Wafflecakes
Member
Jesus. You would think that the poster touched you inappropriately for the absolutely absurd and overblown reaction you are having. Who pissed in your cheerios this morning?
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WaPo: The Senate voted against the GOP bill to make sweeping changes to ACA
- Thread starter WedgeX
- Start date
Jesus. You would think that the poster touched you inappropriately for the absolutely absurd and overblown reaction you are having. Who pissed in your cheerios this morning?
BoogieWoogie
Banned
It would also raise premiums 20% so good luck with them selling that to their constituents.
GoldenEye 007
Member
What explanation? There is no explanation here about MTP in the OP at least. Beyond that, again, parliamentary procedures and rules are just not well known in general. And for the vast majority of people, they never encounter them. And in general, if you're not part of the body, they're not even that important to know.
People will hear "some vote passed" and think it was the actual vote. Add in the general confusion. The speed of this process. The lack of knowledge on what's even being proposed at a given time, and you will get that level of confusion.
I think the opposite. Paul might see it as the first step to taking down the whole thing while Murko and Collins are all in on stopping the train because it'd blow up in their faces in a few years if they voted for it. Throw in Heller who only voted for the motion to proceed so that Trump won't try to undermine his upcoming senate race and it's dead.
Granted, the might on Paul I still find extremely unlikely. He loves voting no.
Ironically a lot of that battle was against Mitch McConnell as well. I think it was Mitch that helped to defeat McCain's finance reform bill. I need to look it up though as I may be misremembering.
Yeah, they'll work toward sabotaging it and then saying it was broken all along.
Aaronrules380
Member
I mean, it would also only worsen the current problems with Obamacare by causing premiums to get even higher
balladofwindfishes
Member
The 20% increase in rates would kinda suck though
"Voluntary" is a loose term. It includes mostly people with low risk aversion who, while they may perceive themselves as healthy or being able to afford going without insurance now, will end up sick down the road anyways. Or exactly what happened prior to the ACA. We can see the impact of the ACA on the financial consequences of medical emergencies through the sheer amount of medical bankruptcies that existed prior to the ACA and how they decreased following enactment of the ACA.
GoldenEye 007
Member
There are more votes coming. And the "skinny" repeal option, which basically just removes the individual mandate probably has a solid shot of passing.
But yes, he did lie through his teeth on this vote by voting yes on the BCRA as is.
Yeah, true. Though 20% higher premiums doesn't even mean that's what people would pay as most people get subsidies.
GoldenEye 007
Member
If they qualify. This premium raise affects employer sponsored coverage too. So good chance that increase is passed on to people who might not qualify for a subsidy. I know I wouldn't.
Been saying it since day one. It's beyond my understanding why he keeps getting his stans hopeful.
UberTag
Member
Nope. Skinny repeal comes after. If that passes it'll kill the individual mandate and virtually cripple the ACA and the insurance market.
They're voting on full repeal first to see if they can get Paul and Lee on board the skinny train by humoring their full repeal gambit first.
hydragonwarrior
Member
Hm how likely is this to pass? There's been too many rollercoasters lately...
War hero or something
Widdle Puppy
Banned
So I'm confused. This was their bill that they were going to vote to pass into law later on, but ended up holding a sudden vote on? How come? Trying to ride the momentum from eqrlier today when they were able to bring it to the floor?
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I would not exactly be crying for people who screw themselves. Also, they could buy insurance or sign up for Medicaid after they get sick.
Most people who buy marketplace plans qualify for subsidies. And the CBO specifically says it is non group policies that would go up by 20%.
I would not exactly be crying for people who screw themselves. Also, they could buy insurance or sign up for Medicaid after they get sick.
Most people who buy marketplace plans qualify for subsidies. And the CBO specifically says it is non group policies that would go up by 20%.
Their actions cause insurance premiums to rise for everyone, as all insurance relies on people paying into the system when they are not drawing benefits in order to pay for those services. Exactly what was happening before the ACA.
Its a huge economic externality.
shawnbuddy
Member
This is only happening so a President who will resign in disgrace in a couple of months can get an ego-boosting "win."
Shit's fucked yo.
Shit's fucked yo.
PingPongvonLaserstein
Member
He happily rolled over for Dubya going on twenty years ago. His lack of spine/integrity is neither recent, nor should it be excused by his medical status.
