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[freethought]

You don't seem to grasp that PSN cards having a real money sum, is why they don't go on sale often, or when they do, it's never near the deals we've gotten on MS Points cards. It has to do with that real money value associated with the card. If having a points system is the price I pay to save 50% on everything, all the time, no exceptions, then bring on the

Or it could have more to do with the fact that Xbox Live is a much more popular service and so retailers end up buying a lot more of them, thus enabling them to give better discounts. There's also the fact that putting MS cards on sale is far more likely to drum up business than putting PSN cards on sale.

If anything, putting a card with a real cash value on sale looks a lot more attractive to the consumer, making the sale more effective. Either way, you cannot claim that you wouldn't be able to find such deals if MS used real money. PSN is not a good comparison because it wouldn't be anywhere near as popular a retail item.

edit: I don't get it. Do you think the billion dollar corporation was a jab at Microsoft? Last I checked all three platform holders were billion dollar corporations, and two of them use points systems.

 

[Son of Godzilla]

People just looking for a reason to whine hate points. Consumers who truly value their money, love the system, as it saves us money, and stacking it with sales, I haven't payed more than 50% of any DLC price in over a year. A lot of it I've gotten for 75% off.

More than this, MS loves the system because it forces people to overinvest which leads them to devalue their purchases which leads to making more purchases in general, all while increasing consumer contentment and making word-of-mouth sales.

I would love to one day read a study or something about XBL marketplace, because some of the things it does are just flat out brilliant from a sales perspective.

Or it could have more to do with the fact that Xbox Live is a much more popular service and so retailers end up buying a lot more of them, thus enabling them to give better discounts. There's also the fact that putting MS cards on sale is far more likely to drum up business than putting PSN cards on sale.

XBL cards are now being sold next to iTunes and phone cards in checkout lines at most places. It's crazy how much it's grown in recognition in the last year or two.

 

[Ysiadmihi]

I don't get how 10 isn't 1. The price of 360 storage is completely insane.

 

[PepsimanVsJoe]

If you're trying to make the argument that it's good for gamers as a whole, then no.

Who gives a fuck about them? Gamers are the worst people around. They're bad-smelling elitist pricks that are never satisfied with anything yet continue to dump ridiculous amounts of money into a hobby that continues to exploit them in any way they can.

90% of the time when I buy a game(especially this gen) it's usually for less than $20 shipped, through ebay, and possibly just a month or four after the game actually came out.

Between that, the point discounts, and whatever other sale I can get by on I believe that I'm not good for the industry. If everyone took on the same buying habits as I this industry would be in for some serious shit. But as long as a large enough percentage does just as the market tells them there won't be any problems(well aside from the usual crap).

In the end when it comes to gaming even the rawest deal isn't an issue because like any other hobby it can be ignored.

I don't get how 10 isn't 1. The price of 360 storage is completely insane.

You'll need a lot of funny money to fill up that expensive HDD. Heck even if you don't own a 360 you still have to deal with it.

 

[Kintaro]

I'm also amused with the point of Retail vs. Downloads. Did people really think that retail would let these companies set one price for retail and set a much lower price for download? In addition to that, did people really think that downloadable games would just magically be set lower because there's no packaging costs? No no. That savings won't be passed on to us. It will be passed on to them. Sale every now and again? Sure. Permanent lower prices? Dream on.

Who gives a fuck about them? Gamers are the worst people around. They're bad-smelling elitist pricks that are never satisfied with anything yet continue to dump ridiculous amounts of money into a hobby that continues to exploit them in any way they can.

90% of the time when I buy a game(especially this gen) it's usually for less than $20 shipped, through ebay, and possibly just a month or four after the game actually came out.

Between that, the point discounts, and whatever other sale I can get by on I believe that I'm not good for the industry. If everyone took on the same buying habits as I this industry would be in for some serious shit. But as long as a large enough percentage does just as the market tells them there won't be any problems(well aside from the usual crap).

