Keep telling yourself that.
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Two Virginia television journalists fatally shot in on-air attack[READ OP]
- Thread starter chadskin
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Keep telling yourself that.
Because one is possible and the other isn't?
Why do you think people would not agree to ban guns but agree to make them prohibitively expensive? Most of the people who don't want a gun ban to happen are people who own guns, you know.
He's not wrong...
I used to feel the same way but not any more. The discussion should happen immediately. We're not talking about a knee jerk reaction to an extreme outlier (IE - the crazy responses after 9/11) but rather reactions to something that's been an ongoing problem for decades. Gun violence isn't just Sandy Hook and Columbine and this, it happens in big cities and small towns every single day.
LyleLanley
Banned
What does that mean?
Marty Chinn
Member
That's a fair point. There would probably be a lot more deaths if people weren't told not to do it because it's illegal. Deaths caused by drinking and driving aren't usually intended by the drunk driver; they're just the result of shitty judgement. That said, aren't the numbers still substantially high given that this after being told not to do it?
We can ban people but we can't ban guns. Or something? I'm not sure what they are trying to say either.
No, I do do it. They do obfuscate well constructed arguments. I get that these types of debates will always be heated, but doing shit like that makes people on both sides more tenacious in their beliefs.
I just wish we could find some middle ground without having to shit on folks.
fastford58
Member
These types of posts are actually pretty gross.
You want to ban guns to save lives but are then wishing death or injury on many innocent people because they happen to support something you don't. It's actually quite gruesome.
Do people even think when they say things like this? No, of course not.
I am against banning guns altogether. It's nice to know you wish death or injury upon my person.
I completely agree and it signifies yet another reason this country sucks.
Pristine_Condition
Member
Classy.
It's a dumb thing to say, but killers don't usually lament the victims of killings, do they? Unless of course you actually know a few (I don't).
Air Zombie Meat
Member
You'd see opposition to this based on pricing a "right" out of the less wealthys hands.
There is some truth to this sentiment - in a utilitarian sense, yes, it makes sense to focus on the largest causes of death first. And I agree, it would be wonderful if we found a way to minimize deaths from irresponsible alcohol use.
However, the misconception here is that society can only solve one issue at a time, and the implication that if we cannot "solve" the problem of irresponsible alcohol use than we cannot "move on" to "solve" the problem of gun violence until we have dealt with the irresponsible alcohol use because it represents a larger statistical threat.
I guess to diagram this common pattern it would be "We can't focus on X because Y is a bigger issue." But in this case, Y is either an unrelated issue or something that is a contributing cause to X but also not being dealt with by the arguer, which undermines the point that we need to focus on Y.
For example, the sentiment "We can't focus on gun control because mental health is a bigger issue." And indeed, mental health is a very important issue that does cause gun violence. Yet the people against gun regulation are also defunding therapy programs, which is clearly not helping the issue of mental health.
But beyond this, the simplest way to counter this line of thought is that society can solve multiple problems at once, and in fact this is exactly why we have people who specialize in different areas! The therapists aren't going to be crafting legislation to restrict guns and the legislators aren't going to be practicing therapy - they each have their own job and function and can accomplish both at the same time.
cpp_is_king
Member
People will actually be shocked, it just goes to show how powerful the 800-pound gorilla in the room (aka the NRA) is.
Ever tried shooting someone without a gun?
Improving mental health in this country is something a lot of people would get behind if there were a major campaign for it. A campaign to ban all guns would be laughed at by the majority of the country.
I want to replace the lives of innocents killed by a weapon with those that feel said weapon will protect them.
Sorry if you fall into the later category but perhaps you should think about what it is you are supporting.
I agree.
But look at all the fucks I give about the misinformed majority...
*sweeps his arms across a vast sea of zero fucks*
Fenderputty
Banned
Wow. I've been banned for telling people to fuck off and I get to hear about how jackhole here wishes me death.
Pinchable Buttocks
Banned
Gun control debate circle.
1a. We should ban guns.
1b. No its too soon, think of the victims.
2a. Seriously, we should ban guns.
2b. We may as well ban everything that kill us then. Driving, alcohol, firecrackers, roller coasters, dogs. ban them all.
3a. Look at Britain and Australia, they practically eradicated their gun problem.
3b. Lol, now you wondering why you guys still have kings? FreEDom Fuq yrr America, Better not touch my draw????!!?
