CornBurrito
Member
Actually, legally (as outlined in the Constitution) any citizen can claim a speaking fee and mandatory appearance from a University. Once per University.
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University ignores warnings about Milo, leaving him free to bully trans student
- Thread starter Anarky
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Actually, legally (as outlined in the Constitution) any citizen can claim a speaking fee and mandatory appearance from a University. Once per University.
Frozenprince
Banned
This is why the left lost.
We didn't make these people feel ENOUGH shame years and years ago. We've allowed this to become re-normalized. People's humanity and rights are suddenly back up for debate and discussion.
There's a german film called "Männer, Helden, schule Nazis" (Men, Heroes, Gay Nazis) about homosexual neonazis. It's just plain bizarre, but a very interesting and rare insight into people that live a contradictory life.
No sympathies for these people, Milo is also terrible. But just because you can't image doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Maybe you can get hold of a subbed version, the german one is more or less available.
He wasn't fucking invited for a conversation, he was invited to do a fucking one-sided presentation of his fuckery. Please stop with the "conversation" and "debate" garbage. None of the speakers that ever do this shit were invited for a properly moderated debate where everyone has a equal chance to speak.
If you care so much for damn "debates" and "conversation", then campaign for a damn open forum and actual debates be organized. Inviting hateful fuckwads to present their shit and giving them all the time isn't debate or conversation.
I genuinely worry for the people that continously defend one-sided hateful presentations as a "debate". It's like they have no idea what the word means.
John Kowalski
Banned
This dude is a turd and undeserving of any dignity. I hope for all the strength to transgender folks, this will be a trying time
To "Allies" minorities' humanity is always up for debate.
For people saying he shouldn't be banned from speaking at Universities because of free speech: would you also be okay with universities allowing and paying Fred Phelps to make speeches? Same damned thing. When the only thing you are spewing is hate, you don't deserve a platform other than the box you set up on the street corner.
and whatever your reasons are for not wanting to attempt to have the argument with Milo, I respect. All I am saying is you should respect those who are willing to attempt to have a rational argument with him
I personally am willing to have that argument, and I understand that by doing so I am leaving myself open to personal attacks from him. In spite of that, I am willing to give the argument a try.
Silver Arrows
Banned
itt: the literal personification of 'we need to talk to racists, homophobes' etc
Psychoward
Banned
For fuck's sake, for the billionth time I'm not saying he should be denied the right of free speech. I'm saying this wasn't an argument, it wasn't a debate, and his hatred shouldn't become legitimized by paying him to spew it. If he wasn't speaking at UWM you still would have been able to try and attempt to debate him, the only difference being a student wouldn't have been harassed and he wouldn't have gotten more fame and money.
You're not going to have any arguments. It was not a debate he was invited for. Once again, it was a one-sided presentation of his fuckery. That doesn't even begin to be even remotely similar to a goddamn debate.
Frozenprince
Banned
Did the woman he harassed and targeted specifically in his hate speech get that choice?
No, her choice was taken away from her. Her humanity deemed lesser. He wasn't there to argue, he was there to be a public speaker about his work in the media and his right wing insanity shit.
You've refused time and time again to look at the simple fact that he was allowed to dehumanize this woman for nothing.
Chie Satonaka
Member
You've nailed it.
If racism and homophobia were really the death knells that people (on both sides) claimed they were, we'd have stamped this shit out decades ago. This rhetoric has always been normalized and tolerated. People who are left leaning have friends and family members they refuse to call out on their bullshit and toxicity.
Again, it's because the majority of them have nothing to lose. It might hurt someone's feelies that this woman was subjected to what she went through, but nobody's really mad about it enough to the point of making change.
Tamir Rice being gunned down in less than two seconds might inspire a few tears, but not enough outrage to tear down the system that allows it to happen.
Status quo.
Psychoward
Banned
THIS. WAS. NOT. AN. ARGUMENT.
It was a one-sided presentation of hateful garbage that he was paid for.
