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Twin Peaks Season 3 |OT2| It's Just A Change, Not An End

EdmondD

Member
Rick and Morty is great. I have been binge watching Bojack Horseman and really enjoying it. For a cartoon comedy about a horse person the drama is surprisingly good. I bought Deadly Premonition a while ago but could not get it to run despite numerous tweaks. I have a good lp of it bookmarked though.

I think I'm gonna finally play Life Is Strange to see if it'll sort of fill the TP void temporarily.
Good game with some cool references here and there. It doesn't really capture the Twin Peaks feel though but still good.
 
I'm guessing it's just little references like that and not so much stylistic similarities, but that's neat. Definitely makes me want to figure out why I can't get the damn thing to run right, I'm using a good rig.

well the town itself is in the PNW, looks very similar. there is also a diner very similar to the RR.
 
I really want to know about Ontkean. Dude went from excited to retired and no one said anything further.


Just started this what in fuck is going on hahaha here I'm thinking a straight continue from season 2 nope lynch being lynch with the complete 180

this amazon review pretty much nails it, altho I might drop the soap opera to 10% and 70% avant-garde sci-fi/fantasy to 75%

Here's how I see it. Twin Peaks season 1 & 2 was a mix of the following:

33% soap opera
33% avant-garde sci-fi/fantasy
33% comedy

After watching the first 4 episodes of season 3, I consider this season to be:

70% avant-garde sci-fi/fantasy
15% soap opera
15% comedy

For hardcore Lynch fans, this could be a great combo. But for casual season 1 & 2 viewers who may not have seen any of Lynch's other films, it may be disappointing. Take that under consideration when giving these new episodes a try.
 

EdmondD

Member
Just started this what in fuck is going on hahaha here I'm thinking a straight continue from season 2 nope lynch being lynch with the complete 180

LA Kings fan? Nice. *fist bump* It's a crazy ass ride but one I think you will enjoy. It's a different kind of Twin Peaks but that's not a bad thing at all.
 
LA Kings fan? Nice. *fist bump* It's a crazy ass ride but one I think you will enjoy. It's a different kind of Twin Peaks but that's not a bad thing at all.
Oh I can tell Lynch has combined all his work in this the scfi shit is so freaky right now felt more uncomfortable than I did for the movie IT hahaha
 
Having watched the synchronized version of episodes 17 and 18, there are at least 19 points where one episode seems to be talking to or referencing the other. Sabrina Sutherland denied that they weren't meant to be watched simultaneously, but those connections felt emotionally true, even taking into account some confirmation bias since I went to the effort of finding a synchronized version to watch.
 
Having watched the synchronized version of episodes 17 and 18, there are at least 19 points where one episode seems to be talking to or referencing the other. Sabrina Sutherland denied that they weren't meant to be watched simultaneously, but those connections felt emotionally true, even taking into account some confirmation bias since I went to the effort of finding a synchronized version to watch.
Can you name some specifics? Or things you felt were important connections

(I don't expect you to find timestamps or anything unless you really want to, lol. just curious)
 
Can you name some specifics? Or things you felt were important connections

(I don't expect you to find timestamps or anything unless you really want to, lol. just curious)

I actually took notes because I was skeptical about it at first:

Cole's exposition laid over Cooper's attempt to save Laura by leading her away from the rendezvous with Ronnie, Jacques, and Leo and Cooper stepping out of the Losge to find Diane in Glastonbury Grove while Naido moans and reaches out as Diane caresses Cooper'a face felt very resonant.

Electricity crackles as Mr. C drives down the highway while Cooper and Diane drive down the highway, both looking for a transition point to somewhere else. Mr. C disappears amidst electrical crackle as Cooper examines the power lines overhead.

Camera zooms in on the back of Mr. C's head as camera closes in on Diane and Cooper driving down a dark highway. Naido moans as Diane makes the transition to another place with Cooper. James asks what's going on at the same time the audience would.

Chad and Dale both open a door. Chad is getting a gun. Dale is arming the trap for Judy with Diane? Cooper says, "Diane" in 18, and Truman responds, "Cooper" in 17. That's a little eerie.

Andy tells Lucy, "Very important" by looking at the camera and through the 4th wall(?) as Diane and Cooper start to kiss and the song plays.

Mr. C lies on the ground, shot. Cooper lies in his hotel bed. Hawk says, "That is Agent Cooper," to which Sheriff Truman, replied, "It's not" just before Cooper reads the "Dear Richard" letter.

