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[Chuckie]

Just noticed its the lady who couldn't dance in the white church era

All I know is I am still in fucking love with Lili Simmons.

 

[shira]

Whoa!! That would be nuts!!

I think everyone has been mentioned as possible Wyatt and Arnold.

Hell the audience can probably be Wyatt or Arnold.

Spoiler

Sylvester is Wyatt and Felix is Arnold

 

[BizzyBum]

Yo this show has like 6 different timelines going on, doesn't it?

I'm prepping for my mind to explode in the finale.

 

[Can Crusher]

Episode 8 was fire.

Of course nitpicks mount up, it's not going to be a perfect ride. The ship is going into Mach 10, so I fully expect the boat to be rocked a bit. I'm ready though, let's do this.

 

[LegendofDragoonLives]

I think you have the wrong read on this. The character as he has been established isn't interested in her because she's a sexy woman at all. If he were there would be more tells and he would actually be interested in building a relationship with her. He's not. His interest in Maeve is foreshadowed by his interest in the bird. He's just curious about the programming and he sees himself as being a potential Behavioral Tech. That's all. It's really simplistic.

Well there's three actual reasons why, including your reason. But you're also right. The feels which is what I said, intrigue as you did and the fact that she's incredibly manipulating as a character. Her manipulation capabilities have only gotten better after she's maxed out her stats.

Show don't tell. I love when the explanation for something is apparently one that has zero expressed or implied evidence. And cut it with the gaf analysis - read a dozen articles and threads about the show and discerning viewers everywhere are pointing out this nonsense.
Besides, you completely missed the boat as pointed out above, on his actual motivation, then made a smug post about how we are all morons who can't see something that isnt there.

They have shown though, through his facial expression. Even the other butcher dude said he knows they have some symbiotic relationship or something along those lines. They just haven't stopped the story to make it incredibly obvious. And no, I didn't miss the boat at all. I still think he's into her as a major reason, but duckroll is correct as well. My post wasn't smug at all, it's just an annoying conversation of people bitching about dumb things for the sake of doing it. Merely an observation. Can't exactly be smug when people in here notice a ton more things that fly over my head on the regular each episode.

 

[wesleyshark]

She's wyatt

This would be awesome

 

[Deleted member 1235]

Why does she keep seeing herself dying while retracing her steps though. Like being shot at the house or face down in the water? It's like she's taken this path many times before.

this is the one thing I don't get.

how often has william been to the park? It gets confusing because it seems like once, but there is a lot of what appears to be Dolores getting reset and going back to the park again, I guess while william is still in it? Like she dies when he's not around, gets reset finds him again. Or William just goes there a lot, but that doesn't make sense with his and Logans story, because he's obviously there for the first time (douchebag logan keeps going on about how he's gonna love it etc).

 

[DorkLord54]

He literally did jack shit on this show creatively. Really.

I mean, shit, outside the pilot he did jackshit creatively on Lost, too. That was (for the most part) all Damon Lindelof and Carlton Cuse.

 

[Nothus]

this is the one thing I don't get.

how often has william been to the park? It gets confusing because it seems like once, but there is a lot of what appears to be Dolores getting reset and going back to the park again, I guess while william is still in it? Like she dies when he's not around, gets reset finds him again. Or William just goes there a lot, but that doesn't make sense with his and Logans story, because he's obviously there for the first time (douchebag logan keeps going on about how he's gonna love it etc).

Those scenes where you see her back in the lab talking to Bernard etc. are actually flashbacks. Dolores hasn't died or been reset once the whole time she has been with William in that specific timeline.

Her flashbacks showing her dead or with the gun to her head are also flashbacks to different timelines where she made the journey herself. The deaths are just showing that she kept getting things wrong or dying before getting to where she was trying to go.

 

[Pachimari]

I don't get the butchers' storyline. It makes no sense to me, how they would obey Maeve's commands really. It feels really off.

Also what was up with the ending? Time for Teddy to get back to the fold? It was implying that I should realize something at that moment.

 

[Kayhan]

I don't get the butchers' storyline. It makes no sense to me, how they would obey Maeve's commands really. It feels really off.

