Septimus Prime
Member
I don't disagree, but I also don't think it's a good idea for a roleblocker to role claim. For one thing, we don't even know what other abilities are in play yet, and the no-kill could have happened for any number of reasons.
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Werewolf! |OT| Making Animal Friends Is Awesome?
- Thread starter Palmer_v1
- Start date
Terrabyte20xx
Junior Wrestlemania XXX Champion
This, for all we know, the doctor just got lucky or someone was bulletproof.
If there are other other abilities in play the roleblocker is a liability anyway. Trading a roleblocker for a very likely mafia target is a very good deal that I think we should take if possible.
RobotNinjaHornets
Banned
This is a point, why would the roleblocker be village side instead of wolf side? Game 1, the mafia had 2 roleblockers and the town had none, it's a terrible role for the village to have. The chances of it backfiring horribly are way too high.
Then again, Palmer might just be a massive dick. Palmer, are you a massive dick y/n?
It's not a terrible role for village to have, because if they roleblock a wolf kill they can claim and boom! dead wolf.
Like, yes, it is possible there is a village roleblocker and they were not responsible for the no kill. The point is there are no certainties in this game so you can only go with what's more likely. In my opinion, if there is a village roleblocker and they did block someone last night, I think that is the most likely explanation for the no kill.
CornBurrito
Member
I actually tend to think it is more a town tell. This is perhaps a bit too meta, but asking for role claims is such an obvious scum tell that i feel scum would go out of there way to never ever suggest a role claim.
Andodalf
Banned
isn't it exactly as likely as doctor or bulletproof?
Terrabyte20xx
Junior Wrestlemania XXX Champion
So here's the next question: What if there is no town roleblocker, but a wolf aligned one claims? How do we know to turn on the roleblocker? Heck, a wolf could claim even if they weren't one as long as we don't have a town aligned one.
RobotNinjaHornets
Banned
And what if they don't target a wolf? Then it's a villager. And chances are, they'll be targeting a villager, just purely down to maths. In which case we'd want it to be ordinary, otherwise we've just fucked up another villager's action which actively harms us. So no, it is a terrible role for village.
No because no one knows what roles are in the game. If there is a village roleblocker, he obviously knows his role and knows who he blocked. He can therefore determine that a likely explanation for the no-kill was his block.
If you are the village roleblocker, it is better to assume that your block was the reason for the no kill than to assume a doctor or bulletproof who might not even exist was responsible.
Does that make sense?
Andodalf
Banned
but his block has the exact same chance as doctor of bulletproof? so its actually less likely than both of those combined.
Trading 1 villager for 1 wolf is extremely village-favored. Roleblocker makes that trade possible and that is the reason it is a good role.
Septimus Prime
Member
In the last Archer game, our town roleblocker actually won us the game (she started with an amazing guess).
But, really, without any idea what--or even how many--other abilities are in play, I don't see why any role would want to reveal right now.
But, really, without any idea what--or even how many--other abilities are in play, I don't see why any role would want to reveal right now.
Yes but the roleblocker, if there is one, does not know those roles are in the game. The roleblocker would know, for a fact, that there is a roleblocker in the game. :O
RobotNinjaHornets
Banned
That's just a shitty cop though!
It's also worth mentioning that not only would they need to hit a wolf, which probably has something like an 18% chance of happening (~4/22), they'd need to hit the specific wolf that sent in the kill order. The chances of this happening by accident on day 1 are 4%!
So yeah mathematically chances are last night wasn't because of a village roleblocker and this conversation is dumb.
I think this is a fine way to approach the game. However, I also think because of what I've said, that it would be perfectly fine for a roleblocker to claim and give us a likely wolf target.
More like a shitty doctor (since they block KP) and a shitty cop (since they can claim who they blocked) combined to made a pretty good role.
You can't MATH your way to proving my suggestions are bad!
CornBurrito
Member
Roleblocker could just target the same dude again.
Wolves aren't going to use the same person to deliver KP twice if they got blocked. Anyway I've said my peace on this RB thing I promise not to bring it up again.
I'm usually a fan of thinking things through, but I don't quite see the point in doing it this early. We know too little for reasonable speculation.
Is this discussion realistically going to help us find the werewolves (now or later), or is it simply an opportunity for our enemies to draw out our power roles or gather information?
