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Very LTTP: Neon Genesis Evangelion
- Thread starter Megalosaro
- Start date
- Status
Regret Upon Approval
Member
Yes it was quite the ride and the bolded covers my feelings, it made me like it a lot.
Astral/H3X
Member
Whaaaaaaaaa that last Angel episode was one of my favorites
You're gonna love 3.3
Yep. I really, really liked the direction that 1.0 and 2.0 took. 3.0 came right out of left field. It really pissed me off how everyone kept Shinji in the dark just for the sake of trolling him. They're like, oh, you're humanity's enemy. We know you don't have any memory of it but fuck you the dog is green.
Megalosaro
Banned
There were a few stand out pieces. Hedgehog Dilemma was amazing. but I'd put quite a few shows above it over all
TheLostBigBoss
Banned
Getting my orange juice ready for the EoE reaction
The OST as a whole doesn't impress me, but there were a few really good songs. The final song in the tv show is one of my favorite. Also have to give Komm süsser Tod a mention, was absolutely perfect for that particular scene in the movie.
Komm süsser Tod tripped me up like crazy. super depressing lyrics with a cheerful as fuck theme? I mean, damn
I love it
Megalosaro
Banned
End of Evangelion
Oh boy. Ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooh booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooy.
That was amazing.
The first half of the movie was okay. Kind of sad that the Eva 01 never got to go ham in the movie. Now that I think about it, the whole "unbinding" thing that happened a few episodes before the ending never really amounted to anything. They were going for the same effect that Ideon had where the Evas were protecting the main characters but didn't necessarily have our best intentions... but it didn't really amount to anything.
That third impact scene though was something else though. The stuff after the intermission was just fantastic actually. Some great imagery there. Same strangely optimistic message the final episode had, but with more of a plot I suppose.
In terms of scenes, I found the scene with Gendo and Rei more shocking than the "I'm so fucked up" scene. But that's because I was spoiled for the masturbation years ago. Either way, it wasn't that big a deal. It was the first scene in the movie.
I'm having trouble seeing where the conflict between Seele and Gendo was however. It seems like they were both trying to achieve the human instrumentality project. Why were they trying to dick each over each other? I mean, I guess I get that Gendo wasn't playing by their rulebook but it didn't seem like.... THAT big a deal since they both basically wanted the same thing.
So yeah, certainly an ambitious movie. It definitely was trying to invoke a Be Invoked vibe, which I think Be Invoked did a bit better of a job (though Evangelion as a whole was a much better series than Space Runaway Ideon as a whole). I enjoyed it definitely. That back half.... oh boy.
As for my thoughts on the series as a whole. Over all I thought it was PRETTY GOOD. Perhaps a bit overrated in some regards, but was certainly entertaining an artistically executed. Most of its run, it plays out like a pretty typical mecha show. It's perhaps a little bit more self aware of it's useage of mecha tropes but not as much as to call it a deconstruction of the genre. I'd say somewhere around episode 20 or so it starts becoming pretty weird in a cool way.
Regarding Shinji.... Not sure what the hate is for. I think it's one of those things where people exaggerate whatever dislike they have for a character. But in this case, I think those people miss the point of the character completely. Goes back to that question I asked in a thread I made once. Does a character need to be likeable to be considered a "good character". I'm of the believer that that is not the case. Shinji is definitely a bit of a wet blanket, but that was the point. His realization at the end was a fantastic conclusion for his character and pretty fitting. And in any case, even though he's a wet blanket he isn't nearly as bad as people make him out to be. Pretty solid protagonist overall.
In terms of other characters: Truth be told, I just don't see the hype for Japan's waifu Rei. She was okay, but was too muted for my tastes. Asuka was a fun character (Channnnnnnnnnnnnnnnsuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu) but for me, the character I ended up liking the most was Katsuragi was my favorite. She toted the line between fun character and deep pretty damn well and I was sad to see her go in End of Evangelion (though I was prepared for it due to the cut away shot in episode 25...) Great well written character. Definitely related with her issues of having to reconcile her professional self with her inner self.
Regarding Gendo. Even though he doesn't do much, he was a pretty nifty character. I think ultimately Gendo was there to be a reflection of what Shinji could become if he continued down his path of isolation.
Regarding "2deep4u". I guess I fall into this camp. Don't get me wrong, I think the show had a lot more depth and meaning than about 99.9% of anime and shows in general. But at at the same time, I think a lot of imagery was fluff. Particularly the religious imagery. It seemed to me that a lot of that stuff that was there was there because it looked and sounded cool, not because it had any particular contextual meaning.
