you reached the pirate ship "graveyard." That may have been one of the most perfect action sequences ever in a game. So much going on.. Drake swinging from the ships, your buddies conversing in motivating dialogue, phenomenal music.
WOW.
And also, there isn't "shamefully few" encounters in this game. This is what many people wanted, and it's definitely what I wanted. The constant encounters in U3 killed that game for me. I love exploring more, and fighting when the time comes. Now, that being said, the combat was much better and way more satisfying this time around, so I actually did look forward to the firefights. At times, yes, I did want a bit more.
For people that don't like the combat in Uncharted they will love this one, but for me there werent enough and I think it would have helped the pace and effectiveness of the story at times. And for replays combat will always be the highlight because it is the most dynamic gameplay element of the series.
Anyone else have issues with the game recognizing Triangle presses, particularly for reloading and reviving in MP? It happens on both of my controllers and I don't have this issue in any other game. Have died a few times because of it.
Anyone else have issues with the game recognizing Triangle presses, particularly for reloading and reviving in MP? It happens on both of my controllers and I don't have this issue in any other game. Have died a few times because of it.
Actually punish Drake or Sam for some of the shit they pull instead of the plot magically resolving itself via deus ex machina Elena once again going for the silly quips, (I mean FFS Sully straight up left the map of the vague Libertalia area that was really far off from where they thought it was with Drake so her finding the island, finding EXACTLY where Drake is in a river is the worst kind of narrative convenience), which isn't even getting into how she found out which incredibly specific motel he was staying at not being touched on at all. Seriously, I hope ND is actually brave enough to kill a protagonist for once in their next game, it kinda worked with Joel because he's a terrible person and the game emphasizes that at the end, but Drake is built up as a hero once again saving the day. The marketing proposes a more interesting story and plot resolution than the actual game
I feel that the ending didn't end the unbearably happy self indulgence. Doesn't even feel remotely divisive or worthy of the "sadness" that was apparently going around in the studio. They even could've had a similar monologue with Elena being pregnant but Drake dead and her daughter finding out about her dad's stuff with Elena telling her the truth. Not a complete dedication to so many genre tropes in film with absolutely no deviation whatsoever. The best recent films recently have been really brave with their narratives, defying character and genre tropes, etc. if games are gonna try to be film-like, they should too. It's the same problem with David Cage games, apparently Neil wanted to go dark, well then let him go dark.
I also think some people just don't really understand the characters or appreciate the nuance of the story telling or character exposition. Elena doesn't fall for Nate's quips, what an insulting premise. The whole point is that Elena not only empathised with why Drake lied, but deep down Elena was herself subduing the monotony and lack of adventure in her own life, just masking it better than Nate. Lest we forget she used to be an investigate journalist who of her own accord would be involved in death defying situations, and know how to sift them out. In several scenes such as the Pirate banquet, this realisation dawns on her, and it's the reason she invests in the company at the end in the first place. It's an escape for both of them, allowing them to do what they both yearn and love, but without as much danger.
I can say with absolute 100% certainty that I did not want some
droopy or unhappy ending
. I liked how it ended and how it wrapped the characters up before the epilogue. I don't know how I'd do an epilogue, but I thought this would have been fine without one, at least the one we got.
Hahaha, yeah. As much as gaming needs to improve its writing overall, some of the suggestions that come out of threads around here and elsewhere are just really bizarre sometimes.
Hahaha, yeah. As much as gaming needs to improve its writing overall, some of the suggestions that come out of threads around here and elsewhere are just really bizarre sometimes.
This is why I don't say "well, this is what I would've did" because everyone has opinions and ideas, and like I said earlier I find that trying to act like you can do it better is a little pretentious and I don't really like to do that thing. All I said was that I didn't care for the epilogue and that I think it would've been fine without it.
I can say with absolute 100% certainty that I did not want some
droopy or unhappy ending
. I liked how it ended and how it wrapped the characters up before the epilogue. I don't know how I'd do an epilogue, but I thought this would have been fine without one, at least the one we got.