In the end when it comes to gaming even the rawest deal isn't an issue because like any other hobby it can be ignored.

*nods* *thumbs up*

 

[SapientWolf]

They could come up with at least a top 5 just for XBOX 360 in no particular order:

1. Ridiculously overpriced storage.
2. Over priced wifi, which should be included in the first place.
3. Batteries for the controllers, or you have to buy a charge kit.
4. MS Points.
5. Charging for XBL. At least let silver members play online with a gimped feature set.
6. The expensive ass cable to use optical audio.

This is why I refuse to purchase another 360. There policies and pricing are setting a terrible precedent for the industry.

1. Agree 110%. Their full downloadable game program is going to flop like a fish unless they lower the price on the 120GB HDs.
2. Non-issue, since you can get a wireless bridge for $20 and it will do everything the wi-fi adapter does and more.
3. Again, non-issue since you can use regular AA rechargeables.
4. MS points are awesome. They give them away like candy. If people have problem with the conversion rate they can just punch it in a calculator. MS is also saved from having to adjust the marketplace prices to yen or euro or aussie dolleridoos or whatever.
5. Agreed, although I wouldn't feel as bad if a portion of the money was going towards infrastructure.
6. That's annoying, although there is a DIY solution out there.

 

[Beer Monkey]

1. Agree 110%. Their full downloadable game program is going to flop like a fish unless they lower the price on the 120GB HDs.
<snip>
6. That's annoying, although there is a DIY solution out there.

There are also DIY solutions for 120GB HDD.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

The storage one annoys me the most.

I'm at the point where if I download one more DLC pack, I can no longer install dual-layered games.

 

[Petrie]

It's awesome that you get to follow deals and such but between work and school I don't got a lot of time to follow sales and go to stores to buy shit and then go home and then wait for it to download when there are two services out there that do exactly what I want, have most of the same games and do it painlessly.

I work 2 jobs and go to school. If you don't care enough about your money to spend 5 minutes a day checking cheapassgamer.com for deals, and then 30 minutes every 3 months going to said store with sales to stock up, then frankly you deserve to overpay.

For 99% of users XBL is just as painless, those of us who aren't so worriued about an extra dollar or somesuch sitting in our account. Thanks to the Zune marketplace, you can add even lesser values than MS defaults for Live, so I just fail to see the problem, other than people who can't do 6th grade (or earlier) math.

 

[Big-E]

I work 2 jobs and go to school. If you don't care enough about your money to spend 5 minutes a day checking cheapassgamer.com for deals, and then 30 minutes every 3 months going to said store with sales to stock up, then frankly you deserve to overpay.

For 99% of users XBL is just as painless, those of us who aren't so worriued about an extra dollar or somesuch sitting in our account. Thanks to the Zune marketplace, you can add even lesser values than MS defaults for Live, so I just fail to see the problem, other than people who can't do 6th grade (or earlier) math.

Why the fuck should I be doing 6th grade math? Why the fuck do I need to drive to the store to get the benefit of using an online service? I care about my money which is why Steam and PSN see my funds and not MS.

 

[shintoki]

I work 2 jobs and go to school. If you don't care enough about your money to spend 5 minutes a day checking cheapassgamer.com for deals, and then 30 minutes every 3 months going to said store with sales to stock up, then frankly you deserve to overpay.

For 99% of users XBL is just as painless, those of us who aren't so worriued about an extra dollar or somesuch sitting in our account. Thanks to the Zune marketplace, you can add even lesser values than MS defaults for Live, so I just fail to see the problem, other than people who can't do 6th grade (or earlier) math.

I completely agree with this...And to take it one step further.

YOUR ON FUCKING GAF RIGHT NOW(And talking about not having enough time) :lol How hard is it to open another window...and look at Cag. Oh look, Ebay is selling MS points at 40% off. YAY for me. I just saved 20$ in 1 minute. I didn't even have to leave my chair.