So yeah, pretty interesting show. I definitely enjoyed it more than I thought I would. I'm gonna hold off a week before watching the first Rebuild movie. Then I'll probably watch each successive one a week apart.
Oh boy. Ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooh booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooy.
That was amazing.
The first half of the movie was okay. Kind of sad that the Eva 01 never got to go ham in the movie. Now that I think about it, the whole "unbinding" thing that happened a few episodes before the ending never really amounted to anything. They were going for the same effect that Ideon had where the Evas were protecting the main characters but didn't necessarily have our best intentions... but it didn't really amount to anything.
That third impact scene though was something else though. The stuff after the intermission was just fantastic actually. Some great imagery there. Same strangely optimistic message the final episode had, but with more of a plot I suppose.
In terms of scenes, I found the scene with Gendo and Rei more shocking than the "I'm so fucked up" scene. But that's because I was spoiled for the masturbation years ago. Either way, it wasn't that big a deal. It was the first scene in the movie.
I'm having trouble seeing where the conflict between Seele and Gendo was however. It seems like they were both trying to achieve the human instrumentality project. Why were they trying to dick each over each other? I mean, I guess I get that Gendo wasn't playing by their rulebook but it didn't seem like.... THAT big a deal since they both basically wanted the same thing.
So yeah, certainly an ambitious movie. It definitely was trying to invoke a Be Invoked vibe, which I think Be Invoked did a bit better of a job (though Evangelion as a whole was a much better series than Space Runaway Ideon as a whole). I enjoyed it definitely. That back half.... oh boy.
As for my thoughts on the series as a whole. Over all I thought it was PRETTY GOOD. Perhaps a bit overrated in some regards, but was certainly entertaining an artistically executed. Most of its run, it plays out like a pretty typical mecha show. It's perhaps a little bit more self aware of it's useage of mecha tropes but not as much as to call it a deconstruction of the genre. I'd say somewhere around episode 20 or so it starts becoming pretty weird in a cool way.
Regarding Shinji.... Not sure what the hate is for. I think it's one of those things where people exaggerate whatever dislike they have for a character. But in this case, I think those people miss the point of the character completely. Goes back to that question I asked in a thread I made once. Does a character need to be likeable to be considered a "good character". I'm of the believer that that is not the case. Shinji is definitely a bit of a wet blanket, but that was the point. His realization at the end was a fantastic conclusion for his character and pretty fitting. And in any case, even though he's a wet blanket he isn't nearly as bad as people make him out to be. Pretty solid protagonist overall.
In terms of other characters: Truth be told, I just don't see the hype for Japan's waifu Rei. She was okay, but was too muted for my tastes. Asuka was a fun character (Channnnnnnnnnnnnnnnsuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu) but for me, the character I ended up liking the most was Katsuragi was my favorite. She toted the line between fun character and deep pretty damn well and I was sad to see her go in End of Evangelion (though I was prepared for it due to the cut away shot in episode 25...) Great well written character. Definitely related with her issues of having to reconcile her professional self with her inner self.
Regarding Gendo. Even though he doesn't do much, he was a pretty nifty character. I think ultimately Gendo was there to be a reflection of what Shinji could become if he continued down his path of isolation.
Regarding "2deep4u". I guess I fall into this camp. Don't get me wrong, I think the show had a lot more depth and meaning than about 99.9% of anime and shows in general. But at at the same time, I think a lot of imagery was fluff. Particularly the religious imagery. It seemed to me that a lot of that stuff that was there was there because it looked and sounded cool, not because it had any particular contextual meaning.
So yeah, pretty interesting show. I definitely enjoyed it more than I thought I would. I'm gonna hold off a week before watching the first Rebuild movie. Then I'll probably watch each successive one a week apart.
JadedWriter
Member
Glad to see you enjoyed it and didn't hop on the Shinji hate train. He's not really that bad of a character, just a bit of a jellyfish. Not everybody can be "manly" like Kamina and the show wasn't really about acting heroic. It was about overcoming psychological obstacles and everybody on the show had them. I'll always be on Team Rei because I found Asuka fucking annoying, but Misato is a great character though. She goes from doting to serious when she really needs to and I liked the revelation that she used to be mute after the second impact disaster, she played off well with Ritsuko, whom is definitely a damaged genius trying not to live in her mothers shadow, but makes the same mistakes as her.
Ganzlinger
Member
Congratulations!
You now understand why this anime is so iconic.
You now understand why this anime is so iconic.
Megalosaro
Banned
One thing is for sure.. There is NO WAY IN HELL this is ever getting a Hollywood adaptation. If it does, there is no way in hell it survives in a form that in any way reflects the themes of the story.
