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[Laeth]

First off I don't think anyone said that writing doesn't matter in games. And secondly you may not need experience in other elements of game design but very few studios actually hire narrative designers, an exception would be Bioware, but even they look for an immense amount of writing experience before they would even consider you.

Most studios that I have worked for, the designers come up with the plot lines, and will hire external Hollywood types to contribute and create the dialog.

Pretty much spot on.

 

[prodystopian]

Hardware programming? Are you good at assembler? Companies will jump all over you if you know assembler. Low level optimization skills are still very much in demand. I learned a small amount of ASM in college and had it on my resume and I got asked about it at every game job interview I went in for.

If you want to do something else programming wise I suggest getting a copy of Programming Interviews Exposed and see how you feel about the C++/OOP related questions. If you can answer them easily then you probably know enough to get through the interview phase.

In my experience as someone trying to get in the industry they will want to see that you have a passion not just for games, but for PROGRAMMING games. Having hobby game programming experience will go a really long way in your favor.

I do VHDL. I don't think my company does any assembler work. I'll look into that book, and thanks for the info.

What would you recommend for trying "hobby game programming"? If I start looking into modding a game I like, should I be able to find the resources to do something like this?

 

[MC Safety]

But let's say your goals are as ambitious as wanting to script or work on story. Writing is a pretty universal skill, and you could apply it to a number of jobs in the industry. You could do technical writing for manuals, write strategy guides, work in PR churning out fact sheets, or work in games journalism churning out fact sheets churned out by PR, just in different words.

Wow, someone doesn't like game journalists.

I'll tell you something. It's not an absolutely terrible path for people who eventually want to write games. I know some very talented editors who went on to write games.

EDIT: And I'd be remiss if I didn't suggest that other editors and writers have gone on to production, marketing, and community management jobs at game developers/publishers.

 

["God's Beard!"]

ooh ohh! what about me? Can I work in the videogame industry?

I'm an illustrator proficient in traditional art mediums, photoshop and painter, a certified engineer that can work with a variety of drafting and architectural programs, and I'm a multiple award-winning computer animator. Also, I really like to write and storyboard, and I think I have some great game ideas that haven't been tried out yet.

do I gots what it takes?

Spoiler

too bad I want to be a sculptor

 

[ari]

Devry have an excellent gaming program. NO JOKE. Seriously, if you want to atleast get interviewed and show companies your ideas and stories, that is a trade school you should look into. Also, you should know that in your senior or last year at devry, it is mandatory to develop a small indie pc game with your class as a whole, so 15 or more of you will develop a game. They also have online courses.

oh, and i should also mention that vivendi(blizzard) have a deal going on with devry. They support most school projects by entering them into contests and such.

 

[Ken Masters]

I've been playing video games for 18 of my 23.5 years. Could I get a job in the video game industry?

it's one thing to want to be an accountant and say you have been balancing companies money for 18 years to but playing video games for 100 years 24hrs a days means jack shit in the video game industry

 

[bluemax]

I do VHDL. I don't think my company does any assembler work. I'll look into that book, and thanks for the info.

What would you recommend for trying "hobby game programming"? If I start looking into modding a game I like, should I be able to find the resources to do something like this?

There's plenty out there on Quake, Source, and Unreal Modding so I'm sure you could jump into one of those fairly easy. XNA is another freely available avenue with lots of support and start up resources. A lot of my coworkers do it in their spare time even.

I don't really have any good book recommendations on that end I'm afraid, everything I've tried as far as intro books felt like a slower, crappier refresher of things I learned in school. The only one I sort of like is this one:

http://books.google.com/books?hl=en...0ncjLk&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=3&ct=result

Although it requires some experience in C++ programming before hand.

You could also hit up some Indie gaming sites when you get a comfort level. Maybe pop by TIGsource and find a project to work on.