I thought a lot of bittersweet and downright sad things already happened before the ending. Sam being in prison for fifteen years, Nathan and Elena's marriage being in jeopardy because of him trying to save Sam, etc. I think when you have a story with plenty enough grim elements that it's fine to have a pleasant resolve. After the fucking Last of Us, I found it very satisfying and even a little surprising that it wasn't darker
a white protagonist destroying half a Madgascar city while lying to his wife and then getting off scot free. really missed opportunity to critique the idea of the current status quo instead of reinforcing it.
That's the thing too is that it's nowhere near as pulpy as the previous games. You can see where they made way more efforts to stay grounded despite some grand moments.
I thought a lot of bittersweet and downright sad things already happened before the ending. Sam being in prison for fifteen years, Nathan and Elena's marriage being in jeopardy because of him trying to save Sam, etc. I think when you have a story with plenty enough grim elements that it's fine to have a pleasant resolve. After the fucking Last of Us, I found it very satisfying and even a little surprising that it wasn't darker
None of those things are bittersweet, bittersweet doesn't=everyone gets a cookie at the end except for the underused villain. TLOU doesn't have a bittersweet ending, it's a dark ending where Joel, a madman, has possibly doomed mankind due to his selfishness and whole lying to the face of the person most important to him.
I can say with absolute 100% certainty that I did not want some
droopy or unhappy ending
. I liked how it ended and how it wrapped the characters up before the epilogue. I don't know how I'd do an epilogue, but I thought this would have been fine without one, at least the one we got.
"Nathan should pay for his crimes!" don't understand UC4s story or the Uncharted franchise as a whole. To me, Nathan goes through a personal hell throughout UC4 which I think it's punishment enough. Watching his brother was Nathans enlightenment.
Not to mention Drake straight up saved the world THREE TIMES. He deserves a vain treasure hunt or two before the narrative demands he arrive at death's door.
No, you wanted one of them to die. You're confusing death of main characters as needed tension. THIS is not that type of game. It's never been that kind of game, and it's not necessary for a satisfying end.
I also never got the villification of Nate for this. Someone described him as a "human turd" for lying to Elena to give her peace of mind while risking his life to save his brother. It's like jeez, didn't know people weren't allowed to make mistakes with good intentions.
No, you wanted one of them to die. You're confusing death of main characters as needed tension. THIS is not that type of game. It's never been that kind of game, and it's not necessary for a satisfying end.
I thought Sam was going to die throughout most of the game and when Elena showed up for the third act I was like oh fucking no. It definitely toyed with your expectations to create tension. Just because they ended up not being killed off doesn't mean it lacked tension or that they weren't in danger
Actually punish Drake or Sam for some of the shit they pull instead of the plot magically resolving itself via deus ex machina Elena once again going for the silly quips, (I mean FFS Sully straight up left the map of the vague Libertalia area that was really far off from where they thought it was with Drake so her finding the island, finding EXACTLY where Drake is in a river is the worst kind of narrative convenience), which isn't even getting into how she found out which incredibly specific motel he was staying at not being touched on at all. Seriously, I hope ND is actually brave enough to kill a protagonist for once in their next game, it kinda worked with Joel because he's a terrible person and the game emphasizes that at the end, but Drake is built up as a hero once again saving the day. The marketing proposes a more interesting story and plot resolution than the actual game
I feel that the ending didn't end the unbearably happy self indulgence. Doesn't even feel remotely divisive or worthy of the "sadness" that was apparently going around in the studio. They even could've had a similar monologue with Elena being pregnant but Drake dead and her daughter finding out about her dad's stuff with Elena telling her the truth. Not a complete dedication to so many genre tropes in film with absolutely no deviation whatsoever. The best recent films recently have been really brave with their narratives, defying character and genre tropes, etc. if games are gonna try to be film-like, they should too. It's the same problem with David Cage games, apparently Neil wanted to go dark, well then let him go dark.
killing off a character was about the most obvious thing they could have done. To be honest it would have felt cheap to me, an easy way to evoke emotion. I think what we got was a fitting resolution to Nate's character arc, he learnt his lesson in UC3.
