Will we achieve Matrix Awakens level visuals by the end of this gen?

The_Observer

The_Observer

Member
I just replayed the 2021 Matrix Awakens demo on my PS5 and I was a bit surprised that the city exploring part didn't seem that "unreal" anymore. The introduction and the chase was still insane but it was because of the cinematic composition I guess. Don't get me wrong, the whole thing still looks incredible but I am starting to believe that this level of fidelity is possible in a real game as well by the end of this gen. People just have to be more acceptable of 30 fps and 1440p (and if you aren't, then there is pc and ps5 pro for you).

I feel like Robocop Rogue City is not that far from the Matrix from a visual standpoint and if a relatively small dev team could achieve this then I don't see why a bigger dev wouldn't be able to come really close to the Matrix demo.

What do you think?
 
a reminder that the matrix demo is a disgusting looking, blurry, artifact ridden, stuttery piece of absolutely dogshit, and a great example if why UE5 and Lumen is gutter trash.

kevboard said:
let's look at our old friend Lumen GI, shall we?
(obviously watch in 4k)


Say hi to the typical delayed screen space information fill-in that is an issue to this day:



then we have the extremely low precision leading to constant boiling and light leaking. notice how at the far edge of the bridge it's constantly boiling as well as shifting from light to dark as it desperately tries to look for screen space information to shade the notches:


and now while moving a bit (notice how it looks like there are some hidden blinking LEDs or something in those notches, but turns out, it's just Lumen once again breaking in non-optimal conditions:



and here another example of Lumen not working correctly without having screen space information to fill the gaps of the insanely low fidelity raytracing. it doesn't know if the edge is in darkness or in bright daylight, unless I have the whole think in screenspace:

(also notice how the light around that spot also changes and is temporally unstable)


and now let's look how fast Lumen is,
here all I do is stand still and move the camera to a different direction. notice how Lumen takes multiple seconds to catch up and correctly light the environment:

(also look how TSR turns into blocky static around my character when moving the cam to fast)

ans last but not least... I don't even know how to describe this... probably a mix of TSR fucking up and lumen missing screen space information... either way look at my character sparkling! 🤣:



the only reason this demo looks even remotely cohesive is becaus the extreme motion blur hides a lot of the issues with image quality.
basically the moment you turn the camera the entire screen is just blurred over to an extreme degree
88g6e6xb.png



the moment you don't hide everything behind motion blur or specifically scripted sequences, everything breaks apart. TSR artifacts, low resolution, low fidelity RT, missing screen space information creating holes in the lighting, the low quality denosier working overtime trying to not boil like crazy.
Click to expand...
 
They could do that now if they really wanted to. Either make a game that runs on all systems and isn't completely breaking the bank or just say "fuck your specs" and go all out. That's why all those tech demos look so good because they pump in ridiculous amount of detail they'd never bother with in an actual game because of time, money, optimization, etc.
 
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GTA VI already did, we literally proved as such in the graphics thread. It looks better than Matrix in trailers already and not by a small amount, especially IQ wise.
 
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These games are 15 years apart. Shows you how little things have jumped

Xbox 360 gameplay;



Madden 2026 gameplay




Does it look better? Sure it does but not 2 generations better.
 
The_Observer said:
I just replayed the 2021 Matrix Awakens demo on my PS5 and I was a bit surprised that the city exploring part didn't seem that "unreal" anymore. The introduction and the chase was still insane but it was because of the cinematic composition I guess. Don't get me wrong, the whole thing still looks incredible but I am starting to believe that this level of fidelity is possible in a real game as well by the end of this gen. People just have to be more acceptable of 30 fps and 1440p (and if you aren't, then there is pc and ps5 pro for you).

I feel like Robocop Rogue City is not that far from the Matrix from a visual standpoint and if a relatively small dev team could achieve this then I don't see why a bigger dev wouldn't be able to come really close to the Matrix demo.

What do you think?
Click to expand...
Hellblade 2 got very close

DF :
"
As a story-focused game, characters and character rendering play a significant role in the presentation. However, while the pre-release media largely focused on Senua herself, Hellblade 2 features a surprisingly large number of other humans. It's without doubt one of the games defining visual features - the character rendering in Hellblade 2 sets new standards, delivering sequences that, at times, almost resemble actual filmed scenes with real actors. This is one of the first examples of a game that stands up against the promise of the UE5 demo The Matrix Awakens. The scenes feel very natural and realistic in a way that manages to somewhat sidestep the uncanny valley almost completely."
 
RaidenJTr7 said:
Hellblade 2 got very close

DF :
"
As a story-focused game, characters and character rendering play a significant role in the presentation. However, while the pre-release media largely focused on Senua herself, Hellblade 2 features a surprisingly large number of other humans. It's without doubt one of the games defining visual features - the character rendering in Hellblade 2 sets new standards, delivering sequences that, at times, almost resemble actual filmed scenes with real actors. This is one of the first examples of a game that stands up against the promise of the UE5 demo The Matrix Awakens. The scenes feel very natural and realistic in a way that manages to somewhat sidestep the uncanny valley almost completely."
Click to expand...
I haven't played it yet but looking forward to it to see it myself.

I'm a bit surprised about the hate UE5 gets. Sure I knew that it's generally not liked around here but didn't know it is so much hated. And I find the nitpicks of the engine also strange because there is still nothing that looks like this. Yes, realtime graphics are like this, there is a lot of tricks involved always and you will always find issues if you are looking for them.

GTA6 was mentioned and I thought about it when I was writing the post that that will be the first to achieve this level. I hope there won't be downgrades compared to what R* has shown so far.
 
what do you mean if devs will achieve something that right now you can boot on your ps5?? You mean if they are going to actually develop a game with those visual, cause it has already been achieved.

