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Twin Peaks Season 3 OT |25 Years Later...It Is Happening Again

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Levito

Banned
This is such a twisted interpretation of my post that it borders on blatantly disingenuous. Who was called a Trump supporter because they like a show? Please point that out, I implore you.

Because by even bringing up "Trump supporters" you're painting a picture of people simply just trying to have fun with a TV show. As someone else pointed out, this is godwin's law-like shit; you knew exactly what you were doing when you brought that up. It was completely uncalled for.


This is not a fucking political forum/thread, if you're not trying to paint us all in an unfavorable light then don't pull that kind of bullshit. Stop sellin' wolf tickets.
 
Because by even bringing up "Trump supporters" you're painting a picture of people simply just trying to have fun with a TV show. As someone else pointed out, this is godwin's law-like shit; you knew exactly what you were doing when you brought that up. It was completely uncalled for.


This is not a fucking political forum/thread, if you're not trying to paint us all in an unfavorable light then don't pull that kind of bullshit. Stop sellin' wolf tickets.

I give you my personal assurance that the only thing on my mind was the silliness of the 4D chess meme and how everything is according to some master plan.

because Lynch always casts unconventional (or in some peoples minds bad) actors and actresses. Jack Nance is super unconventional and so are plenty of the original twin peaks cast. It's a fair assumption that on using Chrysta Bell Lynch thought either 1) She fits the sexy but strange vision of the character OR 2) on casting her he decided he loved what she brought to the character. This isn't something that can be proved but it's a logical conclusion to arrive at from is previous work. She might be a bad actress in the traditional sense and that is exactly why Lynch is using her, not 'she's secretly got a oscar performance in her' '

This would be slightly believable if Lynch did not have a personal relationship with her. She wasn't some nobody to him when he chose her for that role based on what you're describing.
 
EDIT: This might also somewhat explain the genesis of the "blue rose" signifier for cases, i.e. that they are cases that require more intuition and creativity to solve than just strict analytics. I think that tracks because from what we saw of Cooper's investigative ideology in S1, it's far from traditional and logical. Even though we don't get to see that out of him, perhaps Chet Desmond was such an intuitive investigator and that's why Cooper and Desmond work Blue Rose cases and why Major Briggs was at least aware of them (him being similarly in tune with intuition).

I like your thinking! Somebody give this person a donut.
 
I don't see why not, if anything that means he was more likely to know what she would be like

Or he just really wanted to give her a role because of his relationship to her, despite her inability to act. This isn't just some different style of acting, this is legitimately an inability to act on a basic level.
 
I honestly haven't been bothered by Tammy at all. Everything is so weird and off as it is that she feels right at home in the cast

Not saying that to disparage people who think otherwise or anything, I'm just kind of surprised to see people get hung up on it that much (though I guess if you're digging everything else the slightest red flag stands out more)
 

Real Hero

Member
Or he just really wanted to give her a role because of his relationship to her, despite her inability to act. This isn't just some different style of acting, this is legitimately an inability to act on a basic level.

I don't think he would put her in there if she couldn't give him what he wanted and I disagree I've enjoyed her
 

anaron

Member
I honestly haven't been bothered by Tammy at all. Everything is so weird and off as it is that she feels right at home in the cast

Not saying that to disparage people who think otherwise or anything, I'm just kind of surprised to see people get hung up on it that much (though I guess if you're digging everything else the slightest red flag stands out more)
Pretty much


She feels right at home with the stilted weirdness of Norma, Ed, Denise, etc.

Also this show had fucking Leo
 
Posts on a videogame fandom forum that also regularly talks about movies, comic books, anime and tend to worship auteurs such as game developers, directors, authors, musicians. Thinks the only apt comparison to a fanboy is a Trump supporter when talking about a TV show.
 

Flipyap

Member
This is a fan theory, so it will be wrong.

My current idea as to why the book is the way it is, is that it is designed as a trap. Something close to the real history, with enough verifiable facts that someone would mistake it for a factual dossier.

Someone like Mr C.

Like fake towns on maps, so you know if someone copied it. It's a trap. Someone pretending to be Agent Cooper might take something as fact should they find the dossier, and give themselves away.