 

[NemesisPrime]

So, yeah, I'm thinking about a job in the games industry. I really can't program, but I can write stories, articles and memos very well. And of course, I've been playing video games for 18 of my 23.5 years. Could I get a job in the video game industry? If so, where? Any good places to look at besides Gamasutra? Help me here, I'm at a crossroads...

I think asking this on NeoGAF automatically excludes you from having a job in the games industry.

 

[bradido]

Many people say they want to make games and "they have great ideas." If you want to stand out from the thousands of people that bleat to every professional they meet, have the motivation and self-discipline to actually follow through on your ideas and make a finished product.

People ask me all the time how to get a job making games. My reply is, "Make games. There is nothing stopping you." Or if the person is a jackass I will tell them, "You don't really want to make games or you would have already made one."

Your first game can be in Flash, Game Maker or a MOD. Even a paper game will display your understanding of games and your discipline to make a finished product.

 

[Torquill]

Writing matters, but there are fewer postions and only the best are going to get hired. My point was that you weren't going to be hired entry level for writier, cause such a position doesn't really exist. You have to prove your writing elsewehre (like you said, far more elegantly than I )

 

[noonche]

Many people say they want to make games and "they have great ideas." If you want to stand out from the thousands of people that bleat to every professional they meet, have the motivation and self-discipline to actually follow through on your ideas and make a finished product.

People ask me all the time how to get a job making games. My reply is, "Make games. There is nothing stopping you." Or if the person is a jackass I will tell them, "You don't really want to make games or you would have already made one."

Your first game can be in Flash, Game Maker or a MOD. Even a paper game will display your understanding of games and your discipline to make a finished product.

Or at work on something related to games. You need some proof to back up who you say you are, and unfortunately a college degree isn't enough anymore. I did programming work for a military simulation in addition to focusing on graphics in my master's.

 

[Mercutio]

Anyways, the game dev school itself won't necessarily prepare you for anything. Your portfolio has to be genuinely impressive; in other words, don't be this guy. And you shouldn't screw up at the interview. (For example, if you get an interview at EA Canada and you tell them you hate sports games... well, hell. Why did you waste everyone's time?)

That "portfolio" is absolutely amazing. In particular, I like the "work time" listed for each model. 4 hours on the sink huh? I didn't know you were supposed to include the amount of time between modeling and surfacing that you got drunk and made offensive phone calls to neighbors. I've been doing it all wrong, apparently.

 

[Iaido Sword]

You go to USC? Fight On!

Oh wait you go to one of those game design paper mills. Yeah good luck with that one.

LOL!

I have an EA Lead modeler teaching me Maya.

I have the Hothead Studio Lead Designer teaching me about game design.

I'm connected with the game industry as I know all these industry leaders.

I'm in the game just by being a student there.

 

[Reilly]

LOL!

I have an EA Lead modeler teaching me Maya.

I have the Hothead Studio Lead Designer teaching me about game design.

I'm connected with the game industry as I know all these industry leaders.

I'm in the game just by being a student there.

oh dear....

 

[Laeth]

LOL!

I have an EA Lead modeler teaching me Maya.

I have the Hothead Studio Lead Designer teaching me about game design.

I'm connected with the game industry as I know all these industry leaders.

I'm in the game just by being a student there.

But do you have a porfolio better than everyone elses and natural talent?

 

[Iaido Sword]

But do you have a porfolio better than everyone elses and natural talent?

You build your portfolio at that school.

They give you almost a year with other students in the other fields of art animation, sound effects, modeling, programming, and with those students, you create a team that works on a game. You make a game with the industry leaders behind your back and you make your portfolio happen in front of their eyes using their standards.

 

[Mercutio]

I'm in the game just by being a student there.

I was unaware that "drinking the kool aid" was a full 3 credit course there.

You build your portfolio at that school.

They give you almost a year with other students in the other fields of art animation, sound effects, modeling, programming, and with those students, you create a team that works on a game. You make a game with the industry leaders behind your back and you make your portfolio happen in front of their eyes using their standards.