PepsiJoe is right on the money with most gamers just being whiny.

 

[SapientWolf]

Why the fuck should I be doing 6th grade math? Why the fuck do I need to drive to the store to get the benefit of using an online service? I care about my money which is why Steam and PSN see my funds and not MS.

The benefits of being a patient and an informed shopper don't end with XBL. Steam has great deals all the time too.

 

[Vilix]

Decent list. But where's the one about Microsoft's shitty 360 hardward quality, or lack thereof? Or Sony's charging $600 for a gaming console (partly due to a format that wasn't needed), and promising backward compatibility forever, but then yanking it?

 

[Big-E]

The benefits of being a patient and an informed shopper don't end with XBL. Steam has great deals all the time too.

And what do I have to do to get those Steam deals? Oh that's right, I open Steam. I don't have to take the I5 down to Valve and check to see if they still have any games in stock.

 

[Petrie]

Why the fuck should I be doing 6th grade math? Why the fuck do I need to drive to the store to get the benefit of using an online service? I care about my money which is why Steam and PSN see my funds and not MS.

And you will overpay or have to wait 6 months or whatever for a sale to come up. I'll enjoy the games and content the day of release, for 50% off. Steam and PSN offer neither.

And what do I have to do to get those Steam deals? Oh that's right, I open Steam. I don't have to take the I5 down to Valve and check to see if they still have any games in stock.

And you are on their timetable. You have to wait for the specific game you want to go on sale, where I can purchase mine anytime I want, and get in on the content right from the beginning. With multiplayer I don't fall behind, and get in right alongside everyone else.

I can see the merits of your argument, but you're not strapped enough for time that you can't sit on GAF arguing, and a few minutes of that time could be spent saving a lot more money than you do with PSN, and in some ways steam.

 

[Grecco]

It's awesome that you get to follow deals and such but between work and school I don't got a lot of time to follow sales and go to stores to buy shit and then go home and then wait for it to download when there are two services out there that do exactly what I want, have most of the same games and do it painlessly.

Meh. Many of the deals ive used or others have used have been posted on Gaf. Its not hard, and its not like other people taking advantage of them and caring about their money dont have "work and school and not alot of time" either.

 

[MightyHedgehog]

Big-E, I think you need to sit down and think for a moment...

 

[Jswanko]

Big-E, I think you need to sit down and think for a moment...

HE DOESN'T HAVE TIME!

 

[Beer Monkey]

Speaking of deals, does anybody know of a good Twitter feed for really hot game deals? I'm looking for something low volume that only posts the good stuff ($40 Red Faction, $14.98 Ratchet & Clank PS3, etc.).

 

[shintoki]

The benefits of being a patient and an informed shopper don't end with XBL. Steam has great deals all the time too.

It's fantastic being an informed shopper who has patience :lol

Goozex+CAG+Gaf have made pretty much all my purchasing flawless.

Bought Saints Row 2 for 30$ thanks to CAG(Tax free and shipping free), Traded it on Goozex after beating it for 1000points(Spent about 2.25$ to ship it), Used those points then and 1$, To get Street Fighter IV, Traded that in when I was done to get RE5(about 3.25$ again total)...Traded that in when I was done to get Wolverine...Traded that in when I got done to get Ghostbusters(Coming next week ^_^). I haven't even spent the price of a new game yet and received 5 in total for it.

And with spacebucks, I got all mine for 40% off. So all my purchases now on XBLA are like getting 40% off from day 1.:lol

All this with just a bit of patience and checking 3 sites out for a minute a day. I have to wait on the games to come in from Goozex, but I love spending about 3 days to have a game for a few weeks. Then trading that in and another 3 dollars to get the next one.

