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[ethomaz]

I actually get laid quite frequently so no. I’m actually more excited for the PS5 Than any other platform but I see no wrong in thinking XsX and PC will at least match what we saw here.

PC will even surpass it when the 7GB/s or faster SDDs launches.
Xbox probably won't match the level of detail.

 

[Entroyp]

Without a proper SSD, not.
They where clear about that.
The level of detail can't be reached without the SSD streaming.... faster the streaming = more details on screen.

But a 2080Ti will probably run at better resolution the demo.

So it seems I need to do some reading about what Epic said about the SSD.. on it now...

 

[TUROK]

I just find it so incredibly amusing that with all this talk about the Series X's spec numbers, it ends up being Sony's presentation that wows people with its next gen capabilities.

Nobody drops the ball better than Microsoft does, that's for goddamn sure lmao

 

[geordiemp]

I actually get laid quite frequently so no. I’m actually more excited for the PS5 Than any other platform but I see no wrong in thinking XsX and PC will at least match what we saw here.

I dont think they will stream assets as fast, so no I dont agree until faster SSD come on the market.

When will PCs get 12 channel SSD's ?

If its fully XSX capable then I am sure MS will show the demo soon, or they will show something similar.......

Sony is pioneering here with the PlayStation 5 architecture. It's got a God-tier storage system

 

[kruis]

That part is key though... people saying older machines will prevent games to look next gens can stop now.

Texture streaming is just one part of the equation. Current gen games mask loading sections by having player endure corridor sections, elevator rides, slow opening doors, short movie fragment, etc. In next gen it should be possible to seamlessly to open a door in one environment and fly through a completely different environment at breackneck speed just seconds later. SSD have the potential to change game design, how game worlds are created. How can games built for zero loading times be ported to systems with slow hds where these horrible loading section are an absolute neccessity?

I expect that from 2021 onward there'll be more and more games that will mention a NVM SSD drive as part of the minimal requirements to run a game.

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

So it seems I need to do some reading about what Epic said about the SSD.. on it now...

all the quotes are in the OP of this thread, or DeepEnigma ‘s thread, or the DF reaction thread

 

[LostDonkey]

Man, back in the day, I would've dropped my pants after seeing this. Now, as a more cynical ass, I just have a "wait until I see it on my own screen" attitude to it all. Don't get me wrong, it looks absolutely lovely. And I know we're closer than ever to achieving these visuals on home consoles. However, I just can't get that excited until I see this on my own screen right in front of me.

Hardly cynical considering the past years we have been shown stuff to be running in real time or in engine and it was actually on a top tier PC or an over specced Dev Kit and had to be drastically cut and reduced for the final retail unit.

 

[GymWolf]

Decima is proprietary and can be built upon. Guerilla knows what theyre doing and are ready for next gen. Im pretty sure they got their own crazy tech in the pipelines.

can't wait to see horizon 2.
well actually i can (and want) wait, i don't want a rushed game, i hope they take full advantage of ssd stuff for that game.

 

[GreenAlien]

All data is stored as pages in a huge database on the SSD

How huge are we talking here? 200gb? 500gb? more?

I'm just asking because I wonder to what size I will need to upgrade my SSD to have enough room for 1 game at a time.

 

[mckmas8808]

We know it will not reach that buit it will feel near enough.

Many PS5 and XSX games will look BETTER than this demo.

 

[ethomaz]

So it seems I need to do some reading about what Epic said about the SSD.. on it now...

The demo was all about how much more detail can you get on screen with faster SSD streaming.
They used the PS5 because it is ahead of what you have on PC until at least late of this year.

You can even run the demo in a HDD but they said it will have a lot of less details on screen.

I recommend you to watch the full interview but the quotes from most articles will tell you the same.

 

[GymWolf]

Many PS5 and XSX games will look BETTER than this demo.

at least they will have far better character models, that is the only thing 100% sure.

 

[Grinchy]

This is pretty damn awesome. All I could think about the whole time was how I can't fucking wait to see what next-gen VR games look like.

And on a side note it's going to be hilarious watching the new arguments after all the "SSD is only for load times and every game scales back to last-gen with no issues" horseshit

 

[Entroyp]

I dont think they will stream assets as fast, so no I dont agree until faster SSD come on the market.

When will PCs get 12 channel SSD's ?

If its fully XSX capable then I am sure MS will show the demo soon, or they will show something similar.......

Throw in all the custom silicon of the SSD subsystem and I think it will take even more than that. Maybe Cerny was right all along about how important fast storage is.

 

[niilokin]

As great stuff here looks, I think we got glimpses of that kind of game world fidelity with Battlefront 2015 thanks to the Quixel assets.

 

[manuvlad]

Head of Xbox using a PS5 footage to sell XBOX Series X

 

[Sethbacca]

That part is key though... people saying older machines will prevent games to look next gens can stop now.

AI, game mechanics, number of enemies etc will all still be hampered by having jaguar CPU as a baseline vs the new zen cores. True next gen games will be based on zen not jaguar as their baseline. So yes, that statement is still 100% true.

 

[geordiemp]

This is pretty damn awesome. All I could think about the whole time was how I can't fucking wait to see what next-gen VR games look like.