1a. We should ban guns.
1b. No its too soon, think of the victims.
2a. Seriously, we should ban guns.
2b. We may as well ban everything that kill us then. Driving, alcohol, firecrackers, roller coasters, dogs. ban them all.
3a. Look at Britain and Australia, they practically eradicated their gun problem.
3b. Lol, now you wondering why you guys still have kings? FreEDom Fuq yrr America, Better not touch my draw????!!?
Because the punishment for Drinking and driving is not severe enough for people to stop doing it, not to mention, Driving while drunk is more of a arrogant action as in "Im good enough Driver to drive my car like this"
didnt the sandy hook shooters use rifles?
People laughed at a lot things that we hold as self-evident truths.
cpp_is_king
Member
The problem is that both sides are extreme. On one side you have "ban all guns" and on the other side you have "fuck you, I want my guns". The solution is not for the sides to laugh at each other and say "Haha you're a dumbass, that'll never happen". The solution is to find a middle ground.
Jacksinthe
Banned
You're advocating the death of anyone who doesn't want to flat out ban guns.
What the fuck is wrong with you? What the fuck do you call that disgusting line of thinking? "Replace" people who don't want outright bans with the victims. ie- "die, scum".
Jesus H Fuck check yourself in somewhere, psycho.
Suikoguy
I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions
Banning guns in a way similar to Australia is not "impossible" in the physical sense, but it's impossible (right now) in the political sense.
While I advocate for such changes. I'm not against moderate gun control legislation as a starting point.
Michael F. Assbender
Banned
Haven't seen the shooter's video, but how'd he do it? Was he walking with his gun in one hand and phone in the other, filming?
RIP
This constant shooting shit scares me to death about the world I'm leaving for my little girl. She's one year old. Even if she dodges every possible childhood disease/possible cancer, doesn't get into bad habits as a teen and doesn't OD or worse, isn't shot up at school, makes it past all the crazy drunk drivers and rapists of the world, and becomes the amazing, beautiful, independent, strong woman I know she will be, some asshole dud of a human being who isn't brave enough to just swallow a bullet in his dingy shithole apartment could decide to snuff out her life, totally at random, while she's at work, at home, or even while relaxing at a movie theater.
Fuck this country.
RIP
This constant shooting shit scares me to death about the world I'm leaving for my little girl. She's one year old. Even if she dodges every possible childhood disease/possible cancer, doesn't get into bad habits as a teen and doesn't OD or worse, isn't shot up at school, makes it past all the crazy drunk drivers and rapists of the world, and becomes the amazing, beautiful, independent, strong woman I know she will be, some asshole dud of a human being who isn't brave enough to just swallow a bullet in his dingy shithole apartment could decide to snuff out her life, totally at random, while she's at work, at home, or even while relaxing at a movie theater.
Fuck this country.
As long as once responsible gun owners keep killing innocent people, more guns controls will eventually come.
We cannot as a country continue to accept the ridiculous status quo we live with right now. So all you responsible gun owners who haven't killed any innocent people yet? Don't blame me when you can't buy anymore guns, blame the statistically white male in his mid 30s down the street who just used a gun to kill his family and himself.
We cannot as a country continue to accept the ridiculous status quo we live with right now. So all you responsible gun owners who haven't killed any innocent people yet? Don't blame me when you can't buy anymore guns, blame the statistically white male in his mid 30s down the street who just used a gun to kill his family and himself.
Marty Chinn
Member
Just like universal health care? That was really easy to get people behind. I'm not so sure it's as straight forward to push metal health care especially when it would affect far less than the people who would have benefited from universal health care and that was such a hard sale to begin with. I think both are hard sales from a major campaign standpoint. Plus why does it have to be a 100% gun ban right now? Why can't it be a gun reduction and slowly move towards minimizing the amount of guns? Limit sales, limit access, offer huge incentives to turning in guns to reduce the amount of guns out there. If you can start to reduce the numbers that are out there now, and limit how many more are then put out there moving forward, you'll have reduced the number of guns in the country which I have to imagine would do some good.
Pinchable Buttocks
Banned
You're being dramatic.
eBay Huckster
Member
yeah, i'm personally in favour of something like this regulated so that it doesn't violate the rights of "protected classes", rather than flat-out taxation
The type that kill people with bullets.