 

[RBH]

Speaking of deals, does anybody know of a good Twitter feed for really hot game deals? I'm looking for something low volume that only posts the good stuff ($40 Red Faction, $14.98 Ratchet & Clank PS3, etc.).

http://twitter.com/videogamedeals

 

[HK-47]

#1 should have been Xbox Live

Indeed

 

[JKBii]

Who gives a fuck about them? Gamers are the worst people around. They're bad-smelling elitist pricks that are never satisfied with anything yet continue to dump ridiculous amounts of money into a hobby that continues to exploit them in any way they can.

90% of the time when I buy a game(especially this gen) it's usually for less than $20 shipped, through ebay, and possibly just a month or four after the game actually came out.

Between that, the point discounts, and whatever other sale I can get by on I believe that I'm not good for the industry. If everyone took on the same buying habits as I this industry would be in for some serious shit. But as long as a large enough percentage does just as the market tells them there won't be any problems(well aside from the usual crap).

In the end when it comes to gaming even the rawest deal isn't an issue because like any other hobby it can be ignored.



You'll need a lot of funny money to fill up that expensive HDD. Heck even if you don't own a 360 you still have to deal with it.

I totally agree with you, in fact, every item on the list can be ignored if you aren't playing directly to the script of large companies. Electronic enthusiasts in general are so enthralled by fast processors, curvy lines, and a well paid marketing team they're begging to be shafted.

 

[permutated]

Number 8 is the worst of them. The Gamestop BS has gone on long enough. I'm more in favor of including multiplayer maps as tokens in new games regardless of retailer, not this pre order crap that has zero work around even by purchasing the missing components.

Makes no sense and made me want to stop gaming entirely to be quite honest.

 

[BlazeHedgehog]

Come on, it's Chrono Trigger! They see it as a $30 markup from a Virtual Console price, I see it as a $60 drop in price from the $100 SNES cartridge I could never afford when I was a kid.

The whole "Adjusting for inflation!" stuff is bullshit, though. Yes - a lot of SNES games and whatever were $60-$100 back in the day, but the entire reason the disc format was popularized to begin with is because of the dramatic slash in manufacturing costs it offered. That allowed games to be cheaper.

But none of that matters now. What matters now is the standard pricing model we get for games today, and today, Nintendo will sell you a SNES game for $8. Square-Enix even hiked up the prices for its VC releases in Japan, didn't it?

As for me, I'd exchange #2 for "Paying for Online" or "Having to Pre-Order to get a demo for a game I technically just bought". How the hell do developers get roped in to signing stupid deals with Gamestop?

 

[iconoclast]

#1 is so wrong it's not even funny. I can't remember the last time I payed full price for MS points, not to mention all the times they gave out thousands for free.

 

[Petrie]

#1 is so wrong it's not even funny. I can't remember the last time I payed full price for MS points, not to mention all the times they gave out thousands for free.

This again. 1000 times this.

 

[Big-E]

This again. 1000 times this.

That is fine, still its a horribly inconvenient system.

 

[JKBii]

The whole "Adjusting for inflation!" stuff is bullshit, though. Yes - a lot of SNES games and whatever were $60-$100 back in the day, but the entire reason the disc format was popularized to begin with is because of the dramatic slash in manufacturing costs it offered. That allowed games to be cheaper.

But none of that matters now. What matters now is the standard pricing model we get for games today, and today, Nintendo will sell you a SNES game for $8. Square-Enix even hiked up the prices for its VC releases in Japan, didn't it?

As for me, I'd exchange #2 for "Paying for Online" or "Having to Pre-Order to get a demo for a game I technically just bought". How the hell do developers get roped in to signing stupid deals with Gamestop?

I think he's talking about what you'd have to pay now if you the SNES cartridge used on Ebay.

 

[BlazeHedgehog]

I think he's talking about what you'd have to pay now if you the SNES cartridge used on Ebay.

Maybe, but my point about "Nintendo charges $8 for SNES carts." still holds.

 

[demifiend]

As far as #8 goes, I've never quite understood the seething, nigh-irrational fear and hatred people have for preorders.

 

[Beer Monkey]

As far as #8 goes, I've never quite understood the seething, nigh-irrational fear and hatred people have for preorders.

