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Very LTTP: Neon Genesis Evangelion

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Krev

Unconfirmed Member
Oh really? I hadn't come across that information but then again I haven't been keeping up with the news.
Yeah, he said so when he announced his involvement with the new Godzilla film, here:
http://www.evangelion.co.jp/news_20150401.html
Someone translated it at Evageeks:
http://forum.evageeks.org/post/786752/Anno-is-writing-and-directing-a-Godzilla-movie/#786752
I think that's a more accurate description. It's just that the way people tend to write about is implies that working on Evangelion made him depressed which isn't strictly accurate.
A lot of stuff anglophone fans write about Anno tends to be misinformed.
 
I can honestly understand just where all the hate come from for Shinji but I sympathize with the kid. Considering everything he's had to go through (child abandonment, NERV conscription, etc.) it's understandable that he'd be a little screwed up. Even with what he does in the beginning of End of Evangelion, I still felt bad for him. Being responsible for the lives of billions can be a bit of a burden.
 

NCR Redslayer

NeoGAF's Vegeta
I can honestly understand just where all the hate come from for Shinji but I sympathize with the kid. Considering everything he's had to go through (child abandonment, NERV conscription, etc.) it's understandable that he'd be a little screwed up. Even with what he does in the beginning of End of Evangelion, I still felt bad for him. Being responsible for the lives of billions can be a bit of a burden.
Yeah but the only reason why he is shit is because everyone else in the show is shit.
His father is the reason why the are problems in the first place.
 

Tizoc

Member
Am I the only one who liked the stuff that happens before the mental breakdown shit?
Also Yui and Gendo are shitty parents.

Grimløck;160182172 said:
the main character's such a pussy.

Blame Anno for that.
 

Jex

Member
Yeah, he said so when he announced his involvement with the new Godzilla film, here:
http://www.evangelion.co.jp/news_20150401.html
Someone translated it at Evageeks:
http://forum.evageeks.org/post/786752/Anno-is-writing-and-directing-a-Godzilla-movie/#786752

Ah, as I suspected, a Japanese-only source with a fan translation. No wonder I hadn't come across it!

To be honest, even though EvaGeeks is a great resource I tend to steer clear of it because that's a pretty deep rabbit hole.
 
Episode 6

This was a pretty straight forward action episode. It was pretty cool though. The scene where the cannon sucked up all of Japan's energy looked great. I especially loved the shot of Japan going dark.

One thing that was odd was the shot of Toji and that other kid playing video games in their room. Weren't they evacuated to a shelter? Not a big deal though.

Not sure why Rei is as popular as she is. She hasn't really done much yet. But it's still early. I'm sure i'll see something that will prove show why Megumi Hayashibara's career skyrocketed after this.

Kind of surprised Asuka hasn't been introduced yet. She's featured so prominently in fan discussions, yet I'm already a decent chunk into the show, yet no sign of her yet. And it doesn't look like she'll be in the next episode either.

Edit: I just decided to check out the english dub of the first episode. Holy fuck. I'm not one of those "super nippon seiyuu glorious" types. If a dub is good, it's good. But this isn't good. This is god awful. It sounds like amateur hour or something.
Because out of any woman in the whole cast Rei's the only one not trying to use or abuse Shinji in some way.
giphy.gif
Thank you. She's actually legit nice. She's emotionally withdrawn and isolated, but everybody pretty much just treats her like she's a science experiment. She gets a little better in the Rebuild movies...at least the second one.
 

Dreavus

Member
It's been quite some time since I watched the show, but I remember the episode with the
computer virus angel that was trying to get their AI to nuke itself
to be one of the most intense scenes, in an awesome way.

Count me as one of those who were not impressed by the original ending. I mean, they had me. They had me the whole way. I was invested. All the
fucked up vaguely-christian-themed apocolypse shit
? I am IN there. What the hell is going to happen? And then those last few episodes came. They felt like a momentary distraction that would pass "any moment now" to get to what's really happening. It felt like they they were just prepping for the ending. Some exposition to set it all up. But no, it actually WAS the ending. I remember being very surprised/annoyed at the whole thing even though I was "warned" by several people that the ending is non-typical and kind of bad.

