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[Psychotext]

I'm not a fan, but he's unquestionably a monster of an athlete, and definitely a team player.

 

[Charles Brandon]

WTF is happening with Chaves BTW? I had to check to see if he was till on the Tour (he is). He never seems to be anywhere near the leader's group, not even in support of Yates.

 

[jakonovski]

The Finnish Ammattipyöräily's version of today's wattages:

#TDF2017, St.15. Col de Peyra Taillade (8.39km, 7.44%, 624m)

Froome 22:00, 6.20 W/kg
GC favorites 22:40, 6.02 W/kg
Barguil 23:15, 5.87 W/kg

https://twitter.com/ammattipyoraily/status/886707099870408704

 

[Psychotext]

I didn't watch the stage today, but I assume Froome had helpers to take him up (at least a chunk of) the climb?

 

[jakonovski]

I didn't watch the stage today, but I assume Froome had helpers to take him up (at least a chunk of) the climb?

He did. But the others were in a big group so it's kind of moot. What could have an effect are team cars and race motos.

 

[luchadork]

This is the closest tour for ages, Froome is hardly all conquering. Unless you think they're all on the same medicine?

hardly all conquering? there's a good argument to be made that he could have won 6 of the last tours. i LOVE this sport but I'm a realist. we're talking Armstrong/usps results at this stage.

i'm getting deja vu. people defended the shit out of lance too. "he never failed a drug test!" this is the cheatingest sport in the history of sports cheating. and froome is about to win 3 in a row. easily. you need about a minute on him going into the time trial. this guy has gone from being a nobody to the greatest rider of all time in the space of 10 years thanks to "marginal gains" and a cleared up chest infection. cmon.

 

[teepo]

greg le mond is still stigmatized for speaking against lance and the rest of the pro peloton. think about that for a moment


personally, i don't care at this point nor have i ever. without transparency in data, everyone is suspect with team sky def being the most shady

 

[bobnowhere]

WTF is happening with Chaves BTW? I had to check to see if he was till on the Tour (he is). He never seems to be anywhere near the leader's group, not even in support of Yates.

He has no fitness or form, had a big injury that ruined his spring. A bit disappointed he hasn't tried for a breakaway, though two big Alps stages to go. He and both Yates boys are going to the Vuelta apparently.

 

[teepo]

can we seriously give an standing ovation to dan martin. imagine had richie porte not crashed into him

 

[30yearsofhurt]

can we seriously give an standing ovation to dan martin. imagine had richie porte not crashed into him

Technically speaking he crashed into Richie Porte.
Porte just shouldn't have been on his back in the middle of the road at the time.

 

[boxoctosis]

hardly all conquering? there's a good argument to be made that he could have won 6 of the last tours. i LOVE this sport but I'm a realist. we're talking Armstrong/usps results at this stage.

i'm getting deja vu. people defended the shit out of lance too. "he never failed a drug test!" this is the cheatingest sport in the history of sports cheating. and froome is about to win 3 in a row. easily. you need about a minute on him going into the time trial. this guy has gone from being a nobody to the greatest rider of all time in the space of 10 years thanks to "marginal gains" and a cleared up chest infection. cmon.

I dunno, I'd love to think they were clean but we never know do we. By all conquering I meant this tour only, though wasn't clear. I also think the tour winners are often clumped in that you get people who win 3 or 4 or 5, even in eras when everyone was doping, eg Hinault, Big Mig, and so on. Therefore I'm unsurprised in the current 'clean' era we have someone dominating.

Maybe I'm just being naive!

 

[Fonds]

... this is the cheatingest sport in the history of sports cheating.

I don't think thats the case at all. The sport is trying its best to track dope use as opposed to other sports.
Which is why doping use comes to light more often.

We've seen dope use from baseball to judo. For some reason it's just not as sexy to talk about.

 

[Joni]

If you pretend the problem doesn't exist, it is easier to have everyone believe it doesn't exist. Cycling refuses to pretend.

 

[TarpitCarnivore]

I don't think thats the case at all. The sport is trying its best to track dope use as opposed to other sports.
Which is why doping use comes to light more often.

We've seen dope use from baseball to judo. For some reason it's just not as sexy to talk about.

You're kidding right? Baseball fans have been raking PED users over the coals. There was entire senate hearing around it. Mark Ecko bought Barry Bond's home run breaking ball, put an asterik on it and then gave it to the hall.

Baseball fans are probably the most ridiculous when it comes to PEDs.

 

[crispyben]

WTF is happening with Chaves BTW? I had to check to see if he was till on the Tour (he is). He never seems to be anywhere near the leader's group, not even in support of Yates.

http://www.smh.com.au/sport/cycling...-de-france-despite-grief-20170704-gx4ovy.html

 

[weremichael]

Lets leave the doping speculation out of this. Froome has literally nothing dodgy whatsoever in his past. The rumours and speculation about Armstrong were huge years and years before it came out. Everyone knew he was bent.