Is this discussion realistically going to help us find the werewolves (now or later), or is it simply an opportunity for our enemies to draw out our power roles or gather information?
Andodalf
Banned
counter logic, they assume the role blocker will change the block so they use the same guy?
Andodalf
Banned
We need to lynch somebody IMO. Dissucsion till we find the best option.
and we the wolves can't be sure it was a block right? might've been a doctor or bulletproof. If i was a wolf I'd use the same dude, attack a different guy. No death this time confirms that there is a role blocker.
CornBurrito
Member
Doesn't make sense for them to do. Chance of roleblocker happening to target the second killer are slim.
QuantumBro
Banned
I thought we killed this idea on Thursday? The best move for the roleblocker is to just target the same person tonight and see what happens.
There's at least three different ways a death could've been avoided roleblocker, doctor, and bulletproof. If the roleblocker says who he targeted and we lynch that person, there's two possibilities that person isn't the mafia, and then the roleblocker will die later that night for claiming, in total losing the town 1 random and 1 power role.
I don't know why you would be going out of your way to argue for a move that'll hurt the town.
VOTE: batsnacks
Didn't you say you liked voting early? Where is it?
Discussion is one thing, discussion that might only harm town is a whole different thing.
Septimus Prime
Member
Vote: Andodalf
That was quite a slip.
That was quite a slip.
Andodalf
Banned
yeah, I straight up said I was a wolf, lol. For that to be true, the post must have been meant for the mafia thread, but the rest of the post doesn't make sense for that. so yeah. anyways, can't really be upset with anything after that gaffe, lol.
I do generally like voting early. A combination of the lynch being instant majority (most of my past forum mafia games have been plurality lynch) and there being a decent amount of pressure without my vote is holding me back. For example, I usually would have voted Sophia for what I said about the numbers but then I was considering that Sophia was probably just trying to think critically and was off a little. Thinking critically being a town trait.
I think everything I had to say about the RB speculation was fine and I've said all I plan to say about it, so if you're going to vote me for that your vote is going to have to stick. Oh well.
I don't see how that tosses a wrench into the strategy, it's very valid a protector would play the meta game if he was unable to self heal. I think that compliments the theory, it doesn't destroy it.
Your error aside, I don't know what about QuestionBro really makes you think town? I see nothing in this day phase that telegraphs him as such. Care to share with the class? any posts that help tickle your scumread fancy?
I'm watching this with your scenarios in mind, currently with your feelings.
covered earlier, but messing this up was interesting/weird.
I agree, no way they would choose not to kill. I am firmly in the side of believing the target was protected/bulletproof.
I don't know what to make of batsnacks wanting a roleblocker to claim, nothing good comes to it off the top of my head, but I am still waiting for his 'town points' system he mentioned before, can we focus on some early reads instead of weird speculation/role fishing please?
I hate lynching day one because we have so little to go on, but as always, we kind of have to to get a fix on possible wolves. I don't have any prime suspects yet (outside of the stuff that's already been brought up about certain people), but I'm going to go back through the thread and read a little closer tonight to see if anything stands out to me.
CornBurrito
Member
You're starting to come off a little too chummy here pal. I'm keeping my eye on you.
Well, I'm convinced.
We're not friends, not after you said you'd kill me.
CornBurrito
Member
I'd only kill you because I love you.
WTF are you guys trying to extract out of me for mixing TheGoddamn up with QuantumBro? They were in the same game with me before in Arxher.
In what fucking world does that mean anything, AT ALL? Thus is fluff enough to make me want to quit the game. Literally. Cabot and Flux are on Red Flag tier scum list. We are lynching Flux tonight.
In what fucking world does that mean anything, AT ALL? Thus is fluff enough to make me want to quit the game. Literally. Cabot and Flux are on Red Flag tier scum list. We are lynching Flux tonight.
CornBurrito
Member
Can you link the post you are talking about because I thought I explained my hunches?
Just to be clear: you're saying that both me and cabot are werewolves, correct?
Just to be clear, I don't care about anything you say. You're scum. We found you. Gg.
I don't know about Cabot, but he is not on the ball like he usually is.
Andodalf
Banned
This hunch.
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CornBurrito
Member
Ah. See my 4 scenarios post.
Hahahaha...
Convenient, so now you know. Just wanted to make sure.
Remember this, Town.