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[VFXVeteran]

PS5 bringing in the goods......What is it? An extremely fast rendering/streaming solution that takes full advantage of the fastest SSD tech available......Cue what Tim Sweeny said about PS5's SSD.....Real enhancements for next gen, is what we wanted to see, and it's running right there on PS5.

It's only one method, I'm looking to be blown away by first party software much more than this tbh......UE5 is good, but It wont touch PD, Naughty Dog, Santa Monica, Guerilla etc.....If this is UE5, prepared to have your jaws on the floor by first party stuff...….Another great thing about this is that it looks like a game and playable, very impressive assets and character model in realtime/gameplay, not some smoke and mirrors movie demo at 24fps....

This is the most fanboyish comment I've ever seen in my life.

You automagically mitigate a 3rd party developer of cross-platform engines simply because you "love" your 1st party developers. Even though they haven't shown any new technical advancements yet? Wow.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

AMD SSG article (PC Gamer)

Might help clear up some questions some folks seem to be having on how the SSDs work in the systems. With the SSG cards AMD leverages a SSG API so that the GPU can talk with the on-board NAND storage directly, bypassing CPU, PCIe etc. It's speeds are slightly faster than PS5's (8 GB/s read, 6 GB/s write), but yeah it would appear said API allows the GPU to communicate to the onboard NAND directly.

That said it does not replace the purpose or function of the main memory, which is MUCH faster and has MUCH more bandwidth (plus a wider bus, and byte-level alterability). But I don't see how it's impossible for next-gen systems to leverage aspects of the SSG line, particularly the APIs allowing GPU communication to the NAND. And FWIW, those SSG cards are for workstation PCs, so there's nothing fundamentally preventing it from working on any x86-based device I'd assume (unless AMD or other hardware partners just decided not to leverage it in that way).

 

[ColonialRaptor]

Maybe I’m nuts but this was really well presented and I’m extremely excited. Wow! I haven’t read any comments just watched the video. When she flew down it brought tears to my eyes!!

After the Xbox gameplay reveal flub this was a big win for Sony.

 

[kruis]

I told you guys again and again.

DO NOT UNDERESTIMATE THE POWER OF PLAYSTATION.

Now we wait for Naughty Dog, Guerrilla Games, Sucker Punch, Media Molecule and Sony Santa Montica to get their hands on this tech.

I think Sony once again made the right choice with their specs.

I think the slightly faster HD will be more beneficial than the slightly incresed TF. Given the Graphical detail / potential incluesion of RT, I expect the magical 4k figure drop for both consoles pretty damn quick, especially with 3rd parties. I expect to see a lot of titles at 1440p on both consoles and the TF isn't enough of a difference to magically squeeze 60fos on the Series X compared to a 30fps on the PS5.

I expect both machines running things at 1440p CB with the Hard Drive giving the PS5 a slight edge.

1440 CB is going to be indistinguishable from real 4K. I think that CBing (or AMDs version of DLSS) is going to be the norm, especially in combination with ray tracing. The performance benefits are massive.

 

[Saber]

Dude. Sony did not create the technical demo. Epic did. Today had nothing to do with Sony outside of the obvious marketing agreement. This same level of graphics is possible on next gen Xbox and next gen PC GPU's.

But isn't this tech running on PS5?
So I don't think he is wrong saying that.

 

[Rat Rage]

These ultra high detailed realistic-looking graphics don't impress me anymore. AAA development is gonna need so much man power to actually fill all these super realistic graphics with detail, which in turn will - mostly - lead to mediocritiy, just like with the overuse of CGI in hollywood movies. All of this will get boring pretty fast.

Another problem: the average customer is gonna expect every game to look like this now, so AA game studios are gonna have an extra hard time to compete.

Realism is gonna hit a dead end next gen, and it will lead to boredom I feel.

 

[Explosive Zombie]

Was that Tech demo or a game being released to the public one day? I'm confused now?

Classic deflection. The people showcasing the demo credited the PS5 hardware for making it possible. They've said things like that current PC hardware can do it at a lower poly count, or that future PC hardware will be able to do it, but they specifically said it's possible due to PS5's hardware. We're not seeing the tech demo on PC, are we? The way others have made it sound is that a PC is CURRENTLY capable of this, yet no game looks this way? Weird argument.