For one thing, a huge theme of the show is Shinji's sexual frustrations. America would never allow a blockbuster movie about a preteen's sexual angst to be released (unless it was playing it for laughes... even so...)
For one thing, a huge theme of the show is Shinji's sexual frustrations. America would never allow a blockbuster movie about a preteen's sexual angst to be released (unless it was playing it for laughes... even so...)
I watched this for the first time in the last month.
1) too much high school bullshit
2) loved the last two eps, wish the whole series had been weirder
3) v cool fight story boarding
4) the soundscape has soooooo many cicadas holy fuck
5) the "next time on" segments are super weird and gross and dissonant especially the way the lady promises "...and lots of fanservice, too!" several times
6) I wish it wasn't impossible to get my hands on End of Evangelion but it's straight up impossible to buy in US
Cool, good talk.
1) too much high school bullshit
2) loved the last two eps, wish the whole series had been weirder
3) v cool fight story boarding
4) the soundscape has soooooo many cicadas holy fuck
5) the "next time on" segments are super weird and gross and dissonant especially the way the lady promises "...and lots of fanservice, too!" several times
6) I wish it wasn't impossible to get my hands on End of Evangelion but it's straight up impossible to buy in US
Cool, good talk.
Megalosaro
Banned
Ogre Battle 64 is the shit dude.
Just saying
Just saying
JadedWriter
Member
I'd love to see Hollywood do this just to see Shinji being played by Channing Tatum.
Ganzlinger
Member
I want Hollywood Evangelion.
Sibersk Esto
Banned
I believe the reason gendo and seele were against each other was because SEELE wanted to eliminate all individuality and merge all souls together. Gendo disagreed ("death creates nothing") and just wanted to see Yui again.
JadedWriter
Member
Because seeing the clone of his dead wife on a daily basis just wasn't enough for him.
I'm glad you embraced the craziness. End of Evangelion is one of my favourites. I love the emotional trip it takes you on.
Megalosaro
Banned
The song that played during the intermission and also the this impact song were great.
In also fond of the music that plays during the preview.
In also fond of the music that plays during the preview.
Fun fact: The director, Hideaki Anno, specifically stated that this is exactly the reasoning behind the imagery LOL
Also,
Congralutions!
Megalosaro
Banned
That gif is amazing. The whole congratulations scene was amazing.
SpoonyBard
Banned
Hmm... it's been a long while since I watched Evangelion and EoE, but I think it's best to think EoE as alternative ending to the story, and not the actual ending. While I liked the cool action scenes, and surrealistic images in EoE, I liked the series more optimistic (well, kind of) version. Even if it was not as clear and easy to understand as the EoE version... well, you were pretty much free to understand it any way you like.
edit: But I may as well spell out what I think the main difference is. In the series Shinji accepted instrumentality in the end. This is not very clear, but the "feel" of the scenes is that he accepts it. In EoE he rejected it very clearly.
edit: But I may as well spell out what I think the main difference is. In the series Shinji accepted instrumentality in the end. This is not very clear, but the "feel" of the scenes is that he accepts it. In EoE he rejected it very clearly.
John Kowalski
Banned
This is generally correct. The religious symbology in particular is meant to give some attributes of divinity to the events, but rarely cross over beyond that simple metaphor, as in one episode (13?) where it's suggested that the Evas go through some process of apotheosis, which is probably some sort of debugging, updating, or simply turning on. It's a simple nod that only serves to build the vocabulary of its lore, but it also give a bit of density to who the Evas are as characters. I quite like that about it.
Glad to see you liked Asuka. I pretty much liked all the characters, having a soft spot for Kaji, Asuka, and Fuyutsuki.
Megalosaro
Banned
I didn't really care about Fuyutsuki until that flash back episode. After that I thought he was cool
John Kowalski
Banned
Yeah that sold me on him. At first he was just the less mean boss, but that episode really sold me on him. He cared.
Megalosaro
Banned
Fuyutsuki actually had my favorite line in the movie. "Ikari.... did you also get to see Yui again...?" Something about the way the seen was animated, the delivery of the line were just fantastic. Joy and relief.
I guess we should talk about what the people each character saw when they were instrumented.
Fuyutsuki saw Yui. The flashback episode showed that he had a very close relationship with Yui, but it came across as a father/daughter type relationship. Could it be that there was more to it than that? Fuyutsuki was critical of Gendo in that episode, but every other appearance has him treating Gendo with a pretty big degree of respect. He does disagree with him from time to time, but voices it in a pretty calm and respectful manner. A lot of that probably has to do with the fact that they're working towards the same goal (seeing Yui again?).
