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[FMX]

I am currently playing through Chrono Trigger (which in my opinion is the greatest video game ever made) again and was wondering what are the criteria/standard for being considered a rpg? Why isn't Zelda considered a RPG but Cyberpunk is? Why is Cyberpunk considered a RPG but not GTA? Then you have the Witcher series, Diablo, etc.

 

[Rush2112]

The term no longer means anything. They call diablo and GoW RPGs now. any shitty game with a talent tree is called ‘rpg.’

 

[Complistic]

The marketing team.

 

[Killer8]

RPG is a pointless term and has been for years.

 

[TintoConCasera]

Being able to role-play ingame, which means the player being able to express themselves by choosing how to tackle the challenges and/or the story.

JRPGs aren't really RPGs most of the time.

 

[Rat Rage]

Cyberpunk is not a RPG /thread

 

[Danjin44]

Why isn't Zelda considered a RPG but Cyberpunk is?

Because in games like Cyberpunk you have different builds while Zelda is an adventure game, you have different tools to fight and solve puzzles but you cant have different build in that game.

 

[BossLackey]

The term no longer means anything. They call diablo and GoW RPGs now. any shitty game with a talent tree is called ‘rpg.’

lol wat

Agreed on GoW. That ain’t no RPG.

But Diablo? It’s an ARPG. It’s THE ARPG. And has been for over two decades.

It’s a CRPG that focuses entirely on build and combat. Decisions are not narrative, but mechanical.

 

[Wolves hunt in packs]

Being able to date dudes.

 

[MSduderino]

talent trees for different builds and/or meaningful choices (often via dialogue) that affect story/game environment

 

[ShadyAcshuns]

All I know is FFXVI is NOT an RPG.

 

[Sooner]

If you get to choose between body type A and body type B, it's an RPG.

 

[Humdinger]

I am currently playing through Chrono Trigger (which in my opinion is the greatest video game ever made) again and was wondering what are the criteria/standard for being considered a rpg? Why isn't Zelda considered a RPG but Cyberpunk is? Why is Cyberpunk considered a RPG but not GTA? Then you have the Witcher series, Diablo, etc.

This is an issue that has divided nerds since time immemorial.

I think it comes down mostly to two things: 1) lots of options for different ways to craft your character/playstyle, so your build is very different than someone else's and has different options to handle situations (e.g., guns vs. stealth vs speech) and 2) choice & consequence within the narrative (i.e., branching paths). I'm sure people can point to exceptions (e.g., RPGs that don't feature any choice/consequence in the narrative), but those are the two elements that stand out to me.

Zelda and GTA aren't considered RPGs because they don't have much of the latter, whereas Cyberpunk does.

The boundaries have been blurred for a decade or more, though, because nearly every game has "RPG elements" of some sort.

 

[ReyBrujo]

Pretty much the beginning of this video.

 

[hemo memo]

What defines an RPG is having a progression system, but defining what isn't an RPG can't be done.

 

[Denton]

For a game to be RPG it should have:

- character building / progression system, ideally in both attributes/skills and equipment
- nonlinear story with focus on player agency, choices and consequences (and this is why JRPG is a separate genre)
- ideally at least some focus on exploration

Golden standard in RPGs is Fallout 2 and Arcanum. In Fallout 2, you have a nonlinear story, deep character progression, and the stuff that game lets you do (even if in basic form) - you can become a slaver, or a slave, or pornstar, or chemist, or junkie, or gravedigger, or sharpshooter, or scientist...

Cyberpunk has detailed character progression and lot of choice and consequence as well as player agency, in both its gameplay mechanics and its quests and story. That makes it an RPG.
GTA is a linear action game set in an open city.

 

[Reizo Ryuu]

Since DnD was basically the first successful RPG system, it's basically anything that employs similar systems with varying degrees of depth; it's also one of the reasons I despise the 'metroidvania' grouping monicker, because one part of that name uses traditional rpg progression systems, while the other doesn't at all.

 

[rodrigolfp]

No video game is an RPG.

 

[Muffdraul]

Once upon a time, "RPG" generally meant reminiscent of D&D. Player characters and monsters boiled down to a list of atk/def/intelligence/charisma/etc. stats and HP. Turn based combat to some degree or another. And so forth.

That was a long time ago, things got way more complicated ages ago.

 

[hemo memo]

For a game to be RPG it should have:

- character building / progression system, ideally in both attributes/skills and equipment
- nonlinear story with focus on player agency, choices and consequences (and this is why JRPG is a separate genre)
- ideally at least some focus on exploration

Golden standard in RPGs is Fallout 2 and Arcanum. In Fallout 2, you have a nonlinear story, deep character progression, and the stuff that game lets you do (even if in basic form) - you can become a slaver, or a slave, or pornstar, or chemist, or junkie, or gravedigger, or sharpshooter, or scientist...

Cyberpunk has detailed character progression and lot of choice and consequence as well as player agency, in both its gameplay mechanics and its quests and story. That makes it an RPG.
GTA is a linear action game set in an open city.