Doug Heffernan
Member
What do you mean possibly related? Didn't the gunman say himself that it was racially motivated in his manifesto? I'm not arguing for one side or the other, just trying to get the facts straight.
Jacksinthe
Banned
This guy wants to put a bullet in anyone not calling for a ban and I'm dramatic?
I'm rolling my eyes - Just thought I'd let you know.
Why give a shit what anyone thinks? You're privy to the facts in this situation.
Freedom = $1.05
Banned
i'd take my chances with the latter 100% of the time over the former.
Zabant
Member
There were a lot of people that opposed the ban. (see)
It was a very contentious issue, with arguments of personal freedoms and many gun groups and manufacturers very much opposed to it, many people shared your own personal beliefs.
It also wasn't a sudden thing. that 1997 reference I gave was the final nail and was based around handguns, it took nearly a century to get to that point with;
6.2 1920 Firearms Act
6.3 1937 Firearms Act
6.4 1968 Firearms Act
6.5 The Firearms (Amendment) Act 1988
6.6 1997 Firearms (Amendment) Acts
Now I know America is not the UK, but over all i don't think we're all that different, it's not like say the US vs Saudi Arabia.
Would you be willing to support the US in taking the first steps down that long road, knowing that in the end; the facts have shown that for every other first world country it drastically reduces mass shootings?
I'm sure the victims of mass gun violence in America would rather be alive to have that choice.
Even if they did, I don't think anyone would argue that ARs are a bigger problem than handguns.
I think it would even be impossible in the physical sense. What would be the plan - to go door to door in 100 million homes?
I'm advocating their death in exchange for another individual who sees that guns are dangerous, deadly, and far to readily available.
I don't want any innocent to die, but if you willingly put yourself, and society at risk for some farcical "right" then I truly wish you would be swapped with the victims of said right.
Pie and Beans
Look for me on the local news, I'll be the guy arrested for trying to burn down a Nintendo exec's house.
That...they're more important to have than the death of thousands of innocent people? Thats not really something to be proud of or even consider as an argument.
Indeed I'd like to think anyone that thinks like that would fail the psych evaluation test all guns should be sold in conjunction with (a license which should be annual, or at most bi-annual).
Marty Chinn
Member
So the question is again, why aren't more people outraged?
the problem is everyone arguing for the middle ground gets ignored because "ugh it'd be hard to refute their well-informed argument, better dogpile the guy saying he wants everyone who doesn't support a gun ban to die"
and yeah that guy should calm down and his inflammatory rhetoric is not helping anyone and should be addressed
but then we go back to ignoring the middle ground arguments and shouting over them "NO BUT WHAT YOU REALLY WANT IS TO BAN ALL GUNS RIGHT??????"
90% of my middle ground arguments for mandatory psych evaluations and stricter penalties for possession of a gun not registered to you in a national federal database are either ignored or get thrown down the slippery slope of "yeah i agree with that BUT WHAT IF THEN YOU GO ON TO BAN ALL GUNS AFTER THAT?????" and then they still don't institute the policy they "agree" with
and yeah that guy should calm down and his inflammatory rhetoric is not helping anyone and should be addressed
but then we go back to ignoring the middle ground arguments and shouting over them "NO BUT WHAT YOU REALLY WANT IS TO BAN ALL GUNS RIGHT??????"
90% of my middle ground arguments for mandatory psych evaluations and stricter penalties for possession of a gun not registered to you in a national federal database are either ignored or get thrown down the slippery slope of "yeah i agree with that BUT WHAT IF THEN YOU GO ON TO BAN ALL GUNS AFTER THAT?????" and then they still don't institute the policy they "agree" with
Allegedly hollow points, according to him.
I am against it. Respond please with exactly what you wish were to happen to me again.
There is only one political party that would even consider that, and never on the national level as it would be political suicide.
Doing so at a state's level only drives purchases out of state and hampers your ability to control and manage gun ownership among your populace.
I live in Massachusetts. Should my state decide that the taxes for purchasing a $500 gun is $10,000 there is nothing stopping me from going to a gun show in New Hampshire, buying that same gun for $500 (probably tax free, almost certainly off the books) and bringing it back to Mass. Once I have the the gun in Mass the state is not aware of possession or ownership unless I notify them.
You can only make it so hard to a point before you totally lose control of the regulation part.
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