I don't see you answering his question though.

 

[Laeth]

You build your portfolio at that school.

They give you almost a year with other students in the other fields of art animation, sound effects, modeling, programming, and with those students, you create a team that works on a game. You make a game with the industry leaders behind your back and you make your portfolio happen in front of their eyes using their standards.

Well that's a yes then. Not trying to put your school down, don't worry .

 

[Iaido Sword]

I was unaware that "drinking the kool aid" was a full 3 credit course there.

I don't see you answering his question though.

He's asking the wrong question because everyone who comes out of there has a game under their wing as the portfolio, and there is no natural talent to being a developer.

I'm getting what a lot of other people won't get by doing their MODs or whatever games. I get to show off my abilities directly to the industry leaders. At my school, EA, Radical (Activision Blizzard), Relic (THQ), Rockstar Vancouver (Take2), and many more smaller studios are working with the school as instructors and guidance on what they want to see from the students.

Getting to know how the industry works and letting the industry know how you work is as important as the portfolio.

 

[Alski]

He's asking the wrong question because everyone who comes out of there has a game under their wing as the portfolio, and there is no natural talent to being a developer.

You should tell your teachers from EA, Radical, Relic, and Rockstar Vancouver that and let us know how it goes.

For the record, if you don't have talent you wont last a year, and with an attitude like that you wont last an interview.

Good Luck.

 

[Iaido Sword]

You should tell your teachers from EA, Radical, Relic, and Rockstar Vancouver that and let us know how it goes.

For the record, if you don't have talent you wont last a year, and with an attitude like that you wont last an interview.

Good Luck.

Lol, they'll tell you that there is no talent.
They'll tell you that the brilliant geniuses that don't do the work get the McDonald's jobs in the end.

It's all about social networking and hard work.

And guess what, most of them came out of that school.

 

[Zoe]

and there is no natural talent to being a developer.

...

...

...

..................


ohhhhhkaaaaaay...

 

[Mr Killemgood]

Random VG job-related question:

Does anyone have a rough idea on what Microsoft pays to be a higher-level employee for their gaming division? Not a manager but close. I might be getting interviewed for a position with them, and was wondering that.

 

[Iaido Sword]

Random VG job-related question:

Does anyone have a rough idea on what Microsoft pays to be a higher-level employee for their gaming division? Not a manager but close. I might be getting interviewed for a position with them, and was wondering that.

That is what the interview is for. You ask them about it.

 

[Mercutio]

He's asking the wrong question because everyone who comes out of there has a game under their wing as the portfolio, and there is no natural talent to being a developer.

I'm getting what a lot of other people won't get by doing their MODs or whatever games. I get to show off my abilities directly to the industry leaders. At my school, EA, Radical (Activision Blizzard), Relic (THQ), Rockstar Vancouver (Take2), and many more smaller studios are working with the school as instructors and guidance on what they want to see from the students.

Getting to know how the industry works and letting the industry know how you work is as important as the portfolio.

It's amazing that someone who has so many "connections" to the game industry can be so disconnected from it.

Point blank pal: if your portfolio work, and I mean the sheer nuts and bolts of it (modeling, surfacing, rigging, scripting, etc) isn't up to par or better, you simply will not end up doing what you want in the long run. I've strung freelance jobs for quite some time and done well without showing people a reel, but I certainly keep one ready in case I need it.

A well rounded WORKING artist in any kind of CG has the correct balance of skillset and connection. Never forget that.

 

[Vustadumas]

It all comes down to talent and how much you want it. Look for start-ups in your area. Start-ups have a better chance at giving you a shot, as long as you have some sort of qualification (degree or some experience).

QA departments can get your foot in the door, but then you're going to have a lot of competition. So like I said, it comes down to talent, and how much you want it. We've had a lot of QA move up to dev here, so it is a possibility.