FFXIII is an RPG with a very linear story. Crisis Core is an RPG without exploration. So I think the only must for an RPG to be called an RPG is a progression system.

 

[Mozzarella]

Stat based gameplay or RPG mechanics are the main thing.
Leveling systems, builds, skill tree, basically progression.
Secondary thing are the choices and player agency.

Devil May Cry has no builds, no leveling and the game has rank based on how you execute your combo - Action game
Dark Souls has builds, levels and you deal damage based on those numbers, progression is key - RPG

Technically its Action RPGs that are hybrid between Action gameplay and RPG gameplay, they are still RPGs
The most pure form of RPG gameplay is Turn-based.

 

[touchfuzzy]

You have to ask me actually, I make the final call.

 

[kevboard]

a main focus of the game's design is on increasing stats of one or more characters by leveling up through gaining XP, which allows you to customise the strengths and weaknesses of your character in order to build a, well... "build" of your liking.

it's that simple

 

[proandrad]

a main focus of the game's design is on increasing stats of one or more characters by leveling up through gaining XP, which allows you to customise the strengths and weaknesses of your character in order to build a, well... "build" of your liking.

it's that simple

How is that role playing? I feel like another term should be used for that.

 

[kevboard]

How is that role playing? I feel like another term should be used for that.

video game genres aren't literal descriptions of what they are about.
old genre titles like RPG in particular came to be because at the time of them being coined, all games where you play a "role" had these stat and xp driven design principles.

just like an Action Adventure game doesn't mean you go on an adventure (if it did then basically every game would be an adventure game, which is obviously not the case).
an adventure game is a game that has a focus on exploration and environmental puzzle solving, usually by finding/combining/using items on the way. because the name was coined with Text Adventures, which focused on exactly that, and were succeeded by graphics adventures (of which point and click adventures are a subgenre) which also focused on these traits.

when Action Adventures then came into the frame, they took these item collecting, exploration and puzzle solving of the other Adventure genres, and added action elements to them. back in the day "action" simply meant that a game tests your real time gaming skills such as reaction time, real time problem solving, precision etc.
"action" therefore could be everything from simple platforming to hardcore real time combat.


in short, if we wanted to describe a game genre by exactly what is happening, we would need to rename a lot of them basically especially any genre that was established before the mid 90s
and that would probably clash with other genre descriptions as well. as "playing a role" could be the description of tons of games that have nothing in common with eachother.

 

[poodaddy]

For me personally, it's about choices being meaningful to the gameplay experience. For example, Chrono Trigger, as OP mentioned, does actually have some choices that are meaningful, and many different endings. I'd consider it an RPG, but a bit of a light one. Generally speaking, I find much more RPG like qualities in Western games than Eastern, but the SMT games tend to have interesting choices that affect the story, particularly IV, so I consider those to be RPG's through and through. Hell, I even consider most Immersive Sims RPG's, as you make extremely meaningful choices that affect both gameplay and story.

 

[KàIRóS]

I am currently playing through Chrono Trigger (which in my opinion is the greatest video game ever made) again and was wondering what are the criteria/standard for being considered a rpg? Why isn't Zelda considered a RPG but Cyberpunk is? Why is Cyberpunk considered a RPG but not GTA? Then you have the Witcher series, Diablo, etc.

Like always everyone ignored the first post and just responded to the title.

Anyway, It's very simple OP, game mechanics are what determines the genre of a videogame, Super Mario Bros is a platformer because it's main mechanics revolve around jumping from platform to platform, a more complex example is Resident Evil which is a Survival Horror because it's main mechanics revolve around surviving with a (often) very weak character, mechanics like ammo conservation, low health, and slow clunky combat are typical in this genre to make the player feel vulnerable and invoke fear in them.

The main mechanics in an RPG revolve around progression and leveling systems with statistics which then determine the outcome of your actions, Zelda is an Action Adventure because it doesn't have the leveling systems typical of RPGs (with the exception of Zelda 2, you could argue that one is an ARPG) same thing with GTA, on the other hand Chrono Trigger is an RPG because all your playable characters have statistics and levels to determine their effectiveness in battle, it would be near impossible to keep progressing in the game with a low level party and thus leveling them and increasing their stats is necessary for progression.

 

[EruditeHobo]

Why isn't Zelda considered a RPG but Cyberpunk is?

The main mechanics in an RPG revolve around progression and leveling systems with statistics which then determine the outcome of your actions, Zelda is an Action Adventure because it doesn't have the leveling systems typical of RPGs (with the exception of Zelda 2, you could argue that one is an ARPG) same thing with GTA, on the other hand Chrono Trigger is an RPG because all your playable characters have statistics and levels to determine their effectiveness in battle, it would be near impossible to keep progressing in the game with a low level party and thus leveling them and increasing their stats is necessary for progression.

This.

Progression of your character is based hugely on stats that are visible to the player. That's what an RPG is. How nothing to do with what kind of story you're playing, or whether your choices affect the story, or whether there are classes even. It's based on stats, and improving those stats to become more powerful.