GoldenEye 007
Member
Ah, you're right. I was mistaken. I took "nongroup" as those plans not "grouped" into the marketplace - meaning employer coverage.
So yeah, the least evil option given everything. I wonder how costs go down (and passes reconciliation) if less people pay into it, the ones that do consume more funds because they need it, and they also need more assistance for premiums.
But in general looks like a throwback to pre-ACA where people skimp on or deny coverage, something unexpected happens, and now they're screwed even more than before.
Presumably the CBO accounted for this.
Most of the savings will be from people choosing not to sign up for Medicaid.
GoldenEye 007
Member
And I wonder if the $416 billion of projected savings over 10 years funds their tax cut proposal?
Saint Gregory
Member
Yes Trump, please free the people from the burden of having health care.
I'm really starting to think that maybe the Russians showed Donald nude pix of Obama and triggered the fuck out of him.
The parliamentarian had essentially already killed BCRA in its existing form.
I doubt any of these intervening votes are expected to be successful. They'll vote on this and on straight repeal and maybe the House bill and a few other things so that....they can say they did, I guess.
If McConnell has anything he thinks can pass (be it "skinny repeal" or whatever new harebrained idea supplants that) it will be offered for a vote at the end of the full debate.
I doubt any of these intervening votes are expected to be successful. They'll vote on this and on straight repeal and maybe the House bill and a few other things so that....they can say they did, I guess.
If McConnell has anything he thinks can pass (be it "skinny repeal" or whatever new harebrained idea supplants that) it will be offered for a vote at the end of the full debate.
I notice he stopped talking about how much better his replacement plan would be, his "beautiful healthcare". So obvious how it was never about helping people and just about demolishing Obama's legacy. Who cares if people die as long as he gets vengeance?
This tweet and his replies detail whats going on
https://twitter.com/benwikler/status/890002518889115648
Saint Gregory
Member
He's delusional. Obama is gone and his legacy was cemented the moment he left office. He established that health care is not a privilege but a right and nothing that tiny hands can do will change that. All he's doing is cementing his own legacy as being the most unprepared person to ever lead a first world nation.
Dude Abides
Banned
Just to be clear, McCain's sudden interest in campaign finance was a cynical move to cleanse his reputation from being one of the Keating Five (80s kids will remember!).
Then in the 00s he made some mavericky noises driven by personal dislike for W, who had defeated him in the GOP primary. That all went away after 9-11 when the GOP devoted itself to bombing and shooting people abroad, which McCain always loved.
When it came down to it he always put himself first, then party. The maverick reputation is completely unearned.
TheSchwab_7
Member
What in the fuck is a "skinny repeal"? It seems like every day there's a new amendment or new idea Republicans are trying to pass. I can't keep up with all this shit!
Unknown One
Member
Seriously, he has a track record for being scum of the Earth.
It can be summed up in one sentence. Get rid of the individual mandate and the taxes on medical devices. That's it. Basically a "we did something" bill that will basically cause the ACA to collapse.
Shadow Puppetry
Member
It's too mean for him so I can see why he stopped.
Fancyarcher
Member
John McCain's maverick title is one of the great American lies. Even his status as a war hero is in doubt considering how much he was hated on the field for being so reckless.
It's one thing to not like McCain, or to think he's not a good individual, and condemn him (even strongly) for this vote and others. It's another to wish him to drop dead whilst he's one his death bead or on his way to the vote.
If you can't see the difference, I feel sorry for you. If you can and are being deliberately obtuse these two threads I wish you'd stop.
Psychoward
Banned
LOL, asking what happened to McCain's integrity and talking about finance in the same sentence.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keating_Five
The skinny repeal option has me as scared as anything. There are a couple insurers still offering insurance in the area but if they pass that stupidity I worry that the number would go to zero and I'd be completely screwed. The ACA was always going to collapse without action but speeding that up so that it won't even last until the next election is a nightmare.
Never say never. Stay vigilant so that we can be sure they won't. If you have a senator, call them.
Chaos2Frozen
Member
Well now I'm comfortable asking him to get fucked.
This was expected to fail. The skinny repeal vote is the real threat.
The good news about repealing the mandate is, you can just drop your insurance and just pick some up in the lobby of the hospital whenever you need it. See? The system works!