it isn't a technical heavyweight

The areas where the framedrops are feature hundreds of individual feathers, blades of grass, Trico's dynamic AI and animations, the fact that Trico is a big moving collision mesh that you can climb around on (like Shadow of the Colossus)

Simultaneously

 

[Ostinatto]

So the game has several Blightown areas?

 

[SomTervo]

OoT was also an early 3d era game, that launched almost 20 years ago.

Cool, reading one sentence of a ten-sentence post. I like it.

 

[Asriel]

Is this a joke? Because you don't like it, it means they are bad controls? Lol

Yes, it's called an opinion. Using an adjective to express my thoughts about a certain aspect of a game.

 

[MrHoot]

So the game has several Blightown areas?

Mostly blighttown "enclaves", not entire areas. Most of the game runs fine but sometimes you'll get in a little outside place which is meant to be more about getting a breather, and the framerate noticeably dips there. Once you're back inside to continue the game, gets back to normal

 

[MazeHaze]

Not 8 in development because the game was on hold for several times, and just because the game isn't Uncharted 4 doesn't mean it isn't a technical heavyweight

The areas where the framedrops are feature hundreds of individual feathers, blades of grass, Trico's dynamic AI and animations, the fact that Trico is a big moving collision mesh that you can climb around on (like Shadow of the Colossus)

Simultaneously

Plenty of games do all of this and more and manage to keep a stable framerate.

The game seems to just be poorly optimized.

 

[ethomaz]

To put it very simple for people on the fence:

If you were fine playing Shadow of the Colossus on the ps2, you'll be fine playing this.

If not, wait for a sale or get a rental. Or if you're loaded, get a pro.

Personally, the overall experience (music, setting, spectacular AI) leverages well against the so-so performance. Controls I don't mind because I think it fits the overall design that team ICO always went for, but it not might be everyone's cup of tea

Seems to be a good summary from what I read.

 

[DangerMouse]

People worried about the performance should just watch some of the footage on Youtube. What I have seen makes it seem to play great. A few dips here and there would not even make me blink.

This. People pushing their own narratives based on only a couple of dips.

Plenty of games do all of this and more and manage to keep a stable framerate.

The game seems to just be poorly optimized.

No they don't.

 

[More_Badass]

Yes, it's called an opinion.

The two aren't aren't mutual. You not liking something doesn't mean it's bad.

Case in point, The Thing and The Shining got overall bad reviews when they came out. Doesn't change the fact that those movies are expertly crafted

 

[SomTervo]

Plenty of games do all of this and more and manage to keep a stable framerate.

The game seems to just be poorly optimized.

Considering how ambitious the AI and shaders seem to be, they must have optimised it like hell to get it to any level of stability at all.

Here's hoping they can do a lot with patches.

 

[Unknown?]

Yes, it's called an opinion. Using an adjective to express my thoughts about a certain aspect of a game.

Just say you don't like it and call it a day instead of using absolute statements that speak for others then. You call someone's opinion a joke then imply your opinion is the only that matters. Maybe to you but not everyone shares that sentiment.

 

[GIANKRATOS]

Plenty of games do all of this and more and manage to keep a stable framerate.

The game seems to just be poorly optimized.

Like?

 

[Mifune]

SotC framerate on PS2 bothered me quite a bit. The same deal here is...disappointing. Hope there's another patch!

Regardless I'll be playing on Tuesday.

 

[Lionel Richie]

If you were fine playing Shadow of the Colossus on the ps2, you'll be fine playing this.

If not, wait for a sale or get a rental. Or if you're loaded, get a pro.

This is why I always hated the Pro and what it means for the industry. You're not going to get better games with it, you're going to get unplayable games without it. Not saying TLG is unplayable by any means, but I have 0 doubts this scenario will pop up in the future.

 

[ethomaz]

Plenty of games do all of this and more and manage to keep a stable framerate.

The game seems to just be poorly optimized.

Are there are so much CPU being used... more than others games due all the physics needs to Trico and environment.

Everything on Trico looks to be dynamic... AI, moviments, feathers, animation, etc... it is not a basic character like others games do.

So can you show me witch other games do that???

 

[Asriel]

The two aren't aren't mutual. You not liking something doesn't make it bad.

Case in point, The Thing and The Shining got overall bad reviews when they came out. Doesn't change the fact that those movies are expertly crafted

Isn't this obvious? Describing something as bad should never be seen as an objective statement.

 

[Mr. Hyde]

Not an excuse. I just find 15FPS and up good and playable, for any game

I'm the same way. I'd prefer 30 but for some reason it hasn't ever bothered me. Sotc's framerate never irritated me.

 

[S1kkZ]

it just loaded a new patch. lets see what it does...

 

[MrHoot]

This is why I always hated the Pro and what it means for the industry. You're not going to get better games with it, you're going to get unplayable games without it. Not saying TLG is unplayable by any means, but I have 0 doubts this scenario will pop up in the future.

Completely agree with that. I was pretty adamantly against the concept of "mid-gen console upgrades" because I felt that the excuse of getting just regular performance on it to justify its purchase would crop up quickly.

I expected the performance to not be great anyway on Last Guardian as I know team ico was never really good at it so i'm "okay" with it but this particular point still miffs me. Not that it's unplayable, like you said, but I really hope it doesn't set a precedent of sony just kinda flunking their exclusives on the OG to justify "acceptable" perf on the pro

 

[Unknown?]

it just loaded a new patch. lets see what it does...

1.02?

 

[ethomaz]

it just loaded a new patch. lets see what it does...

1.02???

Can you share the description???

 

[Guymelef]

it just loaded a new patch. lets see what it does...

can you post patch notes?

 

[More_Badass]

it just loaded a new patch. lets see what it does...

Are you on a regular PS4 or Pro?

 

[S1kkZ]

1.02, yes. 174,2 mb.
regular ps4.

"minor improvements and issues fixed" (translated from german.).

 

[Asriel]

1.02, yes. 174,2 mb.
regular ps4.

"minor improvements and issues fixed" (translated from german.).

Hmm . . .

 

[ethomaz]

1.02, yes. 174,2 mb.
regular ps4.

"minor improvements and issues fixed" (translated from german.).

Interesting.

 

[S1kkZ]

did nothing to the framerate. at least, nothing that i could notice.

 

[Ostinatto]

did nothing to the framerate. at least, nothing that i could notice.

 

[astroturfing]

i fucking KNEW it, i told all of you but you wouldn't listen when i prophesized the framerate dips. you told me master Ueda could handle it if given enough dev time (and a brand new console!), you tried to sway me, but i stayed true to my conviction. a few others did as well, you know who you are.. (shout out to jett!)

this is a framerate farce of truly epic proportions, and those of us who were ignored for YEARS now demand the respect we are owed, for showing the way despite being brutally ridiculed online by zealous Team Ico proponents. who's crazy now huh?