How is the knowledge of weapons in Europe relevant to a fictional world?
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Wildebeest
Member
One advantage of using Japanese swords is that there are many people who could teach the actors how to use them in a convincing way. Probably they will just be swinging them around like clubs while screaming or something.
Honestly it's better than I feared. Episode 2 was especially good.
GymWolf
Member
I_D
Member
Racial differences are a significant part of the storyline, actually.
The Seanchan and the Aiel are supposed to look radically different from "normal" people, which is how they're such easily-identifiable enemies.
The tinkers could get away with being full of all sorts of races, though.
It was also weird that the show insisted that the "old blood runs through those mountains" yet shows a village full of people who are clearly not related.
It doesn't *really* matter in the long run, but it was a strange disconnect between what we're told in the story, versus what we saw on the screen.
The city covered in vines was a totally different plot-point.
The show didn't do a great job of explaining it (so far), but it's well-understood in this world that time "resets" every once in a while. This story isn't in the far-future in that humanity nuked itself back to the stone age. It's set in the future in the way that time has "reset," and so there are relics from past ages all over the world.
Doom85
Member
I mean, if they follow the books, then yes it is a VERY far future Earth. Not really a spoiler, as I said in my prior post this element is very minor and never confirmed but heavily hinted at on occasion.
Hari Seldon
Member
I'd say if you noped out on Episode 1 and are still curious, definitely give it 2 episodes. Episode 2 is just a huge step up from 1, and episode 3 is just as good. I read scuttlebutt on reddit that Amazon gave them 11,000 notes on Episode 1, so I'm guessing that the episode was shot and re-shot and edited out the ass which is why it is kind of a fast paced bit of a mess.
Batiman
Banned
Ya watched episode 2 yesterday and I’m a lot more hopeful for the series. Much better than episode 1. Enjoying it quite a bit
Ballthyrm
Member
Yeah I just finished reading the books not too long ago and only Rand should stand out from the rest.
So If he is white it would make sens for the rest of them to be black or brown.
They are supposed to be a very insular village and it doesn't match at all with what we have being shown on screen.
They also haven't explored yet the world being a matriarcal society which is weird.
They don't seem to be hitting any of the beats that make the wheel of time setting interesting.
Hari Seldon
Member
Did you watch beyond the first episode? I thought that the cold open to Episode 2 was fantastic. The dream sequence with the bats and a quick glimpse of the shadow dude was great. The "oldness" of the world shown by Shadar Logoth and Moraine's Manetheron speech is very LoTR-like.
The changes they have made to the plot seems to be because they want to start adding in lore earlier than in the books. Moraine being injured is just a conduit to introduce the viewer to Aes Sedai politics. The White Cloaks encountering them on the road is a soft introduction to them before they have a major roll in the show. Getting rid of the Mordeith in Shadar Logoth makes sense as even in the books he is just replaced by *spoiler*, so why not just wait until that happens? I'm also softening a bit on making the main cast a little bit older... it does make the plot more streamlined.
IDKFA
I am Become Bilbo Baggins
Fair enough. I haven't read the books, but if it's a future version of Earth then there isn't a reason why the cast shouldn't be racially diverse.
Still not a fan of the series, but my wife loves it, so we're going to have to finish it together. Might start the books after that.
Ballthyrm
Member
Hari Seldon
Yeah I've watched 1->3 , I think they got the costumes, the Locations, the atmosphere pretty spot on.
I guess it's hard for me to see for what it is. The couple of songs we got were great, very LOTR of them.
I just don't like any of the young actors, I don't think they match the characters at all :
Rand looks like he has already everything figured out ,
Mat isn't nearly charming enough,
Perrin looks like a lost puppy and not a relunctant hero,
Egwene character is mostly glossed over and feel like a damsel in distress,
Nynaeve is way too nice and accomodating.
And that's saying nothing about the very generic, exposition heavy dialog they all muddle through.
This isn't supposed to be Dawson's Creek FFS
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QuantumZebra
Member
Glad to hear! Watching it tonight.
Wow, Rosamund Pike has gone ALL IN in WoT. I think she is an exec producer/writer on the show and she apparently has narrated Eye of the World for audible (not sure of she has done any others). So no excuse for her to not know the source material!
Anyone else think Rand looks like a young Ryan Phillipe? He desperately needs some stubble and longer hair, it looks like he rolls out of bed every morning and goes to a barber.
Anyone else think Rand looks like a young Ryan Phillipe? He desperately needs some stubble and longer hair, it looks like he rolls out of bed every morning and goes to a barber.
