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Windows 8 / RT |OT|
- Thread starter Jzero
- Start date
infinityBCRT
Member
Got Windows 8 installed on my laptop! That thing was unusable for almost a year on Windows 7. Way too much crap on it. Blew it all away and now its fine. That being said since its a gaming laptop battery life still is balls (like 1 hour)
brotkasten
Member
Shouldn't have spent that Lumia 920 on a Toshiba ...
1. They are swamped - allow a while for it to arrive as they only started sending them out yesterday.
2. You can get the 2013 preview from here
fluffydelusions
Member
That is how all these stores work. Probably 30% cut like everywhere else
infinityBCRT
Member
Damn. I did the upgrade offer for the laptop I had Win 7 on but for my other PC I ended up buying a full pro license for $70. Ah well.
VanMardigan
has calmed down a bit.
True, but it does bring up the question of whether I will experience similar problems in the marketplace for wp8. Right now, it works through tricking the Xbox with a US billing address, but if they cut that part out, I wouldn't be able to purchase apps with a windows phone.
I think the universe is trying to tell me something related to where I live and staying away from MS.
fluffydelusions
Member
Needs a GAF app...
joeygreco1985
Member
So my upgrade key will work with the RTM ISO for sure?
Someone from AusGAF did it earlier today.
Kabuki Quantum Lover
Member
Internet Explorer.
Yep. I've done that twice today, once with the 32 bit version and once with the 64 bit version.
I don't think this even requires that you own a qualifying version of Windows either. You can do a fresh install and it doesn't check for an existing version, nor does it ask for a product key from a previous version. It definitely works fine for people upgrading from pirated versions of Windows too.
joeygreco1985
Member
I dont get the option to download an ISO file from the Upgrade Assistant though
Kabuki Quantum Lover
Member
It allows you to burn a DVD or create a bootable USB drive.
If find myself stuck at home tonight without a car..perfect time to screw up my PC and order Windows 8 
I have never used an upgrade version of Windows before, what happens if your PC ever crashes and a reinstall of the OS is needed? Will the licence from the upgrade be usable?
I have never used an upgrade version of Windows before, what happens if your PC ever crashes and a reinstall of the OS is needed? Will the licence from the upgrade be usable?
AndyMoogle
Member
I probably should have went with a clean install rather than an upgrade from Win 7. I can't open any app on the Start screen. I just get kicked back to the Start screen after I've clicked it. No message or anything.
plagiarize
Banned
If I want to make a Win 8 install disc after doing my upgrade, do I have to download an iso? If I do, I presume I want the 64 bit RTM iso yes? Just looking for a pointer or two on this. I'm at my day job so I can't waste much time looking.
Also, I too am still awaiting my WMC key. I hope to get it soon, as my PC is my DVR.
Also, I too am still awaiting my WMC key. I hope to get it soon, as my PC is my DVR.
chickdigger802
Banned
Is store broke?
Getting errors trying to update or dl stuff.
Getting errors trying to update or dl stuff.
http://web.esd.microsoft.com/W8DL/WSEC5B1D8A9DFDFD92DFB736C5B1D8956B5B1D8/Windows8-Setup.exe
Download that and use the product key sent to you via email.
fluffydelusions
Member
I really hope they polish the store interface. It is terrible.
Thanks mate. Oddly enough I have not received the email. And I just read online that microsoft takes 1-2 days to send out the confirmation email for paypal transactions : ( Should have gone ahead and just used my credit card
Frustrated_me
Member
we're running TMG proxy (Microsofts own product!) and cant access the store or any live metro apps... Think theres a bug. Even when Im outside the proxy network and on my home connection the Metro Store does not work.
fluffydelusions
Member
So to the people who are using it. What do you think so far? Honestly I love it.
Yeah, I had issues with PayPal too. When I went to pay, it said that there was an error, but I got an email from PayPal saying.....
I ended up trying again and paying via a credit card as I needed to buy several licenses anyway.
Turn the UAC on, that should fix the problem.
plagiarize
Banned
well, after the nightmare I had with driver issues (the 3D vision / play drivers put me into a horrible teal screen of death / attempt and fail to repair by restoring the PC) got sorted out, yes, i'm absolutely loving it, and if the next NVidia drivers do the same horrible thing I know how to get out of it.
hopefully the problem gets sorted soon. I presume it only effects people with two different vendors graphics cards.