"What the fuck you doing," asks one man in a cowboy hat while another watches Cooper put the ring on Mr. C's finger after Freddie destroyed the Bob bag with punching.

Third cowboy's gun and the ring touch the ground at almost the same time.

Cooper is notably not brandishing a weapon in the Twin Peaks Sheriff's office, while almost everyone else is armed. He's the only person armed in the diner.

Carrie tells Cooper that normally, the door would be slammed in his face. Cooper responds in 17 that he's "going through that door."

When we'd see Mr. C drive down a dark highway, it would usually be accompanied by the electrical crackle. When Richard/Cooper and Carrie drive down the highway, electrical crackle as Mike and Cooper enter the convenience store to talk to Jeffries.

Laura rides with James while Carrie rides with Richard/Cooper. James is to the right of Laura in the shot because he's driving the bike. Cooper is to the right of Carrie in the shot because he's driving her. Carrie talks about being too young to know as we see Laura and James talk about love and running away together.

Really, the James/Laura stuff while Cooper drives Carrie to Twin Peaks up to Laura telling James that he wants to take her home now works together. She's quiet, and the scene is tense and still because she's reminiscing/remembering subconsciously?

We get two shots of the stoplights almost on top of each other. Carrie doesn't remember anything about the Palmer house or neighborhood as Laura leaves James to meet her doom.

Cooper reaches for Carrie's hand, and they start walking toward the Palmer house as Laura's Theme starts playing in 17. Laura tells Cooper that she's seen him in a dream. Cooper reaches for Laura's hand as Richard/Cooper knocks on the door.

"We're going home" right after "There's no Sarah Palmer here" right after Laura's corpse disappears.

Laura disappears amidst her screams in 17's end as credits play over 18 with Laura forever telling Cooper something that we will never hear.

By the time 18's credits are done, we are treated to Julee Cruise's performance from 17's credits to wrap up Twin Peaks: The Return.
 

Krev

Unconfirmed Member
Synchronicity readings are the dark 10 minute car ride to madness.
Pretty well thought out response. I think Lynch did want to close the book on this world and our connection to it, in some way. When we finished the final episode, my friend said he felt like he'd seen enough of Twin Peaks and there was no longer any desire for more.
There's one thing I don't get. Why does the good ol Fireman appear in the Black Lodge at the end of S02 finale? Shouldn't he be in the place of goodness instead rather than sitting down with the Arm in the Black Lodge? Am I missing something there?
This I agree feels like a big inconsistency of the series. We could say that the Giant and the Fireman are different characters, but I don't think so. I think the idea is that the Fireman, who can also take the form of the old bellhop in the 'real' world, drops by to see if Cooper is going to come out on top against Bob. Some have interpreted the coffee that he brings to Coop as a test, where if it becomes oil, the person is going to be overcome by Bob. This explains why Mike and the bellhop say "Hallelujah!". Someone good has come to try and take down Bob.
[–]Backinstylegum 2 points an hour ago
Are you able to comment as to why Michael J. Anderson was not in the new series?
permalinksavereportgive goldreply

[–]SabrinaSOfficial [score hidden] 8 minutes ago
David loves Michael. David wanted Michael to be in the show. We asked Michael, but he declined the offer.

---

Sigh.

Rumours pointed to it being a dispute over money. MJA wanted more than they could afford.
Yes, he will, but that doesn't make him stupid or wrong. There's this strange thing that's happened with Twin Peaks that everyone who showed up for it, they pretty much showed up because of old Twin Peaks - and then when it became clear that this way in no way old Twin Peaks, a lot of people started being condescending about wanting old Twin Peaks. 'you like twin peaks? ha, okay, maybe you're not smart enough for twin peaks.'.

There's a lack of judgment and allowance for ambiguity that is extended to The Return, but which isn't extended to people's thoughts on it. I find that hypocritical.
It is hypocritical, but I understand where the sentiment comes from. People feel that the original show was an oddity that bucked expectations established by what else was on TV at the time, and it would be weird for the new show, if it were really to be Twin Peaks 2017, to give you more of what the original did, now that's familiar from having influenced so much of pop culture.
That doesn't mean that liking the original means you'll like the new one. It could be that the original had elements that were more to your taste and the new one rubs you the wrong way. Fair enough!
 