The studio's budget problems were very very unfortunate indeed.

I never did see EoE though (only the very fucked up opening scene, actually). I'm guessing that follows directly after the series? It'd probably fix a lot of the problems I had with the show. What exactly are the "director's cut" versions of the final episodes? Do they continue the plot?

Maybe I should re-watch the whole thing.
 

co1onel

Member
I never did see EoE though (only the very fucked up opening scene, actually). I'm guessing that follows directly after the series? It'd probably fix a lot of the problems I had with the show. What exactly are the "director's cut" versions of the final episodes? Do they continue the plot?

Maybe I should re-watch the whole thing.

EoE picks up directly after episode 24. In some ways EoE is a replacement for episode 25 and 26. The director's cut episodes add a few extra scenes and longer openings/endings.
 
Normally I'm the type who's into the 2deep4u shit, but near the end of Evangelion (and the actual End of Evangelion) I found my arm wasn't long enough for the jerk off motion it warranted. It isn't a terrible show, but it gets way more praise than it deserves. I think its about twice as long as it needed to be (kind of a recurring thing for Gainax) and Shinji is the absolute king of bitchmade anime protags.

It is interesting to see what a show made by a man having total mental breakdown looks like though.
 
Normally I'm the type who's into the 2deep4u shit, but near the end of Evangelion (and the actual End of Evangelion) I found my arm wasn't long enough for the jerk off motion it warranted. It isn't a terrible show, but it gets way more praise than it deserves. I think its about twice as long as it needed to be (kind of a recurring thing for Gainax) and Shinji is the absolute king of bitchmade anime protags.

It is interesting to see what a show made by a man having total mental breakdown looks like though.
I honestly prefer Rahxephon to Evangelion but I like both shows for different reasons.
 
I tried listening to the You Can(not) Rewatch podcast for a small Eva fix, and its analysis just was too shallow to maintain my attention. The hosts also were as informed about the show as I wanted hosts of an Evangelion-focused podcast to be. Anyone have recommendations for a good Evangelion-focused podcast?
 

MechaX

Member

To be honest, my favorite characters in the series are Rei and Fuyutsuki (don't ask). Rei is genuinely a good person (not only to Shinji, but she even tries to help out Asuka when she's going through her problems with EVA-02, even though Asuka has been a complete and total bitch to her since day 1), but she's been raised in such a fucked up fashion. She gets criticized for being an emotionless doll, but it turns out that not only does she show emotion in her own ways, she even realizes that she's not the wind-up doll and soldier she thought she was.

I'm not counting 3.33 Rei by the way.
 

Altazor

Member
I never did see EoE though (only the very fucked up opening scene, actually). I'm guessing that follows directly after the series? It'd probably fix a lot of the problems I had with the show. What exactly are the "director's cut" versions of the final episodes? Do they continue the plot?

Maybe I should re-watch the whole thing.

You should watch EoE.

Depending on who you ask it's either a complete substitution of what happened in eps 24/25 or the same events viewed from an outside perspective.
 

Fj0823

Member
Because out of any woman in the whole cast Rei's the only one not trying to use or abuse Shinji in some way.

Thank you. She's actually legit nice. She's emotionally withdrawn and isolated, but everybody pretty much just treats her like she's a science experiment. She gets a little better in the Rebuild movies...at least the second one.

In the third one she gets some more progress as a character, even if
Its not the same body
in the original once shit happened, her
Replacement
is pretty much a doll, in rebuild, it starts the same, but at the very end she is moved by Mari's questions and decides to
preserve herself
which is a real advancement compared to her usual views on her life.

One of the many reasons I liked 3.33
 

Mobius 1

Member
To be honest, my favorite characters in the series are Rei and Fuyutsuki (don't ask). Rei is genuinely a good person (not only to Shinji, but she even tries to help out Asuka when she's going through her problems with EVA-02, even though Asuka has been a complete and total bitch to her since day 1), but she's been raised in such a fucked up fashion. She gets criticized for being an emotionless doll, but it turns out that not only does she show emotion in her own ways, she even realizes that she's not the wind-up doll and soldier she thought she was.