AndyMoogle
Member
I've never turned it off to begin with, so that's not the problem.
EDIT: There are some other minor glitches, so I think I'll just do a clean install.
joeygreco1985
Member
Can I download the ISO using this? (After entering in my key of course)
plagiarize
Banned
i'm doing that right now. I think. I'll know when the download finishes and I get the option to create boot media (or I don't).
Loving it alot. Really smart.
Only thing that is bugging me is the Netflix app not working :/ Haven't been able to find a fix either.
AndyMoogle
Member
It doesn't work properly for me because I did an upgrade instead of a clean install, but it's definitely very jarring to go between the desktop and the full screen Start menu. I guess I'll get used to it after a while, but for now I don't like it all that much.
joeygreco1985
Member
Thanks, let me know please!
Also, is there any other way to grab the ISO? I'm at work and I'd rather download it on thier connection so I don't take another data cap hit at home
Dead Prince
Banned
i was okay with it on pc during the preview. but now that i have it on laptop. love it so far.
What isn't working? I did an upgrade and everything is great.
WascallyWabbit
Member
So what's the deal with the preview? Does it stop working after awhile?
AndyMoogle
Member
None of the apps on the start screen are working, and Live Mail crashes 9 times out of 10 when I try to start it. Funny that it's only MS own stuff that doesn't work. Everything else works fine.
Refresh (in the settings menu) worked for me.
AndyMoogle
Member
D
Deleted member 1235
Unconfirmed Member
uk actually is allowed netflix as there is a netflix UK store as far as I know. I'm in NL.
I can't figure it out. I'm going to try signing in with my US account that I made for xbox live silver just to get that damn netflix app on my xbox.
I'm liking the PlayTo feature. Works like a charm with the 360.
Apps are loading like molasses for me.
Full screen ads when I try to start challenges on Minesweeper? Fuck off!
The new music app pales in comparison to the Zune software. Decent though.
I'm actually liking the whole app store on a desktop thing though.
Apps are loading like molasses for me.
Full screen ads when I try to start challenges on Minesweeper? Fuck off!
The new music app pales in comparison to the Zune software. Decent though.
I'm actually liking the whole app store on a desktop thing though.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
Desktop
I think the underlying desktop OS is an improvement over W7. I like notifications. I like most of the revamped system dialogues (like for example the new System Clean). I like ribbon-explorer. I like the new copy dialogue. I like the new task manager. I like the new login/user system and syncing user settings. I do not like the flat shaded visual style and I miss Aero Glass. I don't want a hack to approximate transparency, I want Aero Glass. I think the application controls look nicer.
Start8 is a good start menu substitute. I'm holding off buying until I see if anyone does a 100%, high quality free substitute. If I have to pay $4.99, I will, this is a good product.
Metro
Metro has some neat ideas for a touch interface (I like the side-snapping stuff, I like Live Tiles, I like the general visuals) but is not how I want to use the OS. I think the dominant different between a tablet and a desktop is that with a desktop, tasks are grouped around files--you find a file and open it in a program or multiple programs. On a tablet, files are siloed into applications. Metro is definitely more highly the latter. The interface is built around launching the app you want and using that app to get to your files. This is not compatible with how I typically use my PC. My routine is built around file management and exploring.
I like the right-side charms bar. I'm less impressed by the implementation of the context menu, which I also thought was generally not optimally implemented on WP7. Some of this would be fixed with stricter application guidelines, but it still feels like a not particularly intuitive way of dealing with stuff.
I think the default Metro apps are generally well designed but often times poor substitutes for the applications I was using before. I don't particularly like the Mail client, I think the People application is good but should support a wider array of social options--Siloing every social site into its own App makes little to no sense and defeats the purpose of having a People tile at all.
I am on my Windows 7 PC right now, and these are the applications I have installed and use: Chrome, PuTTY, Command Prompt, Bulk Rename Utility, iTunes, Office, MagicJack, MakeMKV, Handbrake, Core FTP, Photoshop, Skype, VLC, 1Password, and Steam--and there's not a single one of these that I would rather use via the Metro interface, notwithstanding that I couldn't even if I wanted to at this point. I code. I don't want to do development in Metro. I don't want everything fullscreen. I want better window management. And I think anyone here who says that Metro doesn't at least partially impede desktop-driven tasks is kidding themselves. I'm not going to go on a hypothetical future rant about how W10 will drop the desktop or anything like that, I'm saying that as-is, in Win8, my desktop experience is worse than it should be in order to put Metro in the prime seat. There are people for whom that's a good tradeoff. I am not one of them.