 

[MDSLKTR]

"PC can easily run this, it just chooses not to" seems to be the running argument. What hardware will it take for the PC to be capable of this? If it's as easy as some people make out why aren't there PC games that look like this?

I got same bad news for you: Ampere is unveiled tomorrow lol

 

[VFXVeteran]

Go try star citzen then, that's the first game you can try right now that shows how hdd's aren't enough anymore, unless you want to play a game full of stuttering and overall lower performance because the hdd can't load things fast enough.

I don't know what the max RAM threshold is for star citizen where it doesn't need to stream data as frequently on an HDD. That demo they gave didn't tell you the RAM configuration on each system. I have no idea of knowing if their code will allocate more CPU RAM for caching when it sees a LOT of CPU RAM unused. We simply don't have enough information about their caching system one way or another. But you definitely shouldn't assume that demo would cause stuttering on ANY PC RAM configuration. That would be a gross miscalcuation on your part.

 

[SkeletonQuays]

FTFY

Are dev kits drastically different than the actual consoles? Seems stupid of them to be hyping this up as playable on a ps5 (dev kit) if it wouldn't be achievable on the actual machine itself.

 

[Explosive Zombie]

I got same bad news for you: Ampere is unveiled tomorrow lol

Uh, yeah, they said in the vid FUTURE PC tech can do it, is Ampere currently purchasable and usable on PC? If the argument is that PC can eventually do this, no one disagrees.

 

[VFXVeteran]

"PC can easily run this, it just chooses not to" seems to be the running argument. What hardware will it take for the PC to be capable of this? If it's as easy as some people make out why aren't there PC games that look like this?

It's not like that Nanite tech was always around. These studios invent as the years go on. They chose to show this new tech for the PS5. It could have been shown on the PC but they was more proud to get it to run on console hardware as opposed to PC hardware.

 

[Jerm411]

Jesus. Tits.

God I just want a PS5 event now...

 

[ethomaz]

You are ridiculous...everybody can see what you were replying to to get context....
this demo is possible on PC and epic tech director in pcgamer article even suggest things about 2070 performance with a funny tlfops is not all reference.

Yeap I'm the ridiculous lol
I posted something that the own guy in interview said and you post a quote with he saying the same thing and you call me ridiculous.

I will explain again one time.

There is no SSD on PC market actually to archive that (what PS5 demo does).
PC SSDs with that speeds will be launch late this year with 7GB/s (and it can even be used on PS5).

Epic was clear about that... you can can get good performance with what you have today with SSD in PC but not archive what they got with PS5 "god-tier" loading and streaming.

They were very clear.

 

[Explosive Zombie]

It's not like that Nanite tech was always around. These studios invent as the years go on. They chose to show this new tech for the PS5. It could have been shown on the PC but they was more proud to get it to run on console hardware as opposed to PC hardware.

Part of the tech demo involved showing us how fast you could go through an environment without any pop-in, this is about the SSD tech on PS5 which isn't currently possible on PC.

That said, I'm sure people impressed by this demo can breathe a sigh of relief that an insider like yourself is telling us everything is theoretically possible on PC.

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

PC Gamer asked about 2070 Super and storage requirements for UE5 demo

Fast SSD storage is key to the Unreal Engine 5 demo's super detailed scenes

Along with a good GPU, you'll need a speedy drive if you want to run UE5 games at the level of detail shown in the demo.

www.pcgamer.com

Fast SSD storage is key to the Unreal Engine 5 demo's super detailed scenes

I couldn't get any exact specifications from Epic, but on a conference call earlier this week I asked how an RTX 2070 Super would handle the demo, and Epic Games chief technical officer Kim Libreri said that it should be able to get "pretty good" performance. But aside from a fancy GPU, you'll need some fast storage if you want to see the level of detail shown in the demo video.

That doesn't mean that old HDDs will be unable to handle UE5 games and their billion-polygon "film quality" assets. The idea behind UE5 is to let developers import the highest quality assets they have, and then automatically scale everything to fit the hardware being used, all the way down to phones.

"You could render a version of this [demo on a system with an HDD], it would just be a lot lower detail," said Sweeney.