The only reason he got involved this time was because he thought Sam's life was at stake. Yes he did get carried away but when it came down to it and he knew the truth (that Sam didn't need the treasure) he was fully ready to walk away. That's the character growth and I thought it was really great to see Nate finally understand what his choices have done to those he loves. Because here we see him in the role of the sane one, if he deserves punishment that is it. All of his interactions with Elena in the last third show how much Nate knows he has screwed up, and how afraid he is that he has ruined this relationship for good. I think what saved the relationship was Nate trying to walk away in the end. That showed how much he had grown as a person, which Elena appreciated.
a white protagonist destroying half a Madgascar city while lying to his wife and then getting off scot free. really missed opportunity to critique the idea of the current status quo instead of reinforcing it.
That's the thing too is that it's nowhere near as pulpy as the previous games. You can see where they made way more efforts to stay grounded despite some grand moments.
He solved a puzzle in a clock tower causing it to break (but opening a hidden chamber) and then tried to escape from an army trying to attack him and save his brother, and the action quickly goes to the countryside
Do you also pick apart car chases in action movies? "That Jason Bourne sure needs to be punished for causing so much collateral damage! Oh and he's white too!"
I have no idea how you can't reconcile the tone and gamey parts of this experience.
And the
lying to Elena bit..like did you miss the whole point of the story and how Sam'a lie mirrors this or any of the character development as to why he lied?
He did both. First a huge church, then the city while recklessly driving, (Shoreline is responsible for this too but Nadine isn't exactly pretending to be a good guy). But Drake just laughs it off, then proceeds to not go after his wife and even send his best friend/father away. Even was a snippy dick to Sam who offered to help. Drake is an asshole.
No, you wanted one of them to die. You're confusing death of main characters as needed tension. THIS is not that type of game. It's never been that kind of game, and it's not necessary for a satisfying end.
In a story with very little actual tension, a character death would do a lot to raise the stakes, especially going through with said character death, UC3 even had a faux death moment and I was disappointed but understanding that they didn't go through with it because the plot wasn't the most straight faced portrayal of the "liar revealed" plotline tha plagues too many narratives in media.
"Nathan should pay for his crimes!" don't understand UC4s story or the Uncharted franchise as a whole. To me, Nathan goes through a personal hell throughout UC4 which I think it's punishment enough. Watching his brother was Nathans enlightenment.
He did both. First a huge church, then the city while recklessly driving, (Shoreline is responsible for this too but Nadine isn't exactly pretending to be a good guy). But Drake just laughs it off, then proceeds to not go after his wife and even send his best friend/father away. Even was a snippy dick to Sam who offered to help. Drake is an asshole.
Youre not supposed to think "wow Drake you're a great guy" after the Elena confrontation. We know he fucked up, and he knows he fucked up and he feels bad about it. The story absolutely makes it clear about why he is acting the way he is, and he makes amends for it later. The past two games have been about complicating Drake as a character. He has big flaws, but he's still likeable.
He did both. First a huge church, then the city while recklessly driving, (Shoreline is responsible for this too but Nadine isn't exactly pretending to be a good guy). But Drake just laughs it off, then proceeds to not go after his wife and even send his best friend/father away. Even was a snippy dick to Sam who offered to help. Drake is an asshole.
He didn't exactly know the church would be destroyed by solving the puzzle and I'd wager in his predicament that anyone would have did the exact same things. For me this is a case of analyzing someone out of their shoes; I thought everything Nathan did, he had a reason for it and when he snaps at Sam and does these other things, he's clearly got a shit load on his table and is stressed. He's mostly worried about some gang filling his brother with bullets or worse
He didn't exactly know the church would be destroyed by solving the puzzle and I'd wager in his predicament that anyone would have did the exact same things. For me this is a case of analyzing someone out of their shoes; I thought everything Nathan did, he had a reason for it and when he snaps at Sam and does these other things, he's clearly got a shit load on his table and is stressed. He's mostly worried about some gang filling his brother with bullets or worse
a white protagonist destroying half a Madgascar city while lying to his wife and then getting off scot free. really missed opportunity to critique the idea of the current status quo instead of reinforcing it.