Or the lies are there to hide the truths. Like, Garland would know the fabricated facts.

But, yes. Fan theory. So very wrong like all Twin Peaks fan theories. Maybe the show won't contradict it though!
I just can't imagine Mr. Phone Tosser not only not destroying the dossier, but also neatly stashing it back in its fancy box. If deceiving him was its intended purpose, it doesn't seem like it worked and even if it did, it didn't end up affecting the show in any way and now it's too late to introduce the idea that he doesn't know random Twin Peaks trivia.
With the show not treating the existence of Annie as a mystery, the book currently feels pretty close to worthless (which could change, but I don't know what the show could possibly do now to justify the existence of a fictional account of fictional events).

Pretty much


She feels right at home with the stilted weirdness of Norma, Ed, Denise, etc.

Also this show had fucking Leo
fnDXKtd.gif
 

Not

Banned
Yet more people watched 9.

Look, nothing about this is conventional. It's success will be measured in how relevant it is years from now, and how many people it inspired to make great TV.

Fire Walk With Me, by traditional measures, was a complete failure.

But it clearly wasn't a failure.

Yeah, if anything, the buzz around that episode got more people aware of Twin Peaks
 

zethren

Banned
Again, I'm not trying to be a wet blanket and ruin the fanfare but when I come in here and I see people claiming that Tammy's acting is somehow intentional despite no evidence to the contrary, I find that unusual.

For instance, I don't think there's any other demonstrations of Chrysta Bell's acting ability since this appears to be her first real attempt at it. If you've literally never seen her act before and this is the only evidence you have, how can you assume it's intentional (other than blind faith)?

Because of Lynch, that's why. If she was actually a shit actress and doing a shit job, she wouldn't be there. Her performance is clearly in line with what Lynch wants for her scenes.
 
Because of Lynch, that's why. If she was actually a shit actress and doing a shit job, she wouldn't be there. Her performance is clearly in line with what Lynch wants for her scenes.

Kind of brings us back to square one doesn't it? That every single thing that is done by this messiah-like figure is by intention.
 
Kind of brings us back to square one doesn't it? That every single thing that is done by this messiah-like figure is by intention.

Of course it's by intention (with regards to acting specifically). She wasn't forced upon him. He chose her for the role. Intentionally. Whether you agree that she is right for the role or not, or whether she's a good actress is another thing entirely, but she's what Lynch wanted. Lynch can make questionable decisions open to criticism, but saying "that didn't work for me" is different to "that wasn't his intention". It's OK to think his intentions were a mistake, I doubt anyone here thinks he has a flawless record.

The way I see it, Lynch likes very specific performances. And by performance I don't mean "the actor who best mimics reality or a real person" which is how we judge most acting nowadays. He's not afraid to embrace a theatrical or over the top performance like someone out of the star system, he fetishises it if anything. Which is, again, not closed to criticism, but I believe is absolutely intentional.
 
I just can't imagine Mr. Phone Tosser not only not destroying the dossier, but also neatly stashing it back in its fancy box. If deceiving him was its intended purpose, it doesn't seem like it worked and even if it did, it didn't end up affecting the show in any way and now it's too late to introduce the idea that he doesn't know random Twin Peaks trivia.

I don't think Mr C found the dossier :)

The larger issue with the dossier though, is that it's supposedly found in 2016, and TP sounds clueless about Agent Cooper and Twin Peaks in her notes on it.
 
Kind of brings us back to square one doesn't it? That every single thing that is done by this messiah-like figure is by intention.

There is a difference between small continuity errors, and an actress who is in multiple scenes throughout the series.

I agree with your broad principle, that, some of this stuff is just bad, or a mistake. With Lynch it's really hard to know though, but just, statistically speaking, some of the stuff that looks like a mistake must be.

The equipment you can see in the mirror in Part 2? Clearly a mistake.

But this is no small detail. This is the only major new member of the FBI portion of the show. She's obviously doing something Lynch is okay with.

And yes, I think she's raw, and I'm not sure that acting is her thing, but I don't think what we're getting is clearly something Lynch is unhappy with, and obviously something he wasn't going for.
 

