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*UNMARKED SPOILERS ALL BOOKS* Game of Thrones |OT| - Season 7 - Sundays on HBO

M

mcfrank

Member
Faddy said:
Hot Take. Qarth from the books is shit and the show made some fine changes and introduced some memorable characters.

MKRIPHF.jpg
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There are lots of things better in the show than the books.
 
F

Faddy

Banned
Mendrox said:
I will laugh my ass of when it's revealed that the Nightking waited because he knew that Dany with her dragons would appear so that he could take Viserion. Nobody knows what his game is and people think that this was a stupid move on his part, but do we know what plan he follows? What if he has visions himself? He can take Bran out of his ravens and all.

People should chill out. The book also has enough flaws which people easily overlook.
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Viserion is going to burn the through the wall, breaking the magic than binds it together.

The song of ice and fire is The Night King riding his wight dragon.
 
V

Visceir

Member
Aiii said:
Yep, in three days its perfectly reasonable to assume the Night's King would not have gotten a bow and arrow, or you know, one of his massive dragon murdering spears to kill the people on the island.

Nor is it reasonable to assume they could have just hurled undead over the gap until they finally got through. It's not like he doesn't have tens of thousands of tries on that one.

They just all were chilling for four days on that island, freezing like hell, without food.

Come on, it's obvious this wasn't a concern to the writers of the show. They just want action beats.
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It's almost as if NK somehow knew Dany would come to the rescue and used them as bait to get himself a dragon, hmmmm.
 
J

jett

D-Member
John Dunbar said:
if the night king is some sort of super warg, then it's not that crazy he would have some intel on what's going on in the south. of course there's the issue of not being able to raise the dead beyond the wall, but maybe he can still look through the eyes of ravens or whatever.

that would also explain why it took them forever to get to the wall: they're waiting for dany to bring the dragons to them first.
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404Ender said:
I don't think it's too much of a stretch to assume he's a Greenseer. He was originally a First Man, he's already shown warg-like abilities, and he's been established as a foil to Bran in terms of magical ability.
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I guess I'm not clear on the powers of greenseers or the three eyed raven. I guess they can just "teleport" themselves to wherever. But I don't think they look into the future. Or do they? Ugh whatever.
 
B

bratpack

Member
Faddy said:
D&D changed it. In the show Westeros is around a quarter of the reported size in the books.

E.g. when Arya is at the Inn at the Crossroads the two travellers say it is 200 miles to Kingslanding when according to this map it is closer to 400 miles

And we know the maps between books and show are the same because of the painted table and Cersei's map. But also George's maps are outlandishly big. Go look at that map set to the same scale as earth and you can't see shit. Also every major river on that map is 10 miles wide. All of that scale is basically extrapolated from George describing the Wall as 700 ft high and 300 miles long while also having people shoot arrows to the top of it.
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think of it as about the size of Ireland lol
doesn't take long to drive up to Belfast from dublin about 3 hours now imagine dany on a Dragon flying probly be about an hour tops lol
 
DeviantBoi

DeviantBoi

Member
The show helps me understand why it's taking Martin so long to finish Winds of Winter.

It's easy and cheap for the show to say that they had someone run to the wall to send a raven to Dany so that she can rescue the group from the Night King.

I imagine that won't fly with Martin.
 
M

Mendrox

Member
Faddy said:
Viserion is going to burn the through the wall, breaking the magic than binds it together.

The song of ice and fire is The Night King riding his wight dragon.
Click to expand...

Of course Viserion will burn through the wall which shows that this was the Nightkings plan all along. How else would they have broken through that? People forget stuff like the magic barrier. With the dragon they can easily melt the shit out of everything.
 
I

Ithil

Member
Jon is the dumbest motherfucker alive. Not only does he come up with a completely boneheaded plan to capture a wight, but he goes about it by just walking off into the frozen North with a bunch of guys. No scouts ahead, no ravens ready in case of problems, no real retreat plan, hell no real plan on how to capture a wight. They didn't even think of asking Dany for a dragon to help.

