Thaumaturgic Tomato
Member
Folks were waiting for a console release in 2010 that rivaled high end 2010 PCs. But now we get consoles in 2013 that rival 2010 PCs.
What's up with the "this gen lasted too long" argument?
- Thread starter Alphahawk
- Start date
SenjutsuSage
Banned
Yea, I personally never got that argument either. Why would you be against getting as much value possible out of your multi-year investment? Sure, there can come a point where there's no longer any interesting content that's possible on the current capabilities of the hardware, but I don't think we remotely hit that point on the 360 and PS3.
lifa-cobex
Member
I blame my PC.
Upgraded, Played the fuck out of it,
Went back to console.....hmmm something doesn't look right
Upgraded, Played the fuck out of it,
Went back to console.....hmmm something doesn't look right
Dance Inferno
Unconfirmed Member
Yeah I don't get it either. Yes, the graphics don't match top notch PC games. Yes, the games are a little constrained by the current hardware. But you know what? We've gotten some pretty incredible games over the past few years that I'm glad I got to experience without having to buy new hardware. Tomb Raider, Bioshock Infinite, and The Last of Us are three games that came out this year alone that I was able to fully enjoy without having to buy new hardware. And you know what? I was completely blown away by their graphics and the gameplay. So no, I don't think this gen has gone on too long.
Pretty much this!
batman2million
Member
I agree with you, OP. I understand both sides of the argument. Some 360/ PS3 games are starting to look really bad, especially compared to their PC counter part. I do find the console exclusives are where the games shine. Hal 4 and Last of Us are great looking games. This generations length is just perfect, IMO.
Personally, I hate spending money on new systems, at least during the launch period. Always feel like it's a risk b/c of faulty hardware, price drops, and lack of games.
Personally, I hate spending money on new systems, at least during the launch period. Always feel like it's a risk b/c of faulty hardware, price drops, and lack of games.
IMACOMPUTA
Member
The gap between pc and consoles is huuuuuuge right now.
Especially when it comes to resolution and framerate.
Also, an updated console pushes pc games. We want advancement! This is the first gen that I actually bought all of the consoles, and It's because I wanted something new. This gen has lasted too long. Console games are looking ugly compared to PC.
This is essentially the problem at hand.
Looks like you fell perfectly into their trap.
RoadHazard
Gold Member
Well, 2010 would obviously have been way too early (the PS3 had only been out for 3+ years in Europe at that point), but the end of 2013 is also a bit late. The consoles have simply aged too much at this point, they should have been replaced last year or so.
What games have shown that ps4 and x1 perform better? Cause all I'm seeing are retouched graphics. Developers don't have near as much experience with them.
When the first cross gen games come out and you see the same or worse performance from next gen machines you'll see it wasn't the consoles fault. And don't come PMing me saying daffy you were right either.
I pity you.
Honestly I find myself consistently pleased and impressed with the visuals of games I play.
Other people have said it, but, yes people like shiny new things. Personally that's why I mostly gave up on my PS3/360 years ago. I haven't turned on and played my 360 since Gears 3 all the way back in 2011, and, the only reason I still play my PS3 is because PS+ gives me games I missed but wanted to play. Everything else has moved to PC. Despite my PC being 5 years old at this point (with a few cheap upgrades to make it stay "good enough") it runs games faster and better looking than my consoles. In the last 3 years I went from a Steam library that only had the original Half-Life to owning over 220 games (that is not including other non-steam games either).
Point of my story being that the lack of new consoles basically killed my interest in them and pushed me down the PC path (as I would have never considered myself a PC gamer at the start of this gen, or even 4 years ago). That is why I think this gen lasted too long, if there was new consoles 3 years ago it's entirely likely I would still be mostly playing console games currently.
Point of my story being that the lack of new consoles basically killed my interest in them and pushed me down the PC path (as I would have never considered myself a PC gamer at the start of this gen, or even 4 years ago). That is why I think this gen lasted too long, if there was new consoles 3 years ago it's entirely likely I would still be mostly playing console games currently.
Sword Familiar
178% of NeoGAF posters don't understand statistics
I'm hoping they can squeeze out another two years or so of games for this gen. I've had no problems whatsoever with this generation being longer. I seriously hope this is the standard from now on.
