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The Official Headphone Thread 2.5: We're Making WAVs and Catching FLAC

Did end up getting the denon AH-MM400.

EQLGCqg.jpg


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Really like them, although I wish they sat a bit tighter to my head. But think I need an amp for my phone now. It's just a bit too quiet for what I like.
 

K.Jack

Knowledge is power, guard it well
I heard the FA-011 LE they came out alleviated a lot of the treble peakiness of the original though, too bad that's fucking impossible to find.

Tbh I could do with some peakiness. Everything I have is very laid back and polite in that region.

They got back to me pretty quickly. It's $229 AUD for the set and $40 AUD for the shipping.

I feel like the exchange rate is going to fuck me over.

Anyone know if paying in AUD vs USD is good or bad?
 

Antiwhippy

the holder of the trombone
Tbh I could do with some peakiness. Everything I have is very laid back and polite in that region.

They got back to me pretty quickly. It's $229 AUD for the set and $40 AUD for the shipping.

I feel like the exchange rate is going to fuck me over.

Anyone know if paying in AUD vs USD is good or bad?

Uh, it's pretty good isn't it? 0.7 usd buys you 1 aud.
 

Chittagong

Gold Member
Read that post and missed it the first time. It may be a longshot, but hoping Schiit surprises us with a Modi multibit at some point soon.

That whole post from Jason left me salivating so much hahaha. Count me among the ones that can't wait until those new products are revealed!!!!

That product that has the potential to change the desktop landscape intrigues me so much. It's been a WIP since 2012, wow.

Product speculation:

'Desktop' and 'something they said they wouldn't do' is an integrated DAC/Amp. It could be 'small' too. It kinda flies against their philosophy of upgradeability, by isolating functionality to discrete devices. But then again, their low end (Modi/Magni) were never upgradeabile to begin with. So that'd sort of make sense. A small, powered box acting as a DAC and Amp to your computer. Like a powered Fulla, or a combined Magni/Modi in an Aasgard shell. That would change the desktop landscape.

Proper speaker amp. I mean, Ragnarok is pretty much there. Add a remote control and maybe more switching and that's pretty much it. I think a Schiit speaker amp would clean up in the market, since the high end section of speaker amps is pure pseudoscience fuelled nonsense.

For what it's worth, I have been notified my Ragnarok and two Yggdrasils won't ship until mid/late August (after Schiit Show?). So they might be seeing replacements. They're citing 'component shortages'.
 
Product speculation:

'Desktop' and 'something they said they wouldn't do' is an integrated DAC/Amp. It could be 'small' too. It kinda flies against their philosophy of upgradeability, by isolating functionality to discrete devices. But then again, their low end (Modi/Magni) were never upgradeabile to begin with. So that'd sort of make sense. A small, powered box acting as a DAC and Amp to your computer. Like a powered Fulla, or a combined Magni/Modi in an Aasgard shell. That would change the desktop landscape.

Proper speaker amp. I mean, Ragnarok is pretty much there. Add a remote control and maybe more switching and that's pretty much it. I think a Schiit speaker amp would clean up in the market, since the high end section of speaker amps is pure pseudoscience fuelled nonsense.

For what it's worth, I have been notified my Ragnarok and two Yggdrasils won't ship until mid/late August (after Schiit Show?). So they might be seeing replacements. They're citing 'component shortages'.

I kinda agree with your speculation. Jason said in other post that sometimes you need to "kill your babies", so it's pretty evident that this new product will replace at least a DAC and an Amp (I'm guessing the cheapest ones).

Regarding the speakers pre/amps, they will have a remote (confirmed by Jason), he also mentioned they will deliver tons of power. I'm guessing they'll be 100/150 W @ 8 Ohms to 200/300 at 4 Ohms.

Yggdrasil's shortage is most probably due to Schiit not being able to get all the Analog Device DACs they need. In another post by Alex (IIRC) he said they aren't produced in large quantities and even after looking at literally every supplier, they just can't get all what they need.
 

LQX

Member
I do hope it is a all in one unit like the O2+ODAC. I had a Schiit Asgard 2 for awhile and wanted a DAC to accompany but I also wanted some space back on my desk so I thought about downgrading to the Magni and Modi stack but just went with the O2+ODAC combo instead because of the convenience of having a all in one unit. If it is a all in one unit hopefully they do not somehow gimp it.
 