Hari Seldon
Member
The Audible WoT books are narrated by Kate Reading and Michael Kramer, the same duo that do all of Sanderson's novels. Unless they *just* changed this like with the release of the show, as I picked up the audible version a few months ago.
G-Bus
Banned
Have only read up to and half of book 6.
2 episodes in and it's alright. Still not sure how I feel about the way they have done the weaving. I also don't know what I would have liked to see.
Trollocs looked alright and the mydraal are bang on imo. White cloaks are what I pictured in my head.
Casting isn't too bad but I don't care for Rand or Egwene. Nyneeve too for that matter.
Was that Tom in the first episode who ducked out once the trollocs rolled in? I like that guy.
2 episodes in and it's alright. Still not sure how I feel about the way they have done the weaving. I also don't know what I would have liked to see.
Trollocs looked alright and the mydraal are bang on imo. White cloaks are what I pictured in my head.
Casting isn't too bad but I don't care for Rand or Egwene. Nyneeve too for that matter.
Was that Tom in the first episode who ducked out once the trollocs rolled in? I like that guy.
Except that these books were still being sold in book stores all over the u.s. before this tv show was ever announced, so it was appealing to modern audiences. Modern audiences really? and fantasy worlds usually have their own lore and rules that they go by. Which is why folks tend to go crazy when you just all of a sudden change things.
Kinda makes senses. We do probably have a lot dojos that train with the Japanese sword. My argument kept being that the west makes so many medieval knight tv shows and movies that having a stuntman train these folks to fight convincingly would be fairly easy to do.
I'll probably give the first episode a go but I was already groaning over the casting. I did read the whole series but it's been ages so I've forgotten most of it.
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Hari Seldon
Member
Tom is not in it until the 3rd episode. You are thinking of Padan Fain who is PERFECTLY cast haha.
I've enjoyed it so far. They've moved incredibly fast and I think are close to halfway through book 1. Episode 3 was easily my favorite.
I'm not super thrilled with the casting as I do think it hurts the world building. I'm not coming at this from an anti-SJW perspective. The world in WOT is incredibly diverse. Part of the story is the isolated Two Rivers folk coming into their own and learning about the world despite being sheltered their whole lives. Like, if I had a nickel for every time Jordan referenced "copper skinned Domani" or some reference to the Sea Folks dark skin or the fact that Carheineians are short I'd be rich.
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Making the Two Rivers the most diverse place in the world is a bit immersion breaking if you know the books. That said, I do like most of the actors so far on an individual level. Except Perrin. I don't know what it is but I am not a fan of the actor playing him so far. Nynaeve, on the other hand, I like much more than the books. I found her insufferable in the
I'm not super thrilled with the casting as I do think it hurts the world building. I'm not coming at this from an anti-SJW perspective. The world in WOT is incredibly diverse. Part of the story is the isolated Two Rivers folk coming into their own and learning about the world despite being sheltered their whole lives. Like, if I had a nickel for every time Jordan referenced "copper skinned Domani" or some reference to the Sea Folks dark skin or the fact that Carheineians are short I'd be rich.
I haven't finished the books (currently wrapping book 13 up), but if memory serves me correctly, when the Seanchan are introduced one thing I remember sticking out about them in the books is their diversity relative to nations on the main continent since they built their empire by conquering nations
Making the Two Rivers the most diverse place in the world is a bit immersion breaking if you know the books. That said, I do like most of the actors so far on an individual level. Except Perrin. I don't know what it is but I am not a fan of the actor playing him so far. Nynaeve, on the other hand, I like much more than the books. I found her insufferable in the
Wildebeest
Member
There are people who have studied medieval combat now, but those people are not especially stuntmen. In the early days of film there were people who had practised military sabre fencing, but that sort of fell off. Sports fencing is nothing like combat. At any rate, normal swords are equivalent to pistols in modern terms. Self defence weapons rather than weapons you practice for war.
IDKFA
I am Become Bilbo Baggins
The first book was released in 1990, which was a totally different world than what we live in today. Robert Jordan had a dream cast in mind, but when I mean dream cast I mean a dream cast. It was what he considered the best actors for the role based on how they fitted with his characters. The link is here. (Robert Jordan also listed Omar Sharif , who is missing form the below list)
Wheel of Time Fan Casting on myCast
View and submit fan casting suggestions for Wheel of Time! myCast lets YOU choose your dream cast to play each role in upcoming movies and TV shows.
www.mycast.io
As you can see, majority of white actors.
Now, in 2021, there is no way you could get away with such a cast, which is why they had to race swap some characters.
What I'm getting at is the cast had to be diverse because of the time we live in, which is absolutely understandable. I'm not knocking it or calling it "woke", but making an observation that the mixed races of the cast isn't because the location of the world is mixed race.