Kadayi

Banned
I think lynch's track record demonstrates that he's pretty considered in what he does and how he does it, and the effect that he's going for.

The notion that the guy responsible for scenes like these: -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UozhOo0Dt4o

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZowK0NAvig

That pretty much eat their way into your memory on the first viewing is somehow just goofing around on tP needs to be backed up with some solid arguments before I'm going to give it much credence.
 

PizzaFace

Banned
I don't think Mr C found the dossier :)

The larger issue with the dossier though, is that it's supposedly found in 2016, and TP sounds clueless about Agent Cooper and Twin Peaks in her notes on it.

That's the thing that is really bothering me about it, the timeline. Somehow it really lowers the current stakes in the show for me if Tammy goes on to create the annotated dossier 2 years later.
 

Joqu

Member
That's the thing that is really bothering me about it, the timeline. Somehow it really lowers the current stakes in the show for me if Tammy goes on to create the annotated dossier 2 years later.

okay, well... what if we're dealing with doppelganger TP and Gordon Cole there. how's that for stakes?


But seriously, you're right. Secret History should really take place before season 3. :/
 

g11

Member
I think lynch's track record demonstrates that he's pretty considered in what he does and how he does it, and the effect that he's going for.

The notion that the guy responsible for scenes like these: -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UozhOo0Dt4o

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZowK0NAvig

That pretty much eat their way into your memory on the first viewing is somehow just goofing around on tP needs to be backed up with some solid arguments before I'm going to give it much credence.

It always amazes me how David Lynch can make people so fucking creepy. The man behind Winkies, the Mystery Man and even though I guess they're technically not human, the Woodsmen. Like, that scene in Lost Highway where the Mystery Man calls himself should be the hokiest shit in the world and yet the first time I saw that, I could feel the hairs on my arm standing up.
 

Z..

Member
Kind of brings us back to square one doesn't it? That every single thing that is done by this messiah-like figure is by intention.

I get that people may buy a bit too much into the man's quirks and I understand the points you raise regarding the plot and world building in general, but questioning the bad acting on a Lynch production reeks of ignorance (not meant to insult you, we're all ignorant on some subjects)... this is something the man has been known for ever since he started out, quite literally. He can do what you're seeking equally well (check out The Elephant Man or The Straight Story) but the man man is known for purposefully insisting upon acting that looks forced and hacked together quite frequently.
 

Flipyap

Member
I get that people may buy a bit too much into the man's quirks and I understand the points you raise regarding the plot and world building in general, but questioning the bad acting on a Lynch production reeks of ignorance (not meant to insult you, we're all ignorant on some subjects)... this is something the man has been known for ever since he started out, quite literally. He can do what you're seeking equally well (check out The Elephant Man or The Straight Story) but the man man is known for purposefully insisting upon acting that looks forced and hacked together quite frequently.
There is a huge difference between that and what Chrysta Bell is doing.
Lynch has never asked anyone to act poorly. Whenever someone asks him or the actors about those scenes it always turns out that everyone was doing their best and playing those emotions earnestly.
 
There is a huge difference between that and what Chrysta Bell is doing.
Lynch has never asked anyone to act poorly. Whenever someone asks him or the actors about those scenes it always turns out that everyone was doing their best and playing those emotions earnestly.

That's surprising, I've always found the acting in Lynch movies to be stilted and weird in a consistent way. It was actually a big barrier to me enjoying his work for a long time, I've only warmed up to the style recently.
 

A-V-B

Member
Lol wow I did too

I was like "AW YEAH HE'S TALKING AGAIN"

Watch: when he gets back he'll give an hour-long nonstop John Galt-esque speech about the American spirit and small towns and power stations, and we'll be publicly begging for Dougie back

And in our darkened bedrooms, we'll be coping with that scene by thanking David Lynch for pushing the boundaries of television no matter the cost haha
 

Rien

Jelly Belly
Holy shit at the first 15-20 minutes of episode 3. That is some great scary and unsettling stuff. Straight up Eraserhead vibes and beyond.
The atmosphere in that scene is something only Lynch can create. The best of the first 4 episodes i have seen so far.
I am loving the hell out of this.
 