I like the way Mac OSX integrates a tablet-style application Launcher (in LaunchPad) while retaining an overall desktop-style UI. I think Microsoft has made the wrong choice for what I want. I don't think they care, because I think they correctly estimate that the desktop market is less important now and are going all-in on touch--but I wish that, like Apple, they'd start winding down their desktop market elegantly rather than trying to convert it quite so obviously.
I like the Metro Settings panel. I don't like that it's a less-than-full substitution for the original control panel.
The OS is fast. It's very fast. Almost nothing has a perceptible load time--in many cases this is masked through clever visual transitions. For example, the pre-load app startup transition carefully masks a few seconds of loading without feeling like it does. Very very smart. Very slick.
Windows App Store
I think the apps available in the Windows store are largely ultra-shitty. No or poor implementations of search and sharing, ugly Metro choices, inconsistent use of Settings charm versus in-app Settings toggles or dialogues, poor navigation, often terrible in-app ads. Part of this is because skill-less amateur devs have been working on stuff while corporate developers who might make more polished software have held off. I don't know if this will change. Netflix is great, though, and the only App I've rated 5 stars. Not because it's perfect, but because it's not terrible.
Windows Store apps are overwhelmingly made for touch. You can substitute touch with a mouse, but it's obvious when something isn't built for that. The OS is overwhelmingly made for touch, really. The mouse gestures are obvious attempts to approximate touch gestures. I wish they had at least spent the time, both on an individual app level and on an OS-wide level, to really ask whether their KBM experience was as polished as it could be. The vast majority of people using W8 will not be on touch devices. 5-8 years from now it'll be a different story, but in the mean time, this transition is a little rocky.
Error Handling / Locked Out
I am very concerned about error handling and diagnostics. In the RTM version I downloaded Fruit Ninja. Fruit Ninja got an update, which the store reminded me of every time I entered... but I couldn't install the update. Useless error message every time. There was no way to permanently ignore the update, though. I uninstalled Fruit Ninja. The uninstall got botched--I couldn't see the game on my start screen, but the Store App said it was installed. I could not force-reinstall it. I could not launch it since there was nothing to launch. This is a very odd fluke, obviously, and most people won't experience it... but tell me, how am I supposed to troubleshoot it? Application files are hidden away in a hidden, non-visible, system folder set so that Administrators don't have permission to it. Error logs were unhelpful. There's no central way to forcibly delete remaining application files. Then So I couldn't ignore the update, I couldn't delete the botched uninstall files, and I couldn't force reinstall the whole program. I tried forcibly changing the permissions on both my User folder's copy of Fruit Ninja and the WindowsApps folder's copy of Fruit Ninja and forcibly deleting them. I used takeown and icacls to do so. This was very difficult and I got constant error messages--so don't expect to be able to easily modify or play around with app files. I deleted both folders. Fruit Ninja still thought it was installed, so god only knows where Windows actually stashes its install info. I ended up doing an OS install refresh, which required an installation media.
Likewise, I've been getting a few crashes with certain built-in apps. I get the pre-load app logo, then a "Image Not Loading" style broken image, then a few seconds later a crash. It's not my computer, because the same applications work fine other times. Perhaps a server overload thing? Probably, since all these programs need to get network data. But when you just crash back to the start screen, I have no idea. To Microsoft's credit, that's exactly what iOS does when it hits a crash, rather than telling you what caused it... but the difference is that iOS first-party applications by and large don't crash, so we're still back to the fact that I'm getting a crash and I can't diagnose or troubleshoot it.
Games
The implementation of games is significantly better than GFWL. I have no objections to it. I would note that the gaming functionality is pretty bare-bones for now. For example, Jetpack Joyride and Fruit Ninja have friend leaderboards, but no global leaderboards. Messaging through Xbox is convoluted. The store does a poor job of separating Xbox Games from other games and you basically need to go through the Games app to do so. I'd still much rather be buying my games through Steam, and when MS releases games like Skulls of the Shogun and Hydro Thunder which are obvious overlapping with the Steam audience, I think it's unfortunate that they're not releasing them on Steam. For the sort of casual games that didn't really have a home before, for the direct iOS ports, I think Windows Store will be pretty great. Adera is really excellent, and I'm glad MS seems to appreciate free games now.