IMACOMPUTA
Member
AND WHATS CONSIDERED PASSABLE IN TERMS OF TEXTURES :X
I think you should play Tomb Raider or Bioshock Infinite on PC! You will change your mind.
From a technology standpoint, the technology gets long in the tooth.
From a publisher standpoint, the existing userbase becomes so large that new hardware has a longer uphill battle to climb to become a better option. While huge install bases are good for the recordbooks and short term public trading, it does make it harder to sell new items. Same problem Singer machines had back in the day. Alternately: even though capacity has increased, why music still gets sold on CD at retail, even though it's a format that debuted in 1982.
Sales will eventually slow down as there are a finite amount of customers out there.
From a publisher standpoint, the existing userbase becomes so large that new hardware has a longer uphill battle to climb to become a better option. While huge install bases are good for the recordbooks and short term public trading, it does make it harder to sell new items. Same problem Singer machines had back in the day. Alternately: even though capacity has increased, why music still gets sold on CD at retail, even though it's a format that debuted in 1982.
Sales will eventually slow down as there are a finite amount of customers out there.
Kai Dracon
Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
The thing I'm concerned about with the console generation turnover is that it's not going to do much, if anything, to change current trends.
There's a lot of talk about how you need a "new generation" to sell new IP, new kinds of games, etc. I've always found this a bit hand-wavey. The direction big money gaming is going in, is homogenization. Most so-called new games are the same standard games that a particular audience adverse to risk buys - just with a new coat of paint. Change the characters, remix the plot a bit, update that filmic storytelling to reflect whatever is hip and trendy this season. (Zombies, nihilistic survival stories, etc)
The main difference the next generation of consoles seems to be promising is simply that it'll be a lot easier in a technical sense to power open world sandbox games, so we're seeing a ton of those lined up. But speaking very generally, big game dev has transitioned into a pipeline that resists interruption for genuine experimentation. And expression of themes outside of current fashion.
There's a lot of talk about how you need a "new generation" to sell new IP, new kinds of games, etc. I've always found this a bit hand-wavey. The direction big money gaming is going in, is homogenization. Most so-called new games are the same standard games that a particular audience adverse to risk buys - just with a new coat of paint. Change the characters, remix the plot a bit, update that filmic storytelling to reflect whatever is hip and trendy this season. (Zombies, nihilistic survival stories, etc)
The main difference the next generation of consoles seems to be promising is simply that it'll be a lot easier in a technical sense to power open world sandbox games, so we're seeing a ton of those lined up. But speaking very generally, big game dev has transitioned into a pipeline that resists interruption for genuine experimentation. And expression of themes outside of current fashion.
Shadow Hog
Member
What are you on about? Yes, they released 4 games this generation, but they weren't all new franchises; two of them were sequels to the first one. And Naughty Dog was a "relatively unknown" developer? What, developing some of the most well-known titles of the entire PS1 and PS2 libraries (the Crash Bandicoot series and Jak and Daxter series, respectively) still qualifies you for being "unknown"?
I don't care about cross gen games. Those are, quite obviously, designed with 8 year old tech in mind. However, it would take a lot of effort to make something like Assassin's Creed run worse than it already does on current gen consoles.
But, we'll see when they come out, won't we? I consider an IQ bump to be great on these cross gen games regardless. I think that inFamous 3 is one of the best looking games I've ever seen.
That1BlackGuy
Member
I'm" a mid-to-late adopter so I have no problems with extended console generations; there's a large amount of games waiting to be played both new and old. I'll be good until 2016 if/when I decide to go next gen (on home consoles).
Pop
Member
Yeah, I think you may be in for a disappointment on that one.
Well thankfully for me, I won't be getting that.
ReBurn
Gold Member
I wanted new hardware in 2011 because I was hoping that it would mean an end to this cookie cutter crap we've been getting over and over. Now that I see what is coming with the new hardware I am ambivalent. We will continue to get the same cookie cutter crap, it will just be prettier.
Maybe I'm just getting too old for this crap.
Maybe I'm just getting too old for this crap.
Personally I got tired of all the games. There are only so many ways to skin a cat. Technology needs to be pushed forward. Enter the cosmos. Carl Sagan. Infinity. Space.
We aren't going to get to the holodeck quickly with a new console coming out every 7 years.
BRocknRolla
Member
I think it comes from three things:
1.) Diminishing returns - The consoles have been pushed largely to their limits. Maybe not every part of the machines, but bottleknecks abound at this point. Each new game may seem to look a bit better, but only marginally, and often at the cost of performance.