Froome may not be very charismatic and the Team Sky TDF victory forumla is boring as fuck but he's clearly a decent bloke and a great rider who has shown his quality many times when his opponents looked to have the jump on him (at least in the TDF anyway). Today was just another example.

If Froome wins this one, you can't say that he just followed wheels and his power meter to do it this time and the race has been much better for it.

He's always going to have the upper hand until someone builds a team around another GC rider who can TT.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/brailsford-launches-rant-against-cyclingnews-journalist/ mentions the level of skepticism that cycling journalists have in regards to Team Sky, the mysterious Jiffy Bag that was couriered by Team Sky at the end of the 2011 Criterium d Dauphine that is being investigated by the UK Government, and the parallels to Postal/Discovery.

You nailed it on the head for me about the boring formula that Sky uses (same as Lance's plan to win the Tour). I also am against any team that is the wealthiest in any sport. Buying talent doesn't make Brailsford a good director, it makes him the USA of cycling. I prefer underdogs. An unexpected victory is much more fun to watch.

I also agree with your point about Froome showing some serious character this Tour. I'm not a fan of him; however, I am impressed and inspired by his riding this Tour. Of course I was inspired by Armstrong too (I assumed he was doped to the gills at the time).

In regards to comparing cycling to other sports, I think comparing cycling to futbol/soccer shows how serious cycling is about doping. The issue is the methodology. Of doping is ahead of the testing, so cycling is just playing catch up all the time.

 

[Addnan]

Regarding budget, Katusha budget is pretty damn close to Sky

 

[Fonds]

The catch-up game with doping goes for other sports too.

If people are going to gain something with it for cycling you can bet that other sports that have higher budgets will try the same.

The richer the team/ sport, the more efficient they'll be at staying ahead of doping tests.
Just look at the transformation that players like Ronaldo have made in short periods of time.
There have been incidents in soccer in the past five years showing that players have been doing blood transfusions, using growth hormones and the like.
Their sport is just as dirty as cycling, the culture is just different. Plus they probably have a lot more money to cover up the stories.

 

[Shanks D Zoro]

My one thing with Froome is that he never struggles.

I compare him to Nibali, who I consider the best all rounder in the world, and Nibali has days where he looks like he is gonna call it quits. That is natural. There is noway I feel you can naturally not see any dip in form during a three week tour. The only guys who have done that previously have been dopers.

I don't know if Froome is on anything, but at the very least, Sky's resources allow them to absolutely analyse and prepare their riders in a way that nobody else can.

 

[30yearsofhurt]

My one thing with Froome is that he never struggles.

I compare him to Nibali, who I consider the best all rounder in the world, and Nibali has days where he looks like he is gonna call it quits. That is natural. There is noway I feel you can naturally not see any dip in form during a three week tour. The only guys who have done that previously have been dopers.

I don't know if Froome is on anything, but at the very least, Sky's resources allow them to absolutely analyse and prepare their riders in a way that nobody else can.

*cough*bradleywiggins*cough*

 

[Joni]

We have seen riders that were on something get annihilated in some stages during their Tour wins. They just recovered way too fast afterwards. Froome hasn't been annihilated yet this Tour, but he also doesn't look invincible.

 

[Shanks D Zoro]

*cough*bradleywiggins*cough*

Wiggins never really looked a machine, he always looked human.

Then again, I liked Wiggins, so maybe I am biased.

 

[bobnowhere]

We have seen riders that were on something get annihilated in some stages during their Tour wins. They just recovered way too fast afterwards. Froome hasn't been annihilated yet this Tour, but he also doesn't look invincible.

Like Landis, he fell asleep after a bad day with the Testosterone patches on his balls and got a mega dose. At that time if you took the patches off after a few hours it aided your recovery from the stage and was undetectable. He won the next day by a massive margin juiced to the eyeballs!

 

[Joni]

And Rasmussen and Contador did a similar feat if I remember well.

 

[bobnowhere]

Big crosswinds expected towards the end of the stage.

 

[Charles Brandon]

Yup, should be fun

 

[Joni]

Gilbert is sick. He has not started today.

 

[Addnan]

Will Sunweb really try to timeout Kittel at some point, i'm not sure if Kittel is that bad at climbing that could happen or Quick-Step would allow that to happen.

 

[Ruruja]

Damn check out these echelons, nice!

 

[Joni]

Will Sunweb really try to timeout Kittel at some point, i'm not sure if Kittel is that bad at climbing that could happen or Quick-Step would allow that to happen.

I'd hope the jury would keep the green jersey in the tour if he times out.

 

[Charles Brandon]

Will Sunweb really try to timeout Kittel at some point, i'm not sure if Kittel is that bad at climbing that could happen or Quick-Step would allow that to happen.

According to comms QS are working for Martin today, not Kittel, which could make things interesting for both GC and Points. Martin trying to attack.

I'd hope the jury would keep the green jersey in the tour if he times out.