That's the thing too is that it's nowhere near as pulpy as the previous games. You can see where they made way more efforts to stay grounded despite some grand moments.
None of those things are bittersweet, bittersweet doesn't=everyone gets a cookie at the end except for the underused villain. TLOU doesn't have a bittersweet ending, it's a dark ending where Joel, a madman, has possibly doomed mankind due to his selfishness and whole lying to the face of the person most important to him.
This didn't need a TLoU ending, at most they could've gone with the tone of Firefly, but killing the main protagonist just for shock value it would have been cheap.
In fact i aplaud that they did teased the subject and managed to have drama without killing the main characters.
At the end of the day, i think ND knows very well how to restraint themselfs and how to be subtle.
I hope they make another game with this 80´s action movie feel to it, there isn't any other developer delivering anything close to this with this quality.
He solved a puzzle in a clock tower causing it to break (but opening a hidden chamber) and then tried to escape from an army trying to attack him and save his brother, and the action quickly goes to the countryside
He runs over several food carts, through several fences, even through clean laundry, through several barns and over crops, and even goes onto the roofs of houses ONTO a bunch of cars, he even straight up waves at the black dude standing next to him and his brother as they laugh and drive off. Followed immediately by him staying absolutely asinine shit like "I knew you'd react like this." to Elena when she confronted him after seemingly using telepathy to find his exact location, (which she does twice in the story).
Do you also pick apart car chases in action movies? "That Jason Bourne sure needs to be punished for causing so much collateral damage! Oh and he's white too!"
I have no idea how you can't reconcile the tone and gamey parts of this experience.
My thing is that I don't actually watch a lot of action movies. I also see when a game's tone is really at odds with it's narrative, this is probably a pacing issue more than anything else.
And the
lying to Elena bit..like did you miss the whole point of the story and how Sam'a lie mirrors this or any of the character development as to why he lied?
Did you miss the part where he lied to her for weeks and she still forgave him after a couple of quips and a pirate reenactment. This dude lied for weeks.
Did you miss the part where he lied to her for weeks and she still forgave him after a couple of quips and a pirate reenactment. This dude lied for weeks.
She does not forgive him after a few quips. There are a lot of great moments that clearly show how strained things are, culminating in that great silent jeep ride. Did she forgive him faster than she would have in real life? Yeah, but this is an action adventure story, and the character build up earned the moment. She wasn't gonna freeze him out or leave him or some shit becuase she loves him, understands why he did it, and recognizes that he feels terrible about it.
(all end game spoilers) Personally hoping for and expecting
Chloe and maybe Cutter adventure story
Like if they didn't at least have
__chloe__
in it then it would be kinda surprising since this is their last Uncharted for awhile. We really don't need a
Sam and Sully adventure, imo that can be something for a possibly new game down the line or at least for the cassie stuff when Uncharted comes back if it does. S and S had their time in this game
He runs over several food carts, through several fences, even through clean laundry, through several barns and over crops, and even goes onto the roofs of houses ONTO a bunch of cars, he even straight up waves at the black dude standing next to him and his brother as they laugh and drive off. Followed immediately by him staying absolutely asinine shit like "I knew you'd react like this." to Elena when she confronted him after seemingly using telepathy to find his exact location, (which she does twice in the story).
My thing is that I don't actually watch a lot of action movies. I also see when a game's tone is really at odds with it's narrative, this is probably a pacing issue more than anything else.
And the
lying to Elena bit..like did you miss the whole point of the story and how Sam'a lie mirrors this or any of the character development as to why he lied?
Did you miss the part where he lied to her for weeks and she still forgave him after a couple of quips and a pirate reenactment. This dude lied for weeks.
I don't recall Elena fully forgiving Nathan. Did you miss the part at the end when Nathan refuses Sullys offer for a ride home because him and Elena have "a lot to talk about"
Sounds to me they haven't worked everything out yet.