 

[rsouzadk]

AMD SSG article (PC Gamer)

Might help clear up some questions some folks seem to be having on how the SSDs work in the systems. With the SSG cards AMD leverages a SSG API so that the GPU can talk with the on-board NAND storage directly, bypassing CPU, PCIe etc. It's speeds are slightly faster than PS5's (8 GB/s read, 6 GB/s write), but yeah it would appear said API allows the GPU to communicate to the onboard NAND directly.

That said it does not replace the purpose or function of the main memory, which is MUCH faster and has MUCH more bandwidth (plus a wider bus, and byte-level alterability). But I don't see how it's impossible for next-gen systems to leverage aspects of the SSG line, particularly the APIs allowing GPU communication to the NAND. And FWIW, those SSG cards are for workstation PCs, so there's nothing fundamentally preventing it from working on any x86-based device I'd assume (unless AMD or other hardware partners just decided not to leverage it in that way).

There is GPUDirect Storage from nvidia.

 

[Kenpachii]

AMD SSG article (PC Gamer)

Might help clear up some questions some folks seem to be having on how the SSDs work in the systems. With the SSG cards AMD leverages a SSG API so that the GPU can talk with the on-board NAND storage directly, bypassing CPU, PCIe etc. It's speeds are slightly faster than PS5's (8 GB/s read, 6 GB/s write), but yeah it would appear said API allows the GPU to communicate to the onboard NAND directly.

That said it does not replace the purpose or function of the main memory, which is MUCH faster and has MUCH more bandwidth (plus a wider bus, and byte-level alterability). But I don't see how it's impossible for next-gen systems to leverage aspects of the SSG line, particularly the APIs allowing GPU communication to the NAND. And FWIW, those SSG cards are for workstation PCs, so there's nothing fundamentally preventing it from working on any x86-based device I'd assume (unless AMD or other hardware partners just decided not to leverage it in that way).

What's the point really the bottleneck stays. They probably don't want to soldier it on the GPU for the simple reason upgradability.

Yeap I'm the ridiculous lol
I posted something that the own guy in interview said and you post a quote with he saying the same thing and you call me ridiculous.

I will explain again one time.

There is no SSD on PC market actually to archive that (what PS5 demo does).
PC SSDs with that speeds will be launch late this year with 7GB/s (and it can even be used on PS5).

There is indeed no SSD on the PC market with the speed of the PS5 SSD.
PC SSD's however there are.

U should google raid, tim is really particulare on what he says mate for a reason. He would otherwise lie.

 

[psorcerer]

U should google raid.

You should google 64K random read on these.

 

[NXGamer]

And I say it's not. The GPU isn't directly indexing texture lookups from virtual RAM that's represented in the SSD. It's too slow. The GPU is indexing texture lookups from the VRAM. The SSD is just a fast cache for the VRAM. Data is flowing to the VRAM and then GPU reads from there - not directly from the SSD. PC has 2 pools of RAM - CPU and GPU. That can be any configuration. My own personal PC has 64G of RAM and then my 2080Ti has 11G of VRAM. I bet anything I can run that demo with my HDD-equipped PC.

Are stating that the PC can't run this demo? I say it can run this demo and run it better (4k/60FPS). I'd love to know how much RAM this demo costs and I wish they would release it to the PC owners so they can play with it. Probably one day..

You just answered your own question and my statement. The issue here is current streaming, index and management of that data through the PCIe pipe all takes a toll on the PC CPU to manage the Virtual addressing of that.

The PS5 here, has dedicated I/O processors, it also has GPU scrubbers to manage the virtual allocation of assest within the SSD (this is extacly what is is being used for) and more importantly it can access much of this through more channels (12) and the DMA access. The big difference here is the ENTIRE system has been built from the ground-up to deliver THESE kinds of assets and maximise the "relatively" lower specs in VRAM and bandwidth.

Simply having 64GB of DDR4 in your system does not mean it can stream that data with the ability as we have seen here, I must stress I am not saying it is not possble, just until we know more then we need to hold final judgement.

 

[LittleBigGamer]

This is the most fanboyish comment I've ever seen in my life.

You automagically mitigate a 3rd party developer of cross-platform engines simply because you "love" your 1st party developers. Even though they haven't shown any new technical advancements yet? Wow.

lol, says the guy who makes threads to downplay sony 1st party and get banned.
The guy who is always triggered when reads good things about first-party. The guy who thinks he is an Insider.
We will see if his post is fanboyism or not soon

 

[VFXVeteran]

Part of the tech demo involved showing us how fast you could go through an environment without any pop-in, this is about the SSD tech on PS5 which isn't currently possible on PC.

