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UK General Election - 8th June 2017 |OT| - The Red Wedding
- Thread starter Jezbollah
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PJV3
Member
Care agencies on the other hand will be ecstatic, I can see costs shooting upwards if this source of cash happens.
They're Tories.
I'm starting to think this is all a sham.
Start Brexit, rile up the populace with strong rhetoric and patriotic posturing, then oh - so - sadly lose the election. That means Labour and LibDem get handed the hot potato, and due to unreasonable attitude of the voting public they inevitably get bent over a barrel during the Brexit talks, which leads to them getting tarred and feathered by the angry masses. Afterwards you can swoop back in and be the great fixer and doer.
I mean, that's what I think of as an outsider as I watch the Labour and Libdem counts slowly creep upwards ever so slightly maybe possibly if you look at the numbers in a certain way. Does anyone seriously want to win this election? Anyone sane, I mean? Seems like a death curse for the party that wins.
Start Brexit, rile up the populace with strong rhetoric and patriotic posturing, then oh - so - sadly lose the election. That means Labour and LibDem get handed the hot potato, and due to unreasonable attitude of the voting public they inevitably get bent over a barrel during the Brexit talks, which leads to them getting tarred and feathered by the angry masses. Afterwards you can swoop back in and be the great fixer and doer.
I mean, that's what I think of as an outsider as I watch the Labour and Libdem counts slowly creep upwards ever so slightly maybe possibly if you look at the numbers in a certain way. Does anyone seriously want to win this election? Anyone sane, I mean? Seems like a death curse for the party that wins.
I've been trying to understand their policies beyond the usual "Tories are cruel" hyperbole.
They certainly don't make it easy though
Kotetsu534
Member
I get it. The Tories are pushing this so the Bank of Mum and Dad gets an injection of liquidity, and therefore house prices stay afloat or increase. You're going to pay for your social care down to your last £100k worth of assets, but there's nothing stopping you from transferring most of the rest of your assets to your children in your 60s and 70s and surviving long enough thereafter that they can't be clawed back. "You're going to give them to the government, you might as well give them to your children." Classic Tory policy.
Huw_Dawson
Member
Yes, although the article's making fun. It must be nice being in a party with a pet newspaper.
I would like to clarify that a whip-around with yellow buckets is a proud Liberal tradition and I will not have it joked about by a Guardianista!
Ahem.
I enjoyed it. It was nice to have a lot of people around - about 1000 people attended, according to Mark Pack. Farron is a likeable speaker who throws a bit of non-forced humour into his speeches. The manifesto will be discussed and compared over the next three weeks - setting out a stall of "This is Tim Farron's Liberal Democrats" was the goal of the night.
The dude gave his speech standing on top of an EU/UK flag combo for crying out loud.
And running the event in a nightclub was distinctly New Labour, which bizarrely is the position we have now occupied on the political spectrum.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Huw to invade Iraq confirmed.
Although it is indeed a pisstake, for a John Crace job it is virtually praise!
Anyway, glad to hear you enjoyed it.
Huw_Dawson
Member
Brexit has made strange bedfellows. Cable quoted Blair on Newsnight over a 2nd referendum. The idea of an extremely senior Lib Dem doing that before the referendum would have been laughable.
phisheep
NeoGAF's Chief Barrister
Because of the Salisbury convention.
Unpopular policies go in the manifesto not to win the election but to prevent House of Lords opposing them (where the Tories do not have a majority).
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
What are the odds that the Salisbury convention will hold, though? I mean, it is just a convention and we are living in unconventional times.
Huw_Dawson
Member
If the convention collapsed you would have a constitutional crisis.
The manifesto is the core document in the British constitution. To vote it down as an unelected chamber would be to challenge that.
The job of the HOL is to provide scrutiny on legislation and to make sure the government does not veer wildly off course.
Nobody wants May to do what she would certainly do if the convention collapsed, and that is flood the Lords with Tories.
(This is also why it rankles me when Andrew 'Friend of LDs Everywhere' Neil says that the LD manifesto is pointless - it's literally the most important document that the LDs, and all other parties, produce).
firehawk12
Subete no aware
Do British PMs not have the power to simply appoint more Lords from their party like they do here in Canada?
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
May has been dropping veiled hints about doing the latter anyway, though, at which point there's little incentive for the Lords to just mope along.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
They do, but the House of Lords is IIRC the second largest legislative chamber anywhere in the world after Cameron went full hog. If they get stuffed any more, the system will break.
phisheep
NeoGAF's Chief Barrister
They do, but to get even a bare majority they'd need to appoint another 300 peers. That's not in any way politically feasible for a party that has been banging on about the cost of politicians.
chromatic9
Member
Tories going for the treat them mean keep them keen approach.