2.) PC quality visuals - With each touched up trailer, bullshot, and game demo running on tremendously powerful PC hardware, current gen devices look more and more dated. It's undeniably disappointing to see a game's public face be only available to a small base of computer gamers spending money on gaming rigs. Few games actually look the way they're presented these days. PCs obviously will remain ahead in power even into the next gen, but the gap will be significantly less than it is today.
3.) The grass is always greener on the other side - Folks suffering from franchise fatigue, a lack of creativity in many core genres, and those bothered by the increased amount of focus placed on "gimmicks" believe a new generation might free us of that boredom. I'm not convinced, but I'm optimistic.
1.) Diminishing returns - The consoles have been pushed largely to their limits. Maybe not every part of the machines, but bottleknecks abound at this point. Each new game may seem to look a bit better, but only marginally, and often at the cost of performance.
2.) PC quality visuals - With each touched up trailer, bullshot, and game demo running on tremendously powerful PC hardware, current gen devices look more and more dated. It's undeniably disappointing to see a game's public face be only available to a small base of computer gamers spending money on gaming rigs. Few games actually look the way they're presented these days. PCs obviously will remain ahead in power even into the next gen, but the gap will be significantly less than it is today.
3.) The grass is always greener on the other side - Folks suffering from franchise fatigue, a lack of creativity in many core genres, and those bothered by the increased amount of focus placed on "gimmicks" believe a new generation might free us of that boredom. I'm not convinced, but I'm optimistic.
Android18a
Member
I think this gen has been around the right length. Huge libraries and some great classics.
Although I've backpedalled somewhat now the gen is stalling. Sold my 360 and WiiU and just have a PS2, PS3 and SNES hooked up
Although I've backpedalled somewhat now the gen is stalling. Sold my 360 and WiiU and just have a PS2, PS3 and SNES hooked up
ReBurn
Gold Member
Would I still be able to play from my recliner in the holodeck? I don't want to exert too much effort.
TheGreyHulk
Member
if a gen lasts too long, it gets stale. people aren't as impressed anymore and move on to something else. i personally hate the end of gens because most games are pushing the system too hard that you get unfavorable frame rates.
i think the worst thing is that IQ stalls along with it. i'm a tech person, i like the boundaries pushed constantly, and the consoles lasting this long pretty much extended the DX9 era. I hate this because DX11 is so much more advanced, but it's still new even though it was released ages ago. it's like how BF3 was supposed to eat all our GPUs for breakfast because it looked so amazing when compared to what the ps360 was doing, but it turned out that our medium range GPU's were fine enough to run the game with very good IQ because the tech has been advancing far ahead of the software being made at the time.
we're at a point now where the software is playing catch up to the hardware currently available. extended gens suck IMO
i think the worst thing is that IQ stalls along with it. i'm a tech person, i like the boundaries pushed constantly, and the consoles lasting this long pretty much extended the DX9 era. I hate this because DX11 is so much more advanced, but it's still new even though it was released ages ago. it's like how BF3 was supposed to eat all our GPUs for breakfast because it looked so amazing when compared to what the ps360 was doing, but it turned out that our medium range GPU's were fine enough to run the game with very good IQ because the tech has been advancing far ahead of the software being made at the time.
we're at a point now where the software is playing catch up to the hardware currently available. extended gens suck IMO
Exactly. The gap between PC and current consoles at this point is so massive that it's downright ridiculous. I get the OP's argument if he's totally oblivious to PC gaming but spend five minutes playing Bioshock Infinite at 1080p/120 fps or Skyrim with ENBSeries on a high end PC and you'll realize how utterly ancient the consoles are.
OldAsUrSock
Banned
Games just did not substantially improve after 2009 or 2011. In '09 we had Uncharted 2, Modern Warfare 2, 1 vs 100, Killzone 2, Batman: Arkham Asylum, Assasins Creed 2, Bayonetta, and more. In '11 Mass Effect 2, LittleBigPlanet 2, Dead Space 2, Killzone 3, Crysis 2, Bastion, Gears of War 3, and others. Some of those games games, while not the best last gen had to offer, games after them did not get much more revolutionary or much better than those. Not long after 2009 games started to be less than 30fps. 30fps is already bad enough, but then when you also get tons of jaggies, poor textures, and overused lens flare effects to try and cover the bad IQ up, you see that the gen did not provide anymore. In my opinion 2011 was the real end of last gen.