 

[Pelao]

Do I autistically manage a bunch of stats as I go through an adventure? Then it's an RPG.
I like RPGs.

 

[Bieren]

Any game can be an RPG if you imagine hard enough.

 

[Cyberpunkd]

I am currently playing through Chrono Trigger (which in my opinion is the greatest video game ever made) again and was wondering what are the criteria/standard for being considered a rpg? Why isn't Zelda considered a RPG but Cyberpunk is? Why is Cyberpunk considered a RPG but not GTA? Then you have the Witcher series, Diablo, etc.

I would say when you can "role play" as different personas or archetypes. From that perspective Zelda is not an RPG, neither is Chrono Trigger, etc. It's difficult nowadays to put a finger on what it means exactly.

 

[Fbh]

To me a proper RPG is a game where a big focus is customizing and improving your character in multiple ways through various stats, skills and additional mechanic (like classes/jobs, loot, etc) as well as being given a relatively high amount of freedom in regards to the story and how your character behaves and interacts with others.

I love JRPG's and I see them as their own genre but personally I don't really see most of them as RPG's since you often have no input in regards to the story and are given no flexibility in how to build your character.

 

[Poplin]

RPG usually suggests stats, some form of inventory management, and some form of character decision making as you level (e.g. allocating stats, or picking the right equipment and gear, etc).

In the 90s and 00s, that was the main criteria, because most games didnt have RPG elements (e.g. no levelups, no party management, no inventory management, etc). Symphony of the night for example, was initially described as having rpg elements because of the stats and gear, but in mixing rpg stats and inventory with metroid, we got metroidvania as a genre.

Nowadays it feels like some people use RPG for mechanics (stat management, inventrory, etc), while others use it to mean narrative agency (e.g. making decisions that impact the story and quests).

But its all muddy now because of ARPG as a concept, and how few "pure" genre games exist anymore. Everything borrows mechanics from everything, so its now just a marketing term.

 

[Myths]

When numbers are more important and not hidden from user progression/customization and sight.

 

[Darkmakaimura]

Character statistics, leveling up.... Those two are using the most important thing that defines role-playing games.

 

[digital_ghost]

Im an rpg.

Really Poor Gamer

 

[samuelgregory]

This is an issue that has divided nerds since time immemorial.

I think it comes down mostly to two things: 1) lots of options for different ways to craft your character/playstyle, so your build is very different than someone else's and has different options to handle situations (e.g., guns vs. stealth vs speech) and 2) choice & consequence within the narrative (i.e., branching paths). I'm sure people can point to exceptions (e.g., RPGs that don't feature any choice/consequence in the narrative), but those are the two elements that stand out to me.

Zelda and GTA aren't considered RPGs because they don't have much of the latter, whereas Cyberpunk does.

The boundaries have been blurred for a decade or more gachaneb, though, because nearly every game has "RPG elements" of some sort.

RPG is a pretty open-ended term these days. A lot of games claim to be RPGs because they have a skill tree or something like that. I don’t think there is a clear cut list of features that make a game an RPG anymore.

In my mind, an RPG has to have experience points you earn and levels for your character or party. You get stronger the higher your level. Skill trees don’t have to be a part of it but learning new abilities as you level up should be part of the mechanics whether you have skill trees or just learn new attacks or spells at certain points. This isn’t doctrine whatsoever though.

 

[Humdinger]

RPG is a pretty open-ended term these days. A lot of games claim to be RPGs because they have a skill tree or something like that. I don’t think there is a clear cut list of features that make a game an RPG anymore.

In my mind, an RPG has to have experience points you earn and levels for your character or party. You get stronger the higher your level. Skill trees don’t have to be a part of it but learning new abilities as you level up should be part of the mechanics whether you have skill trees or just learn new attacks or spells at certain points. This isn’t doctrine whatsoever though.

Yeah, there is a lot of room for disagreement about the specific criteria. There is also little reason to argue about it. For instance, some guys above are proclaiming with certitude that an RPG is all about whether you can level your character up or not. I think that's a flawed definition of an RPG, but I also know there is no point in arguing the issue, because there is no definitive criteria to appeal to, no definitive authority as to what an RPG is. So people have different definitions, based on what they have experienced in the genre.

It is complicated by the fact that there are so many different types of RPGs - eastern and western, those emphasizing choice and consequence and those not including any of that, games that allow you to create your own character vs those that don't, action RPGs vs narrative-driven RPGs, etc.

It's further complicated by the fact that "RPG elements" (such as levelling) are now a part of other games that are not inherently RPGs. It can be hard to know where to draw the line as to what's a "pure RPG" and what is a game with prominent RPG elements but doesn't meet the full criteria for an RPG.

And at the end of the day, who really cares, lol. It's not as if "RPG" is some honorific, some title to aspire to. It's just a genre label. But fans of the genre tend to be on the obsessive nerdy side, so they get into these arguments. I'm one of them - or used to be, anyhow, lol.