Tommy DJ

Member
I don't see why Schiit would release a big standard speaker amplifier. Professional power amplifiers from folks like Crown and Crest Audio are already better than any audiophile power amplifier so they're wasting time in this department.

The Ragnarok isn't even that good of a speaker amp anyway. It's only remotely interesting because it can double duty as a decent headphone amp.
 
I don't see why Schiit would release a big standard speaker amplifier. Professional power amplifiers from folks like Crown and Crest Audio are already better than any audiophile power amplifier so they're wasting time in this department.

Can you elaborate about who gave Crown and Crest Audio amps the best amp ever award? I'm not being pedantic, but truly curious about your statement.

Regarding the why Schiit would release power amps, well... they think they have a new great topology that will make a difference, but more important, Jason has stated several times that the price of those product will cause a big impact. Basically, they will offer a great product at a super low price.

The Ragnarok isn't even that good of a speaker amp anyway. It's only remotely interesting because it can double duty as a decent headphone amp.

I'm pretty sure I haven't read all Ragnarok reviews, but the ones I've read has been extremely positive, so again... can you provide a link to a review that states that the amp is just meh?

Thanks! :)
 

Tommy DJ

Member
Can you elaborate about who gave Crown and Crest Audio amps the best amp ever award? I'm not being pedantic, but truly curious about your statement.

Regarding the why Schiit would release power amps, well... they think they have a new great topology that will make a difference, but more important, Jason has stated several times that the price of those product will cause a big impact. Basically, they will offer a great product at a super low price.

No one did but professional studios still use professional power amplifiers for a lot of reasons. They're robust, affordable, generally reliable, and offer control for difficult loads that you can't get from audiophile amplifiers without emptying your bank account. Older Class A/B QSC, Crest Audio, Bryston and Crown offerings are all good for instance.

The folks at SBAF are pretty pro-professional power amps over there for these reasons. Both Marv and OJNeg both use the Crest Audio CA2 (the smallest Class A/B amp) because its cheap, reliable, sounds good for home duty, has tonnes of power for anything and eats difficult loads like it was nothing. I use a rescued Bryston 2B for the same reasons. Many vintage aficionados have historically used the Yamaha P2200 for same reasons too.

Let me rephrase my statement. Good professional power amplifiers are better than any reasonably priced audiophile amplifier. And since Schiit is in the reasonably priced audiophile market, I don't see why you'd mess around in this market. And they know this as well, considering they own some Emotiva 500w power amplifiers to power some difficult to run speakers they have in their office. Affordable amplifiers with tonnes of power for 4-8ohm loads that also sound pretty good are honestly dine a dozen these days. I still don't see any point in it unless they want to relive the Theta days.

I'm pretty sure I haven't read all Ragnarok reviews, but the ones I've read has been extremely positive, so again... can you provide a link to a review that states that the amp is just meh?

Thanks! :)

As a speaker amp? According to zerodeefex, the Ragnarok sounds good with its first few watts of power but sounds harsh the more you crank it up. The review above his post flat out trashes it but the reviewer has a very insensitive bookshelf speaker that shouldn't be near the Ragnarok in the first place.

Since the KEF LS50 I demoed them with isn't a terribly efficient speaker, it'd explain why I didn't think especially highly of it now that I think about it. Its why I didn't bother with it and just got the Mjolnir 2 since the headphone out was dry with my Sennheisers and the speaker outputs weren't good enough to replace the Bryston.

BTW Jason has been very specific what this speaker amp is on SBAF. I'm putting $20 on something that doesn't overheat and go into protect mode while running 2 ohm loads from a pair of Magnepans. Its literally the only thing that would make commercial sense.
 

FoxSpirit

Junior Member
I budget offering using the new IceEdge platform would be ace. Not holding my breath though since Jason is against Class D. Such a shame, the IcePower ASX2 line sounds amazing already. Like High End Restek levels of amazing.
 