Youre not supposed to think "wow Drake you're a great guy" after the Elena confrontation. We know he fucked up, and he knows he fucked up and he feels bad about it. The story absolutely makes it clear about why he is acting the way he is, and he makes amends for it later. The past two games have been about complicating Drake as a character. He has big flaws, but he's still likeable.
Saying sorry isn't exactly a good way of "making amends" with someone you lied to for weeks. Even worse is that he's borderline awarded for his "great deeds" which include, making sure a rich guy doesn't get richer and rescuing his brother.
This didn't need a TLoU ending, at most they could've gone with the tone of Firefly, but killing the main protagonist just for shock value it would have been cheap.
Wouldn't even have had shock value, it would've been completely understandable considering the things Drake does in the game. That wouldn't even have had a TLOU ending aside from emphasizing the message that it's wrong. What kinda message am I supposed to glean from
-Lie to your wife for weeks and quip a bit and she'll forgive
-Destroy half a city and probably the livelihood of a bunch of mminorities and no one will care, you'll get off with no consequences, in fact you'll probably end up rich with multiple beach houses and a boat and a wife that ages very well, the same one you lied to, great job you did it.
In fact i aplaud that they did teased the subject and managed to have drama without killing the main characters.
In this one the plot twists were incredibly obvious and followed every trope in the exact same way that defines them as tropes, liar revealed, villain betrayal, the thing the villain was chasing all along killing them at the end, every trope was followed to it's conclusion in the most cliche way possible while also reinforcing the power fantasy that players are so comfortable with.
She does not forgive him after a few quips. There are a lot of great moments that clearly show how strained things are, culminating in that great silent jeep ride. Did she forgive him faster than she would have in real life? Yeah, but this is an action adventure story, and the character build up earned the moment. She wasn't gonna freeze him out or leave him or some shit becuase she loves him, understands why he did it, and recognizes that he feels terrible about it.
After that silent jeep ride and subsequent apology where Elena stands her ground and says that they have a lot of ground to cover, which was a really nice way of saying that no, Drake fucked up, he's not gonna get the girl at the end, they really could've stuck with that. After a point, people usually get fed up and leave, Elena's done it multiple times despite her love for Drake.
I don't recall Elena fully forgiving Nathan. Did you miss the part at the end when Nathan refuses Sullys offer for a ride home because him and Elena have "a lot to talk about"
Sounds to me they haven't worked everything out yet.
He runs over several food carts, through several fences, even through clean laundry, through several barns and over crops, and even goes onto the roofs of houses ONTO a bunch of cars, he even straight up waves at the black dude standing next to him and his brother as they laugh and drive off. Followed immediately by him staying absolutely asinine shit like "I knew you'd react like this." to Elena when she confronted him after seemingly using telepathy to find his exact location, (which she does twice in the story).
I think he can be forgiven for crashing through a few fences when there is an armored car chasing after him spraying bullets in every direction. Maybe you not watching action movies is part of the issue you have, because the tone and feel of action in these games is not the same as something like the last of us. I think the games make that very clear. Action in Uncharted is about exhilaration and isn't treated with serious gravity. It's like every single other action adventure story ever.
He runs over several food carts, through several fences, even through clean laundry, through several barns and over crops, and even goes onto the roofs of houses ONTO a bunch of cars, he even straight up waves at the black dude standing next to him and his brother as they laugh and drive off. Followed immediately by him staying absolutely asinine shit like "I knew you'd react like this." to Elena when she confronted him after seemingly using telepathy to find his exact location, (which she does twice in the story).
My thing is that I don't actually watch a lot of action movies. I also see when a game's tone is really at odds with it's narrative, this is probably a pacing issue more than anything else.
And the
lying to Elena bit..like did you miss the whole point of the story and how Sam'a lie mirrors this or any of the character development as to why he lied?
Did you miss the part where he lied to her for weeks and she still forgave him after a couple of quips and a pirate reenactment. This dude lied for weeks.
