melonrabbit
Member
Was about to get my brilliant post all ready. Now my masterpiece is forever lost.
Good luck, town.
<3.
Good luck, town.
<3.
-
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The Price Is Right MAFIA edition |OT| Come on down!!!
- Thread starter Sophia
- Start date
Wait, if that's what the phone does then why did Scum NK melon?
I assumed the phone meant Item Cop and that's why they went for Melon because I don't believe she ever breadcrumbed getting the BBQ.
So...how does this relate to OA?
Or we talking 'people die' kind of drawback or 'it will be annoying' drawback?
I assumed the phone meant Item Cop and that's why they went for Melon because I don't believe she ever breadcrumbed getting the BBQ.
So...how does this relate to OA?
Or we talking 'people die' kind of drawback or 'it will be annoying' drawback?
CornBurrito
Member
Lol. Who the fuck benefits from knowing the limits of an alignment cop ability.
Hint: Not town.
StarSketch
Banned
I could have sworn I mentioned OA in that same post where I put the breadcrumb. I was deciding between checking you and Oceanic at the time I made it.
Well, it'll be annoying for me, that's for sure.
OceanicAir
Member
Seriously, lol? An indefinite alignment cop doesn't seem dubious to you with how everything else has been x-shot? Besides, the way she phrased it already made it out that she at least had one more shot. What are you even angling at? Do you want her to survive so you'll freak out tomorrow asking "why is she still alive?!?!" or would you like to know as much about it in case there are any downsides that could bite us later? This is ridiculous.
CornBurrito
Member
I disagree. I think she should have hidden that information for as long as possible.
StanleyPalmtree
Banned
y'know, if Star is town (which i think she is), then scum might not kill her, depending on how much they want to risk her future reads.
until she dies, we have no way of knowing if she really has the item, and so no way of confirming her town result of salva and sawneeks.
Star being left alive mean we are left with 3 big question marks above 3 players, which could serve scum as some pretty effective misdirection for town.
until she dies, we have no way of knowing if she really has the item, and so no way of confirming her town result of salva and sawneeks.
Star being left alive mean we are left with 3 big question marks above 3 players, which could serve scum as some pretty effective misdirection for town.
StanleyPalmtree
Banned
imma have to agree with Corn on this one,
especially given how the question was framed with a oh so innocent "just wondering"
StanleyPalmtree
Banned
No thoughts on Kalor?
sory about this, i completely missed it the frst time round.
i kinda doubt it will help now, but my thoughts at the time were pretty much "i wont vote for him, but hey knock yourself out'
OceanicAir
Member
Why? How does it help town? Saying just because isn't a reason.
StanleyPalmtree
Banned
well how does knowing about the items role help town more than scum?
its an alignment cop, its a much bigger threat to scum than town, and im sure they would love to know if they are still at risk or not.
StarSketch
Banned
Er...alright? Why are you telling us this?
Yeah, in retrospect saying how many uses I have was dumb. Not much I can do about it now I guess.
I can say it's probably for the best if scum doesn't find out my drawback, though, which I will keep hidden. Town will be safe not knowing about it.
StarSketch
Banned
Also fun fact- did you think to caclulate how much the year of service would cost and not just the phone, Kark? Because I did >.>;
CornBurrito
Member
You asked her if she was X shot and how many shots she had remaining basically.
This benefits scum:
1. They know whether or not she is safe to keep alive now.
2. Can save potential role blocks/scum PR for other people.
This benefits town:
1. ??? (Oceanic to complete)
Christina Mackenzie
Member
Are there usually both a role cop and an alignment cop in a game? I thought it was either one or the other.
StarSketch
Banned
I don't see why both wouldn't be able to be used.
they both do very specific things, and they don't exactly leak into one another's territory too badly.
they both do very specific things, and they don't exactly leak into one another's territory too badly.
OceanicAir
Member
First off I asked if was indefinite because I find it odd that she would have such an ability. You don't find that weird?
On your points:
1) It really doesn't make a difference either way, do they kill her and reveal the two people as town or do they leave her alive to do further investigations and make us question her survival (which I'd know you'd do)? And is she even anymore or less safe to keep alive or not now?
2) Is based on absolutely nothing, I could say that now that a potential tracker could look after her now instead.