 

[Iaido Sword]

It's amazing that someone who has so many "connections" to the game industry can be so disconnected from it.

Point blank pal: if your portfolio work, and I mean the sheer nuts and bolts of it (modeling, surfacing, rigging, scripting, etc) isn't up to par or better, you simply will not end up doing what you want in the long run. I've strung freelance jobs for quite some time and done well without showing people a reel, but I certainly keep one ready in case I need it.

A well rounded WORKING artist in any kind of CG has the correct balance of skillset and connection. Never forget that.

Huh?

So what makes you think students that come out of the Art Institute are slackers with only basic abilities?

And no, an art generalist is not the only way to get into the industry.

It all comes down to talent and how much you want it. Look for start-ups in your area. Start-ups have a better chance at giving you a shot, as long as you have some sort of qualification (degree or some experience).

QA departments can get your foot in the door, but then you're going to have a lot of competition. So like I said, it comes down to talent, and how much you want it. We've had a lot of QA move up to dev here, so it is a possibility.

What's with this talent bullshit.

 

[M3wThr33]

I'm a DigiPen grad. Now I work at THQ.

DigiPen is fine, but you have to EARN your degree. If you can graduate, you'll be fine, but you have to work your ass off to do it.

 

[Reilly]

Pretty good site

http://www.gamedevmap.com/

 

[Totz]

Pretty good site

http://www.gamedevmap.com/

Pretty cool site, thanks for sharing.

Game developing Gaffers, at your company, what are the chances that the game designer will have to write the game script as well? I'd kill to be able to do both, but seeing as I lack programming skills, that might not be possible.

 

[Apenheul]

Hmm, I'm not a story-writer but if I'd really want to write stories for games I think I would create a portfolio of stories for games in which the execution is really experimental and different (so definately no cutscenes or NPCs with repeating text). It can be really simple flash games, maybe even mockup trailers or storyboards. At the NLGD game developer conference I met this guy who wrote the stories for Ghost Recon Advanced Warfighter and heroes of might and magic titles (www.jeffspock.com) he had quite a few interesting thoughts IMO. Just look if writing stories for games is what you really want, it's quite different from novels or movies with what you can and can't do.

 

[Iaido Sword]

Pretty cool site, thanks for sharing.

Game developing Gaffers, at your company, what are the chances that the game designer will have to write the game script as well? I'd kill to be able to do both, but seeing as I lack programming skills, that might not be possible.

Designers don't need to know programming.

You may need to know scripting as you need to know how to do things with the engine that the programmers build, but designers aren't always programmers.

 

[RiZ III]

the negative is that eeeevvverryone in computer science wants to get into games

I never found that to be true. I had quite a few friends in comp sci programs, no one was really interested in game development as a profession.

 

[blame space]

I want to be a games journalist.

 

[prodystopian]

That is what the interview is for. You ask them about it.

No. You don't ask about pay at an interview. You ask about pay after you've gotten an offer.

 

[beat]

Random VG job-related question:

Does anyone have a rough idea on what Microsoft pays to be a higher-level employee for their gaming division? Not a manager but close. I might be getting interviewed for a position with them, and was wondering that.

No, not off the top of my head. But I've actually found payscale.com wasn't bad for similar salary info. Couldn't hurt to give it a try.

See also the Gamasutra salary survey from April (numbers also listed here, except converted to pounds and without any region-specific data.)

Also, yeah, prodystopian is right. You don't generally ask about salary at an interview. But they will try to feel you out on that before they make you an offer, so you should (1) be vague, and (2) be informed about what you should expect, and (3) know your worth.

 

[Laeth]

What's with this talent bullshit.

Because that's pretty much all that counts? In such a competitive industry, developers have enough applicants to be picky about who they hire - so of course they will hire the candidate who can do the job the best (as long as they aren't socially inept or something).

How many students are on your course?