The only thing I can think of is that the two butchers has to be hosts.

Hosts with a coded submissive personality that makes them ultimately want to do as they are told by what they perceive as authority figures. And that is what Maeve shrewdly taps into by being so firm and commanding with them.

If they are humans we can conclude that humans was a mistake - nothing but trash.

 

[shira]

I don't get the butchers' storyline. It makes no sense to me, how they would obey Maeve's commands really. It feels really off.

Also what was up with the ending? Time for Teddy to get back to the fold? It was implying that I should realize something at that moment.

Apparently Teddy was one of Wyatt's men the last time.

 

[The Mule]

This episode was a pretty big dump of reveals, which was nice, but I was otherwise very disappointed in this episode. Writing, acting (except Hopkins), and pacing all took a nosedive in this episode.

Anyway, back to detective mode. Did anyone carefully analyse the map in the background when Douchebag Writer Guy and Hot Board Member Woman were talking in his office? Did the features on there look like anything in the "real world"?

 

[Pachimari]

But am I right in saying that we don't know who Wyatt is yet, and why MiB wants to find him/her?

 

[ced]

Ford is currently excavating the buried town, which we saw William and Dolores in in this episode..

This bothers me because we also saw the unburied church in an earlier episode when William and Dolores meet Lawrence in that south of the border town.

 

[Kor of Memory]

But am I right in saying that we don't know who Wyatt is yet, and why MiB wants to find him/her?

Biggest theory out there

Huge possible spoiler:

Spoiler

Wyatt is actually present day Dolores. That's why they make the comment about how Teddy and her are always paired off. It would also be the greatest challenge for william to have to kill his "first" love.

 

[Khoryos]

I'm going to have to watch it again to confirm or deny, but isn't the asian butcher the behaviour tech in the room when homesteader-Maeve is malfunctioning?

 

[Moff]

Haven't we already seen wyatt a few episodes ago? Some dude with a beard? Am I mixing that up?

 

[Misha]

Seems like it would be weird to have Wyatt have a specific backstory and face only to make it nothing close unless it's like a dread pirate Roberts scenario

But this is westworld where they're intentionally trying to mislead the viewers

 

[Springhettios]

Haven't we already seen wyatt a few episodes ago? Some dude with a beard? Am I mixing that up?

I think you're right. He is next to Teddy when they are shooting all those people.

 

[arts&crafts]

Haven't we already seen wyatt a few episodes ago? Some dude with a beard? Am I mixing that up?

That is correct, in the town when Teddy remembers "killing everyone".

That doesnt mean anything though as this show often "remembers" things that just arent true.

 

[Nodnol]

I find it curious that that screen of the host's mind somewhat resembles the maze.

It's as if the maze is a journey through one's to discover the person in the centre. It's always been theorized that the maze isn't a physical place, but rather a journey, and Dolores is retracing her steps to achieve the required prompts. Overlay the maze with that host mind display, and it's a path to the centre of a host's identity.

A man who dies over and over again, only to beat death and build a maze so complex only he can navigate it...surely its symbolic of Arnold, struggling with the philosophical questions his work was raising, trying to protect the hosts from the horrors they would experience, whilst at the same time giving them the clues and foundation to evolve and break free.

I would hazard a guess that Arnold resented Ford for how the hosts would be exploited...he wanted to create sentience and "life"....Ford wanted an opportunity and a narrative to explore. The maze was his legacy...Ford and Bernard both acknowledged that "we" don't really understand how the hosts work. I wonder then, if that knowledge died with Arnold, and that the maze was actually the complexity of the host's mind, thus safeguarding the potential for sentience?

 

[arts&crafts]

Its funny how much we are all talking about this plot and I bet at the end it will be the most basic thing.

 

[Pachimari]

In what episode do we see Wyatt? Can somebody screengrab it, or let me know which episode this is and I could screengrab it?

 

[arts&crafts]

In what episode do we see Wyatt? Can somebody screengrab it, or let me know which episode this is and I could screengrab it?