How it could help us: Blindly trusting people has never been a town move and I would honestly not believe her if she said that there wasn't a drawback since that would be completely and wildly different from all of the other role powers given. The fact that you have no issues with that is unbelievable. At worst, even if she didn't have any shots and even said so, does mafia even believe her?
And again the way she phrased her post made it plenty clear that she had additional shots, how many is essentially irrelevant considering our scum lynching track record. The game might not even last that long lol
edit: regarding the two types of cops being in the game, couldn't it be possible that there could be a Godfather?
I think Role Cops are typically put in to balance out a Godfather since they are immune to alignment cops. Although it seems like the Role Cop reads Items ( since I showed up as Mason as opposed to Ordinary) so it sort of doubles as an Item Cop which is a role that would fit this games theme.
Well, it does feel nice that everyone is getting out of my way to clean my good name.
I'll be honest, I feel its weird that we get two cops of some kind one after the other, it makes me feel the scum team must be either really strong to counter the constant flow of abilities that can be used the very same night, or they are constantly contesting the same items so they can use them for themselves.
But I do think that the contestants must be random, albeit said randomness will give the advantage to town since town would likely almost always win the item just by sheer numbers.
I'll be honest, I feel its weird that we get two cops of some kind one after the other, it makes me feel the scum team must be either really strong to counter the constant flow of abilities that can be used the very same night, or they are constantly contesting the same items so they can use them for themselves.
But I do think that the contestants must be random, albeit said randomness will give the advantage to town since town would likely almost always win the item just by sheer numbers.
StanleyPalmtree
Banned
in regards to the role balance discussion.
keep in mind that these powers can go to any player, town or mafia, and that they are showing up days after the start of the game, makes them inherently less effective than a power given at the games start.
the element of chance in particular makes me think that this game was made with a very loose sense of balance in mind, so i really doubt any specific speculation on the balance of these items, and the possible powers of the scum team, will lead to any trustworthy conclusions.
tldr: lets not be distracted by the fabulous prizes, and instead play some good ole family friendly 1970's Mafia
keep in mind that these powers can go to any player, town or mafia, and that they are showing up days after the start of the game, makes them inherently less effective than a power given at the games start.
the element of chance in particular makes me think that this game was made with a very loose sense of balance in mind, so i really doubt any specific speculation on the balance of these items, and the possible powers of the scum team, will lead to any trustworthy conclusions.
tldr: lets not be distracted by the fabulous prizes, and instead play some good ole family friendly 1970's Mafia
Kill the cop in order to clear those that have been cleared by the cop. Insane idea but the only way to really be sure. OA is a 'cop' but he only gives information if the person is vanilla or not whereas SS is giving out the meaty information. I am sorry SS but by coming out to town and clearing the names ( which I am very happy about) you also took the decision to be killed (if t will be by lynch or nightkilled).
StanleyPalmtree
Banned
lynching star would probs be a waste of that lynch. she claims to be able to continue investigating, if this is true then thats a massive threat to scum, one that they would want to kill, right?
so star will likely be killed by scum tonight, which will confirm her cop status without effort on our part.
the obvious complication with this is if star doesn't die tonight. it could be because she is part of the scum team, or that scum knows we will be suspicious of her staying alive. and we wont really have any way to tell which it is.
i would say we dont lynch star today, and probably not tommorow (cross that bridge when we come to it). but if shes still alive after that, then she should have 4 alignments to confirm, which is more than worth it.
so star will likely be killed by scum tonight, which will confirm her cop status without effort on our part.
the obvious complication with this is if star doesn't die tonight. it could be because she is part of the scum team, or that scum knows we will be suspicious of her staying alive. and we wont really have any way to tell which it is.
i would say we dont lynch star today, and probably not tommorow (cross that bridge when we come to it). but if shes still alive after that, then she should have 4 alignments to confirm, which is more than worth it.
StanleyPalmtree
Banned
By the one I meant. The one lying.
What are your thoughts on this mate?
Since we now have 2 'cops' or players that had or have the ability to see the alignment or seeing if that person is vanilla or not. What do you think? How should town proceed?
Kark and Topo still have their vote in Sawneeks. Who got cleared by SS, they don't believe her and I can understand them, since this dilemma has been following for days now. I think that the only way to clear sawkneeks is to kill SS and see if she is indeed the player with that item.
Interesting. To flip StarSketch or not.