I'm not counting 3.33 Rei by the way.

I like Fuyutsuki too, the poor bastard had blue balls for Yui all his life and still did his job.
 
In the third one she gets some more progress as a character, even if
Its not the same body
in the original once shit happened, her
Replacement
is pretty much a doll, in rebuild, it starts the same, but at the very end she is moved by Mari's questions and decides to
preserve herself
which is a real advancement compared to her usual views on her life.

One of the many reasons I liked 3.33
I really do need to rewatch 3.33. I didn't hate it at all, just felt weird I guess. I can't really stand Rei bashing. Now Asuka bashing is a train I'll hop on since she was quite harmful and delusional. She was not in the right mind set to lord herself over everybody else, but she did it any way.
She has just as many problems if not more than the main cast since she knows full well what happened to her mother, but acts like she's miss perfect and belittles everyone.
I think if she honestly just tried to talk to Shinji like he was an actual person then it would've helped her as a character, but she didn't. I've never really viewed Rei as emotionally vacant. She's distant as fuck and confused by them, but she really does have emotions. I believe in the manga that's more of the canon ship and I honestly do prefer that ship. Even though yes I realize that's one creepy ass ship once you find out what Rei actually is.
 

Fj0823

Member
I really do need to rewatch 3.33. I didn't hate it at all, just felt weird I guess. I can't really stand Rei bashing. Now Asuka bashing is a train I'll hop on since she was quite harmful and delusional. She was not in the right mind set to lord herself over everybody else, but she did it any way.
She has just as many problems if not more than the main cast since she knows full well what happened to her mother, but acts like she's miss perfect and belittles everyone.
I think if she honestly just tried to talk to Shinji like he was an actual person then it would've helped her as a character, but she didn't. I've never really viewed Rei as emotionally vacant. She's distant as fuck and confused by them, but she really does have emotions. I believe in the manga that's more of the canon ship and I honestly do prefer that ship. Even though yes I realize that's one creepy ass ship once you find out what Rei actually is.

The problem with Rei is that
She is never allowed to feel, when she starts to be human, the death flag is humoungus.
even in the non canon media. In ANIMA,
Rei IV and V
get the same treatment
 

hateradio

The Most Dangerous Yes Man
Ah, the I just watched Eva thread of the month(TM).

I don't think I can say anything that hasn't been said.


  • Yes, Shinji is supposed to be a shell of a person
  • Rei is supposed to be a shell of a person
  • Asuka is also just a shell of a person, though a tough one to break


Asuka is awesome.
 

Moonkid

Member
When you're done, check out a few AMVs. There's surprisingly a few really great ones, everything from the music of Queen to Death Grips.
 
I love mecha anime. It's my favorite genre of the medium. It's hard to be a fan without hearing about this show. Hell,I majored in Japanese and it's one of the few shows that was brought up in my studies due to how important it's impact was when it came out.

That said, I've always avoided it due to some of the stuff I've heard about it. I always thought it would be "2deep4me" and edgey for the sake of being edgey. But since my two Gundam shows that were currently running ended, I decided to fill the void with this show.

Since it's damn near impossible to watch this show 100% unspoiled due to just how popular it is, I do know some vague things. 1 - Apparently Shinji is the worst anime protagonist (according to the fandom, at least) ever. 2 - There is some sort of connection apparently between the Eva pilots and their mothers. 3 - The show ends in a very rough fashion. 4 - The last two episodes suck.

Now I'm only 5 episodes in. I try to watch one episode a day. Today I watched two. So far Shinji isn't as bad as I expected. He's been kind of boring so far if anything, but this last episode showed signs of life in him. There is some other stuff regarding his character that I'll get into in a bit.

2 - Can't really comment on the Mother/Pilot connection yet. But it became obvious there was some sort of connection when they revealed the cockpit was called the umbilical unit.

Regarding the ending, from my understanding this show was inspired by Ideon. I have some ideas on what that means where this is heading lol.