That said, I'm sure people impressed by this demo can breathe a sigh of relief that an insider like yourself is telling us everything is theoretically possible on PC.

You can believe it's about that. But I assure you that this demo is running on the PC.

You just answered your own question and my statement. The issue here is current streaming, index and management of that data through the PCIe pipe all takes a toll on the PC CPU to manage the Virtual addressing of that.

The PS5 here, has dedicated I/O processors, it also has GPU scrubbers to manage the virtual allocation of assest within the SSD (this is extacly what is is being used for) and more importantly it can access much of this through more channels (12) and the DMA access. The big difference here is the ENTIRE system has ben built from the ground-up to deliver THESE kinds of assets and maximise the "relatively" lower specs in VRAM and bandwidth.

Simply having 64GB of DDR4 in your system does not mean it can stream that data with the ability as we have seen here, I must stress I am not saying it is not possble, just until we know more then we need to hold final judgement.

Then I wouldn't say it can't be run on a PC as you stated. I can also tell you that it runs on a PC because they tell you it does. Once we get around the fact that all platforms will be in harmony with 3rd party titles, we are left with the GPU. And you already got a glimpse of what those limitations are: sub-4k @ 30FPS.

 

[Agnostic2020]

PC Gamer asked about 2070 Super and storage requirements for UE5 demo

Fast SSD storage is key to the Unreal Engine 5 demo's super detailed scenes

Along with a good GPU, you'll need a speedy drive if you want to run UE5 games at the level of detail shown in the demo.

www.pcgamer.com

Those 8k textures need super fast ssd to render I guess

 

[VFXVeteran]

lol, says the guy who makes threads to downplay sony 1st party and get banned.
The guy who always is triggered when reads good things about first-party. The guy who thinks he is an Insider.

I can't help if if a mod is also a Sony fanboy and wants to shut me up. "Think" I'm an insider? I guess you can talk to the mods here about them giving me what I "think" my title should be.

Banning won't happen on here though FYI.

 

[ethomaz]

There is indeed no SSD on the PC market with the speed of the PS5 SSD.
PC SSD's however there are.

U should google raid, tim is really particulare on what he says mate for a reason. He would otherwise lie.

You are talking about software RAID 0, no? Because you need a dedicated SSD controller to support hardware RAID 0 even so it won't give you what PS5 is giving to you.... there are several performance issues with both software and hardware (that one less extent) RAID 0 that can't archive the theoretical peak of 2x the speeds.

And I don't need to google to know that.

Epic was clear about the level of detail on screen of the demo, if you have to separately in tiers:

PS5 = Highest
Actual PC with NVMe SSD = High
Actual PC with HDD = Low

That will probably change with the new 7GB/s SSDs to be launched late this year.

 

[HeadsUp7Up]

Goodbye wallet!

 

[NXGamer]

You can believe it's about that. But I assure you that this demo is running on the PC.




[bThen I wouldn't say it can't be run on a PC as you stated[/b]. I can also tell you that it runs on a PC because they tell you it does. Once we get around the fact that all platforms will be in harmony with 3rd party titles, we are left with the GPU. And you already got a glimpse of what those limitations are: sub-4k @ 30FPS.

You are getting confused with your own statements, just to recall, you stated that the SSD is NOT adding anything to the graphics.
We chatted, you now agree.

I never said a PC could not do this, you did.

 

[LittleBigGamer]

I can't help if if a mod is also a Sony fanboy and wants to shut me up. "Think" I'm an insider? I guess you can talk to the mods here about them giving me what I "think" my title should be.

Banning won't happen on here though FYI.

All I know is you don't know what are you talking about, regarding gaming. Really no clue.
Maybe you know some pc moders and believe you are an insider. I don't know.
On the other forum, you were just a sony hater like many others.

This is my opinion at least. I want to be honest.

 

[ValiantTraveler]

How do developers make these models and environments made of billions upon billions of triangles?

Does it take a lot more time than current gen games or does the new technology allow to make better-textured graphics in more or less the same amount of time?