If you want to have an argument with him feel free to contact him, I imagine you'll be sorely let down when you realize he isn't interested in debating you however. Also lovely, you're willing to shield yourself from attacks. Are you a transgender person who just had their entire existence shit on by a speaker? Doubt it. The attacks against you won't mean much if they're not directed towards you. Hardly the high ground you seem to be claiming.
Coffee Dog
Banned
We know what he spoke about though. And it wasn't a thorough dissection of what he believes in, he played to the crowd and slandered a single student who now has to leave the school.
Milo didn't bring a "conversation" and unless you're able to expound on how he did in your eyes you don't have much of a point.
Frozenprince
Banned
Can you elucidate what the event was supposed to entail, given that this entire argument spawned from him coming to "discuss" things.
BrutishMrFish
Member
Unless you're actually going to find him and talk to him, your "willingness" is absolutely meaningless. Even then, it would still be meaningless because he wouldn't give you the chance.
What makes you think that you would have any more luck with him than anybody else? Do you really think that nobody has ever tried to have a rational discussion with him?
Psychoward
Banned
For nothing? He got paid by the University to do it.
edit: apparently not, whatever
Just to quell this he never charges for his appearences
Frozenprince
Banned
He doesn't charge speaking fees. He makes his money through media outlet appearances and his affiliated websites. He does stuff like this for free because of exactly what's happened in this thread.
Free pub.
Yeah idk. Him being gay or not is neither here nor there. I know w guy from high school who's gay yet thinks trans people are disgusting and shouldn't be mentioned along with gay people and calls liberals literal Nazis that persecute conservative viewpoints.
People are idiots regardless of sexual orientation.
Psychoward
Banned
Gentleman Jack
Member
What almost everyone in this thread and what a lot of students have said is that there should be a line that a public university should draw and not give them a platform at their university (Milo would then be free to have his """"conversation"""" somewhere else), and everyone knew Milo was going to cross that line over and over again. They didn't owe him the right to speak any more than they owe a meeting of Klansmen to project images of black students personal information and mock them to an audience of Neo Nazis. You'd allow that to happen because of a foolish misinterpretation of 'free speech.' And that's disingenuous garbage.
AHA-Lambda
Member
oh but guys we need to let him have his say cos freedom of speech
>__>
>__>
Chie Satonaka
Member
it's the most important thing, after all.
Triggerhappytel
Member
Yep, I got a temporary ban before when I was candid about that Roosh V guy. Won't repeat the same mistake here but Milo is a fucking shitstain and a waste of oxygen.
No-one should be giving this vile little cunt a platform to attack other people.
Ollie Pooch
In a perfect world, we'd all be homersexual
No, I think he just has insane levels of self-loathing. I've come across some gay guys who act like this. Horrifically bigoted and demeaning to themselves and others. Probably not enough to publically shame someone, however.
Tatsumaki Senpuukyaku!
Member
I'm surprised milo hasn't been offered a spot in the trump administration
Frozenprince
Banned
I think Pence would bitch about it.
Or might be overjoyed. A man that homophobic likely has a few dragon dildos in his closet.
jack_package_200
Banned
I hope the student he harassed sues the shit out of that university.
They enabled it by giving that shitcunt a platform.
They enabled it by giving that shitcunt a platform.
Dongs Macabre
aka Daedalos42
Have you actually acknowledged the fact that he harassed a student yet? You keep talking about having a discussion, when that's not the point at all.
Vicetrailia
Member
The University should be ashamed of itself for subjecting their own students to such bullshit. Should have known better.