I am at work so I cant check but based on the episode guide I am guessing 6? "The Man in Black and Teddy continue their journey to find Wyatt. At a Union Army outpost, the soldiers recognize Teddy as an accomplice in Wyatt's massacre of his unit. " probably a flashback here.

Edit. "Teddy has a flashback confirming that he indeed was complicit in Wyatt's massacre and breaks free of his bonds."

Found it!

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm2631749/?ref_=ttfc_fc_cl_t25 listed as wyatt

 

[Kayhan]

Haven't we already seen wyatt a few episodes ago? Some dude with a beard? Am I mixing that up?

That was probably fake Teddy memories.

 

[Moff]

That was probably fake Teddy memories.

I don't understand what this means is teddy fake or are his memories fake? Have we seen fake stuff like that before?

 

[arts&crafts]

I don't understand what this means is teddy fake or are his memories fake? Have we seen fake stuff like that before?

I think he means Teddy's memories are fake. We have seen a few times where we see a memory from a host and later find out that the person in the memory is someone else. "They cant see what could hurt them" or something like that.

 

[cloud_sleep]

I don't understand what this means is teddy fake or are his memories fake? Have we seen fake stuff like that before?

Bernard with his child in hospital.

 

[Kor of Memory]

It always fascinates me how much thought goes into the name of a character:

Dolores - Spanish origin - Means Sorrows
Theodore - Greek origin - Means God Given
Arnold - Germanic origin - Means Power of an Eagle
Bernard - Germanic origin - Means Strength of a Bear
Meave - Irish origin - Means 'She who Intoxicates'
Theresa - Greek origin - Means to Harvest
William - Germanic origin - Combination of Will and Desire
Logan - Gaelic origin - Means hollow
Angela - Latin origin - Messenger of the Gods

 

[shira]

It always fascinates me how much thought goes into the name of a character:

Dolores - Spanish origin - Means Sorrows
Theodore - Greek origin - Means God Given
Arnold - Germanic origin - Means Power of an Eagle
Bernard - Germanic origin - Means Strength of a Bear
Meave - Irish origin - Means 'She who Intoxicates'
Theresa - Greek origin - Means to Harvest
William - Germanic origin - Combination of Will and Desire
Logan - Gaelic origin - Means hollow
Angela - Latin origin - Messenger of the Gods

Sizemore - More size

 

[airmangataosenai]

Its funny how much we are all talking about this plot and I bet at the end it will be the most basic thing.

I have been thinking the same for some time. Most likely Arnold was the baseline for all hosts and the reveries unlocked his "memory" in their minds.

The original hosts were too mechanical so they digitized a map of Arnold and modify it for each host.

 

[Kayhan]

It always fascinates me how much thought goes into the name of a character:

Dolores - Spanish origin - Means Sorrows
Theodore - Greek origin - Means God Given
Arnold - Germanic origin - Means Power of an Eagle
Bernard - Germanic origin - Means Strength of a Bear
Meave - Irish origin - Means 'She who Intoxicates'
Theresa - Greek origin - Means to Harvest
William - Germanic origin - Combination of Will and Desire
Logan - Gaelic origin - Means hollow
Angela - Latin origin - Messenger of the Gods

Ford - American origin - Automobile

 

[Moff]

Bernard with his child in hospital.

I don't think that's really comparable.
Yes, hosts have implanted memories that never happened but a fake wyatt for no other reason than to confuse the audience would surprise me.

 

[ZOONAMI]

Just noticed its the lady who couldn't dance in the white church era

That's weird.

How does she move from prostitute to Wyatt minion so quickly on the same timeline?

I could see the entrance host to Wyatt minion role swap if william and mib are on the same timeline, new role for new narrative, but this seems like multiple same host scenario because Maeve and mib timelines seem to be happening basically simultaneously.

 

[Teletraan1]

I don't understand what this means is teddy fake or are his memories fake? Have we seen fake stuff like that before?

We have seen the shooting scene played out 2x now. Once from Teddy's perspective in the Wyatt backstory and once from Delores' perspective when she got to that town. Both scenes had kills that were similar or the same yet the people being killed were different. Both memories are based on the same events only slightly tweaked. Ford even says "A fiction that like all good stories is rooted in truth" as he is giving Teddy his backstory.