Not everyone who hates retailer-specific exclusive content hates preorders.

 

[A Human Becoming]

Excellent list Kohler; well done.

 

[cultofweaver]

MS points rule if you don't live in the US. If Microsoft used individual currencies from each territory then we UK gamers would get humped on the exchange rate as we usually do, as it is the MS points system is set up reasonably well to match exchange rates between the dollar and pound, it isn't perfectly in line but then they would be changing the values all the time.

Want an example?

Big Surf Island for Burnout Paradise costs 1000pts. This equates to $12.50/£8.50. With current exchange rates that would work out at £7.60 or 90p less. On PSN it costs $12.99/£9.99, with current rates that would be £7.80 or £2.19 less. In other words PS3 owners are being charged £1.29 more (or 12% of the total price) for not being American.

MS points are awesome.

 

[:enemyglider:]

NM

 

[Saint10118]

Ugh, I need 200 Wii points to buy something I want, too bad it's going to cost me 10 bucks for 800 points I don't want.

Go to your local gas station pick up a pepsi with a yellow cap. Enter the code for the yahoo Rock Band promo and you're 99% likely to get 200 nintendo points you can use on anything.

 

[freethought]

MS points rule if you don't live in the US. If Microsoft used individual currencies from each territory then we UK gamers would get humped on the exchange rate as we usually do, as it is the MS points system is set up reasonably well to match exchange rates between the dollar and pound, it isn't perfectly in line but then they would be changing the values all the time.

Want an example?

Big Surf Island for Burnout Paradise costs 1000pts. This equates to $12.50/£8.50. With current exchange rates that would work out at £7.60 or 90p less. On PSN it costs $12.99/£9.99, with current rates that would be £7.80 or £2.19 less. In other words PS3 owners are being charged £1.29 more (or 12% of the total price) for not being American.

MS points are awesome.

I'm sorry, but what does any of that have to do with exchange rates? Isn't it just a case of Big Surf being cheaper on XBL than on PSN in the UK? Blame Sony or EA for not releasing it for £8.50 (which would be a valid point). I just don't get what exchange rates have to do with anything.

If your point is that you pay the same number of points in Europe as you do in the US, what happens when something ends up cheaper on Euro PSN? Say something costs 800pts, that's £6.80. What if the same thing came out on PSN for £5.99? Then you just got screwed by the exact same system. In fact, I think this happened with BCR which was only £6.29 IIRC.

Maybe I just don't understand your point though.

 

[Slavik81]

MS points rule if you don't live in the US. If Microsoft used individual currencies from each territory then we UK gamers would get humped on the exchange rate as we usually do, as it is the MS points system is set up reasonably well to match exchange rates between the dollar and pound, it isn't perfectly in line but then they would be changing the values all the time.

On the other hand, $10 USD is $11.53CAD, but we still pay $12.79CAD for 800 points.
PSN is nice in that they basically just add a dollar or two to each thing, making something from $10 to $11 or $12.

But ultimately, I like Steam the best. They don't distinguish between Canadians and Americans, so all prices are identical in the US and Canada. It goes onto my credit card as USD and I'm charged the exchange rate plus a percent or two.

 

[Rhazer Fusion]

Decent list. But where's the one about Microsoft's shitty 360 hardward quality, or lack thereof? Or Sony's charging $600 for a gaming console (partly due to a format that wasn't needed), and promising backward compatibility forever, but then yanking it?

That was definitely an issue, but it was only a one time entry fee. Now, you can get a PS3 for anywhere between $399 to $499 and if you look hard enough you can even find one for around $300-$350. Hopefully, Microsoft finally resolved their hardware issue even though IMO it look entirely way to long to finally rectify it. The BC issue was probably mostly due to lower manufacturing costs even though I remember it was supposed to be standard. Alot of the issues they are mentioning on the list constantly happen on a regular basis and seem to be getting worst.