 

[VFXVeteran]

All I know is you don't know what are you talking about regarding gaming. Really no clue.
Maybe you know some pc moders and believe you are an insider. I don't know.
In the other forum, you were just a sony fanboy hater like many others.

Corrected.

And you are right. I have no idea about gaming or graphics.

 

[Radical_3d]

meh. this is just a tech demo, not gameplay.

For reference:

this is a similar epic games unreal engine tech demo, but for unreal engine 3:




platform: xbox 360 and ps3

and now compare this demo to real gameplay from PS3/xbox 360 unreal engine games lol

This is simply not true. The Samaritan was a 2011 tech demo (way after the HD generation started) to showcase the next generation of graphics with a target of 2TF machines. I won’t bother to find a screenshot of what a 1,8TF machine achieved.

 

[VFXVeteran]

You are getting confused with your own statements, just to recall, you stated that the SSD is NOT adding anything to the graphics.
We chatted, you now agree.

I never said a PC could not do this, you did.

No. I'm looking at the low level definition of SSD not adding anything to graphics and that's true. If you want to say it can stream more data to the RAM subsystem faster than an HDD can, I agree 100%. But that's as far as it goes bro. Really.

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

All I know is you don't know what are you talking about, regarding gaming. Really no clue.
Maybe you know some pc moders and believe you are an insider. I don't know.
On the other forum, you were just a sony hater like many others.

This is my opinion at least. I want to be honest.

I don't know anything about the other forum and I don't know VFXVet personally or anything but it seems like you are being a tad harsh here. Seems like the guy gets dogpiled on pretty frequently. Not saying I agree or disagree with anything/everything he says but why the vitriol?

 

[psorcerer]

How do developers make these models and environments made of billions upon billions of triangles?

 

[VFXVeteran]

I don't know anything about the other forum and I don't know VFXVet personally or anything but it seems like you are being a tad harsh here. Seems like the guy gets dogpiled on pretty frequently. Not saying I agree or disagree with anything/everything he says but why the vitriol?

Because he doesn't like me deflating their inflated comments about PS exclusive games. It's the whole subjective opinion = objective fact argument - again.

 

[thelastword]

This is the most fanboyish comment I've ever seen in my life.

You automagically mitigate a 3rd party developer of cross-platform engines simply because you "love" your 1st party developers. Even though they haven't shown any new technical advancements yet? Wow.

How do I know? because of their history and tech prowess.....Cue what has been said of Guerilla's next game, it's going to set a benchmark. So will PD, Naughty and SSM. Even Bluepoint with their remake says they are going to lead the charge in graphics and I expect no less from Sucker Punch, San Diego and Insomniac.....

I think this UE5 gameplay is a really impressive next gen look, but we can expect more. First parties on PS platforms have always led the charge, it's just the reality...

 

[VFXVeteran]

How do I know? because of their history and tech prowess.....

Dude, name 1 thing revolutionary tech-wise that any of the 1st party developers invented that was the first time.

 

[ethomaz]

You are getting confused with your own statements, just to recall, you stated that the SSD is NOT adding anything to the graphics.
We chatted, you now agree.

I never said a PC could not do this, you did.

In Epic interview they say the SSD direct affect the level of detail of what you see in the screen... that is graphics for me I guess.
But some people will say Epic is lying like they said Cerny was lying too.
Just another day

 

[Elder Legend]

Man this is super hype for me on a personal leve. Back in my university days I was studying to become a 3D Artist for Video Games and in 2012 I graduated with a Video Game Art Bachelor's degree, but I also realized how tough the industry is and decided not to go into development, but I still wanted to work in the industry so I went the journalism route and now own my own business. As a former 3D Art Student/Graduate I've had a lot of experience working in Maya and zBrush and we created a lot of high end assets, we were taught game engine optimization and things of that nature, so I understand this stuff from both artistic and technical perspective.

We've done our own 3D artwork from scratch, along with texturing in Photoshop, both realistic and hand-painted on a tablet and then we imported into UE3. I cannot wait for UE5, I might get back into doing some 3D Artwork just for fun, this will be an absolute blast!

 

[GymWolf]

and so it begin the contest for what engine is gonna be the better one during next gen:

decima
ue5
capcom engine
ND engine
square enix engine
remedy engine
A4 engine
cd project engine
id tech next engine
many others


ue4 was not the best engine during this gen, it was good\great but not the best, who is gonna win this time?