But yeah... so far, I gotta say I'm enjoying it quite a bit so far. The theme song (which I've known about for years and is one of the reasons I decided to finally give in) is pretty awesome. The artwork is fantastic, though I'm not (nor ever have been) a fan of the mecha designs (or angel designs for that matter). Both the character designs and environments are top notch.

The music is fantastic. It's very subtle in it's useage, but sounds great. It's Yoko Kanno, right? Does she do the music for the Rebuild movies as well? Good stuff there. I especially love the Preview song.

Regarding themes: A big theme so far seems to be alienation/isolation. Shinji seems to be completely alienated in all of his relationships. His relationship with his (only?) parent is utter shit. He has no friends. And he has some pretty big sexual issues (more on that in a bit).

Rei, who just now started getting focus in the series, also seems to have isolation issues. There also seems to be some sort of weird daddy-issues thing going on where she's into her father figure (Gendo).

I'm pretty interested to see where they're going with that.

Sexuality also seems to be a pretty big theme so far. Usually I'm not into "pervy" stuff in anime, but they actually seem to be doing something interesting with it here. In fact, I can't even really say it is "perverted", despite Misato's insistances that she will provide more fan service in the next episode.

Shinji has some pretty big pent up sexual frustration issues going on. They were really on the nose with it in the episode where he ran away and watched a young couple make out at a movie theater. Then you have Misato. She gravitates between a (shitty) parental figure while also encouraging Shinji to view her as a sexual object, causing him to be confused. Maybe I'm reading too much into that though. Once again, some 2deep4me stuff probably where I'm over-interpretting.

Favorite character so far? Probably Gendo. He's done jack shit so far, but he looks boss as hell doing it. Interested to see where they take him.

Favorite scene so far? In episode 3, there is a scene where Shinji is in class and he gets a message asking if he's the eva pilot. He replies "yes" and the whole room erupts. I'm having a hard time pinpointing why that scene stood out to me. I think it was the way the tension and atmosphere was portrayed.

1- Your mileage may vary, but he's very much a broken character like everyone else in the show. No one is whole.
2 - You'll see
3 - The ending is very dialog driven, the spectacle you'll be craving is portrayed in the followup film EoE
4 - They really don't suck, but they are a jarring transition and if you're not on board with what the show is trying to do and say, then you won't like them, because of 3. EoE presents what is happening in a less abstract manner, some people think it's an alternate ending but I don't see it that way, and I don't think it's ever been officially stated that it's alternative in anything but perspective and presentation.

Dub - Your observation about it being amateur hour is astute. Unfortunately the cast and the direction is clung to by some fans and the people working on it, so the dub cast and many of the directorial problems were mimicked in the first of the rebuild films, so there's pretty much no way to watch this dubbed with a good performance, nor will there ever be for a very long time. Thankfully the Japanese cast and performance is really solid, in a way that I think shines through in spite of language barriers.
 

Moonkid

Member
Theres one with Nightwish's Everdream that sold me on the series.

I'm a fan, and discoverer the amazing series for that video alone.

Edit: Holy crap its still here!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-2vAtvDRnU&feature=youtube_gdata_player
I have the same experience but with the musician featured rather than the show itself lol, but any of my favourite AMVs would have sold me on Evangelion if I didn't know about it before hand. Evangelion is one of those rare shows where you can go on a binge-watch for music videos and not get crap half the time if you know what you're looking for. It's also amazing how pretty much every genre can fit in. If classical and noise rap goes well with it, I say anything can.
 

random25

Member
To be honest, my favorite characters in the series are Rei and Fuyutsuki (don't ask). Rei is genuinely a good person (not only to Shinji, but she even tries to help out Asuka when she's going through her problems with EVA-02, even though Asuka has been a complete and total bitch to her since day 1), but she's been raised in such a fucked up fashion. She gets criticized for being an emotionless doll, but it turns out that not only does she show emotion in her own ways, she even realizes that she's not the wind-up doll and soldier she thought she was.

I'm not counting 3.33 Rei by the way.

She really wasn't devoid of emotion as many thought she was, even in the early parts of the series.
She got tensed when she saw Shinji holding his father's broken glasses, and even got angry and slapped Shinji for badmouthing his father.
And later on she developed a ton more, especially when it's about Shinji.