Scrooged

Totally wronger about Nintendo's business decisions.
Was it ever confirmed that the Red Room = Black Lodge? TMFAP refers to it as the 'waiting room' in season 2. This indicates it's somewhere in between, which would explain why both normal and doppelganger versions of people can exist there at the same time. And why both Bob and Laura are there at certain points, seemingly just hanging out.

I don't think we've ever seen the Black Lodge, imo.
 

sappyday

Member
Was it ever confirmed that the Red Room = Black Lodge? TMFAP refers to it as the 'waiting room' in season 2. This indicates it's somewhere in between, which would explain why both normal and doppelganger versions of people can exist there at the same time. And why both Bob and Laura are there at certain points, seemingly just hanging out.

I don't think we've ever seen the Black Lodge, imo.

Isn't the Black Lodge the vast darkness past the curtains?
 

Flipyap

Member
Was it ever confirmed that the Red Room = Black Lodge? TMFAP refers to it as the 'waiting room' in season 2. This indicates it's somewhere in between, which would explain why both normal and doppelganger versions of people can exist there at the same time. And why both Bob and Laura are there at certain points, seemingly just hanging out.

I don't think we've ever seen the Black Lodge, imo.
He could simply be referring to that specific room, which is just one of the red room's many red rooms.
There are quotes in every incarnation of Twin Peaks referring to that place as the (Black) Lodge.

Season 2 finale: "I'm in the Black Lodge with Dale Cooper."
Fire Walk With Me: "The good Dale is in the Lodge, and he can't leave."
Part 2: "I'm supposed to get pulled back into what they call the Black Lodge" -> OG Dougie gets pulled into the red room, the doppelganger ends up there in the finale.

It's the existence of a White Lodge that seems more than a little hazy right now. At least Season 2's fairy tale version of it doesn't seem like it would fit anywhere in Lynch's Peaks.
 

Corpsepyre

Banned
Well, what are the several rooms present within the red Room then ?

Also, that weird purple looking land in season 3, episode 3?
 

Zoe

Member
I think the purple place was the Lynch version of the white lodge.
No way the purple place is the White Lodge with Mother there. And Mr C would have needed access to stash Diane there.

I'll accept the black and white place as the White Lodge, but it's nothing like what Briggs described in season 2.
 

Scrooged

Totally wronger about Nintendo's business decisions.
He could simply be referring to that specific room, which is just one of the red room's many red rooms.
There are quotes in every incarnation of Twin Peaks referring to that place as the (Black) Lodge.

Season 2 finale: "I'm in the Black Lodge with Dale Cooper."
Fire Walk With Me: "The good Dale is in the Lodge, and he can't leave."
Part 2: "I'm supposed to get pulled back into what they call the Black Lodge" -> OG Dougie gets pulled into the red room, the doppelganger ends up there in the finale.

It's the existence of a White Lodge that seems more than a little hazy right now. At least Season 2's fairy tale version of it doesn't seem like it would fit anywhere in Lynch's Peaks.

Hmm. Yeah I guess I forgot about those mentions. That does raise questions about the White Lodge then. Maybe that's the one we haven't seen. Everyone is just kinda assuming the mauve ocean reality houses the White Lodge with the Fireman. Maybe that's something completely different. Nobody has mentioned it by name this season right?
 

Vectorman

Banned
Well I definitely liked alot about that AMA, kinda confirms Lynch being the main designer of how scenes went, with Frost helping the script. Seemed like he just used it a reference and directed the way he wanted the story shown.
 

Flipyap

Member
Well, what are the several rooms present within the red Room then ?
I'm not sure what you're asking exactly.
We've seen the room which could be described as the waiting room, which also has its own double staffed by doppelgangers. There's the table room, the manufacturing room, Leland's pouting room, there are some empty rooms where you can go for a jog and there might even be a separate fiery punishment room.

Hmm. Yeah I guess I forgot about those mentions. That does raise questions about the White Lodge then. Maybe that's the one we haven't seen. Everyone is just kinda assuming the mauve ocean reality houses the White Lodge with the Fireman. Maybe that's something completely different. Nobody has mentioned it by name this season right?
I don't think it's ever been mentioned by name in Lynch-directed Peaks.
 

Krev

Unconfirmed Member
Well I definitely liked alot about that AMA, kinda confirms Lynch being the main designer of how scenes went, with Frost helping the script. Seemed like he just used it a reference and directed the way he wanted the story shown.
I think it started with Frost brainstorming and laying the foundations alone, then he asked Lynch to come on board and they spent some time developing it further and writing together, with Frost handling the bulk of the actual writing, then Lynch did final rewrites alone and got to envision it the way he wanted to direct it. Frost gets the books as his way of having a final say.
 