Huw_Dawson
Member
Repealing the FPTA, because the PM being able to call a snap election whenever they want is good for democracy.
Who knew Ed Miliband was so unpopular here?
Being locked into 5 years pissed me off. When only the walking dead govts used the full 5 before.
And the act has already been shown to be useless.
As we've seen, it didn't really do anything.
JonathanEx
Member
Meanwhile, Sky News, who obviously are pro-Tory Murdoch stooges, are complaining about about the Conservatives blocking them out of events for their coverage: https://www.buzzfeed.com/jimwaterson/sky-news-and-conservatives?utm_term=.spkgGVJxj#.amxZXeWwP
Theonik
Member
TBH this mess we are going through right now proves the FPTA doesn't really work. Opposition won't oppose under fear they lose capital.
Huw_Dawson
Member
No, the act means the government must get parliamentary consent. There is no good reason for the PM (or more technically the Crown) having absolute authority over snap elections.
Labour +8 in latest IpsosMORI poll.
Con 49 (nc);
Lab 34 (+8);
LibDem 7 (-6);
Green 3 (+2);
UKIP 2 (-2)
34! My earlier prediction of mid-30s is looking pessimistic, Labour could end up in the high-30s at this rate. Of course the Tories will be in the 40s at least so that's a shame, but at least Jezza (or someone pushing similarly Left positions) will be staying on.
Insane that UKIP, Greens and the Lib Dems can't manage 15% between them. Our brief dalliance with a multi-party system appears to be well and truly over.
Oh good, I was worried our transformation into Little America wasn't going quite fast enough.
Seriously though, fuck this voter suppression bullshit.
Con 49 (nc);
Lab 34 (+8);
LibDem 7 (-6);
Green 3 (+2);
UKIP 2 (-2)
34! My earlier prediction of mid-30s is looking pessimistic, Labour could end up in the high-30s at this rate. Of course the Tories will be in the 40s at least so that's a shame, but at least Jezza (or someone pushing similarly Left positions) will be staying on.
Insane that UKIP, Greens and the Lib Dems can't manage 15% between them. Our brief dalliance with a multi-party system appears to be well and truly over.
Oh good, I was worried our transformation into Little America wasn't going quite fast enough.
Seriously though, fuck this voter suppression bullshit.
UKIP on 2% is delicious
Kotetsu534
Member
Ipsos MORI has the Tories holding steady while Labour makes a big move from April to May.
Huw_Dawson
Member
We'll see if that Labour bounce sticks. It would throw Tory plans for a landslide off by a little.
Where did the lab bounce come from? Don't knows?
There's still several weeks to go until the election and opinion polls typically flatter Labour so let's not get so excited by that "bounce."
For real though, voter fraud is such a minuscule problem and the need to show ID in the US was, let's not beat around the bush, instituted to stop ethnic minorities voting.
For real though, voter fraud is such a minuscule problem and the need to show ID in the US was, let's not beat around the bush, instituted to stop ethnic minorities voting.
RobotNinjaHornets
Banned
Lol, nicely done
FlammableD
Banned
They really are going for an American style campaign.
Huw_Dawson
Member
Potentially - it's either that or Lib -> Lab swing, but I don't think the latter would cover it. Probably a combo of a few Lib Dem swings and more solidified Don't Knows.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
.
War Peaceman
You're a big guy.
I don't think it is a racial issue so much here in the UK, more an age thing.
I'd take these Labour swings with a big pinch of salt. Let's wait and see how sustained it is.
chromatic9
Member
What about simply Theresa Pay.
We have a Audi/VW dealerships called Smith Knight and Fay but are well known as Smith Knight and Pay. Part costs are extortion.
40% would be absolutely excellent for labour imo. Considering the battering they've been taking. Like you say it gives them a very clear approval of the direction they have taken.
CyclopsRock
Member
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Corbyn's polling is now beating Miliband's at the same point when you use the same weightings.
I mean, Labour is still getting mashed either way, but I think we're getting close to the tipping point where there's simply no going back to what was. Not to say that Corbynism is going to stick around, but at the very least, "New Labourism" is dead.
I mean, Labour is still getting mashed either way, but I think we're getting close to the tipping point where there's simply no going back to what was. Not to say that Corbynism is going to stick around, but at the very least, "New Labourism" is dead.
But why?
That is an absolutely remarkable poll. Who would have expected in 2010 that you would see the two big parties getting 80+% of the vote in 2017? 83% would be the highest they've gotten since 1970.
The big question is really what the makeup of Labour's vote is right now.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
It was a joke, I just switched "Corbyn" and "Farron", and then "Liberal Democrats" and "Labour" from an old article to reflect the change in polling.
Doh. I thought the bit about Farron staying on was odd.
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