One complaint: Putting advertising in Minesweeper and Solitaire is fucking disgusting. "This game is free thanks to our advertisers". No, get the fuck out of here you creepy scumbags. This game is free because it's always been free and it should always be free and it's free everywhere else and your implementation, while good, isn't particularly special, and your sponsors thusfar are Microsoft, and I already own Dance Central 2, and Dance Central 2 isn't on PC so your advertising is embarrassing.
Philosophy
In many respects, Metro imports the worst tendencies of MS on Xbox to Windows. The music app is a great example. It visually combines playing music and buying music. Which is fine if you're there to buy music, but if you're there to play music, it comes off crassly commercial, just like everything on Xbox does. Most of us want to use our devices the way we want to use them. Using a storefront to promote new content is largely helpful. But when you push purchases into user tasks that don't normally involve purchase intent, it's disappointing. Visual separation would make this less problematic--for example, make the user signal some sort of affirmative purchase intent by choosing to click on some sort of purchase-themed menu option BEFORE you start trying to promote stuff to them.
A user here asked for service tweaks and optimizations for the OS. Besides the fact that I don't think the OS needs them, I also think that era is dead. Based on what I mentioned above about how the OS protects applications files, I think it's clear that an increasing percentage of Windows' functionality is now hidden in such a way that users can't pick apart the OS. Is this a big issue? For tweakers, maybe. For regular users I think it's only an issue if they're unhappy in some way with the default experience. Consider jailbreaking on iOS. I don't jailbreak anymore because most of the major things I wanted from jailbreaking are now easily doable without jailbreaking. But for a time, they weren't, and during that time I jailbroke. MS is going to face this as well.
Conclusion
I think it's shocking that many of the things I've mentioned here haven't come up in any review. Not because everyone needs to agree with me. I'm a curmudgeon. But because many of these things aren't discussed at all, even in disagreement. Even the in-depth reviews seem to have a lack of critical reflection on the shifting emphases of the OS.
I remain convinced that users would have been served better if MS had added many of the desktop mode improvements to W7 and released the Metro OS as a separate operating system. By and large, I'd rather be using an updated Windows 7 with many of the incremental updates. I'd rather be playing around with Metro and Windows Store on a secondary install. I don't hate W8, I think there's a lot of good, but I don't think it's a primetime-ready release and I don't think it's the right strategy for the future.
It expires on June 30 2013; other than that it is fully functional.
Stump, is the right click - Your Apps section in the store not what you're looking for? Seems like purchase/download history to me.
Still can't access UEFI. I'm getting pretty frustrated. I've tried clearing CMOS in hopes that some setting I had switched earlier prevented my USB devices from powering up on boot, but nothing is improving. Without a PS/2 slot on my motherboard, it seems I'm out of luck. Damnit ASRock, why can't your Windows BIOS updates work?
Still can't access UEFI. I'm getting pretty frustrated. I've tried clearing CMOS in hopes that some setting I had switched earlier prevented my USB devices from powering up on boot, but nothing is improving. Without a PS/2 slot on my motherboard, it seems I'm out of luck. Damnit ASRock, why can't your Windows BIOS updates work?
Super excited to get home and load windows 8 on my laptop. I have a question that I will ask here as I know you guys will answer faster than if I searched.
So I am going to load windows 8 on my laptop tonight. It is however not good for gaming.. I am considering loading another copy of window 8 on my mac through bootcamp. If I were to do that how does it handle say your Xbox Live account? If I bought a game on my laptop would it show up on my other computer if I am logged in under the same account? Can you have your dashboards mirror eachothe?
Just something that I thought of and I am curious.. would be great to log into any computer get get the same screen.
So I am going to load windows 8 on my laptop tonight. It is however not good for gaming.. I am considering loading another copy of window 8 on my mac through bootcamp. If I were to do that how does it handle say your Xbox Live account? If I bought a game on my laptop would it show up on my other computer if I am logged in under the same account? Can you have your dashboards mirror eachothe?
Just something that I thought of and I am curious.. would be great to log into any computer get get the same screen.