She did not forgive him after a couple of quips though, I don't know how you can say this. Up until Nate tried to get Sam to give up the treasure, I thought Elena was going to up and leave Nate when they got off the island. She is distant from him until he is finally honest with her about why he lied to her. He didn't want to lose her and was protecting himself. From that point she was less distant, and I think she was close to forgiving him at the end. Partly because she missed the adventure too, this was Elena's character development too. It's not all about what Nate wants, she learnt something about herself too, which is why she eventually forgave him.
I think he can be forgiven for crashing through a few fences when there is an armored car chasing after him spraying bullets in every direction. Maybe you not watching action movies is part of the issue you have, because the tone and feel of action in these games is not the same as something like the last of us. I think the games make that very clear. Action in Uncharted is about exhilaration and isn't treated with serious gravity. It's like every single other action adventure story ever.
It is a modern day Indiana Jones... why oh why do some people not get that? I have my speculations, however when things get repeated in ways of, did you really, I mean, really pay attention to the story and dialogue, or did you go in with your mindset into one mode the entire time?
He runs over several food carts, through several fences, even through clean laundry, through several barns and over crops, and even goes onto the roofs of houses ONTO a bunch of cars, he even straight up waves at the black dude standing next to him and his brother as they laugh and drive off. Followed immediately by him staying absolutely asinine shit like "I knew you'd react like this." to Elena when she confronted him after seemingly using telepathy to find his exact location, (which she does twice in the story).
My thing is that I don't actually watch a lot of action movies. I also see when a game's tone is really at odds with it's narrative, this is probably a pacing issue more than anything else.
And the
lying to Elena bit..like did you miss the whole point of the story and how Sam'a lie mirrors this or any of the character development as to why he lied?
Did you miss the part where he lied to her for weeks and she still forgave him after a couple of quips and a pirate reenactment. This dude lied for weeks.
You are over your head here a little, very important thing about a story is that not everything needs to be explained but rather be capable to be explained. Explaining everything treats the espectator as dumb, that's like 50% of anime and bad TV with character speaking their feelings at every turn and having boring exposition.
More so, in a pulpy action adventure is all about being self aware of the jumps in logic and dance around what is posible and what is not, that's a big part of what is fun about the genre.
Also the lies about the trip are clearly not what really got Elena upset, but the fact that Drake was liying everyday about what kind of life would make him happy
Maybe is just a taste thing, if you don't enjoy 80´s action movies, then i have no idea what kind of story would you expect out of an uncharted game.
Edit: Yes the game pace was a little off and is not perfect, but the things you mention are hardly the areas where i think it can be improved up really
Saying sorry isn't exactly a good way of "making amends" with someone you lied to for weeks. Even worse is that he's borderline awarded for his "great deeds" which include, making sure a rich guy doesn't get richer and rescuing his brother.
If feels like you just played this game going into it trying to hate the story or something damn.
How is he supposed to make amends? They had conversations, he explained himself, that's what adults do. They love each other, and he hurt her, but Drake always thought it was a bigger issue than Elena did. And he was finally honest with her, which is what she wanted all along
I really just don't understand your takeaways.
His "great deeds"? You know that he was trying to save his brother and get the treasure because he thought his brother's life was in danger. And he was going to let Rafe have the treasure until A) he needed to rescue his brother again and B) Nadine locked him in a room with Rafe who then tried to kill Nate. Nate didn't want to fight, he didn't want treasure. All he wanted to do was save his brother who he felt responsible for, and empathy for since he understands what's driving him.
He is "rewarded" narratively because he addressed his flaws. He made amends with Elena, he moved on in his life, he gave up adventure, he saved his brother. Like he is not this awful person you seem to think he is
An important thing about Nate being forgiven by Elena which relates to her development as a character as alluded to above, is that she realises that she loves the Drake she sees in Libertalia, rather than the grey unexcited man she lives with. This is so clear in the scene in Averys mansion where they're discussing what happened. She clearly realises that she loves the adventurous and curious facets of Drakes character and that you can't take the adventurer out of the treasure hunter. So not only is it a part of her own personality that enjoys the excitement, it's a huge part of why she loves Drake in the first place. Of course it's going to be relatively easy for her to forgive him for what he's done.