Chumley

Banned
Kind of brings us back to square one doesn't it? That every single thing that is done by this messiah-like figure is by intention.

This is accurate. Lynch fans making excuses for Chrysta Bell's casting (not necessarily on here but all over AVClub) and acting is the height of Lynch stanning. It's ok to admit he fucked up on this one and was likely at least partially motivated by his well documented perv affectations.

He has flaws. The idea that every frame of his is perfect and if you don't like all of it you just don't understand it is patronizing.
 

hydruxo

Member
Yeah, Chrysta Bell was totally miscast here and it bums me out because Tammy could've been so much more interesting. I mean, there's still a lot of show left, but thus far she's been disappointing.
 
Not that her lack of acting experience was unknown, but this bit from a recent Vanity Fair interview with Lillard kind of says it all:

It was his first scene of the day—and the first scene in which Chrysta Bell, who plays F.B.I. Agent Tammy Preston, had performed, outside of short films and TV movies. ”She'd never been on set before," Lillard said. ”So you have an actress that's like, ‘Hi, this is my first day of acting. . . This is my first scene that I've ever done.'"

I mean cmon...can we call a spade a spade. Plus, it was done in two takes including her part:

Luckily, they both showed up ready for work. They got the scene done in two takes. (As Lillard put it, Lynch is ”a little like [Clint] Eastwood. Clint Eastwood is like, one take and you're out . . . You sort of know that you're on the playing field and it's go time.")

Whole thing is worth a read, some other good bits:

Lillard was given no background on his character and had no idea what his motivation was. As he prepared to film that interrogation scene, Lillard recalls pulling Mark Frost aside to see if he could get any information to ground his performance. ”He was like, ‘I can't tell you anything,'" Lillard said. ”I'm like, ‘Yeah, I understand that, but I don't have any idea what any of this means. I don't understand any of it. So you've got to let me know at least what I'm talking about.'" Frost did, for the record, walk the actor through what his character had experienced.

Lillard auditioned for his Twin Peaks role; as he noted, ”when a David Lynch opportunity comes through, you're jumping at the chance." When he first started reading through his lines, Lillard wondered—as actors often do—if his character would end up doing anything noteworthy, ”or if it's just going to be this kind of pedantic normal guy." Luckily, ”normal" people don't have a place in Twin Peaks. When he got to the interrogation scene, Lillard was thrilled—but nervous. His first thought? ”That's bananas."

”I will say that it's the most intimidating scene I've ever read on the page," Lillard said. ”Because you know that the stakes are really high, because people are going to watch, and then you realize that there's this slug line of emotional high stakes, and then none of it means anything. So you're like, ‘Oh my God, how do you do that? . . . Can I actually pull this off?'"

The enormity of the project he was working on—and particularly this scene—hit Lillard as he drove to the shoot.

”I was thinking to myself, ‘Oh my God, people are going to see this scene all over the world. And it's going to be around forever,'" Lillard said. ”I was super aware of the fact that I was doing something that wasn't an average day of work. I was crazy stressed."

Interesting to hear about Frost's involvement there, figured he'd be hands off with the actors this go around. I'm assuming he was for the most part but cool to see he got to sorta play director there even if it was just for backstory to help Lillard process his part. I'm assuming Lynch was zero help lol.
 

Not

Banned
Holy shit at the first 15-20 minutes of episode 3. That is some great scary and unsettling stuff. Straight up Eraserhead vibes and beyond.
The atmosphere in that scene is something only Lynch can create. The best of the first 4 episodes i have seen so far.
I am loving the hell out of this.

Yeah that was my favorite part of the new season so far
 
Not that her lack of acting experience was unknown, but this bit from a recent Vanity Fair interview with Lillard kind of says it all:

I mean cmon...can we call a spade a spade. Plus, it was done in two takes including her part:

Lynch knows how Chrysta Bell behaves and he fucking loves it. It's not like he hasn't worked with non-actors before. And his style of directing is very hands on when it comes to getting actors to move a certain way. He will tell them things to elicit a certain reaction as they are shooting a scene. He uses a megaphone too.