Frozenprince
Banned
This shit is exactly what gets him these gigs. Same as Trump, he's a "straight shooter" who "tells is like it is".
but the presentation closed with a 20 minute Q&A where students were allowed to engage in direct conversation with Milo. I can agree that if you are going to invite someone like Milo to your campus, there should be more of an open opportunity for debate than having Milo speak for an hour and a half and then having a 20 minute Q&A. What I do not agree with is the notion that we should close off all opportunity to have the conversation on campus
I didn't say anything about freedom of speech. I said I do not fault the college for allowing Milo to speak on their campus, and allowing the students the opportunity to engage in conversation with Milo
I'm not defending anything Milo did or said, I am defending the college for allowing him to speak on their campus, and allowing students the opportunity to engage in conversation with him. If Milo says something I do not agree with on his youtube channel, I do not hold youtube responsible for allowing him to host his channel, I hold Milo responsible for what he does and says
I did not say anything about freedom of speech. A college has every right to not allow someone to host an event on their campus if they do not want them to, just like how twitter has every right to ban his account. We're not talking about freedom of speech, I'm saying I do not fault the college for allowing Milo to speak on their campus, and allowing the students to engage in conversation with him.
If this conversation is about what the college can and cannot do, then I am defending the college's right to host this event, even if I do not agree with what Milo has to say
Alcoremortis
Member
I wonder if there'd be some way to hook up a fart machine to the sound system at his next speaking engagement and have a loud fart sound play every time he starts talking bullshit. Treat his talk with exactly the amount of respect it deserves.
Frozenprince
Banned
There is no fucking debate worth a 20 minute Q&A about her humanity what the fuck...
I'm done.
I'm so fucking done.
I'm done.
I'm so fucking done.
A great irony of all this is that the reaction has done more to fuel him than his rhetoric, if i were cynical id say he plans his own protests at universities to sell the narrative.
Wulfric
Member
I'm afraid not, I think it was just his usual alt-right pandering, if you wish to call that a discussion. Both sides did take up a lot of space on the union though.
Afterwards, the student wrote a scalding hot letter to the chancellor telling him off for letting her being attacked. As an LGBT plus PoC , I want to feel safe at school. Rhetoric like this will only grow more common in the next four years, so I'm hoping the university has learned early on that events like this will only foster heartache and raise tensions.
benicillin
Banned
If you don't see what's wrong with allowing this kind of shit to take place you're objectively a bad person and I hope karma bites you in the ass.
Gentleman Jack
Member
I give up. You're never done ducking the fact that he attacks people and nothing else. Unsurprising that you're never going to understand what a conversation actually is since you're not even trying to see things from the victim's point of view.
hey_it's_that_dog
benevolent sexism
When I was at University the Campus Republicans had some kind of panel about 9/11 or Muslims or something, I can't even remember the supposed topic, because it was four absolute fucking nutjobs saying extremely ridiculous things about all kinds of subjects and social groups. I think it was right to let the Campus Republicans embarrass themselves in that fashion, and in general, I think it's right to expose students to complete fucklords for the purpose of 1) showing them what some people actually believe and 2) letting them argue against it, either in their heads or out loud.
However, a speaker specifically targeting and harassing a student is so far beyond crossing the line that said speaker should be forcefully thrown out, immediately. The problem is knowing ahead of time whether a speaker would do such a thing. With Milo, it seems like students could make a strong case that he's likely to do something that shitty. But in general, I think it would be hard to predict this kind of thing ahead of time.
So in conclusion, I don't know.
However, a speaker specifically targeting and harassing a student is so far beyond crossing the line that said speaker should be forcefully thrown out, immediately. The problem is knowing ahead of time whether a speaker would do such a thing. With Milo, it seems like students could make a strong case that he's likely to do something that shitty. But in general, I think it would be hard to predict this kind of thing ahead of time.
So in conclusion, I don't know.
I'm not ducking anything, again I hold Milo responsible for what Milo says, not the college. The same way I do not hold youtube responsible when he says something deplorable on his youtube channel. The jerk is Milo, not the college.
I did, and again I hold Milo responsible for that, not the college. I'm fine with colleges allowing people to speak and engage in conversation on their campuses, because colleges are for adults
GoldenEye 007
Member
The college has a duty to defend students against sexual harassment. The college failed here.
I disagree, if any sexual harassment charges are held, it should be against Milo, not the college
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