I also expect Amazon's middle-earth show to be very diverse as well, which again is perfectly understandable in this day and age.
G-Bus
Banned
That's the name I couldn't remember!! Hahahaha. Good stuff.
Not at all what I pictured in my head for him but you say perfectly cast. Excellent.
Yea I gotta watch 3rd ep asap.
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JBat
Member
Just finished rewatching the 3 episodes. I left some pretty negative feelings in the other thread especial about Matt but after the rewatch I've warmed to it some. Went from about a 5 out of 10 to maybe a 7. I like a lot of the subtle touches like Moiraine entering the wine spring inn dry after Lan comes in soaked. But also noticed Tam's disappearing spear in the first episode...
Regarding Matt - I guess his attitude and behavior in episode 3 (which there is a reason for) colored my perception on the first 2 as well.
Part of me thinks it would have actually been better to not release the 3 episodes all at once because of that. I think the acting is pretty good over all and sure the diverse casting doesn't make 100% sense but didn't really distract me.
Still didn't like how they fridge Parren's wife. Yes, I learned that term this week lol. She has 6 words of dialogue. I counted. Not lines. Words. And the relationship was so weird and cold. We shall see where this goes but I'm more optimistic right now
Regarding Matt - I guess his attitude and behavior in episode 3 (which there is a reason for) colored my perception on the first 2 as well.
Part of me thinks it would have actually been better to not release the 3 episodes all at once because of that. I think the acting is pretty good over all and sure the diverse casting doesn't make 100% sense but didn't really distract me.
Still didn't like how they fridge Parren's wife. Yes, I learned that term this week lol. She has 6 words of dialogue. I counted. Not lines. Words. And the relationship was so weird and cold. We shall see where this goes but I'm more optimistic right now
Ballthyrm
Member
Wheel of Time Fan Casting on myCast
View and submit fan casting suggestions for Wheel of Time! myCast lets YOU choose your dream cast to play each role in upcoming movies and TV shows.
Lucy Lawless would still make a great Birgitte.
I didn't start reading the series until at least around 2005. Well I was expecting the cast to be mostly white since the cover had characters that looked white-ish. They could have still made the majority of the cast white but yeah, I wouldn't expect that from amazon or netflix.The first book was released in 1990, which was a totally different world than what we live in today. Robert Jordan had a dream cast in mind, but when I mean dream cast I mean a dream cast. It was what he considered the best actors for the role based on how they fitted with his characters. The link is here. (Robert Jordan also listed Omar Sharif , who is missing form the below list)
Wheel of Time Fan Casting on myCast
View and submit fan casting suggestions for Wheel of Time! myCast lets YOU choose your dream cast to play each role in upcoming movies and TV shows.
As you can see, majority of white actors.
Now, in 2021, there is no way you could get away with such a cast, which is why they had to race swap some characters.
What I'm getting at is the cast had to be diverse because of the time we live in, which is absolutely understandable. I'm not knocking it or calling it "woke", but making an observation that the mixed races of the cast isn't because the location of the world is mixed race.
I also expect Amazon's middle-earth show to be very diverse as well, which again is perfectly understandable in this day and age.
I do not think it is perfectly understandable but I got to go.
IDKFA
I am Become Bilbo Baggins
We live in a more diverse world, and as this is fantasy it doesn't make sense for it to be overly white.
The show runner actually commented on this when the series was in production. The quote shows that they wanted to avoid a true casting from the books and make the cast look like the world we live in today, or at least how they envision the US to look in a hundred years.
"As much as possible our cast will look like America will look in a few hundred years. A beautiful mix of white, brown, black and everything in between"
It's like Friends. Back in the 1990s and early 00s, nobody gave a shit that the main cast were all straight and white, but there is no way a studio would sign off that cast in 2021.
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
Why not? This doesn't make any sense. Because it's a fantasy it can be as diverse or non-diverse as the creator wants. I don't care myself but this is a weird take.
Hari Seldon
Member
In WoT it doesn't make sense for it to be all white simply because of the lore and the scope of the world. The lore of WoT is that the world was broken after the last Dragon, and people were scattered (with some notable exceptions)... which is why everyone is so afraid of the Dragon being reborn. I would expect a location like The Two Rivers to be a bit more homogeneous in terms of race, as they are insular "mountain people" who do not mingle much, but outside of the Two Rivers things should be a lot more multicultural.
Honestly the racial thing doesn't bother me. The universe of WoT covers the entire "world" and therefore should have all races in it. The universe of WoT also doesn't have "ancestral lands" that go back before the last dragon (3000 years ago?). So there is no analog to say Scandanavia where tall blonde white people have been living for 10,000+ years.