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[UltimateMarioMan]

No I don't mean make stupid unnecessary changes just redo the effects. T2's effects still hold up well compared to recent movies but T1 most certainly does not.

 

[CajoleJuice]

"Do a George Lucas" should never be meant as something good.

 

[darscot]

"Do a George Lucas" should never be meant as something good.

My thoughts exactly!

 

[human5892]

"Do a George Lucas" should never be meant as something good.

Amen to that.

Plus, I think the cheesy sci-fi effects of T1 are part of its charm, especially when combined with the 80's synth soundtrack. On some levels, T2 is a completely different movie.

 

[Crispy]

T1 isn't THAT bad....ok, the stop-motion sequence in the end of the movie is horrible, but the rest was good for its time. Not as good as Alien though.

 

[tedtropy]

In some ways the out-of-date effects lend well to the whole creepy, horror-movie feel of the flick. It's fine as is - T1 is more of a suspense/horror movie, while T2 is an action tour de force / visual orgasm.

 

[UltimateMarioMan]

So crappy special effects make it good? No. It destracts from rewatching an otherwise great movie.

 

[Grifter]

Directors need to be put on a 5 year maintenance schedule where they update their good movies.

 

[tedtropy]

So crappy special effects make it good? No. It destracts from rewatching an otherwise great movie.

I don't see what's so distracting about it. The fact that James Cameron was basically a nobody at the time, but was able to pull together the movie on such a limited budget and make it a great movie stands as his testament to a director. Why not focus on future projects?

 

[human5892]

So crappy special effects make it good? No. It destracts from rewatching an otherwise great movie.

You're missing the point -- as tedtropy pointed out (and I alluded to), the quality of the effects, combined with other factors, contributes to the overall "feel" of the film. Replacing them with some souped-up CGI could endanger the grittier, tenser attitude that the movie has in comparison to T2.

 

[UltimateMarioMan]

I don't mean "souped-up CGI" I mean make the Terminator NOT look like a puppet. It can still have the same feel.

 

[tedtropy]

I don't mean "souped-up CGI" I mean make the Terminator NOT look like a puppet. It can still have the same feel.

The actual Terminator endoskeleton is seen so briefly in the film that you have to question if it'd be worth the effort.

 

[Willco]

The Terminator has aged horribly. HORRIBLY.

The last fourty-five minutes are nearly unwatchable.

 

[SonicMegaDrive]

I LOVE the special effects used in T1.

For some reason, that chunky, slow-moving robot is a helluva lot scarier than it would have been had it been done today using computers.

 

[COCKLES]

The future war sequence in T1 shits all over the one in T2. The models were built to a spec of being 3 to 4 times larger for the sequel...but somehow, they manage to look 3 to 4 times more like models. :lol

One of the things I hate about T2 at the start....the rebels having 'uniforms'. Why? In the original everyone wears the bearest of rag-tag cloths like Mad Max cast-offs. It has a gritty realism that Cameron jettisoned for the sequel. And besides it's a better movie.

 

[Willco]

The future war sequence in T1 shits all over the one in T2. The models were built to a spec of being 3 to 4 times larger for the sequel...but somehow, they manage to look 3 to 4 times more like models. :lol

One of the things I hate about T2 at the start....the rebels having 'uniforms'. Why? In the original everyone wears the bearest of rag-tag cloths like Mad Max cast-offs. It has a gritty realism that Cameron jettisoned for the sequel. And besides it's a better movie.

No way.

The Terminator is virtually unwatchable anymore. It has a solid premise, even if doesn't make much sense (but none of them do) and Arnold as a complete badass is great...

... but the effects are so horrible that I just have to turn the film off right when the fake Arnold starts cutting the fake skin from his completely fake head.

It completely pulls you out of the movie and ruins any of that suspenseful atmosphere.

 

[SonicMegaDrive]

Completely agree with the grittiness bit.

Also, the first one seemed much more like a horror/thriller than the second one. T2 is a teriffic film, but it feels more like a Science Fiction Drama than its predecessor.

 

[Manics]

I totally disagree with what Lucas did in updating the effects in the original Star Wars movies. Movies are meant to be an artform, and should be left alone after they're complete. Going back 20+years later to "update" the movie is really stupid. This isn't software we're talking about.

 

[COCKLES]

No way.

The Terminator is virtually unwatchable anymore. It has a solid premise, even if doesn't make much sense (but none of them do) and Arnold as a complete badass is great...

... but the effects are so horrible that I just have to turn the film off right when the fake Arnold starts cutting the fake skin from his completely fake head.

It completely pulls you out of the movie and ruins any of that suspenseful atmosphere.

Yeah but the head looked fake-ass even in the 80's. You either buy into it or you don't. The stop motion has aged, but stop motion has it's own charms....again you buy into it or you don't. I'm sure in another 10 years time people will be bitching about the CGI in T2 - the scene in the kitchen when the T-1000 morphs from Vasquez into Robert Patrick for example looks ropey now, as does the scene where he emerges from the fire (which I believe were the first of the CGI for the film to be put together).

Future War bits look way better in T1...can't say how anyone can argue the point. In the sequel everythings too glossy and well lit. Culminating in the scene were a HK gets shot down with a stinger missle and hits the ground in all it's modelesque glory. Grainy cheap film stock and smoke covers a lot of the deficiencies in the original. The human camp - when Reece tells Conner 'We were this close to going out forever"...well you cn believe it.

As for the films. Well the sequel has more action, but the original has more heart. "I came back for you Sarah". How can you beat that really?