Everyone else is kind of curious.
Ibuki saw Ritsuko. It seemed somewhat sexual, but I'm not sure. Maybe she just really idolized her? Hyuga being into Katsuragi was amusing. I can't say I blame him though.
I guess we should talk about what the people each character saw when they were instrumented.
Fuyutsuki saw Yui. The flashback episode showed that he had a very close relationship with Yui, but it came across as a father/daughter type relationship. Could it be that there was more to it than that? Fuyutsuki was critical of Gendo in that episode, but every other appearance has him treating Gendo with a pretty big degree of respect. He does disagree with him from time to time, but voices it in a pretty calm and respectful manner. A lot of that probably has to do with the fact that they're working towards the same goal (seeing Yui again?).
Everyone else is kind of curious.
Ibuki saw Ritsuko. It seemed somewhat sexual, but I'm not sure. Maybe she just really idolized her? Hyuga being into Katsuragi was amusing. I can't say I blame him though.
I always found it quite curious how the whole loved one thing didn't apply to Aoba. Dude got a more horrifying end than the others.
John Kowalski
Banned
My opinion is that he simply didn't have anyone in his life, or never cared to care for someone the way the others did. Like how earlier in the movie he's the one who berates Maya for not wanting to shoot the invaders. He's kinda selfish in that way, he never cared for anyone as much as he cared for himself.
Fuyutsuki has always seemed like the one person who really understood that these individuals who are living pretty horrible lives still have some beauty in them, the beauty of truly caring for someone. It's worthy of noting that both he and Gendo seemed to perfectly what was at play, that these kids were going through very rough times, that the team should understand what they're trying to achieve, that what they're doing is morally reprehensible, but Fuyutsuki always seemed to be the one who kept reminding Gendo of that. He's like Kaji in that sense.
Hyuga was not so secretly in love with Misato.
Also OP you should really watch this, it's a deleted live action sequence that didn't make it into the movie. All the voice actors are playing their own characters. IIRC it's meant to be
Shinji's perspective of a world where neither he nor Eva existed, like the actual live action scene in EoE
Also best version of Jesus Bleibet Meine Freude is the Eva version. I once did this with it.
Megalosaro
Banned
I think this was my favorite scene in the series:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=weK5m6Jn0zY
God damn. Probably one of the tensest scenes and then BAM MINDRAPE. The way it plays out is incredible. Shit truly hit the fan.
But jeez.... That dub really is terrible. Someone said earlier that they got better towards the end.. but if that's a sample of how good it got I have to disagree. That acting ruined that scene.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=weK5m6Jn0zY
God damn. Probably one of the tensest scenes and then BAM MINDRAPE. The way it plays out is incredible. Shit truly hit the fan.
But jeez.... That dub really is terrible. Someone said earlier that they got better towards the end.. but if that's a sample of how good it got I have to disagree. That acting ruined that scene.
Hurt and Scared
Member
TheVampire
Banned
Wasnt that whole plan with Asuka shooting it with that gun pointless anyway?
When Rei did it instead of her the bullet just bounced off its A.T field so they can to use the lance instead.
Asuka was a decoy.
Well, she did kinda get absorbed into some weird organism after all.
Tizoc
Member
I'm of the mindset that she was like that before being absorbed :V
Well at the time it was about as good as they got. Having a pretty accurate translation played a big part in that, even if the acting itself never got great.
I've never heard the english voice actors. It's terrible.
I really enjoyed the second half. The early episodes I had to force myself through.
)The setup episodes are a bit hard to watch, but I find most of the first half to be good. It's lighthearted, has a lot of silly jokes, and feels like a typical anime of the 90s. Then the later episodes implode the whole thing.
That's what we now call Eva style.
That's kind of the point, I think. There's a crazy buildup of darkness and introspection, but none of it seems out of place. There are hints that shit ain't right early on, but it very slowly turns into the Evangelion we remember.
I really love that kind of emotional development in any media. The webcomic "Homestuck", which was a bit of a sensation a couple years ago, is the only work of fiction I know that comes close.
John Kowalski
Banned
I enjoyed every episode. Even the thermal expansion one.
I like that you never really know anything about her besides "she's so nice and so smart". Very idyllic and motherly.
I like that you never really know anything about her besides "she's so nice and so smart". Very idyllic and motherly.
Me too.
Jawmuncher
Member
Thread makes me want to watch it all again. I might actually since I haven't done so in english. Also gotta say the
Kaworu Death Scene is one of my favorites.
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