The only reason they did was because of a convenient little party of wights and one White Walker who were not with the horde for...some reason. Way too many shortcuts in this episode.
 
H

Hazmat

Member
Visceir said:
It's almost as if NK somehow knew Dany would come to the rescue and used them as bait to get himself a dragon, hmmmm.
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1. She would have come regardless of if he killed them so long as Gendry made it out.

2. They attack as soon as the lake is frozen enough to bear the weight of the wight army.
 
A

Aiii

So not worth it
Visceir said:
It's almost as if NK somehow knew Dany would come to the rescue and used them as bait to get himself a dragon, hmmmm.
Click to expand...

As I said, you can make up a ton of reasons to make this make sense. Stuff that should have been made clear in the show itself.

Show the guy smirking when he sees Gendry running off. Show him smirking when the dragons appear, for all that I care.
 
I

Ithil

Member
Actually, why would the Night King even know there are dragons? Are the maesters accidentally sending him ravens with all the news from Westeros too?
 
J

Jetman

Member
I laughed when Jon killed that Other/Wight Leader in the ambush and all of the zombies broke apart and died, "Whoops!" - then I laughed harder when just one of them randomly survived the self destruct, "Of Course!"
 
F

Faddy

Banned
Ithil said:
Jon is the dumbest motherfucker alive. Not only does he come up with a completely boneheaded plan to capture a wight, but he goes about it by just walking off into the frozen North with a bunch of guys. No scouts ahead, no ravens ready in case of problems, no real retreat plan, hell no real plan on how to capture a wight. They didn't even think of asking Dany for a dragon to help.

The only reason they did was because of a convenient little party of wights and one White Walker who were not with the horde for...some reason. Way too many shortcuts in this episode.
Click to expand...

He had scouts ahead, his scout got eaten by a wight bear.

And that convenient party of wights were the Night King's scouts.
 
I

Ithil

Member
Jetman said:
I laughed when Jon killed that Other/Wight Leader in the ambush and all of the zombies broke apart and died, "Whoops!" - then I laughed harder when just one of them randomly survived the self destruct, "Of Course!"
Click to expand...

Gerald the Defective Wight, he can't even die properly (again).
 
B

bratpack

Member
DeviantBoi said:
The show helps me understand why it's taking Martin so long to finish Winds of Winter.

It's easy and cheap for the show to say that they had someone run to the wall to send a raven to Dany so that she can rescue the group from the Night King.

I imagine that won't fly with Martin.
Click to expand...

not fair though Martin has time the crew and cast don't have that luxury

it's possible he could be holding out till the tv show is done to see what could be changed that way he could earn more money claiming this the the true ending for the saga
 
G

Gigglepoo

Member
duckroll said:
I'm pretty surprised that the thread hates this episode this much. I mean, it's definitely not a great episode, but we've been through so much worse.
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This is the first episode my wife has ever seen. I told her afterward it was pretty much as good as GoT gets now because even though it was dumb it was also really fun. It just lacked a hugely emotional moment (like The Door).

But this is pretty much the best I expect now and had a good time watching it. It's dumb every week, I'm just happy when it's dumb fun instead of dumb boring (like last week).
 
V

Visceir

Member
Aiii said:
As I said, you can make up a ton of reasons to make this make sense. Stuff that should have been made clear in the show itself.

Show the guy smirking when he sees Gendry running off. Show him smirking when the dragons appear, for all that I care.
Click to expand...

Could be saving some of his powers for a plot twist in next season. Makes for good TV!

Like one of those Nolan movies where you watch it a second time and go "but of course!"
 
J

jviggy43

Member
Visceir said:
It's almost as if NK somehow knew Dany would come to the rescue and used them as bait to get himself a dragon, hmmmm.
Click to expand...
It's funny I've seen people say this. If that's true, how was he not prepared to already kill a dragon upon it's arrival rather than waiting for them to be almost completely rescued and kill a bunch of their soldiers? Why not just immediately attack all the dragons, kill your enemies, and then have 3 undead dragons? Hmmmmm
 
I

Ithil

Member
bratpack said:
haha this I'm surprised at the negative reviews
maybe the early leak hype played a part people were being told it's all kinds of amazing
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I don't want to end up sounding snobby or arrogant here, but I fully believe a lot of people just watched the episode and saw a lot of firebreathing and sword fighting and that's all that was required to call it amazing.
 