 

[SonicMegaDrive]

A bit off topic, but I agree with what was said about Star Wars and the "re-envisioning" process. I love the Star Wars Trilogy DVDs to death, but the CG they threw in there for the 1997 SEs seems disjointed and out of place to me. If only Lucas wasn't so stubborn and put the original 1977, 1980, 1983 version in the collection as well.

And speaking of remastering, and even more off-topic, they really need to bring out a new Blade Runner DVD, complete with both versions of the film. The picture quality on the current disc is AWFUL.

 

[human5892]

And speaking of remastering, and even more off-topic, they really need to bring out a new Blade Runner DVD, complete with both versions of the film. The picture quality on the current disc is AWFUL.

YES. I've long wanted a Blade Runner remaster.

 

[COCKLES]

A bit off topic, but I agree with what was said about Star Wars and the "re-envisioning" process. I love the Star Wars Trilogy DVDs to death, but the CG they threw in there for the 1997 SEs seems disjointed and out of place to me. If only Lucas wasn't so stubborn and put the original 1977, 1980, 1983 version in the collection as well.

And speaking of remastering, and even more off-topic, they really need to bring out a new Blade Runner DVD, complete with both versions of the film. The picture quality on the current disc is AWFUL.

Did Lucas include the Orson Wells narrated preview trailer for Star Wars on the trilogy boxset? I see it last year at a movie festival (before John Williams scored it)...it has a technoish forboding soundtrack and Orson Wells - it's really cool. But I heard Lucas doesn't consider it 'canon' trailer. WTF?!

 

[Orange]

Speaking of the "Wars", I wonder what the ratio is to people who hate the new effects, to people who are indifferent to them, or just don't care.

I do agree that original versions should be made available along with the remastered one. They did it for E.T. (walkie talkies, yeessH), so why not star wars?

T1, yeah, some of the effects look bad, but they always looked bad, we just became more sophisticated. Leave them the way they are, adds to the charm. All these special effect remasters just seem to make the movie less even, visually.

The only time I've ever wanted a director to change something was in Princess Bride. I like the score, but I really wish most of it wasn't synth. THe classical guitar stuff is ace though.

 

[Manics]

Speaking of the "Wars", I wonder what the ratio is to people who hate the new effects, to people who are indifferent to them, or just don't care.

I'm indifferent to the new effects except for the Han Solo scene where Han doesn't shoot first. That's total bullshit. Han shot him dead without that cocksucker touching the trigger on the other gun.

Also, I'll never forgive Lucas for changing the Ewoks "nub nub" song at the end of Jedi.

Han shoots first

 

[Gorey]

Speaking of the "Wars", I wonder what the ratio is to people who hate the new effects, to people who are indifferent to them, or just don't care.

Got the new set for xmas and so far, it isn't bothering me as much as I thought it would. I think this is largely due to a sense of thankfullness, however, that we have 4,5 and 6 after the atrocious trainwreck in progress that Ep 1 and 2 have been. Marginally hopefull for Ep 3, but not by much.

The Han-Greedo scene change sucks, and significantly changes han's character from 'bad man' to 'not-so-bad-man'. Yeah, I'm a nerd. I know.

But the single worst omission? The stormtrooper running into the door. I know they pulled that in the earlier SE's, but geez....that's a piece of childhood ripped away. I'll need therapy.

 

[SonicMegaDrive]

I thought Lucas changed the Han/Greedo scene back to the way it originally was for the DVD release? I'll have to watch that again.

 

[Orange]

I read that he changes the Han Greedo thing to make it look more like they both fired at the same time. I dunno, the trilogy has never been defined by that kind of little stuff for me, anyways, so I don't care so much.

I think we can all agree on the extended Jedi dance scene being complete ass though. I'm no star wars mega fan, but SHIT like that isn't exactly why we have star wars mega fans.

I liked episode 1 and 2. Especially 2, because I can pop it in and BAM, instantly I'm asleep.

 

[Ristamar]

I'd also like to see T1 touched up, mainly the stop-motion effects near the end. Barf.

 

[Manics]

I thought Lucas changed the Han/Greedo scene back to the way it originally was for the DVD release? I'll have to watch that again.

I refuse to watch it again. I saw it on videotape when they first released the special editions. Total bullshit. Greedo bit it and didn't have a chance to defend himself. Oota Goota.

 

[SpoonyBard]

I thought Lucas changed the Han/Greedo scene back to the way it originally was for the DVD release? I'll have to watch that again.

They shoot almost at the same time on DVD, so it's a bit better than the first special edition version where Greedo shoots much earlier. But obviously the original where Greedo doesn't shoot at all is the best version of that scene.

 

[Manics]

I read that he changes the Han Greedo thing to make it look more like they both fired at the same time. I dunno, the trilogy has never been defined by that kind of little stuff for me, anyways, so I don't care so much.

I would say it's a fundamental change to the storyline. The fact that Greedo never actually shot at Han Solo would suggest that Han is a bad-ass who does what it takes to stay alive - even killing a guy who would have probably just brought Han as a captive for reward money. (Correct me if I'm wrong it's been awhile since I've watched it, but wasn't Greedo going to take Han to Jabba the Hut as a prisoner?) By making that seemingly slight change, it suggests Greedo just wanted to kill Han Solo, so Han was justified in killing him in self-defense.

 

[Orange]

Maybe we just gave George Lucas too much credit...

I think what is important is that you interpret the movie in way you want to see it. You see Han as the bad guy, and maybe you "blinked" when you watched the special edition verison of that scene. You KNOW what you saw in the original version, and that will have to suffice.

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

T1's effects aren't hot, but... guys, it could've been worse. Check out this horrible attempt at an Arnoldbot that I saw in Tennessee in 2003:

 

[Jill Sandwich]

The stormtrooper banging his head is still on the DVD and Sarah Conner is a dickgirl, good-day.