Let me rephrase my statement. Good professional power amplifiers are better than any reasonably priced audiophile amplifier. And since Schiit is in the reasonably priced audiophile market, I don't see why you'd mess around in this market. And they know this as well, considering they own some Emotiva 500w power amplifiers to power some difficult to run speakers they have in their office. Affordable amplifiers with tonnes of power for 4-8ohm loads that also sound pretty good are honestly dine a dozen these days. I still don't see any point in it unless they want to relive the Theta days.

No offense, but I'm glad Schiit guys (and other guys) don't think like you. Otherwise we (consumers) would be forced to live with zero innovation.

Again, Jason has said a lot of times they will release a new product only if they are convinced they can offer something new to the market, with great quality and at a fair price.

He said this new topology is by far the best they have created (sonics and measurements).

Time will tell if that's true or not, but so far I'm glad they're trying.

As a speaker amp? According to zerodeefex, the Ragnarok sounds good with its first few watts of power but sounds harsh the more you crank it up. The review above his post flat out trashes it but the reviewer has a very insensitive bookshelf speaker that shouldn't be near the Ragnarok in the first place.

Since the KEF LS50 I demoed them with isn't a terribly efficient speaker, it'd explain why I didn't think especially highly of it now that I think about it. Its why I didn't bother with it and just got the Mjolnir 2 since the headphone out was dry with my Sennheisers and the speaker outputs weren't good enough to replace the Bryston.

Thanks for the link, but man... I thought you were talking about a professional review. Just one guy complaining about it, versus the several super positive reviews.

I mean... I'm pretty sure somebody out there hates Ferraris. It doesn't mean those car sucks.

I budget offering using the new IceEdge platform would be ace. Not holding my breath though since Jason is against Class D. Such a shame, the IcePower ASX2 line sounds amazing already. Like High End Restek levels of amazing.

Yep, they are totally against Class D amps, and it's confirmed there are no digital amps from Schiit in the near future.

Who knows, maybe one day they will change their minds.
 

HiResDes

Member
Crown and QSC are so cheap and plentiful in the auction market, maybe I'll try one out, this particular crown I found only seems to have XLR outputs though... So maybe not.
 

Skel1ingt0n

I can't *believe* these lazy developers keep making file sizes so damn large. Btw, how does technology work?
Got a pair of the new B&O H5s.

I bring my B&W C5s with me everywhere - great earbuds without being terribly expensive. Problem is, the wire just absolutely sucks. And using them to run is just an awful experience.

These are bluetooth with no stupid hard plastic battery cover in the middle of the wire. So much better.

Sound is decent. Very good for $250 BT IEMs - better than what I've heard from Beats and Bose. But no, not amazing. But for working out (weights, cardio, sports), I have yet to run into anything better under ~$400.

Bass is a little light. I try to avoid software equalizers - but the B&O app is surprisingly decent. You can artificially boost the bass, and it helps a lot on hip-hop and drum-heavy alternative. Highs are clean. A good bit of the mids blur together, though - hardly zero separation. About as far from "open" as my headphone selection gets.

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Azalean

Banned
Looking for the best headphones under $75 that have really good, booming bass. Most of the high end headphones don't seem have great bass from what I read in review I know next to nothing about headphones and figured this would be a good place to ask.

Thanks in advance.
 

HiResDes

Member
Looking for the best headphones under $75 that have really good, booming bass. Most of the high end headphones don't seem have great bass from what I read in review I know next to nothing about headphones and figured this would be a good place to ask.

Thanks in advance.
Creative Aurvana Live or JVC S680
 

Antiwhippy

the holder of the trombone
So Venture Electronics (Monk Plus, Zen, etc) have their own site now
https://www.veclan.com/

And my Massdrop order is, well, somewhere... :|

They got it in their warehouse now. They're just sorting it out to mail them out.

Also that website is charmingly... personal?

VE Lee definitely reminds me of a certain type that I'm all too familiar with. Not a good or bad thing, I just find it amusing.
 

Articalys

Member
So if I wanted to get a pair of over-ear headphones that can block out most general surrounding noises in an apartment setting -- footsteps from the floor above, faint music from next door through the wall, and such -- what brands should I be looking at?
Requoting my question, since it might have gotten lost near the bottom of the page.
 

Articalys

Member
Bose QC series I guess. I don't have these problems with even open headphones though as I usually just play it loud enough where outside headphones don't bother me.
Haha, I guess that would be one option.