A

Aiii

So not worth it
Duane Cunningham said:
Everybody I know IRL: HOLY SHIT, DID YOU SEE THAT LAST NIGHT? It's all paying off omg!

Neogaf: Worst episode ever! What trash!
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I hope both those things are exaggerations. I know the latter one is.

Reading the reviews it seems pretty much everyone is having the same qualms as those expressed in this thread, so it doesn't seem a very outlandish viewpoint to have that this episode wasn't A-class.

Ithil said:
I don't want to end up sounding snobby or arrogant here, but I fully believe a lot of people just watched the episode and saw a lot of firebreathing and sword fighting and that's all that was required to call it amazing.
Click to expand...

Basically the same viewers that forgive TWD because ZOMBIES OMG ZOMBIES.

Visceir said:
Could be saving some of his powers for a plot twist in next season. Makes for good TV!

Like one of those Nolan movies where you watch it a second time and go "but of course!"
Click to expand...

"Hey Gendry, whatcha been up to? Rowing all this time? Wink, wink."
 
T

Thug Waffle

Member
jviggy43 said:
It's funny I've seen people say this. If that's true, how was he not prepared to already kill a dragon upon it's arrival rather than waiting for them to be almost completely rescued and kill a bunch of their soldiers? Why not just immediately attack all the dragons, kill your enemies, and then have 3 undead dragons? Hmmmmm
Click to expand...

D&D.

This season has shown their true colors as screenwriters. They're not that good.
 
B

BenjaminBirdie

Banned
DeviantBoi said:
The show helps me understand why it's taking Martin so long to finish Winds of Winter.

It's easy and cheap for the show to say that they had someone run to the wall to send a raven to Dany so that she can rescue the group from the Night King.

I imagine that won't fly with Martin.
Click to expand...

lol no pun intended
 
A

Atraveller

Banned
FutureLarking said:
Show never explained how Benjen survived in the first place did it? Maybe he'll magically come back next season :p
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You should check out the Inside video of this episode on GoT's youtube channel. Weiss basically said they needed someone Jon trust to tell him to get out without any explanation ("there was no time"), and someone we know to add emotional beat. And saving people at convenient time was literally his only purpose.

So don't expect any further explanation.
 
V

Visceir

Member
jviggy43 said:
It's funny I've seen people say this. If that's true, how was he not prepared to already kill a dragon upon it's arrival rather than waiting for them to be almost completely rescued and kill a bunch of their soldiers? Why not just immediately attack all the dragons, kill your enemies, and then have 3 undead dragons? Hmmmmm
Click to expand...

He seemed to be pretty chill and in control of the situation like he knew what he was doing. All according to keikaku.
 
J

John Dunbar

correct about everything
Atraveller said:
You should check out the Inside video of this episode on GoT's youtube channel. Weiss basically said they needed someone Jon trust to tell him to get out without any explanation ("there was no time"), and someone we know to add emotional beat. And saving people at convenient time was literally his only purpose.

So don't expect any further explanation.
Click to expand...

and i bet jon will never even acknowledge that it happened.

or the show goes with its tried and true method: mentioned equals solved.
 
S

Severance

Member
I see a few people have mentioned the idea that the Night King baited Dany there to take one of her dragons. It hit me late last night as an idea that would make the whole scenario actually plausible. The Night King is a greenseer I believe, so it would not be so crazy that he could know a lot about Dany, Jon and the realm of Westeros. All that time behind the wall and he's seemingly doing not much of anything, except he has been watching. I have felt we were going to get more characterization of the White Walkers by the end. Maybe it will be revealed. As far as we know at this point, the Night King has no solid plan to get through the wall because he would have already. Unless.. he does have a plan. We shall see.
 
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