 

[daveo42]

full body wrapping snake tattoo my ass and color me stupid

Then who is the girl working for Wyatt remind MiB of? I thought it was the host shown above.

 

[Kor of Memory]

Then who is the girl working for Wyatt remind MiB of? I thought it was the host shown above.

Angela. She was the Host in the white dress that escorted William around for his introduction to Westworld. The one who helped him dress the part.

Thus the "I thought they would have retired you by now" line. As Angela is most likely the very first Host William ever met.

If you have HBONow, she's in the Preview card for episode 2 standing beside William.

Armistice is the girl with the snake tattoo.

 

[Corpekata]

Then who is the girl working for Wyatt remind MiB of? I thought it was the host shown above.

The host William met as a greeter.

The one in the picture at the whorehouse is just a random extra. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar, etc.

 

[Kor of Memory]

The host William met as a greeter.

The one in the picture at the whorehouse is just a random extra. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar, etc.

Hell, the girl dancing in the background could be a guest, and the guy the Host.

 

[Alpende]

Did anyone notice that, when we saw the flashback to Ford and Barnard 'handling" Maeve following the death of her 'daughter', when Ford commented on her fragmentation, there was a map of her brain on his tablet, which was the maze.

I noticed that too, it went by fast though.

Other than that, I agree with people saying Maeve gained a lot of power too fast. Those two dudes basically follow every order without too much hesitation. It's still a good story line as it kind of reminds me of Ex Machina in that

Spoiler

an AI wants to break out.

Now I just want to see MiB's story unfold further.

 

[duckroll]

The host William met as a greeter.

The one in the picture at the whorehouse is just a random extra. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar, etc.

A rose is a rose is a rose.

 

[Kayhan]

Did William's behaviour seem different, or off, this episode to anyone else?

 

[Kor of Memory]

Did anyone notice that, when we saw the flashback to Ford and Barnard 'handling" Maeve following the death of her 'daughter', when Ford commented on her fragmentation, there was a map of her brain on his tablet, which was the maze.

I'm not 100% sold on this.

It just seemed like a corrupted data circle with a bunch of fragmentation.

Whereas the Maze has a very simple and unique design with solid lines and a bit of hieroglyphs around it.

Did William's behaviour seem different, or off, this episode to anyone else?

I was pretty worried (mostly because of the music) that after Dolores said "We can't just leave him to suffer" that William was going to shoot him to put him out of his misery. He may still have actually done that, and we just didn't see it because Dolores was flipping out.

 

[Cornballer]

- The Ringer's The Watch podcast for this week: Ep. 100: ‘Westworld’ Theories and Casey Affleck’s New Film, ‘Manchester by the Sea’

The Ringer’s Chris Ryan and Andy Greenwald unpack the latest episode of ‘Westworld’ (1:05) and discuss the wild theories about the show floating around the internet.

Good discussion of the show this week. They also get into the Dolores as Wyatt(?) theory that Joanna Robinson brought up yesterday and Andy also takes a stab at Tessa Thompson as the MiB's daughter.

 

[duckroll]

If MiB is William, how can Charlotte Hale be his daughter? He married Juliet, who is Logan's sister. They're all white!

 

[okdakor]

Did William's behaviour seem different, or off, this episode to anyone else?

They realized that they have only 2 more episodes to link him to the MiB, next episode he will be scalping natives to be tougher

 

[Cornballer]

- THR: 'Westworld' Stars Talk Thandie Newton's "Bone Chilling" Maeve Reveal

Let's turn toward Felix and Sylvester's current obstacle: Maeve. They have very different reactions to her awakening. Sylvester wants nothing more than to shut this down, while Felix can't seem to escape Maeve's grasp. Leonardo, is that a fair read of the situation to you — that there's something about Maeve that Felix can't resist, and if so, what does that boil down to?

Nam: It is. I think on one hand it's a matter of survival. When you see these hosts wake up, you know what they're capable of, especially as a technician. When you're not in control of them waking up and going to sleep, and you realize that something else is going on, it's just a pure machine coming at you. That, on one end, is pure survival. On the other hand, it's something that's kind of amazing and magical to watch. It also skids on that border as well, the fascination with what's going on and what's really happening in front of him.