Is Bose pretty much a get-what-you-pay-for expensive brand, or are they actually a little overpriced for their quality?
 

Antiwhippy

the holder of the trombone
You pay for their noise cancellation. Which is very good.

On SQ alone... no.

Just get a sealed headphone. Look at various offerings from sennheiser, shure and audio technica.
 
Haha, I guess that would be one option.

Is Bose pretty much a get-what-you-pay-for expensive brand, or are they actually a little overpriced for their quality?

For drowning out ambient noise in an apartment, I wouldn't recommend a noise cancelling headphone, unless you live next to a railroad or something. A nice sealed headphone should work fine.

What's your budget?
 

Tommy DJ

Member
No offense, but I'm glad Schiit guys (and other guys) don't think like you. Otherwise we (consumers) would be forced to live with zero innovation.

Again, Jason has said a lot of times they will release a new product only if they are convinced they can offer something new to the market, with great quality and at a fair price.

He said this new topology is by far the best they have created (sonics and measurements).

Time will tell if that's true or not, but so far I'm glad they're trying.

Lmao at me being the enemy of innovation. Innovation isn't reinventing the wheel. Or creating a square wheel. We have tonnes of affordable amplification with huge amounts of good quality power. A new Class A/B topology isn't exactly going to be innovative if it does the exact same thing as existing products in the market. That isn't what innovation is.

Schiit's innovation is their direct to market model that more and more manufacturers are adopting, which cuts the price gouging middle man. That and their ability to intelligently drive down costs (eg. use the chassis as a heatsink to cut on heatsink costs) allowing them to manufacturer their products in the United States using mostly Bay Area suppliers, rather than outsource to China. That's their true innovations in the audio market. R2R DACs of dubious value and real difficult to detect under a blind test if you deal with the multibit's hotter than usual outputs? Circlotron circuits that have been seen and implemented before? No, I don't think they're really true innovations but rather solutions to pretty imaginary problems.

Whatever this new topology is, I'm not going to jump on the hype train until someone passes it through actual measurements. That is, the same sort of measurements John Atkinson put the Ragnarok through that showed that the biasing algorithm Schiit uses goes to shit and produces a non-trivial amount of crossover distortion when playing sine waves.

The justification that Schiit gave that music =/= sine waves is sort of stupid unless you don't consider electronic music as music. Its just as dumb as the justification they gave over not putting any protection relays in the original Schiit Asgard.

You guys need to stop taking Schiit as the gods that will take down snake oil audiophilia. They produce affordable hardware that sounds good, unlike a lot of Chinese Hi-Fi products that used to be the alternative. I even blew a grand on a Schiit Mjolnir 2 because it was a good balanced pre-amp/headphone amp. But I'm also aware that they are the same company that claimed omitted muting relays because it made the amp sound worse. Yeah, not buying that for a second.

Thanks for the link, but man... I thought you were talking about a professional review. Just one guy complaining about it, versus the several super positive reviews.

I mean... I'm pretty sure somebody out there hates Ferraris. It doesn't mean those car sucks.

Yeah I'm going to trust Jude, who exists to peddle hardware, or Herb Reichert, who gushes at everything that comes across his desk. I can't find a professional review except from these two so I didn't link one obviously. I mean what the hell is a "professional" review these days? What Hi-Fi rag isn't basically beholden by manufacturers who give them products to review?

The measurement section of the Stereophile review is honestly concerning enough even if we take into account JA trying new measurement methods on behalf of Schiit. The Ragnarok's innovation is a complicated solution aimed at solving problems that weren't even major problems in the first place.

I linked that post/thread for a very good reason. Because the general train of thought in there is that its a good amp that sounds increasingly harsh when given something difficult to drive, whether that be a difficult set of speakers or extremely loud content. Considering all user reviews there agreed that it doesn't really handle difficult loads particularly well, which just so happen to correlate well with John Atkinson's musings and measurements from the Stereophile review, I'd like to think my claim that I thought it was nothing special to be a perfectly fair statement. Especially considering I was pairing them with relatively insensitive speakers (LS50).
 

Articalys

Member
You pay for their noise cancellation. Which is very good.