The latest movies really butchered the whole series, not just Rei.
 
Episode 7
- A pretty light-hearted episode that focuses on Misato. The repetition of the breakfast scene worked pretty well, I thought. And I always enjoy jokes about bureaucracy, so it was a fun episode altogether. The JA mech design wasn't that good, but I have come to expect it at this point.

There was pretty heavy moment that was sort of easy to miss, when Shinji was wondering what an EVA actually was. There was a comment that it smells like blood inside it.

Was it implied that Gendo was the one who sabotaged the JA?

Episode 8
- So that Asuka. She's kind of bitchier than I expected lol. Interestingly, it appears that Shinji is viewed as some sort of prodigy (a fact that seems to make Asuka VERY upset. I guess she wants to be the prodigy?)

One of my favorite themes that has been emerging as been the tension between traditional militaries and NERV. Some pretty cool drama there.

Whoa, the ED changed.
 
Episode 8
- So that Asuka. She's kind of bitchier than I expected lol. Interestingly, it appears that Shinji is viewed as some sort of prodigy (a fact that seems to make Asuka VERY upset. I guess she wants to be the prodigy?)

Shinji doesn't act like a real man so Asuka takes that role. lol
 
NGE was one of those animes that I watched like a decade ago in a marathon and didn't really "get it" and thought mos of the characters were just straight up lame or at least fucked up. Now that I've seen more mecha animes I've grown to appreciate it a lot more, and I'm way past due for a rewatch.
 
Nah, I get it. If it sounds like I'm being hard on her, it's unintentional. I actually enjoyed her in the previous episode.

Asuka is a fun character, she IS a jerk most the time, but for a while she brings a fiesty atmosphere to the show where it lacked one, and it's fun to see the team come together, which she's kind of a catalyst for in some ways. Asuka totally wants the attention shinji gets though, they aren't subtle about that.
 
Episode 9
Another mostly light-hearted episode. Asuka Tsun-tsun'd her her way through a bunch of forced hijynx with Shinji that was actually pretty funny. I especially enjoyed montage of the them syncing together.

Toji and other guy are pretty fun characters, I think.

It's kind of surprising how straight up they are with how relationships are portrayed. No beating around the bush there. I'm refering to the relationship between Kaji and Misato. You don't really see too much of that in anime... or really anything to be honest.
 
Episode 9
Another mostly light-hearted episode. Asuka Tsun-tsun'd her her way through a bunch of forced hijynx with Shinji that was actually pretty funny. I especially enjoyed montage of the them syncing together.

Toji and other guy are pretty fun characters, I think.

It's kind of surprising how straight up they are with how relationships are portrayed. No beating around the bush there. I'm refering to the relationship between Kaji and Misato. You don't really see too much of that in anime... or really anything to be honest.

You're approaching some recap episodes, I would watch them, they are not 100% recap and they offer information once withheld.
 
I always loved the piano track that plays during the battle in Episode 9. But yeah, you can totally see why they removed that Angel from Rebuild. Very monster-of-the-week gimmicky

You're only a few more episodes away from the tonal change


Edit: The "recap" is only half an episode from memory? It's kinda cool in some ways. I think it's actually the true midpoint of the series
 
Eva got me through freshmen year of college that and I had my first taste of ten megabyte peer to peer file sharing and the weird things people share on a college network.
 
Evangelion was the first really good anime series I watched, and still remains the very best I have seen. Well, Cowboy Bebop is also up there, but it's hard to directly compare the two. Escaflowne is also very good, if not quite as impressive.

Anyway, watch the TV series as a whole before even thinking about End of Evangelion. If you want more, or a different ending, watch EoE. EoE can also be thought as being Anno's screw you to the stupid fanboys who didn't get the original ending. He doesn't like explaining things too much, but the studio made him do it anyway. Or something, it has been ages since I read the interviews and theories.

I haven't seen the Rebuild films yet, but as far as I understand tell a slightly different version of the story, and will have a completely new ending again. I'll watch them once the the final film is released...
 