Did they do that for Cav once?

 

[bobnowhere]

Sunweb smashing it now that Kittel is off the back.

Looks like all the sprinters are off the back bar Matthews, EBH and GVA though GVA can't match it with the other two in a flat sprint.

Edit: George Bennett, 11th, is having a very bad day, well off the back of the Kittel group.

 

[True Savior]

My one thing with Froome is that he never struggles.

I compare him to Nibali, who I consider the best all rounder in the world, and Nibali has days where he looks like he is gonna call it quits. That is natural. There is noway I feel you can naturally not see any dip in form during a three week tour. The only guys who have done that previously have been dopers.

I don't know if Froome is on anything, but at the very least, Sky's resources allow them to absolutely analyse and prepare their riders in a way that nobody else can.

Froome has struggled in several Vuelta's though.

 

[TarpitCarnivore]

This is going to be a silly 20-40km isn't it with this downhill.

 

[bobnowhere]

Bennett has abandoned.

 

[kottila]

My one thing with Froome is that he never struggles.

This is just plain wrong. I've seen him struggle tons of times, even just a few stages ago. He hasn't won a single race before the tour this year and blew up on the last stage of the Dauphinee. And in the previous tours, he has been outclimbed in the last week.

 

[NewDust]

I'd hope the jury would keep the green jersey in the tour if he times out.

I'd hope the jury wouldn't do anything if a jersey gets eliminated by a direct attack.

 

[Mimosa97]

hardly all conquering? there's a good argument to be made that he could have won 6 of the last tours. i LOVE this sport but I'm a realist. we're talking Armstrong/usps results at this stage.

i'm getting deja vu. people defended the shit out of lance too. "he never failed a drug test!" this is the cheatingest sport in the history of sports cheating. and froome is about to win 3 in a row. easily. you need about a minute on him going into the time trial. this guy has gone from being a nobody to the greatest rider of all time in the space of 10 years thanks to "marginal gains" and a cleared up chest infection. cmon.

Only people I see defending Froome and his team of cheaters are british people getting triggered and even a lot of them actually agree that his performances are suspicious as hell.

Everyone knows this is an Arsmtrong-bis situation and in a few years they'll uncover a vast conspiracy and the same people who were defending Froome will say " Well we all knew he was cheating but everyone cheats so who cares "

 

[FrankCanada97]

Wiggins never really looked a machine, he always looked human.

Then again, I liked Wiggins, so maybe I am biased.

I remember that disastrous Giro attempt. It was so funny watching him descend in the rain.

 

[His Majesty]

Martin and Landa in the second group.

 

[Gandie]

What a crazy finish. Thank god the group was that small.

 

[True Savior]

Looked illegal.

 

[bobnowhere]

A bit pushy from Matthews, EBH looked like he stole it at the death.

 

[Charles Brandon]

Only people I see defending Froome and his team of cheaters are british people getting triggered and even a lot of them actually agree that his performances are suspicious as hell.

Everyone knows this is an Arsmtrong-bis situation and in a few years they'll uncover a vast conspiracy and the same people who were defending Froome will say " Well we all knew he was cheating but everyone cheats so who cares "

Yeah, no, that's fucking bullshit. So bitter.

 

[NewDust]

Can't see Kittel being of relevance in the next 2-3 intermediates, where Matthews probably can make it. With only stages 19 and 21 likely to end in sprints, the battle for the green jersey is on.

 

[Charles Brandon]

Kittel is going to take the Champs easily you'd have thought. What does 19 look like?

 

[weremichael]

Today's stage reminded me how much I really wish Sagan was still in the race.

Yeah, no, that's fucking bullshit. So bitter.

Sky is already under investigation. I don't care, it's been a part of cycling since the beginning. Who wants a cigarette before the HC climb?

 

[Charles Brandon]

I'm glad he isn't, otherwise this stage would never have happened like this

 

[NewDust]

Kittel is going to take the Champs easily you'd have thought. What does 19 look like?

Somewhat more hilly than today, but mostly longer, 223km.

 

[Gandie]

Kittel is going to take the Champs easily you'd have thought. What does 19 look like?

This is the archetypal break versus sprinters’ fare, though don’t call it a transitional stage as it’s not connecting two mountain ranges. At 222.5km it’s also the longest of the race as it heads through the Vaucluse towards the coast. The Col du Pointu, the final cat-three climb of the stage and indeed the race, comes 45km from the line, so it’s unlikely to make much of an impression. However it does signal some direction changes and as this is near the coast there’s always the threat of crosswinds, particularly a 14km section between Loumarin and Merindol. The final 8km to Salon-de-Provence, once the home of Nostradamus, should be a tailwind, so even if it is the break versus the sprinters - starved for a few days since Romans-sur-Isère- it should be an entertaining day, the kind of stage where, if the bunch does let the break go, the eventual time gap between them will be north of 10 minutes.

Looks too tough for Kittel to be honest.