1st we need to look at the numbers aka. can we afford a mislynch. I think we are at 8-0-3. I assume the starting situation was 15-1-4 mainly because other variations seem bad. There is no evidence of a second neutral so I'll ignore that possibility for now. 16-1-3 is very harsh for scum and leaves the game open for a three day win. While it is unlikely to happen, the possibility shouldn't even get through balancing. The reverse extreme is 14-1-5, what is too much for town. Since we have a vigi in the game, this composition allows the game to end on a successful night four lynch. This is too soon based on what I've gathered from the way the games are balanced around here. 8-0-3 on day five start means the following worst-case scenario applies: 6-0-3 on day six, 4-0-3 on day seven and a scum win on day seven mislynch. We are ok for now but itd be really good to get scum killed today.
I see two options: we flip Star now or we let scum do it for us. Option one is certain, we get to know Stars alignment and we get to know how the item works, thus confirming Salva and Sawneeks for what they turn out to be. If Star flips town, Salva and Sawneeks should be town too. It wouldnt be too much to assume that scum then kill one of the confirmed townies during the night. Essentially, we skip a day forward and emerge with +1 confirmed townie onto day six (6-0-3, one townie confirmed). The downside is that we advance the worst-case scenario and are then just two mislynches away from loss. We then have two chances of hitting scum. Mislynch on day six leads into the confirmed townie kill during the night and day seven starts with 4-0-3 and nobody confirmed.
Option two is to kill someone else and force scum to kill Star. Alignment cop is a bullshit ability that cannot be left alive. If Star lives, shell either catch scum or generate more confirmed townies. Both are really bad for scum. You are now thinking: What if they keep Star alive, just like they did with OA? Star is way more dangerous and the gambit does not have that great of a upside, even if it would go well for scum. Scum kill one night five, it cant be Sawneeks or Salva because their flips would just support Stars claim. Two confirmed townies enter day six. The problem is Stars additional check, shell either catch scum or confirm a townie. Lets assume Star checks a townie, she gets lynched, scum kill one of the three confirmed townies during the night, we arrive at day seven and 4-0-3 with two confirmed townies. To compare this with option one: option one would hit the same spot with two confirmed townies less. And I did not even consider the possibility that Star catches scum with her additional check, thatd ruin everything for scum. In short I think town Star dies this night. She survives, she is scum. It is bit of a complicated thing so Id appriciate additional thoughts on this matter to see if Im thinking correctly. Godfathers and redirects could influence the situation in a unpredictable way at least, that is for sure.
1st we need to look at the numbers aka. can we afford a mislynch. I think we are at 8-0-3. I assume the starting situation was 15-1-4 mainly because other variations seem bad. There is no evidence of a second neutral so I'll ignore that possibility for now. 16-1-3 is very harsh for scum and leaves the game open for a three day win. While it is unlikely to happen, the possibility shouldn't even get through balancing. The reverse extreme is 14-1-5, what is too much for town. Since we have a vigi in the game, this composition allows the game to end on a successful night four lynch. This is too soon based on what I've gathered from the way the games are balanced around here. 8-0-3 on day five start means the following worst-case scenario applies: 6-0-3 on day six, 4-0-3 on day seven and a scum win on day seven mislynch. We are ok for now but itd be really good to get scum killed today.
I see two options: we flip Star now or we let scum do it for us. Option one is certain, we get to know Stars alignment and we get to know how the item works, thus confirming Salva and Sawneeks for what they turn out to be. If Star flips town, Salva and Sawneeks should be town too. It wouldnt be too much to assume that scum then kill one of the confirmed townies during the night. Essentially, we skip a day forward and emerge with +1 confirmed townie onto day six (6-0-3, one townie confirmed). The downside is that we advance the worst-case scenario and are then just two mislynches away from loss. We then have two chances of hitting scum. Mislynch on day six leads into the confirmed townie kill during the night and day seven starts with 4-0-3 and nobody confirmed.