 

[Laeth]

Pretty cool site, thanks for sharing.

Game developing Gaffers, at your company, what are the chances that the game designer will have to write the game script as well? I'd kill to be able to do both, but seeing as I lack programming skills, that might not be possible.

As stated above, you don't need any programming knowledge per-se (although it helps, just like any knowledge of animation, modelling etc. can help), but it helps to know a scripting language (even then, scripting is so damn easy that you could probably pick it up within a couple of weeks).

 

[Crazymoogle]

You'd be surprised how many vancouver game developers are reading this thread.:lol

 

[Totz]

As stated above, you don't need any programming knowledge per-se (although it helps, just like any knowledge of animation, modelling etc. can help), but it helps to know a scripting language (even then, scripting is so damn easy that you could probably pick it up within a couple of weeks).

I'll try to see if I can relearn some C stuff to move on to C++, and should I bother with Lua too?

 

[FabCam]

As many have already said, you need to make something. A mod, a mini game, a flash game whatever. Just show that you're dedicated and can actually produce something.

I'm currently trying to learn how to program as I want to get a job in gaming. You just need to be dedicated, get experience and enjoy what you do.

 

[Askia47]

Fullsail perhaps? They have alot of stuff going on there.

 

[Laeth]

I'll try to see if I can relearn some C stuff to move on to C++, and should I bother with Lua too?

Lua is a common scripting language; so if you want to become a designer then yes... you should .

 

[FabCam]

Seeing as this thread is full of devs:

What's the best language for making a small game (ie. 2D side scroller or basic 3D)? I'm looking at C# and C++. Which is easier to use for a beginner?

 

[Iaido Sword]

Because that's pretty much all that counts? In such a competitive industry, developers have enough applicants to be picky about who they hire - so of course they will hire the candidate who can do the job the best (as long as they aren't socially inept or something).

How many students are on your course?

For those specifically in the game design program, about seven.

Those who tried were weeded out at the first semester.

You'd be surprised how many vancouver game developers are reading this thread.:lol

BishopTL one of them? =P

 

[Totz]

Lua is a common scripting language; so if you want to become a designer then yes... you should .

Good to know. The guys who created it are professors at my university, so I'll see if I can talk to them or something.

 

[Cromulent_Word]

Huh?

So what makes you think students that come out of the Art Institute are slackers with only basic abilities?

And no, an art generalist is not the only way to get into the industry.

What's with this talent bullshit.

not that i really care, but you do realize that many of the people you are being confrontational with actually work (or have worked) in the games industry, some for a long time. Some even in positions where they actually do hiring.

most people with experience (and wisdom) understand that there is no way to guarantee a job in games beyond talent, infallible motivation and a lot of luck.

Not sure why i felt the need to write this, beyond the fact that i feel anyone resting on a 'guarantee' for a way into games is in for a rude awakening.

 

[Torquill]

Game developing Gaffers, at your company, what are the chances that the game designer will have to write the game script as well? I'd kill to be able to do both, but seeing as I lack programming skills, that might not be possible.

We don't have any full time designers and I've been in charge of most of the writing, for better or worse.

 

[XiaNaphryz]

not that i really care, but you do realize that many of the people you are being confrontational with actually work (or have worked) in the games industry, some for a long time. Some even in positions where they actually do hiring.

Sshhh!

 

[BreakyBoy]

Seeing as this thread is full of devs:

What's the best language for making a small game (ie. 2D side scroller or basic 3D)? I'm looking at C# and C++. Which is easier to use for a beginner?

Not a dev but:

C# is essentially managed code, which means you have to worry less about things like handling memory addressing. This makes it a bit easier to learn than something like C++. Also, thanks to XNA it's become much more viable. I'd go with C#, and if you find you enjoy programming, learn C++ in an effort to get used to switching between languages and libraries as often as you need to. In CS, that's kind of the basic rule. Everything is always changing. It's your job to keep up.