On SQ alone... no.

Just get a sealed headphone. Look at various offerings from sennheiser, shure and audio technica.
Thanks, I'll check out those companies, in combination with...
For drowning out ambient noise in an apartment, I wouldn't recommend a noise cancelling headphone, unless you live next to a railroad or something. A nice sealed headphone should work fine.

What's your budget?
...whatever your recommendations would be under $200. I'd like to get closer to $150 if possible but if the good stuff is at the upper limit, I won't be picky.

I will add that I'm no audiophile; all I need is something that can carry a wide variety of music (from rock to jazz and techno to orchestral), spoken dialogue in movies, and games equally, and doesn't sound completely terrible in doing so.
 

amardilo

Member
I'm looking at using a set of headphones and a DAC for my PC. I really like the look of the FiiO E10K.

I'd love to mount it under my desk so I can quickly plug my headphones in and out and not have the showing on the top of my desk.

Has anyone mounted something that small under their desk (my desk is something like a Malm without the pullout section I got from IKEA).
 
Lmao at me being the enemy of innovation. Innovation isn't reinventing the wheel. Or creating a square wheel. We have tonnes of affordable amplification with huge amounts of good quality power. A new Class A/B topology isn't exactly going to be innovative if it does the exact same thing as existing products in the market. That isn't what innovation is.

My point is, you were the one saying there is no use for Schiit to offer power amps, since according to you, with Crown & Crest amps we are already in a sonic nirvana.

If we follow your advice does that mean all the other manufacturers should stop trying to create new (possible better) amps?

Your statement was just silly and anti innovation, because innovation also means trying and failing.

Whatever this new topology is, I'm not going to jump on the hype train until someone passes it through actual measurements.).

Yeah, I don't see anyone here already stating those new amps are the best of the best, but quoting what Jason has said about this new topology compared to their own previous ones, and waiting until they are revealed.

I guess you missed the part where I wrote "time will tell" in my previous post.

Yeah I'm going to trust Jude, who exists to peddle hardware, or Herb Reichert, who gushes at everything that comes across his desk. I can't find a professional review except from these two so I didn't link one obviously. I mean what the hell is a "professional" review these days? What Hi-Fi rag isn't basically beholden by manufacturers who give them products to review?

I linked that post/thread for a very good reason. Because the general train of thought in there is that its a good amp that sounds increasingly harsh when given something difficult to drive, whether that be a difficult set of speakers or extremely loud content. Considering all user reviews there agreed that it doesn't really handle difficult loads particularly well, which just so happen to correlate well with John Atkinson's musings and measurements from the Stereophile review, I'd like to think my claim that I thought it was nothing special to be a perfectly fair statement. Especially considering I was pairing them with relatively insensitive speakers (LS50).

My apologies about the "professional review" part, after I posted I realized it wasn't the best term but just because of laziness I didn't change it.

What I meant is that review looked like one from just an average joe, and your statement about Ragnarok being just meh sounded to me like a fact, so I thought you were going to link a much more in deep review.

The thing is, if you take time to read every Ragnarok review available, the majority of them are extremely positive. I repeat it again, extremely positive, not like "oh this is a nice amp".

Finally, why do you mention Jude? Except for the Schiit's thread there, I don't give a rat ass about him or his site.

You mentioning him, it looks to me like a cheap shot to try to support your point of view about the amp. Again, google and look at all the reviews and then come here to tell that Ragnarok is viewed as a mediocre amp.

I guess I'm too sensitive when people post personal (valid) opinions as undisputed facts. :p

Regards :)
 

Cryst

Member
KEF M500 for 199.99 ($100 off) on Amazon US for Prime Day
if anyone is looking for a super light and portable set of on-ears
 

Booshka

Member
Just picked up some Philips SHP9500's for $65. Really enjoying them so far, had some Superlux headphones before, those were great as well, but these have better clarity and less focus on bass. Most of my music sounds much better, can focus in on every instrument more clearly now, Snarky Puppy, Terrace Martin, Progger and Hiatus Kaiyote are my current artists breaking these headphones in.
 

Tommy DJ

Member
My point is, you were the one saying there is no use for Schiit to offer power amps, since according to you, with Crown & Crest amps we are already in a sonic nirvana.