-Plasma Reus-

Service guarantees member status
From a couple pages back:

ozE1bg9.gif
This is some 4th wall breaking shit. omg.
 
I originally took the gratuitously looping footage of Sarah stabbing the photo to just be a creepy stylistic choice, but it could be pulling double duty to match the pacing of the final shot of 18.
 
I still find it funny/sad that one of the only scenes leaked from the season was the very single last one. I remember reading about it years ago and wish I didn't when it was time to watch it.
 
You could probably overlap two episodes of anything and find a connection somewhere along the line.

I wonder what they would have done if Ontkean had agreed to come back. And Bowie. The show would have been so much different surely?
 

bunbun777

Member
What made sheriff Truman's hat pop up exactly when Mr C shot at him? It's kinda comical and i thought Truman was shot in the head at first.
 

gun_haver

Member
You could probably overlap two episodes of anything and find a connection somewhere along the line.

I wonder what they would have done if Ontkean had agreed to come back. And Bowie. The show would have been so much different surely?

To overlapping - yeah, that crossed my mind earlier. Pretty much anything could be played along with something else and certain things would appear to match up. Aside from the ending of 17/18 with Laura's scream/evil Sarah and it leading directly into Julee Cruise, I don't find any of the other stuff compelling at all. So I think it's just one of those coincidences, and it's brought about by people being forced to search for meaningless in a couple of hours that don't...uh, appear to have much, let's say that.

As for Ontkean and Bowie - nah I think it would've been the same, it was probably written at first with them expected to reprise their roles in some way. Just substitute in Frank back for Harry and change the 'where's Harry' dialogue, and as for Jeffries, keep him where her is except he isn't a kettle, he's David Bowie.
 
You're probably right about Bowie, but Frank felt like a bit part player in the series, especially in the latter episodes. Harry would have had a much bigger role wouldn't he?
 

Krev

Unconfirmed Member
No way the purple place is the White Lodge with Mother there. And Mr C would have needed access to stash Diane there.

I'll accept the black and white place as the White Lodge, but it's nothing like what Briggs described in season 2.
The black and white place was revealed to be the same as the purple place in episode 8.

I took the mother crossing over to the purple place as a sign that evil is winning, and the Fireman is fighting that. That's what he was referring to with the opening clue: "it is in our house now."
 

Solo

Member
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Who on earth are these people that watched Episode 17 and decided "nah, I'm good" and didn't watch Episode 18, which followed immediately?
 

Mogwai

Member
aa9d4bdd3c79118c7281d0489044700b.png


Who on earth are these people that watched Episode 17 and decided "nah, I'm good" and didn't watch Episode 18, which followed immediately?
Well, that's interesting.

Perhaps a lot of people didn't even finish watching episode 17 for some reason?
 

Blader

Member
The black-and-white aesthetic of the White Lodge doesn't really match up to how it was described by Windom Earle in s2 (or very briefly seen with Briggs), but since Lynch wasn't involved with the show at that point it'd probably just a case of liberties being taken that Lynch didn't agree with and just ignored.
 

Corpsepyre

Banned
It's totally possible that's what it ended up looking as after the Mother released all the evils, and started consuming the White Lodge slowly (guess that's what the Fireman means when he says 'It's in our house now'.

I don't remember what the White Lodge was supposed to look like in the original series though.
 

Blader

Member
It's totally possible that's what it ended up looking as after the Mother released all the evils, and started consuming the White Lodge slowly (guess that's what the Fireman means when he says 'It's in our house now'.

I don't remember what the White Lodge was supposed to look like in the original series though.

The White Lodge still looks like that in episode 8 though.

In s2, Windom Earle describes the White Lodge as this:
Once upon a time, there was a place of great goodness, called the White Lodge. Gentle fawns gamboled there amidst happy, laughing spirits. The sounds of innocence and joy filled the air. And when it rained, it rained sweet nectar that infused one's heart with a desire to live life in truth and beauty. Generally speaking, a ghastly place, reeking of virtue's sour smell. Engorged with the whispered prayers of kneeling mothers, mewling newborns, and fools, young and old, compelled to do good without reason ...

But Earle had never been and is crazy anyway, and Lynch clearly does not give much of a shit about Windom Earle in the first place, heh.
 
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