Altazor

Member
It's all fun and games until you start to realize "holy crap these kids lives are fucked up" and then the show never lets go.
 

Fj0823

Member
Rebuild is not a little different, its a completely cracked up new story, we even get a
4th pilot
. Although she is not as important as the main trio, she steals the show in movie 2
 

MMarston

Was getting caught part of your plan?
I haven't seen the Rebuild films yet, but as far as I understand tell a slightly different version of the story, and will have a completely new ending again. I'll watch them once the the final film is released...

Yeah, they're not just a little different.

I'd like to say more on how different it is but I don't really wanna spoil it.
 

Mokujin

Member
I liked quite a bit the first two Rebuild movies, mainly because it was a way to relive some epic EVA moments in gorgeous quality.

And while I was totally WTF while watching the third one and quite disappointed, the movie has grown a lot on me after reading some theories.-

**I would advise to read the spoiler only if you have watched everything, original series, EoE and Rebuild movies**
Rebuild movies are not a new take on the Eva story, but it's a new cycle after the main Evangelion series

After reading about some clues that could point to that theory and learning more details that are easy overlooked in 3.33 I've come to like it quite a bit.
 
Episode 10
Sort of a monster of the week episode but not too bad. Asuka is ordered to dive into a volcano in order to retrieve a developing Angel. Apparently they attempted this before, which causes the Second Impact so they're really cautious.

There was a moment where it really showed how little Misato cares for these kids that I found interesting,. It was when Asuka's Eva started having issues due to the pressure. She was sort of callous there.

Some details at Asuka's backstory emerged, and others were hinted. Apparently she's a college graduate which sucks for her because she's back in middle school. And apparently she can't read Japanese so she fails all of her classes. Interestingly enough, she seems to crave male attention, what with her seen with Kaji at the beginning and her showing off for Shinji later on. With regards to Shinji, it is interesting because she acts like she detests him, yet when he's the only dude around she'll settle for his attention.

That final scene with Misato's scare. I wonder what exactly happened. Apparently there is rough stuff in Asukas' past as well.
 
11

Pretty cool episode actually. I think this is the first time all three of them have been deployed at the same time, and as such you really got a good chance to see their team work at play. W
hile brief, the fight between the angel and the evas was pretty well done I thought. Actually it might be my favorite battle yet in the series.

Some decent stuff throughout. Gendou probably did more in this episode than he has in any episode yet. His conversation with Shinji at the beginning was interesting. Him yelling at some random worker to not forward any calls from Shinji to him was quite a moment for me.

They introduced a few elements here which might go somewhere or might not. First off, the idea that the city is ran by computers (thus finally explaining what the magi are). Then there is this idea that there may be a rebel element within the city. Gendo summed it up. "Ultimately the enemy of man is man."

And finally, Shinji begins to ponder what exactly the angels are, and why were these monsters named after biblical protectors.

Overall, I think this was a pretty strong episode.
 
Sorry for the double post but I figure I'd provide this update:

Just finished episode 26.

Hahahahahhaha. WTF was that. Some crazy stuff there. I'm not entirely sure I know what the fuck I just watched, but it was amazing. I would totally watch that slice of life show >_>

I'm gonna watch End of Evangelion, tomorrow so I'm going to refrain from posting my thoughts on the entire series until then but for now, I gotta say that those last two episodes were definitely something else. I was braced for it, so I'm not pissed or anything. Actually, I was fascinated the entire time. But it is definitely incoherent and comes off as a bit trollish. It was oddly uplifting... I guess?

Some questions I have (that don't necessarily need to be answered)

1 - Was the Human Instrumentality Project complete. Gendo wanted humanity to merge together as a sort of collective spirit, right?

2 - Did Gendo murder Ritsuko and Katsuragi?

3 - WTF happened to Asuka a few episodes back. She was relatively fine for a second after her mind rape, but then next thing you know they have a shot of her comatose or something.

4 - The last angel fight sucked. Not really a question, just more or less a statement
 

CO_Andy

Member
You shouldn't be asking questions until AFTER you watch The End of Evangelion. Seriously.

The series ending in like the appetizer to the main course (the movie).
 
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