 

[LittleBigGamer]

I don't know anything about the other forum and I don't know VFXVet personally or anything but it seems like you are being a tad harsh here. Seems like the guy gets dogpiled on pretty frequently. Not saying I agree or disagree with anything/everything he says but why the vitriol?

I would not be so offensive, if his hating agenda and ignorance was not obscured behind the label:
''Industry Professional''.

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

How do I know? because of their history and tech prowess.....Cue what has been said of Guerilla's next game, it's going to set a benchmark. So will PD, Naughty and SSM. Even Bluepoint with their remake says they are going to lead the charge in graphics and I expect no less from Sucker Punch, San Diego and Insomniac.....

I think this UE5 gameplay is a really impressive next gen look, but we can expect more. First parties on PS platforms have always led the charge, it's just the reality...

Soooo UE5 Demo thread is now a Sony First Party Studio Graphics thread.

 

[psorcerer]

ue4 was not the best engine during this gen, it was good\great but not the best, who is gonna win this time?

Decima will decimate.

 

[ethomaz]

Soooo UE5 Demo thread is now a Sony First Party Studio Graphics thread.

The demo actually was only showed on PS5...
We need it running in others places for comparison while that it only shows what PS5 can archive.

 

[GymWolf]

Decima will decimate.

ignorant question, isn't decima engine rooted in current gen? does it have something similar to nanite for details and lumen for lights and shadows?

 

[llien]

Well there's more to it than just SSD speed.
Here's the list of thing PC doesn't have yet to achieve PS5 IO performance

• 5.5GB/s Read/write speed (9GB/s with compression, remember Pcie 4.0 max speed is 7GB/s)
• Hardware data compression (can be done on CPU but will request a lot of processing power)
• 12 channel instead of 4 to speed random access
• GPU cache scrubbing
• All other custom coprocessor that leverage CPU cycle. (dedicated DMA controller, SSD IO, memory mapping)

For PC to be able to reach this kind of performance, Graphic Card will need to have an SSD attached to it. (Which they might)

For anyone, but Sony devs to use this SSD speed, it needs to be available on other platforms.

 

[thelastword]

Dude, name 1 thing revolutionary tech-wise that any of the 1st party developers invented that was the first time.

Their games look the best, period. They switch between best graphics the whole gen, they constantly win best graphics at each year's awards...….And just a mention, but Dreams on PS5 with this hardware capability should look absolutely bonkers at high fidelity, Look at the Dreams engine, the Decima engine, that and the other SWWS game engines are going to lead the charge.....I personally expect my jaw to be on the floor when ND and PD drops their first trailer.....It's not something you are guessing, it's something you know, because they have delivered every time...

 

[scydrex]

PC Gamer asked about 2070 Super and storage requirements for UE5 demo

Fast SSD storage is key to the Unreal Engine 5 demo's super detailed scenes

Along with a good GPU, you'll need a speedy drive if you want to run UE5 games at the level of detail shown in the demo.

www.pcgamer.com

And still some people here are still talking the SSD don't add details or better graphics... better detail is better looking no?

 

[psorcerer]

does it have something similar to nanite for details and lumen for lights and shadows?

Obviously. Hint: Death Stranding uses Quixel.
I think Sony will position Decima as "our UE5" for next gen.
BTW, AFAIK ND do not have any engine. The tech is developed for each game (using the same tools, but it's not "engine")

 

[Stuart360]

Yeap I'm the ridiculous lol
I posted something that the own guy in interview said and you post a quote with he saying the same thing and you call me ridiculous.

I will explain again one time.

There is no SSD on PC market actually to archive that (what PS5 demo does).
PC SSDs with that speeds will be launch late this year with 7GB/s (and it can even be used on PS5).

Epic was clear about that... you can can get good performance with what you have today with SSD in PC but not archive what they got with PS5 "god-tier" loading and streaming.

They were very clear.

Epic also said you could run this demo on current gen and look comparable, with limitations of course.
This demo wasnt made to simply show off PS5 power, it was to show off the new techniques and possible graphics from UE5, hense the dynamic 1440p, no ray tracing, and stuttery 30fps.