And on a side note it's going to be hilarious watching the new arguments after all the "SSD is only for load times and every game scales back to last-gen with no issues" horseshit

LOl but it will load in 3 seconds not one second - people just dont get it.

 

[faisalasif]

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

Head of Xbox using a PS5 footage to sell XBOX Series X

Maybe it looks exactly the same on XsX? Who knows. Hopefully they release their demo soon.

 

[DoctaThompson]

Classic deflection. The people showcasing the demo credited the PS5 hardware for making it possible. They've said things like that current PC hardware can do it at a lower poly count, or that future PC hardware will be able to do it, but they specifically said it's possible due to PS5's hardware. We're not seeing the tech demo on PC, are we? The way others have made it sound is that a PC is CURRENTLY capable of this, yet no game looks this way? Weird argument.

You got reciepts on PC will run lower poly count? As I saw one of the devs saying it runs on his Rtx 2070. Nothing about reduced this or reduced that.

 

[geordiemp]

Throw in all the custom silicon of the SSD subsystem and I think it will take even more than that. Maybe Cerny was right all along about how important fast storage is.

Yes he was, he even tried to show 1 second loading in front of you in his talk and people still did not believe.

Hoirzon decima engine streams assests in Field of view already, thats how it works.....imagine Decima latest version on Ps5 in hands of Sony first party....customised for Ps5....

 

[Barakov]

That was mighty impressive. You can put me in the camp that wants to see this turned into a game.

 

[GymWolf]

This is pretty damn awesome. All I could think about the whole time was how I can't fucking wait to see what next-gen VR games look like.

And on a side note it's going to be hilarious watching the new arguments after all the "SSD is only for load times and every game scales back to last-gen with no issues" horseshit

be honest, you are only thinking about those quixel quality nipples in vr porn, didn't you?

 

[FireFly]

Then I wouldn't say it can't be run on a PC as you stated. I can also tell you that it runs on a PC because they tell you it does. Once we get around the fact that all platforms will be in harmony with 3rd party titles, we are left with the GPU. And you already got a glimpse of what those limitations are: sub-4k @ 30FPS.

Again, it's a question of the fidelity, and the streaming speed required to achieve that level of fidelity, not the ability to run at all. Since we know the Nanite system is scalable to some extent.

As far as the comparisons to PC hardware go, if we put the PS5 at around 5700 XT levels of performance, then to double that you will need a card around 40% more powerful than the 2080 Ti. And that is just talking about 1440 60 FPS, let alone 4K 60 FPS.

 

[INC]

Just show me VR with it

 

[mortal]

 

[ColonialRaptor]

Texture streaming is just one part of the equation. Current gen games mask loading sections by having player endure corridor sections, elevator rides, slow opening doors, short movie fragment, etc. In next gen it should be possible to seamlessly to open a door in one environment and fly through a completely different environment at breackneck speed just seconds later. SSD have the potential to change game design, how game worlds are created. How can games built for zero loading times be ported to systems with slow hds where these horrible loading section are an absolute neccessity?

I expect that from 2021 onward there'll be more and more games that will mention a NVM SSD drive as part of the minimal requirements to run a game.

i loved the little kick in the teeth of those loading masks by having the next room completely visible from before the crack as she moves around the room that was awesome.

 

[Grinchy]

be honest, you are only thinking about those quixel quality nipples in vr porn, didn't you?

Wait, are you telling me that there's such a thing as VR that isn't VR porn???

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

Ohhh baby. spicy GIFs, mind if I quote you in the OP?

 

[Explosive Zombie]

You got reciepts on PC will run lower poly count? As I saw one of the devs saying it runs on his Rtx 2070. Nothing about reduced this or reduced that.

" I asked how an RTX 2070 Super would handle the demo, and Epic Games chief technical officer Kim Libreri said that it should be able to get "pretty good" performance." - pretty good implies things have been reduced

 

[Entroyp]

Yes he was, he even tried to show 1 second loading in front of you in his talk and people still did not believe.

Hoirzon decima engine streams assests in Field of view already, thats how it works.....imagine Decima latest version on Ps5 in hands of Sony first party....customised for Ps5....

Oh I believed, I loved Cerny’s presentation and have watched it several times. Me being an engineer I’m a fan of his work and the way he focus on data. However, maybe it’s all the downplaying around here regarding the ssd that made me a bit skeptical.

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

Wait, are you telling me that there's such a thing as VR that isn't VR porn???

 

[jackets with pockets]

Guys it uses virtual geometry and virtual texturing. All data is stored as pages in a huge database on the SSD, a hierarchical acceleration structure to select which pages of triangle soup and textures to pull in. Hence why they use 8k textures and have "infinite" detail. Only the texels and triangles being drawn are loading into RAM.

You need a good SSD for that to perform well.

This was discussed a long time ago as a target for id Tech 6 by John C (2011?)

One of the developers says in his quick Twitter thread that it's been a long time coming:

 

[GymWolf]

Wait, are you telling me that there's such a thing as VR that isn't VR porn???

i don't know, never used my rift and quest for anything else

 

[mortal]

Ohhh baby. spicy GIFs, mind if I quote you in the OP?