Its a matter of budget, not the capabilities of the consoles. As the demo exists and its "playable"
 
Gamer79 said:
These games are 15 years apart. Shows you how little things have jumped

Xbox 360 gameplay;



Madden 2026 gameplay




Does it look better? Sure it does but not 2 generations better.
Click to expand...


Why are you using a POS game like Madden to try to prove your point? There's endless examples of massive leaps when comparing Xbox 360 era games to games of today.
 
DonF said:
what do you mean if devs will achieve something that right now you can boot on your ps5?? You mean if they are going to actually develop a game with those visual, cause it has already been achieved.

Its a matter of budget, not the capabilities of the consoles. As the demo exists and its "playable"
Click to expand...
Yes, that's what I meant. Which game do you think achieved this level of fidelity?
 
Neff said:
And more than anything, sheer man hours and lots of money. The Matrix Awakens required 70-100 people to create 20 minutes of game.
Click to expand...

This is why I say the AI hype is bullshit, people who work at the tech industry can see how much power and hardware the models require to run.
 
kevboard said:
a reminder that the matrix demo is a disgusting looking, blurry, artifact ridden, stuttery piece of absolutely dogshit, and a great example if why UE5 and Lumen is gutter trash.
Click to expand...
it's like UE5 was designed to take meme "omg it looks so real" screenshots.

Games that lean into these features look like dogshit in motion, simple as.
 
Gamer79 said:
These games are 15 years apart. Shows you how little things have jumped

Xbox 360 gameplay;



Madden 2026 gameplay




Does it look better? Sure it does but not 2 generations better.
Click to expand...

also, the realistic snow is a major selling point of the new game.

That said EA hasn't given a shit about this series in like 12 years.
 
If only Epic could make one game besides Fortnite, it would be great. Instead of sinking billions in their stupid store (at least they publish games now i guess).
 
Not technically and this is what I have understood.

Matrix demo was meant to show how good Unreal Engine 5 can look without the focus on resolution and frame rates while keeping game 'small'. Both Robocop and Hellblade 2 are UE5 games with small scope. hence why they look the closest.

People forget these consoles DIDNOT ship with proper upscaling hardware. You basically have FSR but not PSSR on base console. Now the demand for 4k-60 fps plus a demand for a 'bigger' game is there. Given that FSR is not capable of upscaling to that extent if the graphics look that good especially in a bigger game, I doubt we will.

However, I do think that the next generation will have a focus on proper hardware upscaling. However, cross gen exists which'll hold it back but eventually I do think that upscaling will improve to the point where we take a weaker resolution on a matrix level graphics and improve it to 4k-60 fps. Infact, I imagine by 2045, we will have a filter of running games photorealistic real time where the AI should be able to do what runway does in real time.
 
Neff said:
And more than anything, sheer man hours and lots of money. The Matrix Awakens required 70-100 people to create 20 minutes of game.
Click to expand...
It's also 25GBs (over 10GB just for City Sample assets) for a city on a grid with no internal structure or height changes, with buildings created with a ton of procedurally-generated elements all painted with the same general color scheme and a select few architectural styles, with randomized characters, with little audio but for some cat honks and engine noise...

Matrix Awakens is a well-made facade to interact with, and it's obviously something UE5 can do because it did. But the requirements for a full-scale game typically require more than this. You have actually seen UE5 projects much more complicated and detailed than Matrix Awakens, but because they can't just concentrate on the simple presentational elements that this demo excels at and look this good ALL THE TIME, the impression of this demo still holds up.
 
kevboard said:
a reminder that the matrix demo is a disgusting looking, blurry, artifact ridden, stuttery piece of absolutely dogshit, and a great example if why UE5 and Lumen is gutter trash.
Click to expand...
I've yet to play an UE5 game without these issues. A fucking mess of an engine. I fucking hate that lumen/light bleed and the blurry/shimmery ambient occlusion/shadowing on grass in all UE5 games.
 
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I would be surprised if most developers ever chase photorealism like that demo. They're going to be more interested in their creative vision.
 
In a game that's worth playing with interactivity, dynamic models/deformation and all the rest? Fuck no, ain't happening for a couple of console generations still. It's smoke and mirrors still.
 
Absolutely not. Some PC games will continue to have specific areas which are technically more advanced, but you will not see a game with the same overall level of visual excellence until the next gen console cycle starts.
 
The Cockatrice said:
I've yet to play an UE5 game without these issues. A fucking mess of an engine. I fucking hate that lumen/light bleed and the blurry/shimmery ambient occlusion/shadowing on grass in all UE5 games.
Click to expand...

yup. every time Lumen is at play, you know you're in for bad performance and an awful looking game.
it was the biggest blemish on Expedition 33 as well. inside the mansion (a very pivotal area in the game) the entire lighting is just broken... you can't call it anything else but broken. Lumen completely just dies inside that mansion, every issue you know from Lumen is amplifier to the max due to the specific lighting inside that place laying bare all the shortcomings of this dog shit lighting system.
 
UE5 is turning into a big visual fail imo. It's only excellent at outputting super dense geometry but even so the nanite tech works better on man made structures. Nanite looks off in natural asymmetrical objects in motion

UE5 also is bad with multi cpu cores and hence the long shader compilation and in game stuttering

I guess it's good only for quicker development for smaller studios to make games that look good for it's budget
 
Great game makers will obviously avoid that except devs like CD Project RED, Halo Studio, GTA VI maybe and some unknown mega projects like Star Citizen cause AI will stand on their side this time to make crazy things.
 
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