If we follow your advice does that mean all the other manufacturers should stop trying to create new (possible better) amps?

Your statement was just silly and anti innovation, because innovation also means trying and failing.

Is creating a functional square wheel innovation?

I am saying that there is no point of Schiit to release a derivative power amp that is already well served by a large number of products. If they want to innovate, they've got to do better than that.

Yeah, I don't see anyone here already stating those new amps are the best of the best, but quoting what Jason has said about this new topology compared to their own previous ones, and waiting until they are revealed.

I guess you missed the part where I wrote "time will tell" in my previous post.

Can you point out where I state that? Saying "whatever this new topology is, I'm not going to jump on the hype train until someone passes it through actual measurements" is not the same as saying "those new amps are the best of the best".

Ignoring that, the only thing I see are people believing that it will change the desktop landscape as well as take down the high end market. Which would imply being best of class no?

What I meant is that review looked like one from just an average joe, and your statement about Ragnarok being just meh sounded to me like a fact, so I thought you were going to link a much more in deep review.

The thing is, if you take time to read every Ragnarok review available, the majority of them are extremely positive. I repeat it again, extremely positive, not like "oh this is a nice amp".

The thing is, if you take time to read every Cardas cable review available, the majority of them are extremely positive. I repeat it again, extremely positive, not like "oh this is a nice cable".

Do you see how silly that statement sounds?

Finally, why do you mention Jude? Except for the Schiit's thread there, I don't give a rat ass about him or his site.

You mentioning him, it looks to me like a cheap shot to try to support your point of view about the amp. Again, google and look at all the reviews and then come here to tell that Ragnarok is viewed as a mediocre amp.

You dismiss user reviews/impressions from SBAF because they're not professional enough despite the negative review very clearly quantifying what equipment he used and what he did to achieve the negative result. Who out there is both part of the professional audiophile media and has reviewed the Schiit Ragnarok? Jude (Head-Fi) and Herb Reichert (Stereophile) are the only two I can find. Hence why I mentioned him because you stated that you were disappointed that I couldn't link a verbose negative review from a professional. I like how you pick on my mention of Jude and completely ignore poor Herb.

When I last checked, 0.5% TMD while playing Get Lucky between a range of 3 and 16Wpc is not a sign of a particularly well designed amplifier. Maybe Herb's gushing is worth more than John Atkinson's efforts but measurements don't lie here.
 
Did end up getting the denon AH-MM400.

EQLGCqg.jpg


nMmH2kT.jpg


Really like them, although I wish they sat a bit tighter to my head. But think I need an amp for my phone now. It's just a bit too quiet for what I like.

I have the exact same ones and couldn't be happier. Pretty much my only complaint is that i sweat like a whore in church when it's really hot, but I guess you can't avoid that anyway with over ears.

Bought a FiiO E10K Olympus 2 yesterday, but I still use my phone as a player because I don't have the money right now to buy a good player. Any recommendations for the future?
 
Bit on a Sennheiser 598 during the prime day thing on amazon (canada). Pretty cheap, $110 CAD. Been curious about the Sennheiser sound so I'll give it a go. I bought a pair for my dad for Christmas last year and he was very pleased with them.

So the headphone stable will become:

Denon D2000
Hifiman HE-400i
Sennheiser HD 598

Neato!
 
I was doing it by hand, yes. I don't know of any such tool, and I don't even see how it would work. If you find one let me know! I would buy such a thing in a heartbeat.
 

HiResDes

Member
Bit on a Sennheiser 598 during the prime day thing on amazon (canada). Pretty cheap, $110 CAD. Been curious about the Sennheiser sound so I'll give it a go. I bought a pair for my dad for Christmas last year and he was very pleased with them.

So the headphone stable will become:

Denon D2000
Hifiman HE-400i
Sennheiser HD 598

Neato!
I don't think there's much aside from a greater soundstage that the Sennheiser can offer in comparison to the 400i.
 
I don't think there's much aside from a greater soundstage that the Sennheiser can offer in comparison to the 400i.

Pretty much what I'm expecting. TBH my wife will probably use it more than me. But, for the price I really wanted to try it.

I listened to my dad's briefly last year and enjoyed it.
 
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