Be my guest

 

[Sw0pDiller]

I see no wrong in thinking XsX and PC will at least match what we saw here.

Well, not my pc I am afraid, and I guess that goes for very, very much pc gamers.

 

[RaySoft]

Head of Xbox using a PS5 footage to sell XBOX Series X

Im actually more surprised that Hellblade 2 are using Unreal Engine and not an in-house one.

 

[geordiemp]

Oh I believed, I loved Cerny’s presentation and have watched it several times. Me being an engineer I’m a fan of his work and the way he focus on data. However, maybe it’s all the downplaying around here regarding the ssd that made me a bit skeptical.

I am an engineer as well, my sceptical bit was how many engines other than Decima will embrase really super fast assset streaming at its core.

That has been answered emphatically. The key part is it took 24 developers to do this demo.

I am sure MS will either have this or something similar if their SSD technology is remotely comparible as they do have an infinite war chest. If we dont see something before launch it means its not comparible.

All we have seen so far on XSX is a game load in 11 seconds...

 

[pawel86ck]

Guys, after UE5 presentation you still think hellblade 2 trailer was prerendered?

 

[sendit]

How do developers make these models and environments made of billions upon billions of triangles?

Does it take a lot more time than current gen games or does the new technology allow to make better-textured graphics in more or less the same amount of time?

Assets are usually created at a much higher fidelity than what is rendered in real time/gameplay and scaled down to fit within the limitations of the hardware.

 

[Entroyp]

Guys, after UE5 presentation you still think hellblade 2 trailer was prerendered?

I’m starting to think it was not now

 

[VAVA Mk2]

While this did look impressive it was at 1440p with no ray tracing at 30 FPS...

 

[Entroyp]

I am an engineer as well, my sceptical bit was how many engines other than Decima will embrase really super fast assset streaming at its core.

That has been answered emphatically.

Hopefully other engines beside UE follow and implement streaming assets like Epic did. We all win.

 

[sneas78]

Man I want to believe but we were promised these graphics 7 yrs ago:

it’s real this time isn’t it ?

 

[SirTerry-T]

That's a pretty rough explanation but okay

Well yeah but If you want to pump out a gazillion poly object from your sculpting package , how would you do it? I never said it was an in depth explanation

 

[thelastword]

And to think this is the bare minimum this engine can make, given how PC and XsX have more raw power, truly fantastic!

More power maybe, but they don't have the custom hardware PS5 has and they certainly don't have the insane SSD speeds PS5 has which is the main reason behind the graphics and fidelity you see here...….I'm sure this can be rendered on PC and Series X as well, but there will be compromises with LOD and transitions......Or perhaps when we get to cycling quickly through the level or in levels with more diverse textures and density, you may see some compromises relative to fidelity/artefacts and performance loss on Series X...…..as it won't be able to keep up with PS5 with the 1:1 triangle to pixel ratio. So you may get a more compromised triangle to pixel ratio on Series X in comparison...…..This is not about TF or CU power....Series X has it's strengths, but most are mitigated through PS5's custom hardware. On the flip, Series X's SSD is no match for PS5's. Series X's SSD is what current gen PC tech has right now, even a bit slower than the best PC SSD's you can find right now....And on top of that, Series X just doesn't have the DMAC that PS5 has to make this work as proficiently, it doesn't have the 12 gates on the I/O....

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

More power maybe, but they don't have the custom hardware PS5 has and they certainly don't have the insane SSD speeds PS5 has which is the main reason behind the graphics and fidelity you see here...….I'm sure this can be rendered on PC and Series X as well, but there will be compromises with LOD and transitions......Or perhaps when we get to cycling quickly through the level or in levels with more diverse textures and density, you may see some compromises relative to fidelity/artefacts and performance loss on Series X...…..as it won't be able to keep up with PS5 with the 1:1 triangle to pixel ratio. So you may get a more compromised triangle to pixel ratio on Series X in comparison...…..This is not about TF or CU power....Series X has it's strengths, but most are mitigated through PS5's custom hardware. On the flip, Series X's SSD is no match for PS5's. Series X's SSD is what current gen PC tech has right now, even a bit slower than the best PC SSD's you can find right now....And on top of that, Series X just doesn't have the DMAC that PS5 has to make this work as proficiently, it doesn't have the 12 gates on the I/O....

Bruh, let's wait and see the demo running on XsX first. Maybe it will be worse, maybe it will be identical, maybe it will be better.

Yes, it is clear that the SSD bandwidth is key to make the demo shine like it does, but for all we know the XsX SSD is more than fast enough for many of the engine's bells and whistles too.

Let's wait and see.

Epic said that ultra fast SSD was required for this (along with good CPU and GPU), be didnt way the XsX wasn’t fast enough

 

[Spukc]

Well yeah but If you want to pump out a gazillion poly object from your sculpting package , how would you do it? I never said it was an in depth explanation

I wouldn’t even bother to explain it hahah

 

[pawel86ck]

And one last thing guys, you still think Horizon 1 on PC will look better than Horizon 2 on PS5 ?