RibbedHero
Member
Dennis wouldn't touch 1080p with a ten foot pole.
I believe some people are moaning about the specs of the next-gen consoles already so imagine if they were released a few years ago, they'd be even more underpowered compared to PCs.
But then I suppose that's the issue, I assume that the top end of the PC market will continue to advance quicker than consoles in a way that's far more noticeable than previous generations.
Although the specs these days go straight over my head so I couldn't be completely wrong about that, if I am I'm sure somebody will let me know.
But then I suppose that's the issue, I assume that the top end of the PC market will continue to advance quicker than consoles in a way that's far more noticeable than previous generations.
Although the specs these days go straight over my head so I couldn't be completely wrong about that, if I am I'm sure somebody will let me know.
outunderthestars
Banned
You know how launch lineups work right? Go back and look at early 360 games:
We have only seen a fraction of what next gen hardware can handle.
Darklor01
Might need to stop sniffing glue
Judging by how often most people want to replace their phones, cars, or various other things they own... this console generation has been around for a LONG time.
That's basically it for me. I'm a bit tired of not having something new to kick around with. I am also hopeful that the new system's games will be immediately better at least visually to enough of a degree to make me happy. It doesn't have to be drastic at first.. I'm just looking for better.
Let's just call it what it is.. shiny new toy syndrome.
That's basically it for me. I'm a bit tired of not having something new to kick around with. I am also hopeful that the new system's games will be immediately better at least visually to enough of a degree to make me happy. It doesn't have to be drastic at first.. I'm just looking for better.
Let's just call it what it is.. shiny new toy syndrome.
Should clarify. I meant that none of the games were carryovers from previous generations, new franchises on ps3. And perhaps relatively unknown was the wrong way to put it, they weren't as noteworthy as they are now.
Mammoth Jones
Member
Most consoles before this had a 5 year shelf life.
It's what I'm used to. But the last year or so the consoles were really showing their age.
It's what I'm used to. But the last year or so the consoles were really showing their age.
Pops Maellard
Member
Current gen games look and perform rather terribly at this point, particularly when they try to push the envelope (Ex: The Last of Us, Assassin's Creed 3).
Because NINE Call of Duty games came out.
And not to pick on CoD exclusively, but game publishers just stopped trying at a certain point, content to just pump out the exact same games over and over and over.
Some of us are hoping that a new generation will lead to at least a little creativity and new experiences. The lineups we've seen so far are starting to show that such hopes were misguided, but hey, maybe we'll get something in the next couple years.
And not to pick on CoD exclusively, but game publishers just stopped trying at a certain point, content to just pump out the exact same games over and over and over.
Some of us are hoping that a new generation will lead to at least a little creativity and new experiences. The lineups we've seen so far are starting to show that such hopes were misguided, but hey, maybe we'll get something in the next couple years.
jonscrambler
Member
console graphics haven't changed much since 2009, the current gap between them and PC is huge. once you've seen what games like BF3 on PC look like, why wouldn't you want that on consoles?
KojiKnight
Member
Mmm those unrealistic expectations for next gen....
Larger worlds/areas aren't just do to system specs, but budget constraints... We might see a few top tier games really push, but mostly what we're going to see this gen is slightly prettier than last gen.
(edit)
This is exactly what I mean by unrealistic... Sure it'll start out innocently enough with "cross-gen" titles literally being just up-rezzed and polished ports of ps360 titles... But when those sell, you'll still end up with 9 or more CoD games and their equivalents because they are quick and easy and cheap to make versus things that are brand new.
Larger worlds/areas aren't just do to system specs, but budget constraints... We might see a few top tier games really push, but mostly what we're going to see this gen is slightly prettier than last gen.
(edit)
This is exactly what I mean by unrealistic... Sure it'll start out innocently enough with "cross-gen" titles literally being just up-rezzed and polished ports of ps360 titles... But when those sell, you'll still end up with 9 or more CoD games and their equivalents because they are quick and easy and cheap to make versus things that are brand new.
Xbudz
Member
That's what the + was for.
I couldn't agree more. At a certain point, most mainstream releases all start looking the same (figuratively, of course), and new hardware might just be the breath of fresh air developers need to fuel their creativity.