Option two is to kill someone else and force scum to kill Star. Alignment cop is a bullshit ability that cannot be left alive. If Star lives, shell either catch scum or generate more confirmed townies. Both are really bad for scum. You are now thinking: What if they keep Star alive, just like they did with OA? Star is way more dangerous and the gambit does not have that great of a upside, even if it would go well for scum. Scum kill one night five, it cant be Sawneeks or Salva because their flips would just support Stars claim. Two confirmed townies enter day six. The problem is Stars additional check, shell either catch scum or confirm a townie. Lets assume Star checks a townie, she gets lynched, scum kill one of the three confirmed townies during the night, we arrive at day seven and 4-0-3 with two confirmed townies. To compare this with option one: option one would hit the same spot with two confirmed townies less. And I did not even consider the possibility that Star catches scum with her additional check, thatd ruin everything for scum. In short I think town Star dies this night. She survives, she is scum. It is bit of a complicated thing so Id appriciate additional thoughts on this matter to see if Im thinking correctly. Godfathers and redirects could influence the situation in a unpredictable way at least, that is for sure.
indeed
StanleyPalmtree
Banned
well, i mean i just said most of my thoughts about the Star situation.
the imediate point was that i dont think we should lynch star today. think its to wasteful.
how should town proceed outside of that? well thats not as obvious so i cant rightly say.
but i do know how im going to proceed.
as the last day continued i felt less of that feeling that Saw was scum, and now with Stars claim on him im sure i dont want to lynch him anymore.
VOTE:OceanicAir
i dont buy the reasoning for asking about the cop role info, and worse is the your defense afterward has felt more like a desperate attempt to save face
OceanicAir
Member
I still don't see the downside on asking about a dodgy role, in fact tell me what's wrong with it instead of again not explaining. And I'd certainly appreciate it if you'd actually tell me if you think an indefinite role cop is problematic. Also, Sawneeks is female.
Christina Mackenzie
Member
From memory we've had
* "1-shot" Mason (I use that term loosely)
* 2-shot Role cop
* 1-shot Vigilante
* 1-shot Doctor
* ∞-shot Alignment Cop
One of these things...
OceanAir, why did you specifically ask StarSketch whether she had unlimited uses or not.
* "1-shot" Mason (I use that term loosely)
* 2-shot Role cop
* 1-shot Vigilante
* 1-shot Doctor
* ∞-shot Alignment Cop
One of these things...
OceanAir, why did you specifically ask StarSketch whether she had unlimited uses or not.
OceanicAir
Member
Because she claimed she had already used her alignment cop ability twice (which I thought was already strong) with the potential for more. As you pointed above I thought that was strange, because an infinite shot cop would be exceedingly out of line with the previous abilities (and it's just as if not even more powerful than other roles even as an x-shot). And if she said yes I'm an infinite shot with no drawback I'd vote for her tbh.
My guess would be that she is indeed a 2 shot cop. Nothing more and nothing less. Up to this point there have been enter one or two shot roles. I think she tried to be vague for either, not getting lynched right away in order to show that she can inspect another player or another reason I cannot think of right now.
Yes, I am thankful for that. We should now move and clear those that have been named by her.
What do you mean?
by move on i mean move onto the next move who would mean lynch one of the cops.
Feel free to disagree or come up with a better idea.
Lynch Sketch?
Yes. Since I think that she already used all her shots if she is to believed ofc.
OK let's get this straight.
Kark and el Topo want Sawneeks dead. Since they tend to believe that she is mafia.
Is that correct?
And if that is correct, why not lynch SS in order to clear those that have been mentioned?
SS I would love to hear from you aswell. Since you kept quiet with the number of shots you have or had. But the list above about those who claimed and how many shots they had, legs me believe that the number was not higher than 2.
Fewl free to interact with me.
Nin 2.0
8)
Kark and el Topo want Sawneeks dead. Since they tend to believe that she is mafia.
Is that correct?
And if that is correct, why not lynch SS in order to clear those that have been mentioned?
SS I would love to hear from you aswell. Since you kept quiet with the number of shots you have or had. But the list above about those who claimed and how many shots they had, legs me believe that the number was not higher than 2.
Fewl free to interact with me.
Nin 2.0
8)
StarSketch
Banned
I was telling the truth when I said I'm unlimited uses, but I lose the ability when I hit scum.
There, that's the drawback.
I was worried scum would manipulate it by bussing someone or something, though I guess in retrospect that makes it easier for me to do my job?
There, that's the drawback.
I was worried scum would manipulate it by bussing someone or something, though I guess in retrospect that makes it easier for me to do my job?
StarSketch
Banned
Aaand I probably just made myself look super suspicious. Welp.