Sylvester is not thinking about "magic" when he looks at Maeve. What does he see?

Slocum: You have to understand that to Sylvester, Felix is working on life. Sylvester is literally working on a very complicated iPhone. For him, there's no illusion. This is a situation where we as humans are built to react to things that look like humans, but this is not a human. It's a very complex iPhone. There's nothing sensitive about it. There's nothing flowery. There's nothing coming out of this thing. It's a machine that's meant to make you react this way. It's not life. As horrible as he sounds, he's a very practical individual. He's been there, I believe, a very long time. This is a job. He sees these things as work. He sees them as constructions. If you confuse the two, and he's watched many people get confused, you can get in some serious danger, including the possibility of losing your job.

Or your life, as it almost played out for Sylvester this week.

Slocum: Yeah. That's the danger. I think we are as programmed as these machines are to react to them. If you allow that programming to get the better of you? No disparaging against you, Felix, but you have some issues man. That's when we get into some shit. That's always been our debate. One of us sees life and light, and the other just sees a thing, an object.

Felix's view of the life and light in the hosts was certainly established a few episodes ago, with his research into the bird.

Nam: Felix has that urge inside of him. He's looking for life. He very much respects what this world is. The fact that this was all created by Doctor Ford (Anthony Hopkins). This is a Delos company. I think he's very much fascinated by that technology and the fact that it's happening. He's part of that, one to one. And Felix is a young dude. He's just awakening himself. He's coming into his own. I think that's the marriage that's happening there, between technology and life.

There's some hesitation on Felix's part before he goes to save Sylvester. Was that intentional?

Nam: Definitely. I think my character, at least in a couple of the takes… I was sitting there trying to figure out what exactly is happening. After she's woken up and what have you, I'm sitting there as a character thinking, "This isn't at all the way I thought it was going to go." That moment of hesitation is more a moment of contemplation. I'm frozen. That part of me that wants to go in and shut her down… I can't do that. Literally, she's awake on her own, making her own choices, outside of whatever guidelines we gave her. A lot of the hesitation on Felix's part is he just wants to survive. He sees how dangerous she has gotten. It's one of those moments where, as an actor deciding to play that moment, the truth of the scene is that I couldn't get to him because there's a table in between us, and you have Maeve holding a scalpel and looking at me with my colleague down on the floor and bleeding. So Felix is in this weird position: "If I go to him too quickly, will she then cut me? And if I don't go to him, will he die, and will I be responsible for that?" So there's a moment of balance in the hesitation.

What will Sylvester look like now that he's survived Maeve's attack?

Slocum: I think we're still figuring that out. It'll be interesting to see how he reacts to this. As ingrained as his arrogance seems to go to the core of him, there's no possible way he has the same sense of self after this event as he does before. Some of that cockiness and some of that holding power over someone, it must have taken a pretty severe hit here, watching his own blood pool around his eyes. We can probably count on that. But going back a little bit to what Leo and I talk about when we talk about these guys… sometimes the viewers are a little confused by these guys, because the show is filled with so many geniuses. So many of these human beings are paragons of intellect and power and wisdom. That's not these guys. We are literally doing the best we can. We're like baristas of blood, and we're just trying to get through the day. This shit is way beyond us. We definitely make some poor choices, but we're doing the best with the material we have inside our minds.

You anticipated the next question, which is how would you defend Felix and Sylvester to viewers who feel they should take more action against Maeve? You would argue that they're just doing the best they can?

Slocum: Yeah! And in my mind, Sylvester owns his domain, which is not necessarily either the wisest or most correct [opinion]: "This is my space. I really think that I am doing the right thing. I think I can handle this [Maeve situation]," which is not correct. In some ways, that's why he lets things go way too far — which he does realize while he's bleeding out, so give him credit for that!

 

[Kor of Memory]

Have you guys noticed how William's hat has gotten dirtier through the series. Or less white, really:

Episode 2:

Episode 3:

Episode 5:

Episode 8:

 

[duckroll]

Doesn't look like anything to me.