I don't know why it's so hard to accept Lynch wants Tamara Preston to be the way she is. I don't like it, but this idea that somehow Lynch didn't get what he wanted is absurd and totally patronizing to him. He made a choice he is happy with that some of us don't like. Oh well.
 

Chumley

Banned
Lynch knows how Chrysta Bell behaves and he fucking loves it. It's not like he hasn't worked with non-actors before. And his style of directing is very hands on when it comes to getting actors to move a certain way. He will tell them things to elicit a certain reaction as they are shooting a scene. He uses a megaphone too.

I don't know why it's so hard to accept Lynch wants Tamara Preston to be the way she is. I don't like it, but this idea that somehow Lynch didn't get what he wanted is absurd and totally patronizing to him. He made a choice he is happy with that some of us don't like. Oh well.

No one said he "didn't get what he wanted". We're saying (or at least I am) that he fucked up by wanting it. Casting her was a bad decision.
 

Flipyap

Member
I mean cmon...can we call a spade a spade. Plus, it was done in two takes including her part:
Luckily, they both showed up ready for work. They got the scene done in two takes. (As Lillard put it, Lynch is “a little like [Clint] Eastwood. Clint Eastwood is like, one take and you’re out . . . You sort of know that you’re on the playing field and it’s go time.”)
Did he always work like that? Because I feel like it's been biting him in the ass like never before (or at least his awful new editing tricks have made it apparent to everyone that he failed to get that perfect take).
 
Everyone I've watched with seems to like her character or at least tolerate her. I'd take an hour long movie of Tammy over another five minute scene of Michael Cera with Andy and Lucy fawning over either side of him.
 

Blader

Member
Why do people give a fuck about ratings? The show is done, there is no season 4 coming. The ratings do not matter in the slightest.
 
Why do people give a fuck about ratings? The show is done, there is no season 4 coming. The ratings do not matter in the slightest.

In a world where the X-Files is getting another season I'm positive if David Lynch wants to do a S4 of Twin Peaks he'll get it.
 
Yeah, I don't think he's against doing another season if there is a good story to tell.

Maybe that's the Agent Coop is back season so many people want as well. We want this show to be successful as possible.
 
This thread has really gone to shit

The bad posts are intentional. The OP meant for the thread to go to shit. You just don't get it.

I wish it was more like the hype threads 2 years ago though. This one is nothing like those. Might as well be an OT for a different show. So many useless posts. Where's the damn editor mod?
 
I'm finding the wait for episode 10 worse than waiting for episode 9 from 8, to be honest.

I loved episode 8 and had a great couple of weeks discussing it with people but the story hook in 10 with Bobby, Hawk and Truman going on the hunt has me keen to so what happens in a more grounded way.
 

Goldmund

Member
I had no idea Chrysta Bell wasn't a professional actress. I think she's great in that role. Looking back at it now, the show is pretty on the nose about it in a meta way. It anticipates and rejects the criticism to come. Bryson not being sure about her, Cole commending her progress. Even her being lost in the Ma (間)-tinged scene with Diane and Cole sharing a cigarette has that dynamic. These seasoned people are so confident, they can just stand there doing nothing. She needs to get out of it.
 

EGM1966

Member
No one said he "didn't get what he wanted". We're saying (or at least I am) that he fucked up by wanting it. Casting her was a bad decision.
Technically if he's getting what he wanted he didn't fuck up: it's just what he wants isn't popular with all.

I'm in the camp that's struggling with her performance too but its clearly his choice and I'm not convinced he's regretting it. Dirty old bugger.

She's growing on me a bit just by familiarity I guess. Anyway Kyle's so, so good in this thus far I'm happy just with that alone from a performance perspective.
 

Maligna

Banned
If the ratings of The Return are in any way correlating with the downloads I've been getting on my Twin Peaks podcast, I think they are gonna be in good shape.

Each week when I release an episode we easily beat our previous record for single day downloads. So perhaps the show is seeing a similar climb each week as word of mouth spreads about it?
 
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